Just want to make sure with the experts before I waste a bunch of expensive ammo sighting in.

The bead/express rear is suppose to be like in “A”? The top of the front sight bead is in line with the top edge of the express rear?






Thanks.

B is correct for the range of the particular leaf.
A is for Tennessee Elevation.
Otherwise you need a different height front bead for the chosen load.
Now go shoot it and let us know.
Then you can get into the finer points of a "fine bead"
(shoots dead on at the top edge of the bead)
versus a "combat bead"
(shoots to the center of the bead that is covering the kill zone).

Rip ...

B is as intended by the design of the site. But the it gets complicated...

Do you COVER the exact point you are shooting at with the bead or do you "sit" what you are shooting at on top of the bead?

Again the design of the sight is meant to be that you sit what you are aiming at on top of the bead. So for a six o'clock hold on a bullseye target it'd be like a figure "8".

This eBay listing for the Webley .455 parts diagram shows within it that figure "8" hold. If you hover to zoom it is under the diagram of the frame of the pistol frame in the left top quarter of the diagram:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/WW1-W...ematic-/253191105765

Personally I have never liked that wide type of express sight, nor a bead, but preferred a square front Patridge blade and a square sided rear notch.

But B is correct.

Thanks for the tips gents! Sooo glad I asked.

“A” does seems a bit imprecise to me. haha


I like the top of the bead/front sight to be POI, just like my pistol sights.


Is it alright to sight it in at 50 yards like I do with my AR’s?

It’s in 458 Lott, and mainly a fun bottle blaster/bear protection when camping.


I intend to use the chart at the bottom of this page:

https://www.newenglandcustomgu..._Services/Sights.asp

Maybe buy different height fronts or this unfinished rear to adjust:

https://www.newenglandcustomgu...20Sight#.W5IBTKRMHv4

Hopefully it only shoots a little high...

What kinda file should I be using in case I need to bring down the rear? How fine, etc?

Thanks!

I mostly shoot semi-auto carbines, but these thumpers are their own kind of fun!

quote:

What kinda file should I be using in case I need to bring down the rear? How fine, etc?

Aha! There's the problem and why I don't like them. With a simple Patridge sight its just easier to start with a tall blade and file it down to gradually bring the point of impact of the bullet up to meet the sight aim at your desired range.

With a bead you've either got to change the blade or, find a file to file that rear sight "V" down. Too much one side or too much the other and you've now altered your windage.

Simplest method therefore is as you've already decided on to change the front sight for another as you aren't touching the rear sight. So it's why I don't like the system.

I prefer "B", with the impact at 100 yards being at the top of the bead. then I can hold dead-on as the drop of the bullet goes from the top of the bead to the bottom of the bead. depending on the cartridge, this may extend from 100 to slightly over 200 yards, which is about as far as I'd want to be shooting with open sights.

Is your rifle to be used for dangerous game? If so, I prefer 'A', having had bad experience with the 'B' scenario.

If the rear sight leaf has flats on it as per your drawing, it is easier to line the top of the bead up with the flats, something like your first (A) version.

If the rifle shoots to point of aim like that, you are lucky.

If there are no flats or it shoots too high with that method, you'll have to tuck the bead way down in the V, so far you may not be able to distinguish the whole of it in poor light, and possibly shoot low. Then, when you're in a hurry, you may forget to get the bead right down - and your shot will go high.

Because of these issues, I actually prefer a large aperture sight. If the stock fits you properly, it lines up spontaneously, is no slower than an express sight and more reliable.

2 minutes of deer or buffalo or whatever yields a very dead animal if you are aiming at a large-ish vitals target. I prefer A for iron sight shooting.

If the express sights prove to be too much of a PITA, I might just install a peep sight from necg.

https://www.newenglandcustomgu...%20Ring#.W5KoCKRMHv4

Then you need to drift the rear express sight out of that integral dovetail on the barrel and fill the dovetail with something else,
like a spare or the same set with the fixed leaf filed down flat,
so as to not interfere with the peep use.
And you still have the folding leaves to play with "through the peep" for deliberate long-range aiming, ignoring the peep.
Peep and no leaves best for most shooting.
Low-power scope best of all.

Rip ...

I would prefer something between the two.

I tend to shoot my express sighted rifles like I do a shotgun. Consistent cheek weld and focus on the front sight only. I don't shoot super tight groups this way, but I shoot quicker with decent groups at 25 and 50 yds.

quote:

Originally posted by Brandon.Gleason:
I tend to shoot my express sighted rifles like I do a shotgun. Consistent cheek weld and focus on the front sight only. I don't shoot super tight groups this way, but I shoot quicker with decent groups at 25 and 50 yds.

THIS!!!!

B
if large sight difference, experiment between center hold and 6 o'clock hold

if that doesn't work for you, pop-out the FRONT sight, and read the number on the bottom, that is sight height, in MM -- then call CZ and order replacement sight .. i think that are like 20 bucks max ... ONLY file rear sight for FINE tuning --

let's say yours in a 10 -- and it's impacting high.. order an 11, and maybe a 12 -- those will be taller front sights, therefore will impact lower

cheers

All are excellent points above and if it’s a bear charge shooting like it’s a shotgun is the bears ticket. Figuring out where the ball is will take too long. Depending on your age and sight, I would consider a small red dot sight. On my doubles it made me more accurate and faster, including on running animals. Shotgun shooting at sporting clays like the rabbit with open sights is great practice. Fit is critical.

Thanks to all for the excellent points!

I had the barrel shortened to 22” and there is a necg banded front sight set-up on it right now.

Will most likely put a T1 or T2 aimpoint on a detachable mount on it later. More in common with my auto-loaders.

My vision isnt that great either so that will help.

So I went the the range to sight it in. Bought a 25 lb. bag of lead shot for shooting off the bench. heheh

First 3 shots at 50yards, I couldn’t find any holes on target.

Surely my aiming eye isnt that bad!

Bought a ginormous life sized deer target ($5!!!) and turned it backwards towards the blank white side and stapled a little shoot-n-see pastie on it for aiming reference.

Finally found a hole with my 4th shot. 14+ inches low.


Since I had the barrel shortened and put a new front sight base on, I don’t think CZ will do anything?

Maybe a rebarreling + adustable/better express sights is the best route?

Does it have extra flip up rear V sights?

Try using 200 or even 300 yard leaf it might solve the problem.

Talk to Wayne at AHR - you will be surprised by his great service and help. He sent me a bunch of different size factory CZ rear sights for free!

I had a CZ 550 in .458 Win Mag and I had it sighted in using the 6 o'clock hold, I do the same with all my iron sighted rifles.

quote:

Originally posted by Quickstrike:
So I went the the range to sight it in. Bought a 25 lb. bag of lead shot for shooting off the bench. heheh

First 3 shots at 50yards, I couldn’t find any holes on target.

Surely my aiming eye isnt that bad!

Bought a ginormous life sized deer target ($5!!!) and turned it backwards towards the blank white side and stapled a little shoot-n-see pastie on it for aiming reference.

Finally found a hole with my 4th shot. 14+ inches low.

This raises a couple of questions for me.

First, 25lb of lead is a lot. I split the stock on a 300 magnum on a machine of similar purpose with much less mass than that, at which point the accuracy also went to hell.

Once you found that bullet hole, 14 inches low, did you fire any more shots to see if it grouped at all? If the stock is not split and you can get some sort of grouping, all may not be lost - higher back sights or lower front sights can be bought or made.

As to the OP, I think you're definitely looking at 'A'

On that point again, for normal ranges, the top of the bead needs to line up with the flats on the sides, any point between there and hard down in the V is just too arbitrary.

^I have the kevlar stock and doubt that a few shots off the shot bag could break it.

I am not sure how to proceed. If the barrel is crooked like in this thread:

http://forums.accuratereloadin...4711043/m/6441094242

then it’d be a bandaid fix even with a higher rear sight. When I mount an aimpoint or scope on it, will there be enough elevation adjustment?

I may just send it to AHR to sort it out. Wayne already did an excellent job on getting it to feed.

Try with the front sight at the top of the V also? Maybe that would help.

If the barrel still groups down there, the situation can definitely be fixed. Assuming the same hold you used before, a front sight about 2mm lower should do it.

For those of you who do not know.

There has been a product to take care of this problem/argument that has been going from the time sights were invented.

It is call a scope.

A works great with a post, its fast and accuate as a receiver sight..

B is the most accepted as they have never tried A...

Bead front sights work best with "B" but keep in mind light moves B all over a target depending on the time of day as a round bead has a shadow..It also under stress very easy to not pull B down in the notch and shoot high..

Give me A every time, but only with a thin post front sight..its truly amazing and I have been shooting irons for at least 75 plus years..A is an old Texas Ranger trick to fast and accurate shooting, they liked it horseback at a run, in bad light, and for fast accurate shooting..Give it a try then comment.

Hey Atkinson,

I actually prefer the patridge/sourdough blade/post too, but with a square notch rear.
Must be from reading too much of Elmer Keith, Ross Seyfried, and Ray Atkinson.
Yes, then you align the top of the post with with the top of the rear sight, in the niddle of the square notch.
Use that post width as a crude rangefinder, and raise the post above the zero for "dialing" the range of the target.

I once filed a Wisner "African" rear sight from shallow-V to flat-top-square-notch.
Worked great with my Patridge.
I settled on having the square notch's apparent width to be twice the apparent width of the patridge.
So the much closer rear notch can't be much wider in actual measurement than the post that shrinks with distance from the eye.

But if a bead is being used, yes, you are right it should be B.

Or get a big, fat, bright bead that is aligned like A and B simultaneously. The "Grandpa Bead."
Rip ...

Rip,
Yeah, but with a square notch you will think your shooting your pistol and not take the shot on elephant, Buff and the Del Carmen catawhumpus!!

On the real side, one only sees the top line to center the post and the eye does that automatically just like with a receiver sight is my approach, I tried it both ways and actually couldn't tell any difference, but folks would say why did you file the notch square??

I like your logic, Ray. I've always liked the square post and sourdough with the peep sight because a small target like a rabbit's head can be centred over top, and light and cant are lesser problems.