Thanks Jeff. My point was not so much about having proper head stamped brass (a legitimate issue) but being able to scrounge up some replacement ammo if a bag gets lost, the ammo gets stolen or confiscated, etc.

You can always fire a .458 win mag, a Lott etc out of a .450 Ackley and I've tried it and they actually shoot pretty darn well too. My PH had .458 win ammo just in case I had my Ackley ammo confiscated and I was unable to successfully bribe my way out of the situation ( as unlikely asthat would be in Africa).

Don't forget the 460 Guns&Ammo.
Mine did 2370fps with the 500grs bullets real easy...

M

quote:

Originally posted by metric:
Don't forget the 460 Guns&Ammo.
Mine did 2370fps with the 500grs bullets real easy...
M

Well, it should do more than the Lott fairly easily--the 460G&A is similarly long (2.86") and is based on the Jeffrey case rather than the H&H. It is between the Lott and the Weatherby.

A person could consider the 458 AccRel to be a shortened version to fit in a standard rifle and to also outperform the Lott by a tad.

As to accuracy with the 458 Win Mag. One Whitworth Express I had was extremely accurate with factory Winchester 510 gr RNSP and Federal 500 gr RNSP. ANUKPUK, a member here witnessed me shoot a 1 5/8" group with the express sights using a milk crate and boat cushion for a rest. With one of my Whitworths. I have found that Accurate 2230 is the best heavy bullet.powder in the Win Mag. I have killed 28 Sitka Blacktail deer with the 458 Win Mag. Many of them head shots at well over 100 yards from quick field positions. . The round definitely has the accuracy to thread the needle. My CZ Lott was equally as accurate and oddly did not loose any appreciable velocity. .

But. Its hard to go wrong with any of the 458 caliber 5k ft lb rounds. Just find the one that is yours and go with it.

I'm going the Dakota route. Simply because I had a RSM in Lott, soon a Mauser M-03 Bbl in Lott and wanted something bigger. Found 500pcs of brass for less than $200 so that was the deal clincher. Dies were a wash with any of the other non-factory rounds.

You can't go wrong with the 458 AccRel .. 2350 -2400 fps with a 500 grainer in a 21" barrel.. I just tried some 405 grs monometal expanding bullets a la Cutting Edge made here in Denmark.. 2600 fps and .7" group at 150 yards...

Pretty nice.

405 gr.
2600 fps
6000ftlbs.
Accurate

Great load.
Great cartridge.

What's wrong with the 465 H&H Magnum?
I really like the design which bears the typical H&H features.
The 450 Rigby would be my second choice.

quote:

Originally posted by CZ:
What's wrong with the 465 H&H Magnum?
I really like the design which bears the typical H&H features.

in this case (pun intended) its not a .458

quote:

Originally posted by CZ:
What's wrong with the 465 H&H Magnum?
I really like the design which bears the typical H&H features.
The 450 Rigby would be my second choice.

If you shortened the 465 and expanded it you could have a 500AccRel with the same boltface. Or go with your second choice.

quote:

Originally posted by 416Tanzan:

quote:

Originally posted by CZ:
What's wrong with the 465 H&H Magnum?
I really like the design which bears the typical H&H features.
The 450 Rigby would be my second choice.

If you shortened the 465 and expanded it you could have a 500AccRel with the same boltface. Or go with your second choice.

Well I have a particular taste so I like long necks (I don’t want bullet protruding into powder space) + tapering bodies and shallow shoulders, all that is offered by H&H.

CZ,
while those are nice designs, it "doesn't matter" as long as what we are talking about is USEFUL powder capacity - for example. the 505 gibbs vs the 500 jeffe -- the gibbs meets your requirements, but the case is so large it is GROSSLY inefficient when compared to the 500 jeffe

but, here's the funny.. it doesnt MATTER how long the neck is -- the same bullet occupies the SAME volume of the case, if seated to the crime line !!

the .458 big game bullets tend to have the crimp at -.800 more or less from the nose -- as this is an external design constraint to make OAL -- therefore EXACTLY the same capacity is consumed by inserting the bullet.. doesn't matter of there is 120gr or 4,000 gr capacity -- the bullet would consume the same X...

so, if you had two cases of about 110gr capacity and the bullet consumed X, then both would be 110-x .. full stop.. you don't seat the bullet deeper (rem 405 excluded) in big bore .458s ...

the 465 is an archaic throwback design, not unlike if we put fins on caddies today -- intentionally designed FOR LOOKS not for performance

I like the 458 Ackley or one of its knockoffs, but in reality the .458 Lott is the best way to go. Its a factory round now, most rifle manufacturers sell the caliber in there production rifles, brass and bullets are available, factory ammo is available, its been legitimized, and you can shoot .458 Win. ammo in it and that's normally available in the far corners of the world..

I see no reason not to go the 458 Lott route, and I'm sure some will point out its weaknesses, but they have to nit pick to do it..