The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Guns, Politics, Gunsmithing & Reloading The Political Forum Henry Kissinger Has DiedGo | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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I hope somebody gets to Connecticut and drives a stake in before that evil bastard gets back up. At least Jimmy Carter lived long enough to see him go. "If you’re innocent why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”- Donald Trump | |||
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Who pissed in your corn flakes? Vote Trump- Putin’s best friend… To quote a former AND CURRENT Trumpiteer - DUMP TRUMP | |||
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Kissinger pissed in the world's cornflakes, whichever evil bastard was responsible for the second-most people killed just moved up. "If you’re innocent why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”- Donald Trump | |||
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That bastard can rot in hell! All he did was spread American influence over countries that did not want it. Blackmail non stop! I hope he rots in hell! | |||
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If there is a Hell he surely will. "If you’re innocent why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”- Donald Trump | |||
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Since there must be millions, could you please give a few examples of millions he killed? Vote Trump- Putin’s best friend… To quote a former AND CURRENT Trumpiteer - DUMP TRUMP | |||
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Just the bombing of Cambodia, which he was the architect of, killed several hundred thousand and directly resulted in the Khmer Rouge taking over and killing somewhere between a million-and-a-half and three million more. Do you really not know Kissinger's history? "If you’re innocent why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”- Donald Trump | |||
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He was behind the coup that brought Pinochet to power in Chile, the coup in Argentina that initiated the "Dirty War" there, greenlighted Suharto "annexing" East Timor, backed and enabled the Pakistani massacres of the Bangladeshi... The United States has never harbored a bigger war criminal. "If you’re innocent why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”- Donald Trump | |||
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Kissinger was small time compared to Stalin, Mao, Hitler. I'd say McNamara was a bigger "war criminal" than Kissinger. Realistically, Johnson was in charge with the Gulf of Tonkin resolution so he's really to blame there. But that does kind of make the point when those are the ones that are worse. | |||
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No Kissinger fan here Not sure I agree that he is responsible for thousands of deaths…but his policy was never sound. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
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And tell me, Doctor, which of those are still alive? "If you’re innocent why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”- Donald Trump | |||
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Check all of America’s senseless wars!  | |||
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True, but incomplete. Kissinger was not only directly (Cambodia, Laos, Vietnam) responsible or advocating for (Gulf War I and II, Afghanistan, Grenada, Panama) every war the U.S. has been involved in for half a century, he fomented coups and civil wars any time our Army was busy elsewhere (Chile, Argentina, Angola) or backed strongmen in taking territory and massacring civilians by the shitload (East Timor, Bangladesh). "If you’re innocent why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”- Donald Trump | |||
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None, nor is Kissinger, Nixon or Ford.
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Another point- Kissinger was responsible for Detente and for mainstreaming communist China. The man had many faults. His policies worked, but had huge unintended consequences. | |||
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So they, like Stalin and the rest, wouldn't stand to move up as "whichever evil bastard was responsible for the second-most people killed" among the living, would they? "If you’re innocent why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”- Donald Trump | |||
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You were the one saying he was responsible for the most deaths… when he WAS ALREADY DEAD. The thread name notes he is dead. No part of amongst the living in this thread. | |||
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I said whoever was in second place moved up, the requirement that they be living was clearly implied since the vacancy at the top was occasioned by Kissinger dying. Where did you say you went to college? "If you’re innocent why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”- Donald Trump | |||
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43 is a bigger war criminal. Him and his buddies Dickie C and Rummy. | |||
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NPR had a thing on Kissinger tonight. When asked about human rights of what happened in Chile. Kissinger reportedly said, "there was such thing as human rights back then" | |||
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If I recall, if Chile went commie, it would have turned Cuba and Venezuela and if I recall again, those two don’t have good human rights records and if we only knew how many went missing … news from those places don’t get out Nothing like standing over your own kill | |||
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Its all very revisionist. he was a man of his times, and his actions most likely prevented equally aggressive reactions from the alternate players of the day. Who were also men of those times. Actions that most likely would have meant more harm too the west. | |||
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Kissinger made decisions with the available info at that time. Right or wrong it is that it is. Who knows if his decisions saved or killed more people. People only see the bad not the good. Unfortunately that is the way the world is. It is the same with a lot of important people in history (i.e., civil war generals, old authors etc.), they are crucified for their actions from years ago when they were in a different time and place. We should not judge people from a different time or place with our morals and standards of today. | |||
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I'll boldly go out on a limb and say that carpet-bombing civilians in a Country you are not at war with and lying about it is generally a Bad Thing. Doing it in two Countries you are not at war with does not make it better. "If you’re innocent why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”- Donald Trump | |||
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Mostly it's getting caught that is the bad thing. Countries do bad shit all the time, for a number of reasons. It only matters when you are outed. | |||
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All the ethics of Donald Trump and George Santos rolled into one. "If you’re innocent why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”- Donald Trump | |||
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Can you think of any super power country with clean hands? Or even non super power if you go back far enough in their history. | |||
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Every civilian Kissinger got killed was within my lifetime, not the dim mists of history. "If you’re innocent why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”- Donald Trump | |||
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I know little about him.... But he couldnt act in a vacuum could he? The US government is still responsible not one individual. | |||
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Yet you have found it necessary to post 4 times in the thread. Not the least bit surprising. "If you’re innocent why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”- Donald Trump | |||
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So I'm trying to learn something, what is wrong with that? You didnt answer my question either. I'm sure not going to take your word for anything without more info then you dont like him. I see you trying to bluster your way through other posts. | |||
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I don't recall signing up to educate you. If you would like to apply my Adult Education Tutoring rate is $300/hr. "If you’re innocent why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”- Donald Trump | |||
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In other words, you are as full of shit as your posts in the nutjobs thread. Maybe you can get by in your house by trying to BS your way through. It doesnt work here when you can get called out on your blustering. | |||
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To give Jeffive his due, Kissinger has been one of the think tank Republican gurus for over 50 years. His actual involvement in US foreign policy has had a large number of severe unintended consequences. He advocated for far right regimes to counter the Soviet influence in South America. He got a Nobel Peace Prize for kicking the fan down the road enough to get us out of Vietnam, while leaving our allies in the lurch. He traded the USSR for the PRC as our geopolitical adversary. His ideas did lead to the dissolution of the USSR. Like a lot of bright political figures, he was right in his details, but very wrong long term. | |||
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Maybe. Maybe not. that is kind of my point. We really do not know if the bombing saved more life's than it cost. for example dropping the atomic bombs on Japan during WWII is very controversial. Did it kill thousands of innocent people...Yes it did but how many did it save? Estimates were that if the US had to invade Japan there would have been 500K+ American casualties and over a million Japanize, so the question is do you trade 200K dead for 1.5 million dead? If you look at it on the surface the short answer is dropping an atomic bomb on any city is wrong so how in the world can you justify dropping it on two cities? Soo my whole point is that people with a lot more balls than me are making some very big and deadly choices and it is not fair to judge them in hindsight when we were not in their shoes and did not have to make those kinds of calls, and I am really glad I did not have to make those calls. | |||
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Really? We shouldn't judge the decisions high government official make because they might be hard? Carpet bombing Cambodia and Laos never stopped supplies moving to the South, but it did destabilize the government of Cambodia and pave the way for Pol Pot to take over. Remember him? 50 years later those Countries haven't recovered from what Kissinger did and Nixon allowed. "If you’re innocent why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”- Donald Trump | |||
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And the North Vietnamese had nothing to do with the Khmer Rouge (communists in the Maoist model) taking over Cambodia? Technically, allowing a combatant to use your sovereign territory to move troops and supplies is an act of war. Cambodia didn’t declare war on North Vietnam or us over this. I don’t disagree it was wrong of us to unilaterally bomb their territory, but it’s not as simple as you seem to imply. Your statement of the consequence is likewise flawed. I really doubt that communism would not have come to Cambodia in the abscence of our interdiction of the Ho Chi Minh trail. Both nations have had problems since then, but hardly solely due to Kissinger.
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I am saying we should not judge people in general from another era on their decisions. My parents made some decisions a generation ago that I would not in any way make myself today. Do I judge them today on those actions? No, I know that they made those decisions on the best available information at that time and also what was acceptable behavior at that time. I really think that Kissinger made the decisions he did for good reasons. History may very well show that they may not have been the best choices but I do not think he did what he did just to kill people. History does have a lot of people who choose to kill just to kill (Hitler, Stalin etc) but Kissinger was not one of those killers. | |||
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