I was at my gun shop today picking up some cleaning supplies. A "gentleman" was telling me that a double rifle (he shoots a 470 Nitro)has a different type of recoil than a bolt rifle does and is more punishing. Does anybody have experience shooting a 460 weatherby(factory loads 500 grain) and 577 Nitro? The reason I'm asking is because I'm talking to Butch Searcy about having my 577 weight 11 pounds vs 13 pounds. I shoot 20 rounds(460 Weatherby) factory loads per range practice session. You guys are great with your feedback. Thank you!..steve

AKA:
In the past, most double rifles in .577 NE chambering would have been fitted to their owners. This means that felt recoil was reduced by correct stock fit. A weatherby .460 on the other hand is more likely to be bought off the shelf, so stock fit could be less than perfect.

Recoil velocity, rather than just recoil energy, is a big part of felt recoil. The bigger bullet with lower velocity will give the least felt recoil, all else being equal.

Having said that, there is a very good reason why the big British NEs were built heavy. Reduce the weight significantly, and you will increase both recoil energy and recoil velocity. Be prepared to seriously notice the difference between a 13-lb and an 11-lb .577! Up to you, mate.

The saving grace is that Butch will fit the stock perfectly for you by all accounts, and that will count for a lot.

BTW, the "gentleman" was FOS IMHO!

the "recoil" is about the same..

the VELOCITY of the recoil is a different question..

the weatherby will feel MUCH sharper.

an 11# 577 would be next to unshootable, no matter how good the fit, without a ton of training and "build up" of loads

I probably could shoot that power level in a straight stock bolt gun (and do in a lighter gun ...550express) ... but having spent some range time WITH a near 14# 577, I can tell you, without a doubt, the FELT recoil of the 577 is more, mostly due to flip.


Marrakai, I tend to disagree on a couple reasons

1: most 577s are NOT fitted to the current owner... as that would alter a high desirable collectable weapon - Butch is one of the few still making these with any regularity, and is the exception.

2: the $$ require to have a 460 fitted is FAR less than a double ..

jeffe

Jeffe:
I did say that in the past most large-bore doubles would have been fitted to their owners.

And according to AKA's original post, he is having his .577 built by Butch Searcy! That means a custom fitted stock as I understand it. As far as dollars go, its already paid for with the Searcy.

Have I missed something?

My 577 weighed 13.5 pounds was a handful. The recoil was grim enough but the muzzle flip would really get your attention. I wouldn't even consider a 577 at 11 pounds, I'm not strong enough to hang onto the gun!

Marraki,
no insult intended, however the heyday of double rifles was pre-WWII ... which means 60 years ago.. In that reference, (and in the past) most guns are were not fitted to their user, assuming 109 years since the advent of nitro rounds, I dare to say most of these rifles didn't have a 10 year field life.. and a gent at 45 probably would not be shooting/carrying his 577 a decade later. .. so that leaves 99 years of it's life, from the first ones, to now. Effectively, assuming a 20 year carreer of the hunter, that means it would pass through 5 to 6 new owners, if kept in that 20 year cycle, and perhaps fitted to the first one or two.

The incident that he's getting a searcy makes fitting the critical issue in the conversation. With butch making customo fit rifles, he'll be able to have it fit, as one hasn't truely been since the days of the army navy, in terms of affordability.

In short, over the course of the 577 nitro's life (about 109 years) It would be safe to assume that LESS than 20% of the owners were fit to the guns- - I realize that's an odd construction, but accurate ... so your statement would only apply to new owners

jeffe

What is actually fit in a Searcy? I am sure length of pull but what else. Does he use a try stock?

LOP, cast, cant, tip(or tilt), comb height and grip..

basically everything

jeffe

sorry for the late response. Was out of town on business..My 577 will be fitted. Thank you all for your feedback. I think i will increase the rifle weight to 13 pounds. Using the accurate reloading recoil section that would put the recoil in the range of my 460 weatherby. Thanks again..steve

IMHO- neither the .577NE or .460 Wby has enough recoil to really bother you. Get a past shoulder pad and shoot the gun alot. remember though, your gonna be carrying that 13lb gun much more than you'll be shooting it. You'll never feel the recoil in the field anyway. I'd go 11 lbs myself.-Rob

Steve: maybe we can discuss further on the phone, but i would put a LOT of credibility in what JohnS says. Not to take anything away from the other folks here, but I KNOW John and he's had them all and shot them all. In any case there are two salient issues with the 57 that give me pasue to think. One is muzzle flip. One of the pluses of a double it's the ability to get off a quick second shot at a fleeting (or charging) animal that will either bite, claw, stomp gore (or any combination thereof) you into a furry-bloody mess. To my way of thinking, the 577's muzzle flip will negate the efficacy of that second shot and if you are shooting from a less than optimum position, i.e., kneeling, crouching, etc., that 577 will most likely knock you on your rear end. Second, a 13lb rifle is going to be a tough nut to crack on long walks after elephant. I can tell you that my 11.5lb plus scope Ruger Rigby kicked my ass pretty good and I run 4 miles/day.

I guess my own preferences are showing, but I really do like the 500NE! jorge

Jorge, You know you have always given me great advice. Do you really think there is much of a difference between at 460 and 577? Using a 13 pound (577) rifle ..the recoil of a 577 is a little less that a 460 WBY. (using accurates recoil tables) But I would think in a standing position the difference would not be that noticeable. But you guys are the pros..Thats why i post and get you all advice..I'll call you..hey..thanks again..steve

Prone position? Ouch.

quote:

Originally posted by MTM:
Prone position? Ouch.

standing..brain slip..

thanks for pointing that out..I need to clean up that post!!!