quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Reducing access is antihunting. Which USFS policy reduces access? None is the answer. There is no official policy that promotes access reduction but internal agency policy actions it. Absolutely no reason to close a trailhead to horse traffic except to limit hunting. I have only encountered closed trailheads due to damage on the trails. Can you point to some of these closed trailheads? Specifically off the top of my head, I can name two. The trail that links the Upper Rio de los Piños drainage just below Flat Mountain (Trujillos Meadows area northwest of Cumbres Pass) to the Divide Trail. This trail entrance where it leaves the USFS road and enters the Lower San Juan wilderness was fenced off to horse traffic. This entrance for years had a V entrance (if you have been around traiheads you’ll know what I am referring to). They closed it and said it was to keep snowmobiles out of wilderness. The joke was that when snowmobiles go they can cross easily anyway. The entrance was built for foot and horse entrance. The same thing occurred at the head of the Red Horse trail. Hunters ignored them as they knew the area and the law and to this day…the fence is just pushed down with logs and the trail goes over it. How does a county close a USFS road? They can close the road because these were formerly county roads, old stage coach routes that the county had and never gave up. YThe other way is that USFS rds cross private land(very common here) and the County chosses to settle a property dispute by closing the rd. Both have happened within walking didtance from my house. I can understand the private property thing. But some didn’t cross private property and were closed anyway. Why would the county want to limit access? Plenty of money available for trail maintenance — No, there has been a lack of funds for DECADES, there is not plenty of money, that is only in your head. fire all those green office employees and hire a few mule-men to ride the trails and a few foresters that actually know how to manage a forest. The USFS is nothing but a green agency that sits in offices and blames their problems on global warming. They do f***-all for hunters or to better the land they steward. Rubbish, I spend weeks every year hunting USFS lands, they provide access to 10 of millions of scres, free for anybody who buys a State hunting license. Hard to find a better deal than that. I have literally spent months in the same areas. The USFS does NOTHING to give us these areas. They do do their best to hassle hunters when they get the opportunity and then spend the rest of their time bitching and moaning about the woes of global warming.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Ryan Zinke is a fellow hunter, a patriot, a nice fellow and all around good guy. He did nothing to harm hunters. NPR is nothing more than a liberal propaganda outlet.

I personally worked on conservation projects with him. But working on conservation is something I have done quite a lot of while most here only bitch and moan about stuff they are mostly ignorant on.

I have never accused Biden’s administration of being anti-hunting albeit 0bama’s certainly was.

quote:

As Secretary, Zinke opened some federal lands for oil, gas and mineral exploration and extraction.[8] His actions as interior secretary raised ethical questions and were investigated by the Interior Department's Office of Inspector General.[9][10] In October 2018, the Interior's inspector general referred the investigation to the Department of Justice.[11][12] On December 15, 2018, Trump announced that Zinke would leave his post as of January 2, 2019,[13][14] to be replaced by his deputy, David Bernhardt.[15] The Inspector General's report concluded that Zinke had repeatedly violated ethical rules and then lied to investigators.[16][17] His tenure as the interior secretary was plagued by scandals, including his insistence that special flagpoles be erected so that flags could be raised or lowered when he was in residence, spending over $200,000 of taxpayer money to do so.

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Ryan Zinke is a fellow hunter, a patriot, a nice fellow and all around good guy. He did nothing to harm hunters. NPR is nothing more than a liberal propaganda outlet.

I personally worked on conservation projects with him. But working on conservation is something I have done quite a lot of while most here only bitch and moan about stuff they are mostly ignorant on.

I have never accused Biden’s administration of being anti-hunting albeit 0bama’s certainly was.

quote:

As Secretary, Zinke opened some federal lands for oil, gas and mineral exploration and extraction.[8] His actions as interior secretary raised ethical questions and were investigated by the Interior Department's Office of Inspector General.[9][10] In October 2018, the Interior's inspector general referred the investigation to the Department of Justice.[11][12] On December 15, 2018, Trump announced that Zinke would leave his post as of January 2, 2019,[13][14] to be replaced by his deputy, David Bernhardt.[15] The Inspector General's report concluded that Zinke had repeatedly violated ethical rules and then lied to investigators.[16][17] His tenure as the interior secretary was plagued by scandals, including his insistence that special flagpoles be erected so that flags could be raised or lowered when he was in residence, spending over $200,000 of taxpayer money to do so.

You sure do admire and vouch for some real scumbags...

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Ryan Zinke is a fellow hunter, a patriot, a nice fellow and all around good guy. He did nothing to harm hunters. NPR is nothing more than a liberal propaganda outlet.

I personally worked on conservation projects with him. But working on conservation is something I have done quite a lot of while most here only bitch and moan about stuff they are mostly ignorant on.

I have never accused Biden’s administration of being anti-hunting albeit 0bama’s certainly was.

quote:

As Secretary, Zinke opened some federal lands for oil, gas and mineral exploration and extraction.[8] His actions as interior secretary raised ethical questions and were investigated by the Interior Department's Office of Inspector General.[9][10] In October 2018, the Interior's inspector general referred the investigation to the Department of Justice.[11][12] On December 15, 2018, Trump announced that Zinke would leave his post as of January 2, 2019,[13][14] to be replaced by his deputy, David Bernhardt.[15] The Inspector General's report concluded that Zinke had repeatedly violated ethical rules and then lied to investigators.[16][17] His tenure as the interior secretary was plagued by scandals, including his insistence that special flagpoles be erected so that flags could be raised or lowered when he was in residence, spending over $200,000 of taxpayer money to do so.

You sure do admire and vouch for some real scumbags...

I have no problem with oil and gas production on public land and promote it.

Zinke is a good guy and has a helluva good record as a SEAL. I do really like the man.

I would NOT recommend calling him a scumbag to his face.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

I have no problem with oil and gas production on public land and promote it.

Zinke is a good guy and has a helluva good record as a SEAL. I do really like the man.

I would NOT recommend calling him a scumbag to his face.

quote:

Originally posted by Magine Enigam:
Zinke joins a long list of republican appointees who Lane loves:

Scott Pruit
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...Pruitt#Controversies

James Watt
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...tary_of_the_Interior

Anne Gorsuch (Justice Gorsuch's mother)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...rd#EPA_Administrator

History of US Presidential Assaults on Modern Environmental Health Protection
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC5922215/

quote:

Originally posted by MtElkHunter:
Zinke is in a race now for his office. I suspect he will win. He is just like Trump all he really cares about it himself and making more money for himself no matter what he has to do to get it. Very narcissistic!

quote:

Originally posted by TomP:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

I have no problem with oil and gas production on public land and promote it.

Zinke is a good guy and has a helluva good record as a SEAL. I do really like the man.

I would NOT recommend calling him a scumbag to his face.

Having watched gas drilling on the Pinedale Anticline, I'd rather not see more of it.

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:

quote:

Originally posted by MtElkHunter:
Zinke is in a race now for his office. I suspect he will win. He is just like Trump all he really cares about it himself and making more money for himself no matter what he has to do to get it. Very narcissistic!

Right up Lane's alley.

quote:

He is a true conservationist as well.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by TomP:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

I have no problem with oil and gas production on public land and promote it.

Zinke is a good guy and has a helluva good record as a SEAL. I do really like the man.

I would NOT recommend calling him a scumbag to his face.

Having watched gas drilling on the Pinedale Anticline, I'd rather not see more of it.

I watch a lot of drilling in wild land…some of my own where I have a very strong sentimental attachment. I have never seen it be a problem for wildlife longterm. Oil companies do a damn good job with recovery these days.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
I can show you pics of lots of Antelope in west Texas all around active production and exploration. They are in record numbers out there.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Just shows how 180 you are ME. I work on many conservation groups as well as sitting on the boards of some. Many here will remember my time running the Lion Conservation Task Force and you can even look at some of our work in the Lion Conservation forum on this website.

Zinke is a realistic conservationist.

quote:

Originally posted by Duane Wiebe (CG&R):
Look at the positive...Trump has promised to finish the wall and make mass deportations. If for no other reason at all,. that gives him my vote.

Better smell the roses...this country has been on a down hill slide since obummer days...It will take some firm choices to make meaningbful correction..Yeah...Lotsa hanky twisters and commies just might get their feelings hurt

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
I was involved in the investigation and aftermath of what actually transpired and have been to the property many times.

What do you want to know?

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:
Yeah Zinkie was just thrown off one of the most corrupt administrations since Harding by the worst president since 1900 for no reason.

I have yet to see you refute real reporting on the issue with specific facts.

Trump did more to restrict public land than any modern president.

The current Sex of the Interiors has done a good job from a hunting point of view.

Facts hurt when you are a petty hack

Secretary Bernhardt Announces Historic Expansion of Hunting and Fishing Opportunities on Public Lands

https://www.doi.gov/pressrelea...ishing-opportunities

Decorum prevents from saying what I think about you.


Trump attacks on public lands

https://www.wilderness.org/art...-whats-happened-then


Trump was so incompetent, he could not even appoint a Director of BLM correctly.

https://www.reuters.com/articl...wyers-idUSKBN26K3NJ/

https://www.reuters.com/articl...wyers-idUSKBN26K3NJ/


Trump wants to give our public lands to foreign companies for development.

https://apnews.com/article/tru...7eaa2a398abcf616d1be

https://ictnews.org/outside/do...cess-to-federal-land

This was good policy:


https://ictnews.org/outside/do...cess-to-federal-land

I always thought Dems would try to turn our public lands into housing projects.

https://subscriber.politicopro...ederal-land-00177728

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by Tumbleweed:
If Trump wins, he becomes the third leg in the triumvirate of despots, along with Putin and Xi.

If Trump loses, the American people will seriously damage their own society and economy from within, to the tremendous benefit of Putin and Xi.

I think we’re all fucked, either way. The dissent and rancour sown and promoted from external sources has done what it was intended to do - to destroy the western democracies to the benefit of the eastern autocracies. Remember when Khrushchev told Kennedy that “We’ll conquer you without firing a shot”? The east is much better at playing the long game.

The more powerful oligarchs like Musk and the Murdochs are acting on the belief that their actions now will buy them a table at the upcoming feast.

“1984” was off by 40 years, but here we are. Electing Trump will just hasten the process.

You are such a nut…it amazes me you get along in the world OK.

quote:

Originally posted by Magine Enigam:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
I was involved in the investigation and aftermath of what actually transpired and have been to the property many times.

What do you want to know?

I got an answer to a question I didn't ask, but thanks anyway.

I'm now wondering how you have time to do any vet work? I am semi-retired from practice. I mainly manage and consult on difficult orthopedic cases.

By your use of the words "actually transpired" I presume that you have your own spin on it, as usual.
No, I know what actually transpired.

quote:

did the death of Cecil influence you regarding lion conservation?

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Well let me backtrack a little. It did affect me…but not how you think. The aftermath of the whole incident taught me that real logic based science driven conservation was impossible in the 21st century. Sensationalism drives all.

As to the killing of the lion…he was an extremely old (for wild males) male lion well fitting of the definition of a huntable male lion. No Africans had ever even heard the name Cecil until initial story came out as told by an anti hunting NGO. In other words the killing of the lion was inconsequential to lions. The sensational story told however was highly detrimental to conservation.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
There were multiple males in the pride he was believed to be part of — 3 I believe. Some thought they were all brothers…others did not. They were some sort of coalition. He had not been staying with that pride much at the time he was hunted. Some think he was ousted. He was 13 years old. Ten is an old male lion. The pride stayed together with the other males and nothing changed. I believe he was an acceptable male to take.