Hey Canadian contingent. This ongoing ostrich farm debacle is fascinating. I don't understand why your govt wants to put these ranchers out of business? Do you have some comments?

As a poultry farmer here, Stateside, my flock is tested yearly for AI. It's a very easy test to do with throat swabs sent to a local laboratory. Yet your govt is unwilling to test the damn birds these ranchers have years of investment it. They just keep trying to slaughter them all and have even arrested the ranchers. It looks like there is no proof these birds have ever been sick. AI is pretty distinctive illness and again, testing is VERY easy.

What's going on? Heavy handed govt?

Update with the Canadian fed's

BC Ostriches

That sounds terrible!

Again, Ann, you're not telling the truth. Or, it's possible that you are misinformed. I can see how that happens with a diet of misinformation.

AI Overview
Yes, the Canadian Food Inspection Agency (CFIA) ordered the culling of approximately 400 ostriches at Universal Ostrich Farms in British Columbia in December 2024 due to an avian flu outbreak, but this has been temporarily paused by an interim stay from the Supreme Court of Canada, which is deciding whether to hear the farm's appeal. The order was issued after a unique H5N1 mutation was found on the farm and spread to a human, raising public health concerns.

https://www.google.com/search?...sclient=gws-wiz-serp

One headline:

19 hours ago — The Supreme Court of Canada has issued a stay in the case of a B.C. Ostrich farm fighting to stop a cull of its 400-bird flock over an avian ...

At the bottom of it all, you’ll find some piss ant bureaucrat who’s never been anything but a bureaucrat, but who wrote a rule.

Bureaucrats love creating rules - then beneath that one, there are other multitudes of piss ant bureaucrats who love to enforce rules, blindly and with great delight, because then they feel powerful. Cops and prison guards are classic examples, but there are definitely civilian versions who constantly strive to bring others down to their level of uselessness and take pleasure in doing so. Mindless pieces of shit; government sanctioned zombies.

The rest of us try our damndest to avoid them, to succeed despite them, and to fuck them up at every possible juncture. Unfortunately , they’re like rats and cockroaches, you’ll never be entirely free of them.

This ostrich killing thing is just the power trip du jour. Some bureaucrat is getting a woody by bringing a successful farmer down to their own level of uselessness by means of a useless rule that they wrote.

quote:

Originally posted by Tumbleweed:
At the bottom of it all, you’ll find some piss ant bureaucrat who’s never been anything but a bureaucrat, but who wrote a rule.

Bureaucrats love creating rules - then beneath that one, there are other multitudes of piss ant bureaucrats who love to enforce rules, blindly and with great delight, because then they feel powerful. Cops and prison guards are classic examples, but there are definitely civilian versions who constantly strive to bring others down to their level of uselessness and take pleasure in doing so. Mindless pieces of shit; government sanctioned zombies.

The rest of us try our damndest to avoid them, to succeed despite them, and to fuck them up at every possible juncture. Unfortunately , they’re like rats and cockroaches, you’ll ever be entirely free of them.

This ostrich killing thing is just the power trip du jour. Some bureaucrat is getting a woody by bringing a successful farmer down to their own level of uselessness by means of a useless rule that they wrote.

Well put and absolutely correct. Ultimately, it was the intervention of the Native Indian contingent which stopped the proposed slaughter. While the bureaucrats will cheerfully run over white people, they are gun shy about the natives. Regards, Bill

I'm not seeing where Ann lied or was misinformed Kabob. What are you reading different than the rest of us?

AI Overview
Yes, Canada's Canadian Food Inspection Agency (CFIA) provides compensation to farmers whose animals are destroyed due to an avian influenza outbreak. Under the Health of Animals Act and the Compensation for Destroyed Animals and Things Regulations, eligible owners may receive payment based on the fair market value of the destroyed poultry to help them recover and reestablish their operations.

AI Overview
Under the Health of Animals Act and Compensation for Destroyed Animals and Things Regulations, eligible owners are those who have their animals or "things" (such as feed, cages, or troughs) ordered destroyed by the Canadian Food Inspection Agency (CFIA) for public health or safety reasons. Eligibility is not defined by a specific role, but rather by the official destruction order issued by the CFIA, with compensation being based on the market value of the destroyed item up to a maximum amount stipulated in the regulations.

Yes, the Compensation for Destroyed Animals and Things Regulations (CDATR) under Canada's Health of Animals Act stipulate maximum compensation amounts per animal , which are based on species and type, to reflect current market values. For instance, the CDATR sets a maximum compensation of $16,500 for registered cattle and $10,000 for non-registered cattle, reflecting the species' market value at the time of destruction.

Yes, compensation under Canada's Health of Animals Act for destroyed animals can apply to ostriches, as they are listed as eligible livestock under the regulations for Compensation for Disease Eradication. You should consult the official Health of Animals Act and its regulations on the Canadian Food Inspection Agency (CFIA) website for specific details on eligibility and compensation amounts.

Here's why:
Species Eligibility
: Ostriches are explicitly listed as "Eligible livestock species" within the context of compensation for disease eradication under the Health of Animals Act.
Purpose of Compensation
: The Act provides for compensation for animals destroyed due to disease outbreaks to help control and prevent further spread.

Yes, the US has laws that regulate the control and potential destruction of animals to prevent the spread of disease, similar to Canada's Health of Animals Act. The Animal Health Protection Act (AHPA) (7 U.S.C. 8301-8317) gives the USDA authority to control the movement of animals and to order the removal or destruction of animals to prevent the spread of pests and diseases.

quote:

Originally posted by theback40:
I'm not seeing where Ann lied or was misinformed Kabob. What are you reading different than the rest of us?

Let's go back and review the OP:

quote:

Originally posted by Aspen Hill Adventures:
Hey Canadian contingent. This ongoing ostrich farm debacle is fascinating. I don't understand why your govt wants to put these ranchers out of business? Do you have some comments?

As a poultry farmer here, Stateside, my flock is tested yearly for AI. It's a very easy test to do with throat swabs sent to a local laboratory. Yet your govt is unwilling to test the damn birds these ranchers have years of investment it. They just keep trying to slaughter them all and have even arrested the ranchers. It looks like there is no proof these birds have ever been sick. AI is pretty distinctive illness and again, testing is VERY easy.

What's going on? Heavy handed govt?

First she relied on FB info.

She wrote: "I don't understand why your govt wants to put these ranchers out of business?"

And: "Yet your govt is unwilling to test the damn birds these ranchers have years of investment it."

And: "They just keep trying to slaughter them all and have even arrested the ranchers. It looks like there is no proof these birds have ever been sick. AI is pretty distinctive illness and again, testing is VERY easy."

===========================================

There is no way this happened without testing. If so, don't just claim it - prove it. Testing being easy is besides the point.

I don't believe for a second that the Canadian govt would order slaughter without proof of the disease. And this has been beyond the reg agency into the courts. They would all have to be in cahoots - a really ugly conspiracy theory substituted for reality - SOP.

And that's aside from the information I provided in AI summary to questions I presented which should be obvious by reading the answers.

IMO, Ann is so misinformed and vulnerable to mis/disinformation it's pathetic. IMO, it's pathetic because I'm assuming she isn't stupid, but there's another reason she is so vulnerable.

If there is any relevant factual info that I'm missing, please provide it.

An old vet and good friend of mine Robert Johnson, was head of the state epidemiology dept.
There was an outbreak of scrapie in Canada.
He worked with his Canadian counterparts over the border. They were not testing all sheep, but if it was found in a flock, they were slated to be destroyed.
He was not thrilled with the recording of events there, as it was not something the gov wanted to get out. Much of what should have been documented was not.
I have the same faith in AI responses as I do FB. There is much better out there.

quote:

I have the same faith in AI responses as I do FB. There is much better out there.

Well, you can put your faith wherever you want even if it's a dark, moist place that never sees sunshine.

When I ask AI a question, it quickly shows the sources it consults, then summarizes. If there aren't many sources, then it doesn't summarize. It just shows top sources. If there are many sources, sometimes way over 50, the top source shown is first among many, below the summary/analysis.

FB is a farce in comparison.

I could just show a source of info or two, but even that wouldn't be good enough for you.

AI does what I don't have the time to do, especially if I want to counter a claim or argument quickly.

Certainly, this method isn't without potential errors or mistakes. IMO, it's just the best in this circumstance.

Of course, as always, mistakes or errors or additional information are welcomed.

The trick, if there is any, to using AI is the same with all info. Be skeptical, corroborate anything that doesn't look right, or contradicts other known factual info.

In this thread, for example, I asked several related questions, and it gave consistent answers. All the info, stated as factual, can be corroborated. It just takes time.

As I said, I'm going for speed, and reliability and thoroughness. You see only some of the searches I do. I screen the results and don't even post reference to anything I find probably not right, or even muddled, through cross reference.

If I just expressed my own opinions, as many if not most herein do, without research for accuracy, my error rate would far exceed anything Google AI could produce and be deficient in thoroughness.

Here's Google's own answer to the question:

(I'm sure they say this for legal or liable reasons)

AI Overview
No, Google's AI is not always accurate; it can produce false or misleading information, also known as "hallucinations". While Google aims for accuracy by using reliable sources, its AI models can misinterpret information, reflect biases in their training data, or rely on unreliable web sources. Users should critically evaluate AI-generated answers and verify important information with alternative sources, especially for sensitive topics like medical or legal information.

Why Google's AI can be inaccurate:
Training Data: AI models learn from vast amounts of web data, which can contain errors, biases, and outright falsehoods.

Misinterpretation: The AI can misinterpret search queries, linguistic nuances, or even sarcasm, leading to inaccurate summaries.

Unreliable Sources: The AI might pull information from questionable sources, such as user-generated content from forums, that are not always reliable.

Hallucinations: AI models can sometimes generate incorrect information or make connections that are not supported by the sources they cite.

How to approach Google's AI responses:
Be Skeptical: Treat AI answers with caution, especially if the information is critical or sensitive.

Check the Sources: Look at the sources provided below the AI-generated answer to see if they are credible.

Verify Important Information: For crucial information, always cross-reference with other trusted sources or consult with experts.

Report Inaccuracies: Provide feedback on incorrect responses to help Google improve its systems.

In essence, while Google's AI is a powerful tool, it's not a substitute for critical thinking and human judgment.

You can stick AI responses up your own ass Kabob.
It gives you back what you type in to find, large user error in that.

Ann looks outside.

Never bothers to look at her own country and how it is torn apart by the ORANGE MAGA TURD!

quote:

Originally posted by theback40:
You can stick AI responses up your own ass Kabob.
It gives you back what you type in to find, large user error in that.

How do you know it gives back what I type in? Like most of your posts you don't know, just opine.

I tried to be nice and respect your question, and I thought it was a good and appropriate question.

See how you are. For a self-deemed tough guy, you sure are thin skinned.

Back on ignore for you.

The issue is not that there is no evidence of the disease. The owners freely admitted their flock had been infected, and some birds actually died. The rest of the birds recovered and have been shown to be disease-free for around a year or better.. So, the owners contend that the surviving birds are immune and present no threat to people or anything else.
Whether or not this is true can probably only be shown by testing.
Tumbleweed is correct in his assertion that bureaucrats will often come to decisions just as a means of flexing their administrative muscles. The Canadian government would absolutely kill the flock just to prove a point. If they didn't have a good reason, they are not averse to making one up. Regards, Bill.

Well, Bill, I won't pester you with an AI summary this time.

But a search sorta confirms the probability of your first paragraph being true.

In summary, in my own words, as I recall, the analysis said there are two versions of the disease, one not so lethal as the other. And one has a vaccine, the other not.

The difference, as Ann said, can be determined by tests.

I don't know which it is, but I figure the case will hinge on the science.

Another factor, again as I recall, is that whichever version it is transmitted to an employee. That means of course it crossed species. That's a concern too.

Of course there are clean-up concerns to rid the place of the virus. Even if the surviving birds developed immunity, the virus probably lingers in the facility.

And the birds actually having a market.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Ann looks outside.

Never bothers to look at her own country and how it is torn apart by the ORANGE MAGA TURD!

ah ah a little too much for the followers of the cult of the supreme leader ...

govt always go where they should not ... they feared the evolution of the virus but it did not happened on more than one human but gvt is still worried about that ... ostriches are still alive and kicking end of the story ...

Robert Johnson now lives in Stowe VT.
Would you like his phone number to call and tell him he doesnt know what he's talking about?
Hows that for opinion?
Kabob, you quote MSNBC, Maddow and opinion writers for money sections of women magazines, for your political sources. You are not an honest venue of information. Now to make sure you can hear yourself on every topic, you use AI. which is only as useful as the user allows. Your track record shows what that is.

Here is a question for you kabob.
You claim to be meticulous in your searches.
You were called out as one of the worst for using fascist and maggot, as dehumanizing.
You posted a rebuttal of your choosing.
In it, it showed you were using dehumanizing language. You simple said, I dont agree with that answer.
You dont agree with your own searched reply, but everyone else is supposed to?

ME,
Figuring the case will hinge on the science is naive at best. There are plenty of examples of the government, at all levels, totally ignoring the science, except when it might bolster their narrative.
As for not pestering me with an AI summary, I can only say, Thank God! Regards, Bill

quote:

As for not pestering me with an AI summary, I can only say, Thank God! Regards, Bill

quote:

Originally posted by Bill Leeper:
The issue is not that there is no evidence of the disease. The owners freely admitted their flock had been infected, and some birds actually died. The rest of the birds recovered and have been shown to be disease-free for around a year or better.. So, the owners contend that the surviving birds are immune and present no threat to people or anything else.
Whether or not this is true can probably only be shown by testing.
Tumbleweed is correct in his assertion that bureaucrats will often come to decisions just as a means of flexing their administrative muscles. The Canadian government would absolutely kill the flock just to prove a point. If they didn't have a good reason, they are not averse to making one up. Regards, Bill.

The issue is Avian influenza, it's transmissibility to other birds and possibly humans, there is a protocol to be followed, End of story. The owners did not report the initial infection either, probably knowing the birds would have to be destroyed, very bad on their part. Ostriches are useless birds anyway.

Thanks for the input from the Canadians here. I figured you would know more about this situation which is why I asked. ME, you have some serious problems. Please get some mental health help.


As far as this creature's usefulness I do know of a couple. One, is as a protein source with those who have Alpha-gal. So they have potential for meat production. The other is to study immunity to AI and develop treatments. The second AI season is now going with autumn waterfowl migration so don't be surprised to see more reports of industrial/commercial scale poultry depopulation all around the continent soon.

This disease doesn't necessarily kill off loads of wild waterfowl but as you know can and does affect domestic avians in our food supply. Study will be the only way to find a solution.

Also, will point out there are several strains of this virus and it may mutate yearly like our flu and rona viruses. Few have been fatal to humans and other livestock who have gotten infected. Still, it would be great to be able to 100% control/immunity the problem at the flock level.

quote:

Originally posted by Grizzly Adams1:

quote:

Originally posted by Bill Leeper:
The issue is not that there is no evidence of the disease. The owners freely admitted their flock had been infected, and some birds actually died. The rest of the birds recovered and have been shown to be disease-free for around a year or better.. So, the owners contend that the surviving birds are immune and present no threat to people or anything else.
Whether or not this is true can probably only be shown by testing.
Tumbleweed is correct in his assertion that bureaucrats will often come to decisions just as a means of flexing their administrative muscles. The Canadian government would absolutely kill the flock just to prove a point. If they didn't have a good reason, they are not averse to making one up. Regards, Bill.

The issue is Avian influenza, it's transmissibility to other birds and possibly humans, there is a protocol to be followed, End of story. The owners did not report the initial infection either, probably knowing the birds would have to be destroyed, very bad on their part. Ostriches are useless birds anyway.

Apparently there are a bunch of financial claims against the Ostrich farm according to the latest media, including against the compensation they would receive if the birds were destroyed, the people they sourced them from haven't been paid. Judging by names, one of the principals was involved in an ostrich farm that went bankrupt in the market collapse, just down the road from me.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada...urts-money-1.7650546

I was under the impression the farm owners did not want the birds to be destroyed so that does not make sense. No matter, it is a very strange situation.

I have to say, ostrich farm owners are often a half-bubble off plumb, and these may be typical of the breed. Still, at this point, with no birds ill, destroying the flock is nothing but punitive. It looks a lot like bureaucratic muscle flexing, to me. Bill