I reveived my new Heym 500 Jeff yesterday. I had purchaed...in waiting...4 full sized A-Zoom dummy rounds/snap caps. I don't know what specs they used.....but....they go into the chamber but the bolt absolutely WILL NOT close on these rounds. I also sent back to Jamison 100 pieces of brass purchased from a distributor in Feb of '08 so I was not able to check its operation. I actually had about 20-30 round loaded and pulled the bullets before I sent it back. Jamison is sending me 100 new pieces.
So, now I'm wondering...what the heck is going on??!! As soon as I receive the brass, I am going to load a single round and see if it fits/functions, etc....and will compare the appropriate measurements to RIP's post of the new CIP specs. I hope it's correct now or I'll have to use that massive barrel for a freakin' club!
Will post asap.

Gary
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Why don't you buy a box of loaded ammunition? I know it's expensive but not compared to a Hem rifle. You can check the rifle's feeding, sight alignment, accuracy etc.

Regards,
Chuck

Gary – You and the 500 will be fine. Remember that European makers are bound by law to follow CIP specs with not only min and max chamber dimensions, but also for bore/groove size and rate of twist. They can only do it one way, and there is no room for interpretation.

Not only would your chamber have been cut to the correct CIP specs for the 500, but it was also proof fired with CIP ammo at a German proof house. Proof houses in Europe have stood independently for hundreds of years, and they take their jobs (and your safety) very seriously.

I am curious if A-Zoom can tell you what specs they used to base their snap caps on - if you find out.

Here is the 5/15/02 (current) spec sheet.

Chuck.....where? I've tried and NO ONE I've checked with has it.

Chris....was going to call you this morning but don't need to now. I will try to find out about the A-Zoom dummies. The fed fine and went in the chamber, but the bolt just wouldn't close....it went about 1/4 of the way. The ejected fine and the next one fed great too....just no closing of the bolt. I wish I had not sent the brass back so quick as I could have checked dimensions of it compared to the dummies. My bad. The new stuff should be here in the next few days. I'm going to check the brass before and after sizing/loading to see if there are any changes. Thanks for posting the specs...RIP had done it also and I'm going to go over all of the measurements and compare my stuff to the specs.
But that rifle is a BEAST....can't wait to touch some off....well....I say that now!

Thanks, gents.

Gary
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VFR1,
The Jamison brass I had was from a batch that Butch Searcy had purchased and he sent me a box of it..It would not fin in my chamber so I pulled the bullets, fireformed the brass, and reloaded it twice and cases started splitting at the neck and I had two minor (meaning not complete) seperations. I told Butch about it and he told me that he had some problems also but didn't elaborate and told me to toss them and sent me some Hornday brass and no problems there..It was the 450-400-3"...

The stuff was soft and I couldn't say if it was softer than Bertram, but close enough for me to toss some very expensive brass or use it for dummy cases...

I suspect Jamison is probably having some growing pains and will come around sooner or later or another firearm related industry will bite the dust.

I have a 505 Gibbs and am considering buying some Jamisons new brass for that caliber as its only $53.00 per 20 cases and thats a great price, but only if it works well..so this discussion is of particular interest to me.

Gary,

Midway USA has Kynoch 500 Jeffery loaded ammunition. You can also buy loaded ammo from the Westley Richards website. In either case it will set you back about $85 per 5 rounds. I have no experience with ether brand, but am going to give the Kynoch a try.

Ray,

I used the Jamison 505 Gibbs brass with no issues back when I still had a Gibbs, so based on that and Chris' experience with the 470 Mbogo brass, I believe the QC issues are mainly with the Jeffery.

Come to think of it, I still have some once fired Jamison 505 Gibbs brass that I'd be willing to part with if you're interested

DGR.....I THOUGHT I had looked at Midway.....I'll try them.

THANKS.

Gary
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quote:

DGR.....I THOUGHT I had looked at Midway.....I'll try them.

THANKS.

Glad to help.
The Kynoch line is new for Midway, I think. I just ordered some earlier today myself. If it works in my rifle, I will contact Kynoch about the possibility buying component brass.

FWIW, Midway also has Kynoch in other calibers, including 416 Rigby, 404 Jeffery, and 505 Gibbs.

Just ordered a box of softs and solids. As well as feeding and functuion, I want to chrono them against my handloads to establish a baseline.....I'm not interested in hot-rodding this round.....a 500 Jeff at 2250 or so is PLENTY for elephant, buff and ME!

Gary
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Gary,

Let us know what the chronograph says when you get them. I dont have access to one at the moment and would be curious to see how close they come to the advertised 2400fps.

Will do...my Heym has a 24" barrel just for your reference.

Gary
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quote:

Originally posted by GarBy:
Will do...my Heym has a 24" barrel just for your reference.

Gary
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Gary, I just sent you a PM.

Dave

Dave...thanks...and just responded.

Gary
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Has anyone used any Jamison 500 Jeff brass from their newest lot? I have 50 rounds but the rifle is under construction. They assured me they had fixed the problem when I ordered it.

quote:

Originally posted by ACRecurve:
Has anyone used any Jamison 500 Jeff brass from their newest lot? I have 50 rounds but the rifle is under construction. They assured me they had fixed the problem when I ordered it.

Andy:

I have. Jamison sent me five rounds about three weeks ago. I only loaded and fired one. Even though it was a very mild load that had worked perfectly for me with Horneber brass, the Jamison brass showed signs of excessive pressure. There was considerable case stretching just in front of the web and the primer was just FLATTENED. In defense of Jamison, CZ tells me my gun needs more throat so I have sent it back in to them for a re-barrel job. They don't seem to be having trouble with the Jamison brass.

Dave

Mark Jamison claimed that the brass I received from him in late August was from the newest run. I still did not conform to the latest CIP specification. Too short to the shoulder, too deep at the extractor grove. I have since returned it.

Hello Everyone,
Been reading this post with great interest, I bought 40 rounds of Jamison 500 Jeffery brass when I visited Huntingtons in August 2008. Buzz told me that they just got the shipment about 2 weeks prior, so I'm assuming it was from a new lot? To date, I have fired 20 rounds of it once only, my difference is that I fire-formed mine with a cast bullet weighing 500 grains and doing 1800 FPS, not a heavy load I know. I must admit the 20 cases of mine are fine, I had no problem with them feeding, firing or extracting. I had a "feel" inside the cases with a sharpened bit of wire and can't detect any separation at this point, the primers did not back out at all in my loads. I don't have a blade micrometer to be able to measure extractor depths unfortunately. My rifle is a custom on an M17 Enfield action. All I can tell you about its chamber is that a Clymer reamer was used, I don't know whether they follow SAAMI or CIP as far as dimensions go.
So at this stage, I have no problems at all with the Jamison brass.

Also, Kynoch brass is made by Bertram, David Little from Kynoch confirmed this to me at the 2006 International Big Game shoot in Brisbane, so it will not be any better than Bertram, other than having the Kynoch headstamp.

Thanks.
David.

Good to know about the 505 Jamison brass as I can buy that stuff for $53 per 20 and thats real good pricing!!

Got 10 rounds of Kynoch 500 today, 5 each solid and soft. They feed thru the rifle as fast as I can move the bolt...and trust me, that's fast. My NEW Jamison brass is due any day and I will compare the measurements. I'm trying to let loose a few downrange tomorrow and will post results for those that want to know how they clock.

Gary
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quote:

Got 10 rounds of Kynoch 500 today, 5 each solid and soft. They feed thru the rifle as fast as I can move the bolt...and trust me, that's fast. My NEW Jamison brass is due any day and I will compare the measurements. I'm trying to let loose a few downrange tomorrow and will post results for those that want to know how they clock.

Gary,
Took five rounds of the Kynoch to range today, myself. Fed flawlessly and shot well out of my rifle. Didn't have a chrono, so will be interested to see what kind of velocities you get.

DGR:

Softs shot at 2300 fps and the solids at 2250 fps. Fired 4 rounds of each....speeds were VERY consistant. All 8 shots went into 2.5" at 55 yards from a standing rest. Recoil was not mild...but manageable.

Gary
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Gary,

Thanks for the report. Much appreciated

DGR...totally my pleasure....well...until about the 7th round or so. I'm not going to be using it in any benchrest matches in the near future.
But that gun is AWESOME.

Gary
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Yeah, recoil is, um, how shall we say...BRISK. But, then again, it sure is cool watching those big slugs impact the berm Congrats on your new rifle, sounds like she's a shooter!

Not BRISK, GRIM is a better word..

quote:

Not BRISK, GRIM is a better word..

Yup...I felt things shake loose that I didn't even know I had

Wakes me up, boys, better than a cup of Cuban coffee. But when she puts those first 8 rounds in about 2.5-3" I forgave her. The nice thing about it is that once I settle on THE load, shooting the tuskless I want, I won't feel a thing!
And you know what they say about a slow heavy push.....as far as I'm concerned, it just kicks the pi$$ out of me....so hang on and enjoy the ride.

Gary
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Just received my new Jamison brass. The extractor dia is 12.0 mm;rim dia is 14.48 mm; the base to start of shoulder is 57.53-54 mm as close as I can measure. OAL is 69.66 mm....but that's in it's "virgin state".
Once fired Kynoch brass is: Extractor dia is 12.8 mm; rim dia is 14.48 mm; base to start of shoulder is 57.59 mm....again as close as I can measure; OAL 69.51 mm.
The Jamison brass doesn't seem to have a distinct "shoulder"...definitely as sharp and distinct as the Kynoch.

So...what say thee O brass experts? I don't feel like screwing around with this if its not right. I am going to FL size a couple to see what happens.

Thanks.

Gary
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Sorry....I meant NOT as sharp and distinct as the Kynoch.

Gary
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Duane...do you think the deeper extractor groove will be an issue. When I hand feed the Kynoch vs Jamison into the extractor/bolt face, the Kynoch brass seems to fit "tight" while the Jamison not so much. I'm going to FL size a piece or two of the Jamison brass and compare it to the Kynoch. As I stated, the Jamison does not seem to have quite as distinct of a shoulder as the Kynoch....and the once-fired Kynoch has a bit more distinct should than the unfired.
Thanks.

Gary
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quote:

Originally posted by Atkinson:
Not BRISK, GRIM is a better word..

big girl.....


Sorry Ray...
While the 500 jeffery, at book loads, kicks more than a same weight 458 lott, it aint THAT bad... shesh....

However, the 500 AR was designed to duplicate those ballistics in the smallest case and lightest amount of powder possible, and yeah, recoil is closer to 458 lott than 500 jeffe

Jeff....you're right...it really isn't as bad as I thought it was going to be. I don't feel like shooting 30 or 40 from the bench at a sitting, it really isn't too bad. But then again, I think the rifle weighs around 11.5# or so....going to weigh it on a postal scale in the next couple of days.

Gary
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Well....now it gets interesting....the new Jamison brass sizes up fine and the once-fired Kynoch won't even fit in to the RCBS shell holder...WTF???
The angle from the body of the brass into the extractor groove ain't lettin' it go into the shell holder.
Hope the Jamison works!!!!!!!

Gary
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Sorry.....AND THE DIAMETER OF THE EXTRACTOR GROOVE IS TOO BIG!!!!
NOW I know why folks have issues with this round.
I STILL hope the Jamison brass works.

Gary
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quote:

....now it gets interesting....the new Jamison brass sizes up fine and the once-fired Kynoch won't even fit in to the RCBS shell holder

Gary,

I had the same issues with Horneber and Kynoch brass not fitting in the RCBS #37 shellholder You can either use a dremmel tool to open up the #37, or get an RCBS #14 shellholder or a Lee #8, the brass will fit in either one of those two

I use the shellholder for my 480 Ruger, works fine with Star and Hornbear brass, no mods needed. It's a hornady shellholder.

Sorry I couldn't answer earlier....chasing furred critters in WY! You damn right the headspace is spot on with PT&G reamers and gages. Jamison has not figured out 500 Jeff brass even with 2002 CIP specs sent to them. Just got a BS reply alluding to KIPP chambers, .5 Schuler chambers, Euorepean chambers, American Chambers....this is bullshit pure and simple...CIP is the ONLY dimension to be considered.....I've personally given up and managed to purchase 100 rounds of Horneber brass.....and yes...I DID get a refund on the Jamison brass from the supplier

PS.....I ain't the first one to demand and get a refund....this problem is like mushrooms......cropping up all over!

Thank-you, Duane...and where IN THE HECK CAN I GET 100 PIECES OF THAT SAME BRASS?????
I am dying to reload some of those babies and go get a bruised shoulder.

Thanks.

Gary
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Duane, where did you find the Horneber brass?

Dave

So is the latest lot of Jamison 500 J brass giving problems too, or not? I have 50 rounds of it but haven't gotten the rifle yet. Thanks.