Impeachment of Mayorkas loses 215-215.

Dang it Jefffive I posted over you again.

Again, I agree.

Republicans having a bad day.

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Mitchell:
Republicans having a bad day.

Remember how many floor votes Nancy Pelosi lost as Speaker?

None. She could count.

They tried to slide the vote through when a Democrat was in the hospital after surgery, they rolled him in wearing scrubs to vote.

I haven't researched it be sure but I think this is the first impeachment vote to fail on the House floor since Andrew Johnson.

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:
I haven't researched it be sure but I think this is the first impeachment vote to fail on the House floor since Andrew Johnson.

I guess back in peckerwood county they think little Alex is doing a GOOD JOB?

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news...aefdf3723e998b&ei=17

Speaker Mike Johnson 'bolts from the Capitol' after 'embarrassing' double loss: reporters
Story by David McAfee • 13h

"I've seen a lot of embarrassing days for different House Republican leadership teams. This one is pretty high on the list," Jake Sherman of Punchbowl News reported. "They lost a vote to impeach Mayorkas. And then they lost a vote to send $17.6 billion to Israel. They didn't need to vote on the Israel bill today. They knew it would fail. They chose to."

Johnson's demeanor seems to align with what is being said about him by various right-wing pundits. Trump ally Steve Bannon said, "This I got to tell you is an absolute catastrophe for Johnson.”

"Absolutely devastating," the host added.

========================================

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news...8cd466d050c77a&ei=21

House Republican warns of Pandora’s box in explaining vote against Mayorkas impeachment
Story by Nick Robertson • 1h

Gallagher, Buck and McClintock did not defend Mayorkas’s job performance, but argued that Congress should not impeach a Cabinet official for merely executing the president’s policies, even if lawmakers believe they are the wrong policies.

=============================================================

https://time.com/6691749/impea...inet-member-history/

Mayorkas Almost Become the Second Cabinet Member Impeached. The First Was a Civil War Hero

On March 2, 1876, the Clymer committee released its report, concluding it had “found at the very threshold of their investigation such unquestioned evidence of the malfeasance in office by Gen. Belknap” that there was no other choice but impeachment.

On the morning of March 2, shortly after Belknap learned that the House was preparing to send articles of impeachment to the Senate, he rushed to the White House to offer his resignation. According to the diary of Hamilton Fish, Grant’s most trusted adviser, Grant reported that Belknap was “very much overcome and could barely speak,” as he handed his resignation to President Grant. Belknap expected that no longer being in office would spare him from impeachment. It didn’t work. The Senate went forward with the trial anyway, but fell short of the two-thirds majority needed to convict.

More than a century later, when former President Donald Trump was impeached for a second time for his actions related to the Jan. 6 attack on the Capitol, the Belknap impeachment was cited by Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer and others as setting a precedent for impeaching an officeholder even after they had left the position.

The right result, but it never should have come to this. We should be doing a better job of controlling our border, like every country. We should also not allow a Congressional responsibility as serious as impeachment to be defiled and debased for political reasons. I guess we can just plan on having impeachment proceedings for every foreseeable session of Congress any time the House is controlled by the non-Executive party. Ridiculous. Just another in a long list of examples of how the two major parties have utterly failed the people they ostensibly represent.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
The right result, but it never should have come to this. We should be doing a better job of controlling our border, like every country. We should also not allow a Congressional responsibility as serious as impeachment to be defiled and debased for political reasons. I guess we can just plan on having impeachment proceedings for every foreseeable session of Congress any time the House is controlled by the non-Executive party. Ridiculous. Just another in a long list of examples of how the two major parties have utterly failed the people they ostensibly represent.

When did the Democrats launch frivolous impeachments against Cabinet members?

For that matter, when did Speaker Pelosi have floor votes she couldn't win?

Republicans are cosplaying running the House, poorly.

Defending either side just indicates to me that the defender is part and parcel of the problem. Frivolous impeachment proceedings have become the norm over the last two Administrations.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Defending either side just indicates to me that the defender is part and parcel of the problem. Frivolous impeachment proceedings have become the norm over the last two Administrations.

Neither impeachment of Trump was "frivolous", they were both grounded in ample evidence; the only thing frivolous was the Republican Senators putting Party before Country, as usual.

Both sides are not, in fact, the same.

Dems are frivolous by nature

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Defending either side just indicates to me that the defender is part and parcel of the problem. Frivolous impeachment proceedings have become the norm over the last two Administrations.

Neither impeachment of Trump was "frivolous", they were both grounded in ample evidence; the only thing frivolous was the Republican Senators putting Party before Country, as usual.

Both sides are not, in fact, the same.

Not that you particularly care, but you often look just as foolish and ridiculous defending the ineptitude of the current Administration and the actions of the Dems as those persons defending many of the actions of Trump and the GOP. Makes it much easier to simply dismiss your views as those of someone only prepared to look at issues from one perspective.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Defending either side just indicates to me that the defender is part and parcel of the problem. Frivolous impeachment proceedings have become the norm over the last two Administrations.

Neither impeachment of Trump was "frivolous", they were both grounded in ample evidence; the only thing frivolous was the Republican Senators putting Party before Country, as usual.

Both sides are not, in fact, the same.

Not that you particularly care, but you often look just as foolish and ridiculous defending the ineptitude of the current Administration and the actions of the Dems as those persons defending many of the actions of Trump and the GOP. Makes it much easier to simply dismiss your views as those of someone only prepared to look at issues from one perspective.

Exactly what "ineptitude" would that be?

NATO is stronger, and bigger, than it's ever been.

Our economy is leading the world with record job creation and a great deal of manufacturing clawed back from overseas.

If Republicans were trustworthy partners in government we'd be doing even better but their word is worthless; they get shit they insist on and then turn it down because their Orange Messiah has only one issue, which he did squat to solve, to run on.

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
the ineptitude of the current Administration

Exactly what "ineptitude" would that be?

Hmm, now, sarge, you said you were gooder at reading than math --
Literally the TOPIC of the thread YOU started boils down to the border --

and i'll leave the rest right there as an exercise for the reader

I hope you will excuse me. Debating someone that has demonstrated an unwillingness to be open minded and objective on numerous occasions is a fool’s errand. I think George Bernard Shaw summed up such an exercise nicely.

I prefer Twain on this one, Mike

quote:

“Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.”
― Mark Twain

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
I hope you will excuse me. Debating someone that has demonstrated an unwillingness to be open minded and objective on numerous occasions is a fool’s errand. I think George Bernard Shaw summed up such an exercise nicely.

So, you have nothing except a fondness for repeating talking points.

. . . pot meet kettle.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
. . . pot meet kettle.

Got any more empty aphorisms to avoid admitting you've got nothing?

Maybe just one thing. I have the ability to think for myself and form judgments without regard to political affiliation . . . something you seem to sorely lack. But the irony is rich that someone that appears to be little more than a talking head for Dem talking points wants to call others out for repeating talking points.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Maybe just one thing. I have the ability to think for myself and form judgments without regard to political affiliation . . . something you seem to sorely lack. But the irony is rich that someone that appears to be little more than a talking head for Dem talking points wants to call others out for repeating talking points.

Yet you still can't specify the ineptitude you constantly harp about.

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Maybe just one thing. I have the ability to think for myself and form judgments without regard to political affiliation . . . something you seem to sorely lack. But the irony is rich that someone that appears to be little more than a talking head for Dem talking points wants to call others out for repeating talking points.

Yet you still can't specify the ineptitude you constantly harp about.

i can -- one word

math

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Maybe just one thing. I have the ability to think for myself and form judgments without regard to political affiliation . . . something you seem to sorely lack. But the irony is rich that someone that appears to be little more than a talking head for Dem talking points wants to call others out for repeating talking points.

Yet you still can't specify the ineptitude you constantly harp about.

You might spend a bit more time paying attention to what people say and less time regurgitating talking points and you would not need to ask for folks to repeat themselves.

I strongly consider President Biden’s withdrawal (the actual withdrawal implementation) to be inept.

Yes, it was President Trump’s plan. However, President Biden had no obligation to follow through with the plan. We will assume withdrawal needed to happen. Yet, the manner of the withdrawal by the administration was inept.

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:
I strongly consider President Biden’s withdrawal (the actual withdrawal implementation) to be inept.

Yes, it was President Trump’s plan. However, President Biden had no obligation to follow through with the plan. We will assume withdrawal needed to happen. Yet, the manner of the withdrawal by the administration was inept.

Yes, he did, the United States signed an agreement. There were only 2,500 troops in Afghanistan when Biden took office, with no transition. Link

Here's some "math" for you. The Republican led House has been the least productive in the last thirty years. https://truthout.org/articles/...congress-in-decades/ Surely one of our MAGA morons can put a positive spin on that for us. Doesn't it seem like the Republican Party is incapable of governing anything more important than what they want for breakfast?

If you are still supporting Trump be sure to wear a "Stupid" sign around your neck.

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:
I strongly consider President Biden’s withdrawal (the actual withdrawal implementation) to be inept.

Yes, it was President Trump’s plan. However, President Biden had no obligation to follow through with the plan. We will assume withdrawal needed to happen. Yet, the manner of the withdrawal by the administration was inept.

Yes, he did, the United States signed an agreement. There were only 2,500 troops in Afghanistan when Biden took office, with no transition. Link

A) The new administration is not required by law to follow it. It was not a treaty ratified by the Senate.

or

B) We are not arguing the withdrawal itself. We are arguing the horrible implementation by the Biden Administration in executing the withdrawal.

I agree with you about the GOP. Particularly, the minority of the House, 4 seat majority.

I agree with you House GOP is not even trying to be a good faith partner in governance. I expect them to lose this 4 seat majority.

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:
I strongly consider President Biden’s withdrawal (the actual withdrawal implementation) to be inept.

Yes, it was President Trump’s plan. However, President Biden had no obligation to follow through with the plan. We will assume withdrawal needed to happen. Yet, the manner of the withdrawal by the administration was inept.

Yes, he did, the United States signed an agreement. There were only 2,500 troops in Afghanistan when Biden took office, with no transition. Link

A) The new administration is not required by law to follow it. It was not a treaty ratified by the Senate.

or

B) We are not arguing the withdrawal itself. We are arguing the horrible implementation by the Biden Administration in executing the withdrawal.

I agree with you about the GOP. Particularly, the minority of the House, 4 seat majority.

I agree with you House GOP is not even trying to be a good faith partner in governance. I expect them to lose this 4 seat majority.

Joe Biden is the kind of public servant that believes when the U.S. gives its word it should keep it. Perhaps an obsolete outlook these days.

His options were to complete the withdrawal or deploy more troops, the 2,500 Trump left weren't enough to be safe.

Withdraw, so be it.

The issue presented is not the withdrawal as a policy. The issue is how the administration ineptitude in preforming the withdrawal.

"If you are still supporting Trump be sure to wear a "Stupid" sign around your neck."

They wear it proudly.

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:
Withdraw, so be it.

The issue presented is not the withdrawal as a policy. The issue is how the administration ineptitude in preforming the withdrawal.

While I'm inclined to agree with you, I can't think of exactly what the administration should have done differently. Can you?

Last I read, there are 17 GOP senators who have yet to endorse Trump.

I don't know how many in the House, but I'm sure 90% have endorsed Trump.

I'm also fairly sure that the ratio of those herein who SAY they don't support Trump is not where it stands with repugs in the public.

Trump OWNS the GOP.

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:
I strongly consider President Biden’s withdrawal (the actual withdrawal implementation) to be inept.

Yes, it was President Trump’s plan. However, President Biden had no obligation to follow through with the plan. We will assume withdrawal needed to happen. Yet, the manner of the withdrawal by the administration was inept.

It must have taken a special kind of moron to believe that the Afghan army would continue to fight the Taliban, when the Taliban would be in charge of their government, their weapons, and their paychecks in a matter of months, thanks to a deal negotiated with everybody except their elected government.

The much-vaunted deal was flawed in its basic premises. There would be no clean exit with peace or dignity.
That's not the Afghan way, anyhow. When you're wounded and left on Afghanistan's plains...

If there is a ray of sunshine there, it's that Iran now has well-armed Sunnis on both borders.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
The right result, but it never should have come to this. We should be doing a better job of controlling our border, like every country. We should also not allow a Congressional responsibility as serious as impeachment to be defiled and debased for political reasons. I guess we can just plan on having impeachment proceedings for every foreseeable session of Congress any time the House is controlled by the non-Executive party. Ridiculous. Just another in a long list of examples of how the two major parties have utterly failed the people they ostensibly represent.

Well written.