I know there are several gunsmiths that specialize in particular brands. I know that for instance Cole's is one of the smiths to have work over your Baretta. Does any one know of a really good smith to work over Benellis? Thanks. "D"

What type of work do you want to do ??

We just got back from Argentina from a duck, dove, perdize hunt. My son and I took SBE II's that were brand new. We had several jams. My gun averaqed 2-4 jams per shoot. Maybe that is not bad considering the volume of shooting we did. However my son had almost 10 % of his shots jam. That is not acceptable. Really what we need is the internals smoothed up by someone who knows where the pivot points that need it are. A little trigger work wouldn't hurt either. Thanks for the post.

In answer to the guy woho is looking for a gunsmith, I would look for a sucker instead to buy that POS. I have said it before and I will say it again, if you own a Benelli it ain't IF it will fail, it is When. Get an O/U opr a SxS and forget the failures.

Jim Kobe,
Nothing like a good SXS Off to Argentina in 2 weeks see you soon John

I worked on my own M1 90 .Though trained as a gunsmith I'm not working as one.The trigger on mine went from 8 1/2 to 5 lbs simply by polishing all the contact points. There reliability with target loads went up by judiciously polishing the locking lugs.When I first bought mine [when handled by HK] I asked the gunsmith about what I should be carefull of .He said that at least 50% of guns returned because they wouldn't work only needed a cleaning !!That's a common problem with all guns !! The Benelli is very easy to keep clean.

Why not just send it back?????????????????
If it doesn't work, let the factory fix it.
I bought my son a M2 we have shot hundreds of clay's and pheasant. Not a jamb yet. The action is sloppy and probably will jamb soon but until then I'll leave it alone. When it breaks I'll call the NYC Beretta shop and ask them what to do with it.

quote:

Originally posted by mete:
I worked on my own M1 90 .Though trained as a gunsmith I'm not working as one.The trigger on mine went from 8 1/2 to 5 lbs simply by polishing all the contact points. There reliability with target loads went up by judiciously polishing the locking lugs.When I first bought mine [when handled by HK] I asked the gunsmith about what I should be carefull of .He said that at least 50% of guns returned because they wouldn't work only needed a cleaning !!That's a common problem with all guns !! The Benelli is very easy to keep clean.

I SHOT competition wiith my H&K Benelli M1 Super 90(original with long fixed shell tube. by tricking the lift plate you can get 9 rounds into it) and rifle sights. Best conservative guess would be over 40,000 rounds of 00buck and slug. On the line it would get so hot I would spray it with brake cleaner to cool it and keep shooting. At the end of the day I would break it down to what? 5 parts and clean then backon the line the next day. I think they take tremendous abuse and will run when others simply won't. In all that shooting it never skipped burped or mal'd. Any gun that can run faster then I can slap a trigger is running REALLY fast. Best clock times using full buck loads- 1.6 seconds for 5 rounds on pins. 2.1 seconds for 8 pins. Folks said there were 4 empties in the air at the same time.

I also used the same shotgun for entry work while spending 5+ years on a large coop concept drug unit. Faster and much better than a subgun would EVEr be. I bet my life on the reliability.

d hunter
what type of load was it jamming with?
i had a sbe that just wouldnt shoot light trap or dove loads no matter what
i talked to benelli and they said gun wasnt broke in yet i said bull____! i paid $1200 for a shotgun it had bette rnot need a break in period they said it needs 400-500 rounds thru it( i had close to 400)
i posted my problem i think here and besides being told to clean it i was told to get a new recoil spring that is lighter
i just got a different gun for dove and trap shooting kept my sbe for bigger loadds
fog

Fog they were light dove loads mostly. The duck loads were only once or twice. As for break in my son went through 30 boxes the first afternoon. It was disassembled and cleaned and lubed each night. I think that mostly it is an inertia gun. Needs a full load of shot and powder to run smooth.
Still if someone that knew what they were doing went over it and took off the rough edges it might work a bit better. I have yet to have a gun roll off the assembly line that couldn't be improved by the hands of a skilled craftsman.
Looks like no Benelli guru's exist huh?

One other property of a recoil operated shotgun that is often overlooked is that it needs someone/ something to operate against. In plain english if the shooter is on the light side or rolls back and absorbs some of the recoil the shotgun will not and cannot work properly and this problem is multiplied when shooting a load that barely has enough energy to operate the shotgun (dove loads).

I still don't understand what you mean by 'jam'.I worked on the bolt head lugs so that the it would move forward and lock easier.This made heavy target loads reliable and light target mostly so.Brownells had a light spring available but it was a bit expensive.

Been reading these posts about the Benelli's now for some time. Remember what I said, it ain't "if" you're gonna have trouble it's "when"

I ain't had to do nothing to keep my lightning 20 working.

Jim,
I have no idea how many shells you run a year thru your Lightning 20 but I have run something between 5 to 6,000 rounds thru my 20 Benelli with no malfuntions. I have a matching 12 that has been shot no where near as much but again...no malfuntions. I sell guns for a living and I have sold Benelli for years and seen on two back to me that had a problem. On one Super 90 a small part was broken but it did not cause the gun to fail...they brought it in for replacement after the shoot. The other gun had a magazine tube that was too small in one end and caused the magazine spring to bind up. Once that part was replaced it worked fine. Both of these guns were very early imported guns...in the H&K import era.
Now...your Browning is a fine O/U but I can assure you that at some point in time your Jap or your Belgian O/U will break a part. Any competion shooter can damn near tell you to the exact round it will happen be it the Jap gun or the Belgian gun.
I find I must disagree with your statement.
I have a full time gunsmithing service and we do not see what you claim. As an end user of Benelli (both are H&K import era) I don't find your statements to hold water either.

Mete, I mean that a shell would fail to eject or load the next round causing the gun not to go bang on the next dove or duck. I do not think it is a big deal but just needs slicking up a bit. D

Funny thing about these Bennellis, I had three in the last two weeks or so that needed work. It don't matter what they needed, they needed something done to keep them working. Guess what? Just got off the phone with a fella that says his Montefelpro ain't working and could I look at it? 'nuf said.

Guess what guys, I just got back from SD pheasant hunting and had to bring another Bennelli back with me. It just quit working and the owner kept telling me "... I can't believe it, this thing has never failed me..."

It ain't if, it's when and I don't give a shit how many guys tell me, I still think they are a throw-away.

Jim, they're sending all the bad ones to you !!! After all what would you do with your life if you couldn't complain about Benelli !

Jim now that you have taken in a bunch of Benelli's to fix. How have you fixed them What parts have you replaced or what work have you done to them.

I have trouble with mine with super light trap loads 1100fps stuff seems like after a couple hundred rounds of the stuff I have to clean the gun.

Just got back from a SD pheasant hunt myself killed all my birds with the Benelli and not a bit of trouble. But then 1300fps 1.25 oz load of 6's have a bit more punch on both ends of them.

We can talk about the auto 5 I had to take apart and fix ( clean for a fellow last year) We can talk about my BSS 20 ga that safety rod fell off and jammed it so it wouldn't open. So I had to pull the stock off to fix it.( years ago. We can talk about the many 870's over the years that had to be "fixed".

Any where from broken parts to stuff getting into the action causing it not to work.

Being a Ruger,glock,colt,remington armorer people bring lots of there stuff to me to fix.

Most of the time it lack of maintance. Some times one does find broken parts.

I would be interisted what you are finding on the Benelli's that require fixing.

Could you try one little thing. Put your light loads in and close the bolt. Then hit that silver button on the side next to the loading port. You should here a click. This will release the spring and allow you to shoot two shots without a malfunction. (the one in the barrel and the next round up and comming) I see this in sporting clays and it makes me feel bad. A new guy with his brand new gun and it won't shoot. Get a Beretta or a Browning semi-auto. and save that Benelli for duck and goose hunting. Or better yet a SxS or a O/U. They will make you a better shot.

The solution has been touched upon, benelli's being inertia fed, they dont like light loads.

there is a very good reason why most of the dove hunting operations in Argentina rent Benelli's to clients. day in and day out they cause less trouble and require less upkeep than other guns. if this wasn't the case, don't you think they would change to a better gun?

Really???

Can you imagine Juanpozzi outfitting 8-10 shooters with Browning, Belgian O/U's?

D Hunter, in response to your question contact either Beven Grams from Grams Engeneering or Benny Hill from Triangle shooting sports. These guys are Benelli guru's, they build and tune Benellis for all the top 3 gun competition shooters in the world. These are the go to guys for making a Benelli run with light loads.

how do you go about tuning say a benelli m1 super 90?
they are pretty good on thier ownn but if a little tweek sweetens them up i am all for that.

I shot an M1 for 10 years before replacing it with a SBEII this past spring. Never a problem duck hunting with it even on a -42 day in Maine one winter.

Took the SBEII to Argentina this spring and ran 2500 rounds through it in 5 days on ducks, doves and pigeons. Made it through 4 days without a glitch even using low brass CAZA shells. 4th day I had some problems where there was not enough recoil in the chambered shell to push the bolt all the way back. In looking at the receiver there was crap everywhere! Almost looked like weed seeds. Set that case aside and was back in business. I have no clue what was loaded in that case but I don't think any 3.5" gun could have cycled it since I shoot 1040fps 1oz loads all the time at skeet and only get about 1 shell out of 25 that does not open the bolt all the way. Buddy tried the bad shells in his 390 and he could shoot them fine. A 390 is not a 3.5" gun though. Up until that bad case I had around 2000 rounds through it without a cleaning and it was spotlessly clean in the receiver compared to the Berettas in the group. Came home and shot it for another month to see how many shells I could cycle through it without a cleaning. Hit the 3500 mark without an issue and finally broke down and cleaned it!

Even with a 3.5" gun, I've never had much trouble with light loads if it is cleaned properly. By that I don't mean that it needs to be clean, I mean after cleaning to remove all oil from the rails that the bolt travels on and from the chrome lug that engages the shell. IMHO, the biggest reason that light shells don't cycle is too much oil. I've always had the best luch running it dry.

Well, guess what guys, number 5 is coming in today. What was it I said about the Bennellis? It ain't if, it's when!

Jim Kobe I am really interisting in what you are fixing on them what are you finding for broken parts ect.

You have had five of them in so far what are you finding wrong with them.

He has been asked that question several times and has failed to respond.
I asked my gunsmith what parts I should keep on hand just in case something happens when I am in a foreign country on a shoot and he said that he had never had to fix a broken part on a Benelli.
Years ago I had problems with the very first of the light load 20's but no more and the problem was with a Benelli that was the prerunner to the current Montefeltro. I had friends bring it to me from Finland. There were no 20's in the USA at that time.

Joe Shiozaki of J.S. Air-Cushion Stocks works on all my shotguns. I know he does a great job working over my 391's --- polishing & honing the internal parts plus he does a great job on semi-auto triggers which includes fitting a trigger-stop to limit over-travel.

I know he works on Benelli's as the shop next door to him sells a ton of them and a lot of them come to him before they go out the door. If you're interested I can get his phone number. He's in Azusa, CA and is off for the holidays until a week after New Year's --- off chasing quail and chukkar.

Best way to contact me is via a PM.

SOrry I did not respond; didn't want to create too much unrest.

Most of the problems have had to do with dirty guns. I have had to clean up the action area and also the mag tube was cruddy and sticky on one. On the other one or two, it was the recoil tube/spring in the buttstock. I think the interior finish on those was bad and caused a bit of drag. However, replacement of a stainles one made by an outfit in Idaho did not cure the problem and the client says he refuses to shoot it anymore. As for the others, It was the cheezy way the ejector is attached to the barrel extension. They kept coming loose and disappearing.

Now hear me out. My problem has to do with the cleaning to keep these things working. Almost everyone who swears by these things says with regular cleaning they keep working. My O/U's don't repuire this High Maintenance shit. They keep working and I don't have to worry about if they are going to quit or not! Or for that matter, when I bought them, I did not have to take them to some guy in CA to hone the locking lugs or do any work on the mechanics to make them work better!

High maintainence ? For a gun that I can field strip in 10 seconds to clean [see my second post], on a slow day there's no excuse not to clean them. In my experience the biggest cause of malfunctions ,with any type of gun , is poor maintanence.

MY POINT EXACTLY. For the price one pays for one of these POS's, you should not have to field strip or clean to keep the damn things working. I don't need to do that to my O/U's.

How do you figure a gun that runs multi thousands of rounds before cleaning is a POS?
Somehow you have a hard on for Benelli.
I have owned and used o/u's that cost thousands of dollars and I got no better service from them. That included Luxes Merkels and Browning Superposed. They did not break a part while I owned them but they did need cleaning in order to open and close properly. eject properly and they did have more perceived recoil than my Benelli 20's.
Again, I will state that with something like a Browning o/u a target shooter will tell you just about what number shell it will break, what it will break, no matter where it was / is made. How come Perazzi comes with two complete triggers? Most likely the best of the Beretta O/U is the older ASE 90's and they break too.
I consider constant broken parts or the same malfunction all the time in a brand of gun as firearms not worthy of owning....cleaning a firearm after thousand of rounds is not my idea of failure.
Different strokes for different folks.

Few years ago I bought a Benelli S90 M1 from my friend. He had only shot 25 rounds with it so it was in perfect condition. The gun had been unused for 3-4 years when I got it.

Well, I took it to range and tried several different ammo from skeet to heavy hunting loads. It would not work with any of them. Sometimes it didn't eject at all and sometimes the empty shell was stuck in the ejection port.

I even tried to hold it looser or firmer to make sure it is not me. As everybody probably knows, Benellis inertial system can malfunction if you hold it too firmly (usually not a problem unless you are a muscular type and don't give in at all).

Then I took it totally apart (beyond field strip) and cleaned everything. There was some sticky grease everywhere. I am sure it was from the factory, probably some kind of storage grease.

With cleaned gun i went back to the range. Not a single malfunction ever since (several years now). I have not made such thorough cleaning anymore but just a normal cleaning after hunting trip. So, i believe this factory grease was the culprit in my case.

Now I have total confidence in my gun.

This is funny, I guess. I just last week hunted ducks three days. SBE on each side of me in the blind. Guy on the left has a a SBE with rust on the bolt. He has Mr Kobes idea. Gun costing 1400 should not need much loving. The guy on the right one of my best hunting buddies, is the most anal Muther I know. He breaks his gun down to nothing each night. Blows the moisture out with gun scrubber and an airhose. everything is inspected and oiled. His gun locked up on the 2nd shot three times in a row. The rusty SBE and my 870 knocked down what his gun went click on. This area is about 10 miles from the Pocomoke Bennelli/Berretta. My hunting buddy works for them as a seasonal employee. We both have friends that work at the plant. So what does this mean. I am looking for a used SBE, and it will go in for a complete overhaul. Cheaper and rougher the better.
Mr Kobe I have alot of respect for the work you do, but come on. A malfuction due to poor maintance can not be blamed on the maker. If a gun you built comes back beacuse it will not group. You find the barrel coopered up and the action screws loose. Did you build a bad rifle or did you build one for a dickhead.

My order Pump Rem 870
Semi SBE
O/U no preference.

Just so you are clear on this, in a previous post I did not specify all malfunctions or repair was caused by poor maintenance. I have my opinions and I guess, like assholes, everyone has one but don't need another. I was expressing mine based on actual experiences. I also think one of the best pumpguns is an 870.

Again, I can only comment on my experience, but out of thousands and thousands of rounds I've put through my SBEII before cleaning, it kept running like a champ, so it would have to be one dirty gun caused by the actual elements, mud etc... to get it to malfunction because mine certainly didn't from shell fouling and dust from the Argentine country side.

Talk to any Argentina outfitter and most are shooting Benelli's on their volume hunts. Now why would an outfitter pay for a premium gun if it was not holding up better than any other auto?? An outfitter in Argentina get's more shotgun experience in a year than most do in a lifetime. They see every make of gun put through some very harsh conditions associated with high volume shooting and they pick Benelli first, Beretta 391's second and I've never heard another auto brand mentioned. My group this year shot around 10k rounds total between 3 of us in 5 days and the SBE's ran flawlessly.

If a SBE is a POS, what is a Beretta? Remington? Browning??

For reliability, I'll take a Benelli or Beretta Auto any day over an O/U and this is comming from someone that shot over 10k rounds through O/U's last year.

I think the comment made by Duane from North Dakota has gotten lost in all the "smoke" but in my limited experience is one of the main reasons a recoil-operated gun works or doesn't work ------ the shooter can't normally shoot one the same way he does a gas-operated gun.

I don't know Jim Kobe from a sack of salt or Adam's off ox but I think he may be just about half a bubble off plumb. I have a Benelli SBE that I have used a lot over the last five years, killed a lot of ducks and geese with this gun. Now, having said that, let me say some more. I've owned and shot a lot of different guns in 50 plus years of hunting waterfowl, some of them good, some not so good. The Benelli is the hardest gun I have ever owned to learn to shoot but also one of the most reliable - period! I think it is overpriced and has some problems, one of these being the chokes supplied with the gun are absolute crap. I'm using a Rhino in mine, best money I have spent on an after market item. And I also carry a 'kit' of spare parts for the SBE along with me in my gun box, and I do the same for any other gun I take afield. As to 'problems' I think the majority of folks that run into trouble with the SBE could fix it by removing the stock and cleaning the tube, spring and etc. Same for the 11000 and the 11-87 Remington’s if you use them in the wet and damp.
As to your Browning O/U, I've owned a couple of these too and currently have a 12 & 20 set of old Winchester 101 O/U. I love them but they are not waterfowl guns. And I cannot imagine shooting a case or three of 3.5" mag loads through any fixed breech gun. I see no fun here.
I also might add that I always, without fail, carry some back up gun when I go out for any trip over one day. My old 870 Remington has made a lot of trips and saved the day for some other folks as well. Last one that comes to mind was a guy in So Illinois shooting a Browning O/U. First problem was one shot - not too uncommon with a recoil set trigger, right? - and the second day was a no-shot Browning – it completely quit shooting. I never knew what was wrong with his gun but he was not too proud to shoot my Remington 870 for two days! Even offered to pay for the use or to buy it if I would sell it.
A gun, purely and simply, is a mechanical device and as such, is subject to and prone to failure. The more complicated the gun, the more apt it is to fail. The African Double rifle, made as much as possible to be two complete guns rolled into one, is an example of this. Probably, the old 98 Mauser owes much of its success over the past 100 plus years to its utter simplicity.
Having said all this, I’ll keep shooting the Benelli. It works for me, and it works well. I don’t think it would be my choice for a first gun, and it surely would not be my choice for a “one-gun†battery, Heaven forbid I should be limited to only one. My little 20 bore O/U is so much more pleasant to use for quail or dove but it is not a goose/duck/turkey gun. The Benelli was designed for this works and does it well. I cannot think of another 3.5 mag auto loader that does the job as well. And please, understand this is my opinion and only for my use – if you don’t like the Benelli, don’t use one..