A few questions about the 10.75x68:

1) Who originally made loaded ammo for this cartridge? And at what velocity were each of these loaded? I understand the typical loading was a 347gn bullet at something like 2150fps. I recall a reference to a factory load that went 2300fps, but am not sure who made it, or if my memory is faulty.

2) I read somewhere on A.R. that, other than betram, no one is makeing brass at this time. Is this true?

3) Again, I read somewhere on A.R. that chamber specs are sketchy when building a custom. Who makes a "proper" reamer for this round?

4) Who makes a properly sized magazine box/bottom metal for this round, and if none are available, what are my options for a custom bottom metal?

A rifle in this caliber for me would be years down the road if ever, but it sounds interesting, and I would like to learn more about it. Any info would be greatly appreciated. Thanks- Matt

Matt, and interesting caliber indeed. My old references list a 347gr bullet at 2,175 (1930 Kynoch catalog), 2,198 (DMW, same period), and 2,313 (old Mauser catalog). The round is also called the 423 Mauser.

I understand that with modern bullets and pwders hand loading can achieve Edited - correction 2400 2150 fps with 400 gr bullet. This duplicates the great 404 Jeffery's original balistics. The 404 can also be loaded up a bit of course.

I have been dreamaning of owning a 10.75X68 for years. My dad had one and sold it in 1968.

Horneber makes cases.

Nakihunter,

I've seen loads for 347 gr bullets at 2400 fps and 400 gr bullets at 2150 fps, but not 400 gr bullets at 2400 fps.

The original 404 Jeffery ballistics I am familar with show to be;

A 400gr bullet at 2125fps,

A 300gr bullet at 2625fps,

When fired from a 28" barrel.

shesh, what a load presented here. -- laughing boy joe calls that malarkey

1: designed for a 347gr bullet,
2: this bullet was originally a very lightly jacketed bullet and NOT SUITABLE for big, heavy game
3: OAL was unnecessarily compromised too short
4: the 404 original loading is 400 at 2250 .. full stop .. it is designed to mimic the 450/400 in a bolt gun - modern loadings are 2400 - fact, and I wish ya'll would get that worked out ..
5: loaded at 3.34 oal, or on the groove on a hornady .423 400gr bullet, 2250 is EASY and 2400 is doable with decent brass and good loading, as it was originally loaded with GERMAN FLAKE, which aint bad for the day, but is hot hot today.

quote:

Originally posted by z1r:
Horneber makes cases.

I thought I read somewhere on A.R. that Horneber brass was no longer available. Thanks to everyone for all the info so far. How about bottom metal/magazine options?

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
shesh, what a load presented here. -- laughing boy joe calls that malarkey

1: designed for a 347gr bullet,
2: this bullet was originally a very lightly jacketed bullet and NOT SUITABLE for big, heavy game
3: OAL was unnecessarily compromised too short
4: the 404 original loading is 400 at 2250 .. full stop .. it is designed to mimic the 450/400 in a bolt gun - modern loadings are 2400 - fact, and I wish ya'll would get that worked out ..
5: loaded at 3.34 oal, or on the groove on a hornady .423 400gr bullet, 2250 is EASY and 2400 is doable with decent brass and good loading, as it was originally loaded with GERMAN FLAKE, which aint bad for the day, but is hot hot today.

1. Yes true

2. Some early Kynoch solids and softs were light in the jacket, I have some RWS blue nosed softs with steel jackets which work well and RWS made good steel jacketed solids too but the main problems was the .423 cal 347gr bullet was too light for calibre i.e. shortish and stubby and not conducive to good penetration.

3. Yes the seated bullets are well back in the neck so powder space was compromised for the calibre.

4. No the original Kynoch factory load for 400gr bullets in the 404J when it was introduced was a MV of 2125fps and this was later upped to a MV of 2225fps with a white stick on label on the packets advising of this change and advising that re-sighting may be required for changes in POI. Not all modern loadings were at 2400fps, Parker Hale as loaded by Norma was 2245fps, modern Kynoch is again being loaded today at 2125fps. RWS ammo was loaded to 2300fps and some early DWM advertised at 2400fps. It has been proven over and over again that a well constructed 400gr solid or soft bullet at around 2100-2200fps is ample for dangerous game and penetrates better than many larger bores, that is what made the 404 and 416 so effective back when introduced and animals heads and bones have not got any harder despite what some may think.

5. Realistically a good 400gr bullet at 2100fps in the .423 mauser or 10.75x68 as we know it most, which is easy and safe in this cartridge will put it up to the old 404J performance. Velocities much above this is pushing the envelope in some of the old guns and just not necessary just as pushing the 404 or 416 up to 2600fps or 2700fps as can be done but not required.

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
shesh, what a load presented here. -- laughing boy joe calls that malarkey

1: designed for a 347gr bullet,
2: this bullet was originally a very lightly jacketed bullet and NOT SUITABLE for big, heavy game
3: OAL was unnecessarily compromised too short
4: the 404 original loading is 400 at 2250 .. full stop .. it is designed to mimic the 450/400 in a bolt gun - modern loadings are 2400 - fact, and I wish ya'll would get that worked out ..
5: loaded at 3.34 oal, or on the groove on a hornady .423 400gr bullet, 2250 is EASY and 2400 is doable with decent brass and good loading, as it was originally loaded with GERMAN FLAKE, which aint bad for the day, but is hot hot today.

Jeff- I recall that you had a "cigarette" rifle made up in this caliber. How long is the barrel, how much does it weigh, what magazine did you use? Can you post a pic please (and thanks)?

I would check with Duane Wiebe for bottom metal.

I have RWS 10.75x68 brass back-ordered from Huntington's.

I purchased a 10.75x68 finish reamer from Pacific Tool and Gauge Inc. which was probably built using SAAMI specs. You could ask them to build a reamer using CIP specs.

I have a 1930 Model B chambered for 10.75x68. I have Horneber and Bertram brass and both have to be re-sized before they will chamber. I am using a 'C-H Tool & Die/4-D Custom Die Co' 2 die set which has no problem setting the correct sholder angle. The bolt will not close on the GO guage I got from Pacific Tool and Gauge Inc. so I don't know if the brass or my chamber is out of spec, or both.

I assume you will be handloading so does it matter which specs you use?

Pierre van der Walt has a good write-up in hs latest 'African Dangerous Game Cartridges' book.

Where are you finding the reloading data for the 10.75?

I have 3 rifles in 10.75x68. A very light B mauser, one on an FN supreme action and a VZ24 stocked mann style with a 21.5" barrel.
I bougth RCBS dies first, and had the chambers cut to match the dies, which also work for the old mauser.
The best brass I have is from Buffalo Arms. It's made from belted modern cases with the belt turned off and extractor groove cut to spec. It is very good brass.
I dont run my loads very hot in any of the 3. The favorite is the mann version with 347 woodleighs at 2200 fps. Works great on moose! For a deer bullet, horn xtp 300 grn,44 cal sized .423 at 21-2200 fps is mild and kills, well, like a 444 marlin of course.

Matt,
I sent a VERY LIGHT 8x57 cigarette gun off for the rebarrel, dies, claw mounts, and bluing .. the gent I sent it to is slow on jobs, but he knows his stuff -- i have the gun throated and feeding done for hornady DGX crimped on the grove, about 3.35 oal, and then the dies setup for the same -

I have not received it, as yet, ,, appears the rings went on walk about -

it is cut to CIP, not SAAMI -- there is a large difference in the shoulder/datum, but I don't currently recall the exact issue - suffice to say, I am building it to cip, which would allow me to shoot factory ammo, if I should stumble over it...

the gun is VERY VERY VERY light -- I plan to make a pop-up or use a lyman peep, and a simple front sight, but it will spend most of its time scoped -- in fact, the scope is sitting 12 feet from me.. waiting...

i did mine to be a VERY light weight pig popper -- but with claw mounts - i know its a crime, but I think of these as big bore 308s .. it aint a 30/30 (444) or a 300 win (404) but it will do the trick...

I expect it will account for its share of pork and bunnies.. and likely, knowing me, treerats if i can catch them on the ground

Thanks, Jeff! I just looked at horneber's website. Not out of business as some have suggested in the recent past. Huntington's has a new lot of horneber's brass in @ $60/20. Hmmm...

Just looked over old posts on AR, and maybe a magazine designed for the standard length belted mags should do the trick. Am I wrong? It looks like the 10.75x68 case is roughly equivalent to the standard belted mag case with the belt removed. Am I on the right track here?

quote:

It looks like the 10.75x68 case is roughly equivalent to the standard belted mag case with the belt removed. Am I on the right track here?

Read my post above.

quote:

Originally posted by theback40:

quote:

It looks like the 10.75x68 case is roughly equivalent to the standard belted mag case with the belt removed. Am I on the right track here?

Read my post above.

Thanks

You can get them for $47.60/100pcs. Great price.

My apologies for the error is the 400 gr velocity for the 10.75X68. I have edited & corrected the post so that no one else will attempt an unsafe load.

I am still dreaming of a rifle in that caliber. I just heard from India that one is available. I just hope it is my dad's old rifle! That would be an absolute miracle!

Going from memory...

A standard m98 will take 4 down & close the bolt on a 5th
one in the chamber in 10.75x68. Am I rembering correctly?
I was thinking it just needs a little work on the feed rails.

I got a 1909 Argie out & checked it with 10.75x68 dummy
rounds with 400gn Woodleighs.

I had to bump them in to a COL of about 3.30 as at 3.3
they would drag in the 1909 mag well. Was tight enough
to bind & not drop thru.
It looked like the mag well could be opened up front too
back & a COL of 3.34 would work.

But I only could get 3 down.

shouldn't it take 4 down?
The the mag well was just needing a little work?
Or it is a no go deal?

Allen

AllenBosely,

I tried inserting dummies into the magazine for the following rifles:

a 9.3x62 FN98 HVA 1950's Mauser holds only 3 rounds, the fourth almost seated. Maybe changing the follower would allow 4 rounds.

a 458 Win Mag 98 Withworth Mauser holds only 3 rounds. The box height was a hair shorter than the FN98 HVA Mauser box.

an original 1930 Mauser 10.75x68 Model B swallows 5 founds with room to spare. This magazine box is hugh.

The magazine boxes for the 9.3x62 and 458 Win Mag will hold longer cartridges up to 3.34 allowing for 400 gr bullets to be crimped using the existing bullets crimp groove, the original will not.

The original Oberndorf Mausers made for the 10.75x68 had slightly deeper magazine boxes than the standard M98 Mausers and would have held at least 4 rounds if not 5. It is noticeable in these sporters made in 10.75x68 that the trigger is sitting higher up in the bow than normal.

My Type A was originally a 10.75x68 but is now a 404J still in the original stock (and mag depth) and it holds three and a half 404 cartridges allowing 3 down and 1 up.

quote:

Originally posted by eagle27:
The original Oberndorf Mausers made for the 10.75x68 had slightly deeper magazine boxes than the standard M98 Mausers and would have held at least 4 rounds if not 5. It is noticeable in these sporters made in 10.75x68 that the trigger is sitting higher up in the bow than normal.

My Type A was originally a 10.75x68 but is now a 404J still in the original stock (and mag depth) and it holds three and a half 404 cartridges allowing 3 down and 1 up.

Is your 10.75x68 mag box any wider than a standard mauser magazine?

quote:

Originally posted by ColoradoMatt:

quote:

Originally posted by eagle27:
The original Oberndorf Mausers made for the 10.75x68 had slightly deeper magazine boxes than the standard M98 Mausers and would have held at least 4 rounds if not 5. It is noticeable in these sporters made in 10.75x68 that the trigger is sitting higher up in the bow than normal.

My Type A was originally a 10.75x68 but is now a 404J still in the original stock (and mag depth) and it holds three and a half 404 cartridges allowing 3 down and 1 up.

Is your 10.75x68 mag box any wider than a standard mauser magazine?

I don't know about width of the mag box for the 10.75x68. What is the "standard" Mauser magazine width?

I measured a mag box from a K98k 8m/m Mauser and a 1930 Oberndorf Sporter in 10.75x68 Mauser.

- Outside Dimensions 8m/m 10.75x68
Front Width: .811 .940
Front Height: 1.100 1.211

Rear Width: 1.003 1.147
Rear Height: 1.300 1.429

- Inside Dimensions
Front Width: .700 .854
Rear Width: .875 .930

Thank you Jim. That's some great info. Did you happen to measure the inside length of the 10.75x68 magazine? If you don't mind, I am going to put this info on Allen Bosley's new 10.75x68 post, as he is trying to gather as much info as possible.