I got a call from my favorite gun maker and my 9.3x62 will be home next week. We talked about my experiences with the 500 Jeffery he built me and told me that he did not recommend using the lead sled or any other such device for calibers bigger than the 375 H&H as there have been instances where stocks have split from the forces meeting a realitively immovable object. He worried that the recoil of the 500 Jeffery when shot from a lead sled or similar device would not allow the rifle any kinetic motion and might split the stock. I was hoping to get the next generation of lead sled to use in shooting the bigger guns until my right shoulder has enough healing time. Has anyone had this experience or has this phenomenon been acturall seen ?

I don't buy it.

A friend of mine has been using a Benchmark or Benchmaster for many years with his .378 Wby. and .416 Wby. with no damage to the stocks.

If any rifle would suffer the phenomenon described by your gun maker, it would be one of the big Weatherbys and their viciously quick recoil impulse.

George

What need is there for a Lead sled for anything under 375 H&H? The Band of Bubbas have used a sled from 375 up thru 550 Exp. No problems with any of the stock so far. Of course these rifles are properly bedded, cross bolted, recoil lugs on the barrels of the bigger ones, etc....

That said, the sled is only used for sighting in, all other shooting is done free hand or off sticks.

Hog Killer

It is a real concern. Yoda Ray himself opined so before he went over to The Dark Side, and many of us agreed here.

The fact that some rifle has survived the immovable object meets irresistable Force scenario, merely speaks highly of the strength of the stock and bedding.

The stock will split sooner with a lead sled than without. Undeniable.

May The Force be with you.

I got my dad one for christmas last year. He has used it quite a bit, loves it and has had no such problems.

quote:

Originally posted by lb404:
I got a call from my favorite gun maker and my 9.3x62 will be home next week. We talked about my experiences with the 500 Jeffery he built me and told me that he did not recommend using the lead sled or any other such device for calibers bigger than the 375 H&H as there have been instances where stocks have split from the forces meeting a realitively immovable object. He worried that the recoil of the 500 Jeffery when shot from a lead sled or similar device would not allow the rifle any kinetic motion and might split the stock. I was hoping to get the next generation of lead sled to use in shooting the bigger guns until my right shoulder has enough healing time. Has anyone had this experience or has this phenomenon been acturall seen ?

I have not seen this, and have shot my CZ .416 Rigby and a heavy-kicking .45/70 load from a Ruger No. 1 using the lead sled with 40 pounds of lead on it, with no ill effects to either rifle. But I suppose in theory it could happen. I doubt that it would happen, however, if the rig has some give to it, and it is not the equivalent of placing the buttplate against a reinforced concrete wall then firing! The gun/sled will have to be able to move, then the whole system is equivalent to shooting a rifle weighing the combined total of the gun's & sled's weight. In other words, if you load up the sled to the point that it is indeed an immovable object, you might damage something. But if all you are doing is using extra weight to REDUCE recoil to a reasonable level, it should be O.K.!

I have an Encore 375 H&H Magnum; the stock design is such that shooting it from the bench without my Lead Sled gets very old after about the first shot. It has a composite stock and no problems so far.

I have a CZ 550 in 458 Lott with a wood stock that I also shoot off the bench. With their reputation for cracked stocks, I've never dared to use my Lead Sled with it but since it's heaver, has a better stock design and a nice cushy recoil pad, shooting it off the bench isn't bad.

I believe if the gun has a very good wooden stock or a composite stock, using the Lead Sled won't hurt anything. With a good stock design in a heavier gun, you may not need the Lead Sled.

Several good points here. Bottom line, the Lead Sled moves under recoil and won't damage a properly installed stock. RIP, the "sooner or later" point you made can only mean sooner or later bad craftsmanship or a poor choice of blank will reveal itself. Build them right and there will never be a problem using a Lead Sled.

Thanks for all of the responses. He was just wondering if anyone had had an experience with the lead sled and any bad outcomes. I figgure if anyone would know, forum members would.

I haven't heard of one yet. I shoot with Hogkiller and since people have been exposed to the Lead Sled more have bought one. 'Nary a complaint except on mine, the grade 3 elevation adjusting bolt on the rear sheared off from recoil on the 550 Express. I would automatically change that out to grade 5 or grade 8 hardware.

I just use a 25 pound bag of lead birdshot between the rifle and my shoulder if I am under the weather some days. That still provides plenty of free motion rearward so as to not punish the stock too badly, and it gentles anything I care to shoot.

Whatever you choose to risk, in initial load development, you still have to get rid of it all for final hunting zero, of course ... unless you are in a tied-down situation shooting long range, like prairie dogs at one mile.

I have a question:

Will a .577 Tyrannosaur make a lead sled rock over onto its right side a bit, with full power loads?

lb404,

I would be very cautious about shooting hard kickers. I avoid them these days to be frank. Many of my friends are up in their 50's and 60's like myself and many of us can't shoot the big guns these days. The 9.3-62's and 375 Whelans are not all that bad however.

Now many of us don't take the precautions like you might as your an MD. For instance I really don't work out and I was splitting wood and then shot at the range and my shoulder really bound up. I had to buy a Past shield but now I have recovered.

I would use the Lead Sled and the heck with the stocks. Of course don't overload the sled or whatever.

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:

I have a question:

Will a .577 Tyrannosaur make a lead sled rock over onto its right side a bit, with full power loads?

I don't know the answer to that but I sure would be careful what I set on that side of rest!

Actually, nothing on a Lead Sled captures the rifle. It's just a rest with a vertical pocket for the butt to rest against. Nothing "grabs" the rifle except the shooter.

The front is just a set of normal rabbit ears. The "sled" part comes from a tray in the bottom in which weight can be added.

tiggertate,
Thanks.

Then T.rex shooters will still need to hook a thumb over the top of the barrel, to keep the "flying rifle" from jumping out of the lead sled and flipping over onto its right side, with right hand twist rifling in the barrel.

A T.rex is definitely best with a peep and no rear sight leaf.

The Lead Sled is a very well thought out concept, but it does have it's draw-backs! This idea was taken form one that was simpler, and much cheaper to make or buy, and actually worked better than the Lead Sled.

The one problem that is bad in the LS is it's vertical butt rest, haveing hard sides, to marr the butt stock if a rifle kicks slightly to one side or the other because of the shooter being right, or left handed. The other is it is not suited to double rifles at all, because they must recoil up, and to both sides depending on which barrel you are shooting. The third problem is $120 for that thing!

The idea was origenally a cordura bag with a long stap, with a soft cup made of the same Cordura to fit over the butt of the rifle. the bag was filled with bags of lead shot, and placed on top of the shooting bench, pushed forward, then by pulling the rifle back to your shooting position, with the hand on the fore-end placed on a standard eared bag up front, the rifle was allowed to recoil any dirrection it pleased. The bag type has nothing hard on it, and simply made the rifle push more weight before it moved the shooter's weight, without incountering any hard surface at all. The bag thing wouldn't sell for any $120 is why it wasn't kept, and the bag can be stored in you shooting bag, or car under the seat.

MacD37, Do you have a picture of the one you are speaking of? I don't like the lead sled much as it puts me in a bad attitude for shooting. I have been working off a front rest and rear bag for 30+ years and It (lead sled)- feels totally unnatural to me. It did abate the recoil to a point I could shoot the 500 Jeffery about 8 times just to evaluate a load.

Savage99, You may be completely right in your observations. I can still handle the 375,404, and the 458 Win.Mag, very well even after the shoulder surgery. It's that "kick it up a knotch" that just might do me in. It really is hard to decide you are getting on in years and some of these boomers just might need to be replaced with more suitable and less powerful rounds.The other part of this arguement should be detatched retna. One of my best friends told me about his numerous hunting experiences in Africa and Soouth East Asia. His collection of rifles included a 505 Gibbs by Gibbs, a 416 Rigby by Rigby and a pair of Jeffery made rifles in 375 H&H and 300 H&H. He traded in his 505 for a pair of Hoffman rifles one in 7x57 and another in 250-3000 in 1960. His advice on calibers was to find the biggest caliber you can tolerate shooting not the biggest one offered, shoot it alot, and be satisfied with your choice. My Jeffery might retire before it is really ever used! A real shame.

All of these boomers are meant to be shot from the shoulder not the bench, but you still have to work up loads to evaluate performance and it does help. I just dont want it to tear up a perfectly fine rifle in the process. Thanks.

What do you folks think about the Lahti Rifle Evaluator?

I see where you can get a larger shock absorber to handle things like a 700 Nitro off the bench.

I also found a place where they cost about $199. As I recall, they were over $300 several years ago.

Jim

I have broken 3 stocks putting them on sandbags and shooting "benchrest" with them.

I've shot 550s, 500s, 470, 458s, and 416s off leadsleds...

you don't put so much weight on them that they become immovable, just enough to take the sting out.

if you tried to put says 60# in it, i can see where there would be a problem... but 20, or 30... far less risk than putting the toe of the stock right on the bench

btw, be careful with the rear screw and foot and BIG stuff.

jeffe

I shoot all the big ones on a Benchmaster with two five pound weights from a barbell on the bolts for the front feet. I hold the forend as well, so that the POI won't change from the bench to a hunting position. You just put a bit of weight on it to take the pop away, or at least I do. Yes, the big ones from the .416 Rigby up will twist the rig over to the right. I shot a .256 three shot group at 100 with my .416 Rigby 105 grains of H4831SC and a 370 NF Friday night, so it works. The rifle is a pretty consistent .7 rifle, would make a dandy windy day varmint rifle! In Namibia, I shot my .375 over a rest the PH had set up that had a piece of angle iron welded to a barrel full of sand, it had no give and my stock is still in one piece. I didn't like doing it however, it worried the heck out of me.

And while People ponder the Lahti, what about the National Match Rifle rest?

In my mind, I would rather have the rest absorb the recoil than the rifle (which the Lead Sled does).

Thanks

Jim

is there a website for the National Match Rifle Rest?

There is a website:

nationalmatchriflerests.com

I don't trust them for the reasons you mention.

I just use a cheater pad between the rifle's butt and my shoulder.

Plus, all of my heavy rifles have removable muzzle brakes. I ONLY screw them on for use off the bench. With the cap on while in the field, it gives them a nice WR look.

The worst thing that has happened to me when blasting away from the bench with a big bore (while wearing a T-shirt) is that I lost half the skin off of my right elbow.

I learned the hard way to get a pad for that elbow!

I worry far more about a detached retina than my shoulder. One does not have to make a firm check weld when shooting from the bench.

No reason why I can't twist a little and stay away from getting wacked.

Stretching ones shoulder before shooting a heavy kicker just has to be a good idea. I should take my own advice.

I went to the Cabela's site to look up shooting sleds and noticed a good selection . http://www.cabelas.com HySkore Ultimate Sighting Rest is interesting