Hi
I'm intrested in having some Integral features on my barrel, ie. barrel-banded front sight ramp, front swivel and recoil lug. Who do you recomend for this barrel??
Dr B

Are you talking about having those features machined into the barrel starting from a large enough blank? If so ,talk to Butch Searcy and expect to pay $2-4K. There are some serious plusses and minuses to this approach that you need to consider.-Rob

or dan peddersen, and expect a years + wait

jeffe

Ralf Martini should be on your short list.

- stu

Robgunbuilder What are the minuses of having these features machined in to the barrel?
Dr B

Robgunbuilder
A while back I asked the fourm about Searcyes work when I was looking at one of his bolt guns. It was a honest question to my AR friends about this rifle. Searcy then got on the thread and acted all pissed that I would ask the fourm for references, It was uncalled for several of the members took up for our right to ask questions.
I have never met Searcy but if this is his attitude He's not some one I would do bussines with.
Check the thread under my name from several months ago.
Dr B

All of my dealings with Mr. Searcy have been extremely pleasant and fruitful. He has been extremly service-oriented for his customers, and he produces a product with excellent value for the price. Sometimes things read differently on the internet than if spoken in person.

Disadvantages of integral barrel hardware:

1. waiting time to get your barrel

2. cost

3. If not done properly, the barrel can have residual stresses which negatively influence accuracy.

Martini & Hagn, I would definitely give them a call. They do very nice work and are considered some of the best in the industry for this.

http://www.martiniandhagngunmakers.com/

quote:
What about the Searcy bolt rifle, how do they fair as a DGR. Is the quality equal to the price.
Thanks
Dr B



quote:
Dr. B inquired about my bolt rifles on several different forums. I fail to understand why one would ask questions on a forum about a product or person and not go to the source...



quote:
ARE YOU SERIOUS? People are "cranks" for posting honest inquiriries or giving honest responses that were often based upon personal conversations with Butch? COME ON! The day a manufacturer of ANYTHING gets pissed off at me for asking the honest opinion of his customers is the day I shop elsewhere.

JMHO,

John


[quote] It was suggested that Dr.B simply "call Butch and ask him" and then Butch (with an obvious tone of annoyance) posts, "I fail to understand why one would ask questions on a forum about a product or person and not go to the source." Sorry Dan, this is ridiculous. As if someone is supposed to call Butch and ask "hey, are your rifles any good" [/qote]

These are a couple quotes from the thread I mentioned I'm sorry if I ofended anyone but Searcys tone put me off.
Dr B

I would recommend that you go with the Granite Mountain Arms barrel. John Roden cnc machines integral feature barrels on a regular basis. John uses an oversize kreiger barrel blank. I have installed about 150 of his integral barrrels and they are straight, they shoot awesome groups as well. Back in May of this year gunmaker and I (Timan) finished A joint build of a 416 Rigby, gunmaker stocked it and I did all the metalwork, final assembly and range work for regulation of the open sights. The customer is absolutely elated about this rifle, targets shot at 100yds with a scope are impressive his smallest group is .599 for 3 shots the first two shots in this small group actually measure .092 center to center, he claims he got a little excited about that and pulled the third shot a little and opened up the group to .599, the rifle is doing what it should. Lots of good accuracy reports have been coming back to me on the other GMA barrel jobs as well. I did a 375 H&H GMA barreled action for for Gene Simillion that is shooting sub-moa groups, Gene of course stocked it and his customer is thrilled. They've all been shooting very well and it is not by accident, this is accomplished thru accuracy proven machining and gunsmithing methods, excellant barrels, combined with proper bedding an good stockwork.
Timan
Stuart Satterlee

I believe Mark Stratton does integral barrel features.

quote:

Originally posted by Dr B:
quote:
What about the Searcy bolt rifle, how do they fair as a DGR. Is the quality equal to the price.
Thanks
Dr B

For the same price you can buy a Searcy double rifle, which is what I would recommend.

I built my 505 Gibbs with a Searcy Integral barrel rib/recoil lug/barrel band and ramped front sight. By the way, in the end the gun is a work of art and now a safe queen as I can't bear the thought of getting it all scratched-up. It worked out fine and shoots quite well. However, the barrel cost a heck of a lot more than I actually think its worth. A good metalsmith can make a top rib that when soldered and/or screwed in place and blued will be indistinguishable from a integral one. You gotta think your way thru the screw hole placement etc so its covered by the sights. Same with the recoil lug, band and ramp. Check out the Rib I made for my Borchard 12 GaFH. Once you have all the barrel dimensions, its Have Mill will replicate! I have to admit, that I was pretty concerned about off-axis machining stresses causing the barrel to string shots with a integral barrel and its probably a darn good idea to have one heat stress-relieved before screwing the barrel into the action, just to be sure. Luckily mine didn't string, at least as far as I can tell on a .505. All in all I'd put more money in the action ( a GMA is a darn good one) and get a Pac-Nor barrel and have all the other parts installed at 1/3 the price of a Integral barrel gun.-Rob

quote:

For the same price you can buy a Searcy double rifle, which is what I would recommend

500grains
What kind of money are you talking about last I checked a Searcy DR was over $10,000.
Dr B

A bolt rifle from searcy starts at $15,000

Dan Pederson-Classic barrels is a good way to go. I had Dan put and integral quarter rib, banded front sight, and barrel banded swivel mount on my 375 Granite Mt. action. It cost 1,400 and he had it done in less than 4 months.

Danny Pedersen for sure. He is doing a 10.75x68 barrel for me at present.

I'm having one done by Ralf Martini.

quote:

Originally posted by micdis:
A bolt rifle from searcy starts at $15,000

8500 and wood blank, actually

I have four rifles with integral features. All have BB front sight, BB sling swivel, barrel lug, and quater rib. All done by Rick Stickley when you could count on him. The only fear one has with integral barrels is after it is compleated it might not shoot well. It may not even depend upon built up stresses it might be due to other unknown factors. With add on sight furniture one can always trash the bad barrel and start over again and loose the price of the barrel and the labor to make into a rifle. All of mine shoot so well I can not believe it and I have a real indestructable african battery to hunt with forever.

FYI - Pedersen rifles the barrel after the integral features are machined (I assume it's stress-releived in between). He says you've got no worries about his barrels not shooting from stresses.

I have this gunsmith friend of 28 years in Boise, Idaho, that machines tapered octagon barrels with integral sight quarter ribs, under barrel lugs for a screw, and considers it all in a days work and worth a couple hundred dollars. He is also less than sixty days out on such work.

Perhaps the effusive praise here caues a recommended 'smith to add a zero to the value of his work. To me it seems that quote "custom" smiths take advantage of the situation. It seems odd that any action should be more than 10% higher in cost than a smaller one, but here we have people lining up to pay thousands of dollars for a mauser 98-style action long enough to build a 416-length cartridge on when CZ builds a solid one for less than $750 (last price I saw). The past ten years I have seen innumerable instances where a manufacturer gouges people ten times what a product is worth. A prime example: injection molded grips for a 1911...$60-$100. Go to the kids toy store and see a 200+ part injection molded model car sell for $12.95. Put the word "Magnum" or "tactical" (my two favorites) in the ad copy and add 300-500% to the asking price. In 2003 Bill Ruger told me that there was not a single rifle in his lineup that cost over $160 to build, parts and labor. The mark up was 300% to the distributor, and an additional 100% markup to the store, and an additional hundred or more dollars to the customer. I asked why the RSM was so much more than a 30-06 and he replied "stupid people who will pay more for the status factor". It is why I admire the the 550 Express so much, it is built on a standard Ruger 7mm Magnum, and the charges for such an animal reflect it.

Rich