The weather got upto 35 f today,the sun came out,I dusted some guns off & headed to the range,shooting some big bore DR'S was the plan & it went well except the last two shots from my 458 Lott O/U,offhand at 25 yrds,the bottom barrel placed a 500 gr Hornady in the bullseye,I pull the back trigger & it went click ??? & not boom,puzzled I cracked the barrels open,both the primers had firing pin indentations,did I double the gun? no I did'nt,next both cases are ejected into my hand,both come easy,I look down into the barrels,the top barrel is not showing any light,so now I have an obstruction,look at both cases again,cannot see anything abnormal,pick up the gun again looking it over,my first thought was that there was no powder in that round & the primer had pushed the bullet into the barrel,I go to shut the gun & all this powder came streaming down the chamber
What do you think happened? faulty primer?the ammo was about 6 months old loaded with Varget,I have experienced hangfires but never this !!!

Bill,
I have no idea what caused your phenomenon.

BUT some years back I read that for long cases full of powder, more primer flash and burn is better than less. Since then, I have always used Federal 215M primers for such loads. That is their Match Magnum primer and in one notable case, in my 400 grain .405 WCF compressed loads, moving from another brand magnum primer to Federal 215M increased MV by 35 FPS; that made a believer of me for my loading.
Results may differ for other cartridges, powders, and loads.

Had the same thing happen with my Marlin .45-70. Bullet got stuck in the barrel(just barely) and the powder that came out of the chamber looked like it was damp. I had reloaded the rounds just a couple of weeks prior. he round only went click.

I just think it was a bad primer.

Hip

What kind of crimp? Is there any chance the first shot pulled the bullet from the second case, allowing the primer to fire without lighting off the powder?
For Lott loads, a hot primer and strong crimp are good insurance.
Your double could be working like a kinetic bullet puller. Would hate to think what would happen if a bullet moved up against the rifling and the primer did set off about 80 grains of powder in a Lott.

Interesting comment about varget-
http://forums.thecmp.org/showthread.php?t=125421

" If you want to see ignition problems (30-06), here is a formula is approximate order of importance: 1. lube the case neck--and don't crimp. 2. Cold. 3. VarGet--in a reduced load. 4. Lite bullet- 110-125grs. 5. Standard primers. 6. Lite cases--as Hornady. 7. Reduced firing pin strike, failure to seat primers fully, excessive headspace, etc.--all reducing the firing pin energy. 8. Case interior contamination--say water, lube or what-ever."
from comment #9

no fun --
good news, a 3/8 dowel and a dead fall hammer should fix you right up ...

what primers did you use? I had SEVERAL "click..... wait for it .. BOOM" in the 500 jeffe from NOT using federal primers ... redid loads and that went away ...

dud primers happen, but not often .. did i overlook you stating what make primers?

Jeffeosso,
I know it's overthinking this, as the bullet is probably barely into the rifling but just in case someone not familiar with the trick is reading this-
Make sure the grain follows straight thru the entire length of any dowel used to remove a stuck bullet, and if it takes more than a tap get a brass rod. A dowel split and wedged in a barrel can become a gunsmith issue. Have read more than one "OOOPS, now what do I do......"

Hoping to answer some of the questions posted,I went back to check on some things,I had twelve fired rounds from that batch,I started by examining each case neck for size,all seemed the same,looked at all the primers?all seemed the same for firing pin strike,next I got a flash light to inspect the cases further,in one I could not quite see the primer hole,I took a small punch & fiddled around inside the case,out comes a lump of powder with rust like coloring SHEEESSSHHH,WTH it's gotta be moisture,somehow my ammo got contaminated by moisture,I broke down the remaining two rounds,one round showed faint discoloring in the powder,so that answers what took place,thanks for your taking the time to respond to this thread,happy new year to you all.

Another point to note,I have some loaded rounds from the same time period,but using 3031 instead of Varget,the powder from these rounds showed no discoloring at all,all rounds were stored in the same box.bullets used were 500 Hornady sp's & 480 Woodleigh sp's.

What inside of a brass case with plated primer is rusting?
How old is the powder?
What does smokeless powder look and smell like when it deteriorates?

quote:

Originally posted by 86thecat:
What inside of a brass case with plated primer is rusting?
How old is the powder?
What does smokeless powder look and smell like when it deteriorates?

The brass looks normal,powder is a few years old,the loaded rounds were at least a year old,except for the discoloration of the powder,there was no abnormal smell.

The only time I have ever seen rusty colored powder, the powder was breaking down but usually smells funky also. Varget is known for being hard to ignite in low temps or reduced loads unless the primer gives a hot flame. Varget is also known to "melt" together but not ignite if there is a misfire. I wonder if the rust color was due to older powder and just enough heat to break down the powder without igniting it. Modern primers are amazingly reliable unless there are other problems, anything from cold oil slowing firing pin strike to primers not seated fully or lack of crimp etc. Might have to start at square one and check everything. Powder condition, primer seating and amount of crimp would be my starting point, especially crimp in a Lott double rifle.
Hope you get it figured out.

Most of the time its a primer that was not fully seated, but only enough to allow you to close the action, then the firing pin hits it and seats the primer but no explosion..The other is a tight fitting case that is not fully chambered and the firing pin pushes the case forward and that will always cause a misfire..all these things leave a indention on the firing pin, but not enough to fire the case..

Prevention is full length resizing of double rifle cases is always a recommendation, they need to slop in..not seating a bullet deep enough and off the lands is also probably, all these things are prevented in the same way, they are required for a DG rifle of any kind...