quote:

Originally posted by Michael McGuire:
Ron,

A 510 on the 338 Lapua (improved ?) is an interesting way to go, plenty of room in the Mark V magazine. I see yo have the extended magazine

By the way that stagger load but fed inline is what the 224 Wbys were. Roy knew what he was doing.

Mike,


Aye, the feed lips at the top of the Weatherby sheetmetal box do allow for identical/consistent feeding of the top round coming out of the box.
No left versus right feeding issues.
A good DGR feature.
Jeez, I am starting to like Roy Weatherby!


Best DGR scope mounting, IMHO:

Glue on a steel Picatinny or steel Weaver-style cross-slot bases (2-piece better for a DGR) with 8X40 screws and no worries.

I am really impressed with the Burris Xtreme Tactical rings. They make steel 2-piece bases also.
They just replaced Leupold QRW rings in my preference.
I can carry a 1/2" socket "Atkinson Tool" in my pocket to use in field if needed. But will probably never need to tighten them in the field:

Burris specifies to torque the main mounting "base" nuts to "65 to 100 in-lbs, and for the ring tops 20 in-lbs."




Now there is something better than OEM integral base and CZ or Ruger rings:
Glue on a steel cross-slot base(s) and use the Burris Xtreme Tactical rings.
The rings are mainly constructed of aluminum alloy (must have some titanium in there) saves weight. However, the important base nuts and crossbolt/recoil stops on the bottoms of the rings are steel and are square pegs in square holes.







The low 1" and 30mm rings will work great on a sporting DGR, slug gun, etc.
The looks please my aesthetics.

Only two rings will be needed for lightweight DGR scope on a .458 Lott.

1" or 30 mm scope tube, low or medium height rings:

1" low height:



30mm low height:



30mm medium height:



30mm high height:



30mm rings, high height, able to get a third ring on the Ruger No. 1 Picatinny on this 500 A-Square with the heavy "Eurolux" scope, that just got moved off of the Weatherby Mark V 500 Bateleur shown previously:





Now that I have the bases sorted out on the Wby Mark V, the 1-inch-tubed Sightron 4-16X will go back on that again,
with 2 Burris Xtreme Tactical rings of medium height.
Two of the Burris rings are all that will fit instead of the 4 lesser rings used previously.




On a DGR you can also replace one of your ring tops with one of these (parts is parts), either 1" or 30mm size replacement parts available:



Put a micro red dot/reflex sight on top of a ring for point and shoot.

Ron,

Agree 100% but for any rifle.

Have I been knocked on the head or are those tactical rings kinda cool?

RIP - if you have a set of lows, can you tell me the distance between the top of the action and bottom of main scope tube?

quote:

Originally posted by BaxterB:
Have I been knocked on the head or are those tactical rings kinda cool?

RIP - if you have a set of lows, can you tell me the distance between the top of the action and bottom of main scope tube?

BaxterB,
I will not scrap my QRW lever rings, but I will not be needing anymore of them, now that I know about the Burris Xtreme Tactical rings.

About the heights:

This is the distance from bottom of ring to the bottom of the scope tube, for both 1-Inch and 30mm diameter rings that I have measured:

Low: 0.250"
Medium: 0.500"
High: 0.750"
Extra-High: 1.000"

All are increments of 1/4" above the flat top of the Weaver-style or Picatinny base.
The bases may vary in height from 0.185" to 0.650" above the front action receiver, on rifles I have, and a greater range than that does exist,
so add your specific base height to the ring height, and select ring height accordingly.

Now I hear there are 34mm-diameter rings offered too, and I believe those heights are the same:
Low: 1/4"
Medium: 1/2"
High: 3/4"
Extra High: 1"

BTW, using more than a pair of these Burris Xtreme Tactical rings is overkill on most rifle and scope combos.

A pair of rings means a dozen ring-top screws (8x40 and 1/2" long each), and the 1/2" main mounting nuts can be torqued to 100 inch-pounds.
65 to 100 is recommended but I am too lazy to get past 65 inch-pounds, 65 will gitterdun.
One pair of rings should be bomb proof in attaching scope and rings to base.
Just make sure the base-to-rifle attachment is good.

Thanks for the info - very helpful. Off to do some measuring of my own… :-)

Welcome,
I am learning about these rings too!

Example:
I have them on bassackwards here:

My nuts are on the left side of the rifle: Wrong!



I need to flip the rings 180 degrees to face the other way so nuts are on right side of the rifle, and the precision-machined recoil stop on the bottom faces forward, toward the muzzle of the rifle.
Best square fit of the cross slot in base to recoil stop on bottom of ring!

I will redo this, nuts to right instead of left,
and I can also use medium height instead of high rings on this rifle:




There is a quarter inch to spare, since my Picatinny is so high on that Ruger No.1 rifle.
I can also get rid of the third ring, I do believe.
That will be a lot prettier! Medium height and only two robust rings I can trust.
Though I will still be putting silicone adhesive in the bottom half of the rings, whether needed or not!

Live and learn, self taught.
Well! These rings have a front and back, a left and a right side, and a top and a bottom. Not reversible in any way!

Proper installation of a beater scope:



A smaller 1/2" socket tool will be easily devised and carried in pocket for QD field use. The pocket socket tool.
Use Wheeler Engineering F.A.T. Wrench ("Firearms Accurizing Tool") for proper torque.



Even a beater scope is a thing of beauty when properly mounted.
The matte ring surface on a matte scope surface, all degreased, grips well enough not to need the silicone adhesive here, most likely,
but I did the silicone anyway.

Ron,

Yo might win the title on Big Bores for some of the most innovative wildcats but you DEFINITELY win the title for photography and drawings

By the way, do you know what happened to Mr 577 T Rex, Mitch, is he still with us.

For those who are newer to the forum Mitch was the one that got Saeed to start Big Bores and he used shoot a 577 T Rex from the bench with the both the number of shots and accuracy that most people wold be happy doing with a 243!!!!

RIP, thanks for the tutorial. Great photos and SOUND advice! I learned a lot that will be incorporated into my next project.

Wow! All I can say is my experience with 8/40s on the real big bores is limited to one 458 Lott and one 505 gibbs IMP. in which case, after some use I opted for a receiver sight on one and a shallow V on the other, Neither I nor the scopes could take much more than those two kickers!!

The reason some folks claim no problem with scopes on big bores is their bores are not big enogh or they have not shot them enough to have a problem IMO...Ive never seen a 505 or a 458 Lott or larger with a shot out bore as a matter of fact they all looked new even after a 100 or so years.

Mike,
Last I heard, Mitch was selling his T-rex, bought a Chevy Corvette, and moved to Florida, retired from his job in New York.
Unfortunately retired from ar.com also, although his 577 Tyrannosaur data lives on, in the reloading pages.
In the spring of 2001 I made the pilgrimages to Long Island, New York gun ranges indoors and outdoors (not the Creedmoor range). New York, imagine that!
Mitch did stuff like this with his 577 T-rex at an indoor 100-yard range:



Hell, I was there, as Elmer would say. I guess Mitch stopped after three shots so as not to risk his point-one group, for bragging purposes.

His scope and mounts for this:
A Leupold fixed 6X in Leupold dual-dovetail mounts, with the BASES SOLDERED AND SCREWED onto the BBK-02 rifle.

Barrel installation and chambering were by Pac-Nor, with the remainder of gunsmithing metalwork and stockwork by Harry McGowen himself.
Harry actually made the BBK-02 boltface and magazine work for the 577 T-rex,
and most amazing of all, Harry McGowen did the boat building to make an MPI fiberglass&foam stock stand up to the pounding.

Ron,

I used to speak to him quite a bit on the phone and he told me then he was going to move to Florida. I also seem to remember him saying he had blood shot eyes from recoil.

I first met him back in 98 just after AR started and in those days the forum was one of those continuous one page of threads. Changed in 2000.

For his "small stuff" he had 378s and 460s

I remember your visit to Mitch as you posted about it. It's interesting to go back to the posts/threads on Big Bores from years ago...a 100 times more active.

Thanks for the replies, JC and Ray.

The hobby of sporter-weight big bore benchrest shooting:
Goal is personal best for 3 shots at 100 yards.
PAST pads and muzzlebrakes are legal. Lead Sleds are not.
Any optics feasible within total rifle weight limits for rifle plus sights:
Weight limits:
.500-.555 caliber: 14 lbs or less
.556-.625 caliber: 18 lbs or less
.626-.999 caliber: 24 lbs or less
1.000-caliber and greater: Whatever!

Weigh-in of my 500 A-Square Ruger No.1 with latest scope and rings: 12 lbs and 12 ounces = 12.75 pounds.
Lead or mercury in the butt would improve the fat-barreled balance and keep it below 14 pounds.

This hobby is best practiced in conjunction with plinking with a 22 rimfire to conclude a day at the range.
My personal best for a qualifying big bore, is shown below, done with same Ruger No. 1 shown above (a long-throated, long-loaded 500 A-Square) and a Leupold VX-III 1.5-5x20mm scope in 4 Weaver rings, set at 5X power.
I am trying to beat this with my new beater scope and mounts, 10X possible now:





Backside of above target with approximate impact points of the three shots marked:



This hobby will either improve your .458 Lott shooting or ruin it.

Good bullets are the best way to good groups.



In .510-caliber I still have some S&H 535-grainers, AAA Harlow 705-grainers, Hornady A-Max 750-grainers, and some GSC 450, 570, and 800-grainers.
They all have benchrest potential, loaded properly.
My throat has 0.400" of parallell-sided freebore, just 0.100" longer than the standard 500 A2 IIRC.
Therefore, 0.588" total throat with bevel in front of case mouth and leade included.
Even with all that slop, if you load them long enough, they will shoot, practical in a Ruger No. 1.

Correction:
F.A.T. Wrench = Firearm Accurizing Torque Wrench
shown here along with a pocket socket tool for "Quick Detachable Lever" use in field.

This more recent F.A.T. Wrench only reads to 60 inch-pounds.
An older one that I have, and still use, has a top setting of 65 inch-pounds.
I do not go over 65 inch pounds on the Burris nuts or the CZ main mounting screws.
Don't forget to dial the setting down to zero after use, for storage with tension off the spring.

Also shown is the 5mm hex bit for torquing CZ OEM rings that have had the slot-head screws replaced with 5mm socket cap screws,
but the simple Allen Wrench/hex key works great for a CZ pocket tool.





Got this one sorted out too:
Extra high 30 mm rings required for this one.
Also, no reason not to use three rings on this one,
even if they are Burris Xtreme tactical rings,
pleasing to the eye here:



What does all of this have to do with Talley rings and bases on a .458 Lott?

Well, there are stronger setups, but Talley will work OK, except for the poorly designed Talley-CZ rings, do not use those on the integral CZ bases.
But, if using the acceptable Talley add-on, dove tail bases with Talley rings, you really ought to have the bases attached with 8x40 screws and epoxy, or screwed and soldered,
and use some RTV silicone sealant/adhesive or 3M Liquid Electrician's Tape inside the rings.
Also, do not over-tighten the levers, or you will strip them.
And use a lightweight scope.

This is all that Forrest Gump had to say about that.

I've used Talley QDs on heavy recoiling rifles, including CZs in .458 Lott and .500 A-Square, for years.

No problems whatsoever.

But maybe I've just been lucky.

I've been accused of that many times, but never convicted!

Rip, my "cheater pipe" is a 2" piece of arrow shaft with a fancy grained small marble size polished wood ball, its pretty and cute, but should one crank down on it such as you suggest it would simply split out..you use it to snug the levers pretty tight and to get them in the same direction,in my case that's straight up and tight..A big ole boy like yourself could probably tighten them as tight as my pipe can, but I can get mine off faster I betcha..

Most standard Weaver type rings could be converted to quick detachable by replacing the nuts that come with them with wing nuts.

Forrest Gump told me that levers which tighten clockwise must be pointed up when they are on the right side of the rifle,
and they must be pointed down when they are on the left side of the rifle,
so that recoil does not loosen them but acts to keep them tightened.
Or you can just align both levers parallel to the bore axis pointing muzzleward or buttward, whether on right or left side of rifle,
but such precision as exactly 0-degree angle from the bore is fussy.

Forrest also likes old steel strap Weaver rings but hates the way they cant the scope on the final tightening. Too fussy to get the scope reticle square to bore, but it can be done with a lot of re-doing.
Forrest also says no need for wingnuts on the old Weaver rings to make them QD, just keep the right size coin or token from Chucky Cheese in your pocket.
You will get better leverage with a big coin than with a little wingnut.
A Mossberg choke tool in your pocket is even better than a coin.
Works on Ruger rings too.