How about some descriptions or even a video on how to do this (assuming extractors)? Where are the spares: stock, wristband?
Peter.

I always keep two in my left hand. I've done this for years in my bird hunting and it is very quick. The CAS shooters have neat tricks, too. You might go watch a shoot and see what techniques they use. Speed is everything with them.

When shooting buffalo I wear a thin pair of buckskin gloves with two .470 between my first and second finger of my left hand..The gloves friction holds the cartridges there for hours without a conscious effort on my part, try it...

I never get in a rush to reload, that causes fumbles, I simply load the rifle and shoot under any circumstances...

For the slow shooters - I was just doing some research on bayonets and came across a hunting bayonet designed for a double barrel gun !! The two rounds in the left hand is best for me but you're right , go for smooth rather than fast.

Practice is everything. Do it so many times that when the pressure is on you don't even think about what you're doing.

I don't shoot doubles but I've cycled so many bolt actions I could never imagine short stroking it or any other problem. I've got myself trained to feel the bump of the bolt being stopped by the bolt stop before the push to grab a case and feed it in.

When I shot skeet competitively loading the OU was just as automatic. It happens with thousands of rounds. Get some dummies or snap caps and practice, practice, practice.

I have been playing with different methods to reload a double rifle as quickly and as surely (no dropped rounds) as possible. There are many different ways to do it. Two rounds in weak hand, wrist belt, stock holder. waist carrier etc. I have used a shot timer to check differences in reload speed. But how quick you reload isn't as important as how surely you do it with out dropping a round or two.

Here are a few of the results I have found:

Loading one round at a time from any position is more sure then trying to load two rounds at one time. You can do two at a time but it takes much much more prectice. Keeping the rifle at eye level allows you to look over the breach and keep your eye on your animal and see the breach as you feed the cartridges into the chambers in your periferal vision. I find it very uncomfortable to be carrying a couple of rounds in my weak hand all the time and tend to get lazy and not do it except on an approach. That means I'm not always ready to do a quick reload. I have found it more sure if carrying two rounds in the weak hand to carry them with the bullet end in the palm of my hand the diameter of the cartridge is smaller at the bullet end and more comfortable to carry. I then reload one round at a time to be sure not to drop a cartridge. Since I have been shooting IPSC for over 20 yeras it is natural for me to go to my belt for a reload. I prefer to reload from my culling belt. Through practice I can grab two rounds with my right hand and reload quickest in this manner. But it took a lot of practice to be able to do it consistently. If a second reload is necessary which has happened on a couple of occasions, it is then automatic for me to return to the belt for another two rounds. I don't have to learn two methods as I would if I used the weak hand carry method.

But everyone is different and there is no right or wrong way to do it. Try the different methods and see what works for you. Maybe you will come up with an even faster and surer method.

465H&H

I have to go along with 465. I used to carry the two in my left hand, but being very predominantly right handed I found it was quicker to pull them from a carrier and reload with my right hand

I'm very predominantly right handed, but, Like Ray, I load my double with my left hand! I too carry the two cartridges between the first two fingers of my left hand, and load both barrels similtaniously. As I have stated before here, I use a culling belt, with a Galco "DOUBLE DUTY" placed on the point of my left hip, with two rounds in it. There is no reason to carry the two rounds in your hand all the time. The time to place them there is when you start into the weeds with a Buffalo, at the end of a stalk, or in a follow-up of a wounded one!

In the last few yds of a stalk, I take two rounds, from the culling belt, and place them between my left hand fingers, When I fire both rounds, I break and dump the empties, holding with my right hand, with the butt stock between my ribs, and upper right arm. The left hand comes up with the back of my hand faceing the chambers, the rounds simply drop into the chamberss, and as my left hand slides back down the forestock closes the rifle on the way back to my shoulder. My right hand has never left the trigger area of the rifle. Now fire those two, pop the rifle open dump the empties and with my left hand I flip the DOUBLE DUTY open,it drops two rounds into my left hand for the next re-load. Gentlemen, that is six rounds, and it takes a lot less time to do, than to tell you how to do it!

I need more practice myself, because I had cancer surgery on the fore finger of my left hand a couple of yrs ago, and the nearves in that finger were really damaged, but I'm still pretty fast, and am improveing!

The little gadgit called DOUBLE DUTY, made by Galco, and available from Trader Ricks, for about $50 is worth every penney spent, and if you have several doubles with different size cartridges, you need one for each of them, that is used to shoot dangerous game.

Our last DRSS hunt we all got to see NE450#2's video of his hunt last year. Even in the face of charging elephant he always removed the two spent cases stuck them in his pocket and drew two fresh ones from the elastic shell holder around his butt stock. Each step of the reload sequence was deliberate.

We really ragged him about it!

Is this the one?

For the biggest game of all, Keith's Double Duty Cartridge Case packs two rounds for a .400 to .500 caliber double rifle. Slide this finely constructed case onto your belt to have the cartridges close at hand when you need them. Individually stitched loops maintain their shape through time and use.
price: $65.95

The method I use is one I learned when hunting with a Ruger No1.
I use a buttstock shell carrier made by http://www.murrayleather.com. The part that touches your face is smooth leather. On my 450 No2 the elastic ones would rip my face open.
I have the same one on my 9,3x74R Double. In Africa I carried soft points toward the front, and 2 solids at the back on the 9,3. On the 450 No2 I carried only solids on the stock.
With both rifles I carried a 15 round belt, also by Murray.
With a double you have several different reloading options.
You can shoot one, load one.
You can shoot 2 and load 2.
You can shoot 2 and reload only one, when you need to get a nother shot off VERY QUICKLY at an aproaching or departing animal.
When under duress or in some what of a hurry I load off of the butstock carrier. As soon as possible I refill the buttstock carrier from my shell belt.
This is the fastest, most reliable method I have found.
Also when not under duress I pull the empties out of the chamber and place them in my pocket, then reload.

I like to carry one round in my left hand because my left hand is not strong enough to carry 2 rounds all day long.

I for one would sure like to see a video of 4 fast AND ACCURATE shots from a big bore double rifle. Does anyone have one they can share?

I have read MacD37, NE 450 No 2, Ray, Robgunbuilder (very recently), and others waxing poetic on how the double is the FASTEST thing going. Now I am prepared to believe all that (really, who am I to argue?..I've never picked up a double, let alone shot one), but the skeptic in me still won't allow me to be a TRUE believer unless I see it.

Dave E. (470 Mbogo) and I have discussed this at length (over good CDN Rye Whiskey and great camp food IIRC), and we talked about possibly challenging the double rifle users here to show us how fast an "average-good double rifle user" really is with, two, three and four fast and accurate shots. We were even trying to think of a carrot for doing so, other than the obvious satisfaction of showing all us skeptics what a normal mortal guy can do with a double. Haven't come up with a good carrot yet though, being poor-boys from the near-arctic.

Hopefully I am not posting out of turn, as Dave and I have not discussed this for almost a year, but when we left off, Dave was prepared to host said video clip on his website, next to his videos of he and I shooting the 470 Mbogo quickly and accurately. It should be a good comparison, as he and I did those videos cold (unpracticed) and we consider ourselves to be pretty average'ish. I am sure there are lots of bolt users that are faster than us.

So, any interest from you double rifle users out there? To re-coin an old phrase, anyone care to put some video where your mouth is?

Cheers,
Canuck

ps: apologies for the hi-jack, but hopefully this would also be pertinent to the thread originators query.

quote:

Originally posted by Canuck:
I for one would sure like to see a video of 4 fast AND ACCURATE shots from a big bore double rifle. Does anyone have one they can share?

IMO, it would take a VERY skillful double user to get off 4 shots as fast as a guy with a bolt gun.

Really the key difference between a double and a bolt gun is that when the game is closer than 20 feet, you get 2 shots with a double compared to only one shot with a bolt gun.

Hey I carry them in my right hand, but I'm left handed!

Ed

quote:

Originally posted by Canuck:
So, any interest from you double rifle users out there? To re-coin an old phrase, anyone care to put some video where your mouth is?

Cheers,
Canuck

ps: apologies for the hi-jack, but hopefully this would also be pertinent to the thread originators query.

You know, Canuck, you are a real little trouble maker!

I agree with you however, this should be on video, and I have thought, for several years that I might do exactly what you suggest. The reason for this is not any need to prove anything to anyone. In that vain, I couldn't care less if anyone agrees or not, but simply as an instructional video, and a commercial venture. It is simply easier to show people than it is to tell them in print, at least, for me anyway. I have a book that covers all these aspects, that I have been working on for five years, and it isn't close to publishing yet. I had thought I might add the video to the book at publishing time!

My idea was to not only to show what you suggest, but instructional on handleing, and care of double rifles as well other types of bigbore rifles meant for dangerous game. Not only the comparison between them but to demonstrate the differences,visually! Also to set up rules for the fun shoots that could result from this understanding on both sides of the question, not to mention the bennefit to those first venturing into the Bush with dangerous game! Once they, as you say, see with their own eyes, then they are able to make an informed decision. GUN RAGS only teach confusion, and I agree with you, the best way is to demnonstrate it is visually!

Canuck
I have been using bolt rifles since about 1966 or 67.
I have been using double rifles for about the past 8 years.
I think I can shoot 4 aimed rounds from a double rifle as fast as I can from a bolt rifle.... but, the main advantage to a double is in shooting 2 shots. A double rifle is faster for the first AND second shot. I have discovered that even in non DG hunts that fast second shot is worth the money. Much more so than shots 3 and 4.
On a DG hunt the quick 1/2 of a double is invaluable. Also a double cannot jam.
Remember, I have used a bolt rifle a lot longer than a double, but with DG I feel MUCH better with the double.
For ANY game where the shots will be under 200 or even 250 yards the double is the superior hunting rifle in my opinion. A scoped small or medium bore double is a great hunting rifle. I "discovered" this using my 9,3x74R for all game from problem skunks, armidillos, up through coyotes, bobcat, deer, wild pigs, black bear, impalla, civet cat, side striped jackel, baboon, waterbuck,and kudu.
If I could only have one or two rifles to do ALL of my hunting they would both be doubles.

What are the disadvantages to a double rifle compared to other action types?
1. The main one is cost.
2. A double will weigh more than a super light plastic stock mountain rifle.
3. Usually a double rifle will not shoot as good on paper as a good bolt rifle, but I do not think the game can tell the difference. I have taken a coyote at 271 yards and a kudu at a little over 300 yards with my 9,3x74R, which is not a long range rifle. just think what I could do with a 7x65R or an 8x75R .

To anyone who is a doubting Thomas, or wants to test the theory, just buy a Chapuis 9,3x74R, scope it and do some hunting. [Or any other quality 9,3x74R].
You too will be amazed. I know I have been.

Why a double rifle?
Canuck, check this thread out.. Real world report!
double rifle on elephant

Mac, yah, I guess I am a bit of a trouble maker, but hey, in this day and age posting up a bit of video is as easy as cake. Heck, I could video something with my cell phone, send it to my e-mail address and have it hosted on-line in minutes. So I don't think I am asking too much here.

I do look forward to your book, and think a companion video would be great! Unfortunately I am your typical Gen-X'er and need instant gratification!!

NE450#2 (and Rusty), Its not that I think you guys are full of baloney or anything, and I sincerely do take your experience seriously (that includes all of you double users up to and including Rob's recent experience on that elephant), its just that I have a helluva time making my brain take it on faith that a BIG BORE DOUBLE (like 470 NE and up) is all that much faster to shoot ACCURATELY than an equivalent BIG BORE BOLT-ACTION, particularly on shots 1, 3 and 4. You guys can tell me that it is so until you are blue in the face, but I don't think I'll really get it until I see it. When I see pictures of guys in full recoil from a 500 Merkel like these DRSS Hunt, I even have more trouble believing that you can get an accurate second shot off faster than a decent guy with a rifle!

If I knew someone that had a double rifle I could try, that would probably solve it for me. But I don't, so I was hoping one of you guys could show me over the internet.

What would be great is if someone could video themselves using their 470 NE (or bigger) double, shooting at 4 canteloupe (or something about that size) at 20 yards or so. I can convert any format (VHS, 8mm, Dig-8, DVC, etc) and get it hosted on-line, if you can't do that yourself.

I'd be happy to shoot some more video of myself or Dave E shooting our 470 Mbogos at the same kind of target, at the same distance, sequence, etc.

No matter how it turned out, the side-by-side comparison (no pun intended!) would make an interesting and educational bit of video, don't you guys agree?

Don't make me triple-dog-dare you!

Cheers,
Canuck

Canuck
Before I started shooting double rifles I was prepared to believe that they were faster for the first and second shots. After using them for several year, I an say that I prefer them to any other type rifle for dangerous game.
Try and come to our next DRSS Pig hunt. You can shoot several different doubles, and hunt with one of mine.
As with any thing new it might take more than one hunt to convince you, but with a little practice you will probably see the light.
I do know when I am in in an area with DG, be it Africa or Bear country I feel much safer with the double.

As to the recoil, when shooting a hard kicking gun at paper the tendency is to roll with the punch. On my video when shooting my 450 at game the barrels seem to rise only 4 to 6 inches.

quote:

Originally posted by Canuck:

No matter how it turned out, the side-by-side comparison (no pun intended!) would make an interesting and educational bit of video, don't you guys agree?

Don't make me triple-dog-dare you!

Cheers,
Canuck

I'd pay to see that, as long as I could view it on my dial up line.
More random thoughts:

People could retake video until they managed to get the "perfect" reload.

One go each may go to the luckiest on the day.

What if the bolt CRF jammed??

No, seriously now, the trouble I would have with a double is knowing (in some circumstances) when to reload after just fireing one shot.

EG. J. Hunter liked to always reload after just one shot where possible, but one day in the thick stuff he looked down while reloading and admitted he would have been wacked except his offsider allerted him to DG (Elle by memory) almost on top of him.

He had time only to close up and shoot from the hip. He had looked down because he couldn't see anything (whereas the Native could.)
John L.

Two things come to mind...

500,
If you carried your two rounds with a buckskin glove, you could sleep with two rounds between your fingers, try it....

The other thing is I don't care for ejectors as it requires you to physicaly break open a tight action, and you have to lower the gun to do this unless your gun is worn out....Extractors will fall open from the weight of the barrel and can be loaded with droping the gun to waist level if your so inclined....

Bottom line is there is no reason to be fast, shoot straight is the key to success, the PH is standing right beside you..every time anyone gets all panicky and tries to be fast the drop everything...It's totally counter productive IMO...

Ganyana posted earlier this year on the results of the Zim PH test results. One of the stages requires shooting, IIRC, targets at something like 30, 20 and 10yds then 10, 20 and 30. Scores are for both time and accuacry. The winner and second ... all shot 470's.

On AfricanHunter.com again, IIRC, there is discussion of time trails done and how at first they limited the magazine guys to the number of rounds in the rifle to act as a handicap to help out the double rifle guys on the third and fourth shots. This turned out to be unnessecary as the double guys were faster all around.

I'd post links if I knew how.

JPK

quote:

Originally posted by JPK:
Ganyana posted earlier this year on the results of the Zim PH test results. One of the stages requires shooting, IIRC, targets at something like 30, 20 and 10yds then 10, 20 and 30. Scores are for both time and accuacry. The winner and second ... all shot 470's.

On AfricanHunter.com again, IIRC, there is discussion of time trails done and how at first they limited the magazine guys to the number of rounds in the rifle to act as a handicap to help out the double rifle guys on the third and fourth shots. This turned out to be unnessecary as the double guys were faster all around.

I'd post links if I knew how.

JPK

NOW! Canuck, there is some data you can wrap your head around!



I'm sure, however, you will want someone you know to do it on film! then you'll say well it is edited.


Posted by RAY:
Bottom line is there is no reason to be fast, shoot straight is the key to success, the PH is standing right beside you..every time anyone gets all panicky and tries to be fast they drop everything...It's totally counter productive IMO...quote

Or get two rounds vieing for one chamber, in a PF bolt rifle!

The above quote by Ray, also applies to bolt rifles as well, and in particular to push feed bolt rifles, but in any type rifle for that matter.

IMO, the key is to be as quick as you can be, without fumbleing, and that speed is aquired only by lots of shooting of your particular rifle type. I will admit, there are few who shoot thier 470NE, or larger rifles nearly enough, but that also applies to heavy kicking bolt rifle that throw expensive bullet down range. That is one of the benefits of owning smaller caliber double rifle, of the exact same type. With them the shooting is not only cheaper, but is easier on your shoulder, so you shoot them far more often. The habits developed by shooting these "LITTLE" doubles, transfers dirrectly to the way you handle your big bore, when under attack.

The clinical forum, as you find on a rifle range, is not the way to demonstrate this unless you are shooting against time or other shooters, while dodging obsticles, to give you a case of nearves. Sort of like Cowboy shooting compitition, where you are shooting against the clock, and running a course of obsticles, at the same time. As I said in an earlier post, you start with the rifle loaded on your shoulder African carry, with two rounds between your fingers, time starts when you start down with the rifle off your shoulder, you fire two shots, at a life size Buffalo target with no aiming points on it, then while dumping the two empties, and re-loading the rifle you move to the other side of a barrier, and shoot two more rounds at another, or the same target, then re-load the rifle and shoulder it for shots 5&6, time stops, with the rifle loaded, with the 5&6 rounds in the chambers, and at the shoulder, ready to fire the last two. Any shot that is not in the kill zone is considered a miss, and effects the final score. Canuck suggested cantalopes, as targets, and that is alright, but does not speak to the use, these rifles are made for. The kill zone on Buffalo is much larger than any catalope I ever saw, and few buffalo have a bulls eye on their chest.

Most big bore bolt rifles will be totally dry, by the third round, and will require either single loading for shot 4,and a re-load of two rounds in the magazine to end with two rounds in the rifle, and fourshots on target. 5,and 6,would require a lengthly reloading of the magazine,and the working of the bolt again to have the rifle ready to shoot again to finish with 4 shots on target, and with two left in the rifle, when time stops. In this exercise, all rounds fired have to be in the kill zone on target. The lack of aiming points requires the shooter to know where he must hit the Buffalo without a bull's eye, the way he has to shoot in the field on a real buffalo.

This would make a fine fun competition!

Maybe we can set one of these up at our next DRSS shoot, and film it!

quote:

Originally posted by Canuck:
........ You guys can tell me that it is so until you are blue in the face, but I don't think I'll really get it until I see it. When I see pictures of guys in full recoil from a 500 Merkel like these DRSS Hunt, I even have more trouble believing that you can get an accurate second shot off faster than a decent guy with a rifle!

Canuck

Won't the recoil of a similar chambered rifle be equivalent in effect whether from a double or a bolt action?

So the recoil of the first shot on the speed on the second shot should largely be a mute point?

I'd like to try one of the butt mounted ammo holders 450No2NE recommends. But are they faster than a good ammo belt or holder at the waist on the front of the waist on the same side as the reloading hand?

quote:

Won't the recoil of a similar chambered rifle be equivalent in effect whether from a double or a bolt action?

So the recoil of the first shot on the speed on the second shot should largely be a mute point?

I think that is exactly why my brain has trouble processing the fact that a double is that much quicker. You don't have to wait until recoil is over to work the bolt. It takes little practice to master racking the bolt quickly following the shot, and much of the time involved in chambering the next round occurs while the rifle is off target during recoil. In fact, the way I do it, slamming the bolt home is part of target acquisition for the next shot (ie. bearing down on the target). I am sure that a double is going to be a little quicker during target acquisition on shot #2, but is it significantly faster?

Cheers,
Canuck

quote:

I'm sure, however, you will want someone you know to do it on film! then you'll say well it is edited.

Hey Mac, ... please understand that my intention here is not to cause trouble. I will take anyones video as authentic. I am sure the double is faster for shot #2 at least, I would just like to see it so that I can rid myself of nagging doubts!! And I am curious how many guys are actually good at getting another couple rounds loaded and back into action. With todays technology getting that on video and sharing it here shouldn't have to trouble anyone much.

If no-one wants to go to that trouble, that's fine. It doesn't hurt to ask, eh? And I promise I won't resort to calling any of you double users chicken! (sorry couldn't resist! )

This topic does come up once a year or so... wouldn't it be nice to have some video to point the next skeptic to, so that you don't have to repeat the same anecdotal stuff all over again??

BTW, I 100% agree with you and Ray on not trying to be too fast...which unfortunately doesn't help me convince the skeptic in me that a double is really faster in the field!

Cheers guys,
Canuck

quote:

Originally posted by Canuck:

quote:

I'm sure, however, you will want someone you know to do it on film! then you'll say well it is edited.

And I promise I won't resort to calling any of you double users chicken! (sorry couldn't resist! )

Cheers guys,
Canuck

Canuck, you are quite a guy!

quote:

Canuck, you are quite a guy!

The problem is that I really enjoy my own sense of humor. Drives my GF up the wall sometimes. You guys generally get off pretty easy!

Cheers,
Canuck

Hey Canuck,

What is the price of a sheep hunt these days?

quote:

Originally posted by Canuck:
Now I am prepared to believe all that (really, who am I to argue?..I've never picked up a double, let alone shot one), but the skeptic in me still won't allow me to be a TRUE believer unless I see it.

Cheers,
Canuck

Canuck,

Do you ever get down to the Seattle region? I have a (Searcy) 500NE I'd be willing to let you take a couple of pops with if you'd like. After all a guy should have the option to scramble his thought process' with a double if he's game

Roi

P.S. Send Me a PM if your interested.

quote:

Originally posted by Canuck:
Now I am prepared to believe all that (really, who am I to argue?..I've never picked up a double, let alone shot one), but the skeptic in me still won't allow me to be a TRUE believer unless I see it.

Cheers,

Canuck

Next time I come up to Horsefly I'll bring along a 577 and some other caliber. If you can get down to there or even meet at McCleese Lake at Cariboo's you can see for yourself.

Mr. C,

The only place a double has any advantage over a bolt gun is from 15 yards in, when he is coming to get you....That quick 2nd shot from a double can save you a stomping...

Inasmuch as we usually have a PH and maybe another hunter with us, a double is a big boys toy, and thats about it...Now I know that has all the double gun afficiendos shrinking back in the fetal position, knashin of teeth, and spewing Metamucil, but its a fact...

I love my double, but I don't try to make everyone believe its the last thing in the world of gundom, its just another rifle that I love to hunt with..Nostalgia for the most part and I'm a nostalgic kinda guy....

Mr. A, Thanks for your comments. FWIW, I am sure I would love doubles too, being a nostalgic myself. Perhaps when I am finished paying the mortgage off in 20 years or so I'll get one myself! Til then I can get in lots of hunting with that $$. Same reason I have lots of skulls/horns and very few wall-mounts!

510 Wells, I really appreciate the offer. I have never been to Seattle, and don't see myself travelling there in the foreseeable future, but I might take you up on it if the opportunity comes up!

Mickey, I do get to the Cariboo region from time to time. Next time (or one of the times!) you are up we should see if we can meet. I am sure Dave E. would come up from the coast for that too.

Cheers guys,
Canuck

quote:

Originally posted by Atkinson:
Mr. C,

The only place a double has any advantage over a bolt gun is from 15 yards in, when he is coming to get you....That quick 2nd shot from a double can save you a stomping...

Inasmuch as we usually have a PH and maybe another hunter with us, a double is a big boys toy, and thats about it...Now I know that has all the double gun afficiendos shrinking back in the fetal position, knashin of teeth, and spewing Metamucil, but its a fact...

I love my double, but I don't try to make everyone believe its the last thing in the world of gundom, its just another rifle that I love to hunt with..Nostalgia for the most part and I'm a nostalgic kinda guy....

Ray,

Are you coming out to the double gun shoot on the 8th?

I hear that they are going to have managed care facilities there for people who need it..

I will take you up on this challenge. If I can get up to my ranch, I'll bring two doubles and a video cammera and see just how fast I can shoot and reload 4 aimed shots at gallon water jugs at 25 yrds. I still have my CAS timer so it starts with the first shot.-Rob

Sounds good! That was my original request! I would also like to see you shoot and load one round. The reason, of course, is that you can't just tip 'em out, but presumably have to extract it by hand.
Thanks, Peter.

quote:

I will take you up on this challenge. If I can get up to my ranch, I'll bring two doubles and a video cammera and see just how fast I can shoot and reload 4 aimed shots at gallon water jugs at 25 yrds. I still have my CAS timer so it starts with the first shot.-Rob

Rob, you ROCK! Thanks! Looking forward to seeing it....just wish I could be in Tx in Nov to video tape personally!

Cheers,
Canuck

Peter,

I have an ejector gun so there is no tipping necessary. Just open the action and the spent shell flies out.

I've played this game against a bolt gun. A really good bolt gun operator who knows how to work a bolt gun I.E. somebody whom knows that you never need to take the rifle off your shoulder to reload and knows how to do a rapid bolt flick. Will on most occasions come out just about even.

A guy who hasn't been trained in bolt operation will be slower than a good double gunner. And a slow double gunner will be slower than a good bolt operator.

That is for four rounds. No bolt gun on earth is as fast as a double on two rounds.

I learned a double reload from a friend of mine who is a very competent combat shot gunner and who teaches home defense and teaches it with a double SXS shotgun.

This is by far the fastest way I've ever seen anybody reload a double.

I carry my two extra rounds in the palm of my weak hand with the rounds facing me and resting under the forearm of the rifle. When I go to reload I simply open the action let the empty eject out take my left hand which has the rounds in it and place them into the barrels. Much like the rounds between the fingers but it takes less fine motor skill to do it my way and it's faster.

I don't walk around all day with the rounds in my hand. I take them out of my shell holder and place them in my hand when the action is getting ready to start.

As far as one being better than another. There are great bolt guns there are great doubles. there are also lousy doubles and lousy bolt guns. Shoot what you like and what you practice with and what your good with.

But to say that a bolt gun is under all circumstances superior to a double for all hunting application outside of 15 yards is complete horseshit.

A good double with a competent man behind it is every bit as accurate as a good bolt gun out to any range you'd be hunting DG under normal circumstances.

And yes if I were wanting to snipe buffalo at 200 plus yards I'd not do that with any double I'd want my scoped .375.

However if I've got a wounded buff breaking cover at 200 yards I'll put a bullet up his rear with my .470.

Practice.. practice....practice

I don't try and convince people that a double is the end all weapon in the world either. But they are not as limited as some would make you think.

Unless of course your double happens to be shooting 5 or 6 inches left to right, barrel to barrel at 10 yards. Then you've got a serious problem.

Surestike,
I was but now I am afraid I would be stoned and left for the coyotes or shunned and placed in a corner table!

Actually I have a roping that week, then another right after that one someplace that skips my mind at the moment..

Cunnuck,
I shot a lot of about everything before I could afford a double rifle and lived through it somehow! I think 99% of the hunters are better off with a bolt gun that is scoped on dangerous game...Anyone that doubts that is just out to lunch and become a fanatic on doubles...

I love my double, love to hunt with it, but I have seen many ocassions wherein a scoped bolt rifle would have better suited the situation, but today I can live with those situations and pass on those shots if I must...I see situations every year where the client wished he had his scoped bolt rifle rather than his double...

I can be just as happy with either...A nice light 8 Lb. 10.75x68 or .375 H&H has a lot of appeal about 4 PM in the hot African sun and 10 to 15 miles behind you...This I promise...