Those of you who know me realize I enjoy field testing bullets prior to using them by recovering them from 5 gallon water buckets.

These have proven to duplicate bullets recovered from big game by 90-95% for weight retention and expanded frontal area.

So, thanks to the donation of 5 nosler partitions from Walt (465 H and H), I can report they are likely to be a good bullet.



Specs are: 2341 fps, .79 x .795 inches expanded, 4 thick propellors mushroom, front core recovered in last (4th) water bucket which is unusual, .861 inch tall, .516 diameter beer barrel expansion of rear core (similar to a 450 grain Swift and much less than a 500 grain Swift), lead expansion .679 x .749, 44 + inches penetration (almost as good as a 450 North Fork Cup Point), 404 grains retained weight, plus 64.3 grain front core.

Other pictures:





The test stand before:



After:





Buckets front:



and rear:



Bullet sectioned:



Conclusion. Not as impressive as the 450 NF soft point, 400 NF soft point, 450 NF Cup Point, 500 Swift, or 500 Kodiak. For instance the NF CP and 500 Swift split open the 3rd can and the CP had a bit more penetration. But better than the 450 Barnes Tripple Shock, and the bonded TBBC by Speer.

I might also add that it "regulates" more closely with the Nosler FN solid than any other pair of soft and solid I have tried, and I have tried most of them. Almost identical velocity (like 1 or 2 fps) and perfectly overlapping point of impact.

I would happily hunt w the pair of them.

Andy

quote:

co-located

do you mean correlated?

Will,

I changed that to "regulate," using the DR terminology.

The two bullets over lap at 100 yards perfectly using the same powder charge and seating to cannelure.

I did give up 100 fps seating to cannelure vs using a 1/10th inch longer OCL which you can use in the 450 Dakota.

Andy

Andy,
Good work. Thanks for sharing.
Interesting that the lead nose core pancaked out and stayed to the last bucket even though not bonded. Bulged base of bullet like a Swift A-Frame.

However ...

You need to get with the rest of the world (even though you have been doing it longer than they have) and start laying your 5-gallon water buckets end to end to form a WBT (Water Bucket Train) which is the new standard for international comparison of softpoints.

It would be a squeaker on whether the bullet would make it into the 4th Homer Bucket that way.

If you can get into the 4th bucket long-ways, WBT = 4, the softpoint has scored a real "homer." Those Homer Buckets come with rubber O-ring seals and are water tight, no worries, even when lying on their sides, end-to-end, bottom seating in lid of next bucket, perfectly parallel and straight and normal surfaces rather than curved impact surfaces on target.
Gotta be as consistent as possible.

Andy

What was your load?

TerryR

Andy,did both the 500gr A-Frame and the NF CP split buckets?

I'll second Terry's request. The Nosler solid was next on my agenda.

Terry and Dr. Duc,

I used 94 grains RL-15 and seated to cannelure of both bullets with full length trimmed brass.

I used the new 450 Dakota brass and Federal 215 match primer.

Seating out to full length which adds another 1/10 inch OCL you can add 2-3 grains more powder.

Shootaway,

The 500 Swift and the 450 NF CP split the rear of the 3rd bucket. So does a 400 grain .416 Swift. There are very few bullets that carry this much frontal area and velocity so deep into the buckets.

The nosler did completely rip the first bucket in two which not all 458's will do (for instance the 450 and 500 grain Barnes X). And made a small split in rear of 2nd.

RIP and I both put some faith in this phenomenon. A high velocity small bore like a .223 or even a 22-250 wont split them open. Smallest caliber that will is a 130 grain .270 or 140 grain 7mm. So the over-pressure does correlate to well known killers if delivered in heart or lungs.

PS a 450 North Fork actually crushes the first bucket into a couple hundred small pieces.

Andy

Thanks Andy. Have you tested the 450gr or 500gr TSX? How do they do on the buckets?

Pictured,

400 Barnes X, 450 grain Barnes X, 500 Barnes X.



The 450 and 500 TSX are similar. Just dont lead the barrel so much.



Pictured 450 X, 450 TSX, 450 North Fork CP.

Notice that the 500 grain pictured first has turned over 180 degrees. You can see the fracture line in two remaining X petal. First two blew off in first can other two are bent backwards afetr having expanded which can only occur if it was going base forward.

You can capture this event by shooting into wooden boards.



That is now the base of the bullet (photo was taken from what should have been the base of bullet.)

The 500 does not stabilize even in a 1-12 twist at 2350 fps. It turns over even quicker in water.

Damage to buckets is modest for all X bullets but I still like the 450 grain TSX which does pretty well at normal ranges from 458 win mag or Lott.

Why I like the North Fork:



Pictured 400 and 450 grain at point blank and 100 yards.

Andy

thanks Andy.

Andy,
I am pretty impressed with the new big bore Noslers..They blow out the front lead during expansion and the petals stay in tact and make a perfect ragged mushroom and they penetrate like the dickens and do a hell of a lot of internal damage..They worked better for me than the NorthForks in my .416 and the expanded cross sections was .620 with lots of base to push it..I got 100% exit wounds on broadside shots on buffalo even at a little angle and the only bullets I recovered were from the classic going away shot that comes after the first shot.

I understand Nosler moved the partition a little more forward to obtain this effect. It sure works in the .416. Expansion is good and penetration is par excellent..It's right up there with my other favorite bullet, the great Northfork Cup Point..

I like the Northfork softs as they kill well and are great if your after pretty little mushrooms to photograph. They don't have the penetration I like but they do a lot of internal damage and always stop on the off side skin.

quote:

I like the Northfork softs as they kill well and are great if your after pretty little mushrooms to photograph.

Ray,

Nosler spokesmen told me the 416 was designed to retain 70% weight.

It appears the .458 was designed to retain 80%.

The traditional (original) John Nosler is designed to retain 60/40%.

The .458 nosler will be an excellent all around bullet and penetrate as well as the NF CP.

I am confused by your statement that the NF's kill well but dont have as much penetration as you like.

My PH was sure I had made a CNS hit on kudu it went down so fast. I didnt. Thats just what happens with large frontal area and relatively high velocity.

I personally like the bonded NF, not because it makes a pretty mushroom, I really dont care how it looks, but because it will completely destroy a buffalos heart, not just put a hole in it.

It is the "how much penetration do you need?" question.

If you look at the photos, you will see that the mushroom of the soft point is more likely to survive a mishap than the Cup Points.

Lots of copper left if either one blows off, but the Soft Point is not likely too, if a 400 grain .458 at 2750 fps did not.

The CP lost about 1/3 of its FA at 2550 fps. Still much better than the Barnes X or TSX.

Andy

Andy,
I am not sure to agree or disagree with you , but what I ment was the NF softs always stop on the off side in that typically boring perfect mushroom, thus the perfect bullet for some, but to me I always want an exit hole, so I don't get a pretty bullet unless I shoot one up the keyster.

I have to say that I have shot too many buffalo in the heart to say it completely destroys the heart..It simply put a big hole in the heart in any caliber has been my experience.

The Cup point expands to a lesser cross section and as such, has much more penetration and like most things its probably a trade off, but I am satisfied with the internal damage of the cup point..

I much prefer the cup point to any bullet I have ever used, but I agree the new Noslers in .416 and apparantly the 458 may change my thinking. I have shot only 5 buffalo so far with the .416 Nosler and none with the .458.. At any rate all bullets mentioned are excellent.

If I were herd hunting in Zimbabwe I would definately go with the Northfork soft for my first shot followed my cup points or flat nose solids. If I am hunting dagga boys then my magazine and chamber will be full of cup points.