quote:

Originally posted by Schrodinger:
Enough pit bulls are bad news, that I would never have anything to do with.

When I was a young lawyer, I had a dog bite case. Because of that I had occasion to talk to dog control officers. Uniformity, they agreed that the most unpredictable dog was a Chow.

Some years ago, my wife and I were walking on the beach with our Lab. I have a thing for field trial Labs. I had a handgun in my pocket. My Lab was a male. (I’ve since gone to females. Like em a lot more. Anyway, some dude was walking with his two pit bulls. Big wash basin heads. My dog is running around and from about ten yards away this dude tells me to leash my dog or his dogs will kill mine.
I stopped and looked at him and said, “Your dogs attack my dog and I’ll shoot both of them. Then I’m going to beat you within an inch of your life.”

He rapidly veered off.

Fucking A.

quote:

Originally posted by Schrodinger:
Enough pit bulls are bad news, that I would never have anything to do with.

When I was a young lawyer, I had a dog bite case. Because of that I had occasion to talk to dog control officers. Uniformity, they agreed that the most unpredictable dog was a Chow.

Some years ago, my wife and I were walking on the beach with our Lab. I have a thing for field trial Labs. I had a handgun in my pocket. My Lab was a male. (I’ve since gone to females. Like em a lot more. Anyway, some dude was walking with his two pit bulls. Big wash basin heads. My dog is running around and from about ten yards away this dude tells me to leash my dog or his dogs will kill mine.
I stopped and looked at him and said, “Your dogs attack my dog and I’ll shoot both of them. Then I’m going to beat you within an inch of your life.”

He rapidly veered off.

This is weird…but some days Doug…you remind me of me.

Haha, that’s funny, Lane.

Sometimes I react without thinking. Not always a smart move.

Some twenty-five years ago, I was in a coffee shop in Portland buying a pound of coffee. Love that Ethiopian coffee ever since I hunted in Tanzania. Anyway, the dude in front of me pulled a knife and demanded all the money from the cashier. Crazy how fast your mind is doing these calculations. Should I try to punch him? His side is to me. But he has this knife with what looked like a 7 or 8 inch blade. If I didn’t take him out with one punch, well, I may have a problem. He loaded the cash in a cloth bag and ran out of the store. I took off if it hot pursuit. He was kind of skinny and didn’t look all that tough to me. I’m a pretty good sized guy and played sports.
Anyway he takes off running, but I could see that I was quite a bit faster than him so I ran up on him and took a running kick and kicked him as hard as I could right in the bung hole. I did this over a two block distance in downtown Portland about 6 times. He finally stopped and spun around and brandished the knife at me. When I backed off, he turned and started running again. I had to kick him only one more time and he tossed the bag down and kept running. I picked the bag up and went back to the store. The police and manager were there and told me that my behavior was not smart. I got my pound of coffee for free. I have wondered how he managed to sit or take a dump over the next week. I weigh about 225 and took running kicks about 6 or 7 times. I’m not claiming that I’m some big, brave dude, for he was kind of a skinny, stingy haired puke.

Why not just kick his leg sideways so he tripped himself, Cat? Can you imagine the road rash he would have got!!
In my state, you have to have control of your dog when it is off property. whether it's leashed or not. If the fellows PB could not be controlled, they should have been on leashes.
I carry insurance in case my cattle get out on the road ( they do at times) If a vehicle hits one, it is my fault.

Back40, to kick his leg out would have been too smart for me. When you have a pint of adrenaline surging through your veins, the old brain tends to short circuit out.

I don’t get why people get pit bulls other they want to project a tough guy image. German Shepherds, Dobermans, etc., are far better watch dogs I’m certain that some pits are loving, but there are tons of loving breeds.

These dogs were originally breed to kill rats during a warm period in the British Isles and there was an abundance of stored grains. Latter they morphed into bull baiting and finally dog fighting. They are natural born killers

You made it work Cat, and have a funny story to tell.

"I carry insurance in case my cattle get out on the road ( they do at times) If a vehicle hits one, it is my fault."

Not in farm country Iowa

Most of the west is the same, not here. You have to have control of your animals.

In KY the animal cannot be liable, if the cow gets out without the driver speeding (still might not defeat liability( or being intoxicated the animal owner owner is liable.

I am surprised Iowa is not like that.

quote:

Originally posted by Schrodinger:
Haha, that’s funny, Lane.

Sometimes I react without thinking. Not always a smart move.

Some twenty-five years ago, I was in a coffee shop in Portland buying a pound of coffee. Love that Ethiopian coffee ever since I hunted in Tanzania. Anyway, the dude in front of me pulled a knife and demanded all the money from the cashier. Crazy how fast your mind is doing these calculations. Should I try to punch him? His side is to me. But he has this knife with what looked like a 7 or 8 inch blade. If I didn’t take him out with one punch, well, I may have a problem. He loaded the cash in a cloth bag and ran out of the store. I took off if it hot pursuit. He was kind of skinny and didn’t look all that tough to me. I’m a pretty good sized guy and played sports.
Anyway he takes off running, but I could see that I was quite a bit faster than him so I ran up on him and took a running kick and kicked him as hard as I could right in the bung hole. I did this over a two block distance in downtown Portland about 6 times. He finally stopped and spun around and brandished the knife at me. When I backed off, he turned and started running again. I had to kick him only one more time and he tossed the bag down and kept running. I picked the bag up and went back to the store. The police and manager were there and told me that my behavior was not smart. I got my pound of coffee for free. I have wondered how he managed to sit or take a dump over the next week. I weigh about 225 and took running kicks about 6 or 7 times. I’m not claiming that I’m some big, brave dude, for he was kind of a skinny, stingy haired puke.

You have enough redeeming qualities Doug that I forgive you for being a liberal.

Good job on the above.

quote:

Originally posted by wymple:
"I carry insurance in case my cattle get out on the road ( they do at times) If a vehicle hits one, it is my fault."

Not in farm country Iowa

Nor in TX or OK.

Lane, I ain’t no liberal.

The truth is that I am dumb shit with very few answers for our thorny problems. Actually, no answers.

About all I really know is that I love hunting Mule Deer, long-legged women and country-western music. You

quote:

Originally posted by Schrodinger:
Lane, I ain’t no liberal.

The truth is that I am dumb shit with very few answers for our thorny problems. Actually, no answers.

About all I really know is that I love hunting Mule Deer, long-legged women and country-western music. You

How could anyone argue with that!

quote:

Originally posted by wymple:

quote:

Originally posted by MtElkHunter:

quote:

Originally posted by theback40:
As the pitbull is simply a staffordshire bull terrier, it's the people who breed the traits into them, that makes the difference. In the UK, they are known as "nanny dogs" for their love of kids.
It's the small dogs I see as the most likely to bite. Jacks, and border collies are high on the list for back of the leg biting.

I have had a lot of dogs in my live including PBs and Rotts. It is true that some PB and Rotts are bad but the ones I have had have been fantastic, they have been the most loving, kind dogs I have ever had. I have seen bad ones and almost every time they were bad because of the owner.

I have had way more issues with the small ankle bitters than PB's and Rott's. A lot of people have bad impressions of PB's and I think they get a very bad reputation because of it.

If that ankle biter takes a bite it won't kill or seriously maim somebody. If a PB or Rott takes a turn it can easily turn hard on serious to the point of deadly, as is often happening, regardless of whether or not the owner is crap. My big guy is a Rott, and is wonderful. A big baby, actually. But I've seen him kill coon with a single chomp on the back of the neck, and coons are tough. No way I trust Rotts or PBs, which I consider worse, around kids unless adults are present. Who knows what triggers the inbred violence of a PB.

Very true however that same statement can be make for a lot of other things in life. Why do you need 400+ HP in your car? A car with 400+ HP has a way bigger chance of killing you than a car of 200 HP. The key is how it is used. That 400+ HP car is fine and save if used correctly if the owner uses it incorrectly it is dangerous.

I was raised on a ranch and horses and cattle were way more dangerous than any dog, yet most people have no issues with their kids being around horses. Any large animal has the ability to hurt you or someone just by moving in the wrong direction. I cannot argue that there are some very bad dogs, most if not all of that is to be put on the owner training it to be bad or not traing it to not be bad. I have had my share of bad horses. ones that i would rather shoot than deal with so I do agree that once in a while you get a bad one and they need to be disposed of but I don't think a blanlet all dogs of a ceratin bred are bad and should be disposed of. That is just wrong.

Never trust a mule around a dog or a child.

quote:

Originally posted by MtElkHunter:

quote:

Originally posted by wymple:

quote:

Originally posted by MtElkHunter:

quote:

Originally posted by theback40:
As the pitbull is simply a staffordshire bull terrier, it's the people who breed the traits into them, that makes the difference. In the UK, they are known as "nanny dogs" for their love of kids.
It's the small dogs I see as the most likely to bite. Jacks, and border collies are high on the list for back of the leg biting.

I have had a lot of dogs in my live including PBs and Rotts. It is true that some PB and Rotts are bad but the ones I have had have been fantastic, they have been the most loving, kind dogs I have ever had. I have seen bad ones and almost every time they were bad because of the owner.

I have had way more issues with the small ankle bitters than PB's and Rott's. A lot of people have bad impressions of PB's and I think they get a very bad reputation because of it.

If that ankle biter takes a bite it won't kill or seriously maim somebody. If a PB or Rott takes a turn it can easily turn hard on serious to the point of deadly, as is often happening, regardless of whether or not the owner is crap. My big guy is a Rott, and is wonderful. A big baby, actually. But I've seen him kill coon with a single chomp on the back of the neck, and coons are tough. No way I trust Rotts or PBs, which I consider worse, around kids unless adults are present. Who knows what triggers the inbred violence of a PB.

Very true however that same statement can be make for a lot of other things in life. Why do you need 400+ HP in your car? A car with 400+ HP has a way bigger chance of killing you than a car of 200 HP. The key is how it is used. That 400+ HP car is fine and save if used correctly if the owner uses it incorrectly it is dangerous.

I was raised on a ranch and horses and cattle were way more dangerous than any dog, yet most people have no issues with their kids being around horses. Any large animal has the ability to hurt you or someone just by moving in the wrong direction. I cannot argue that there are some very bad dogs, most if not all of that is to be put on the owner training it to be bad or not traing it to not be bad. I have had my share of bad horses. ones that i would rather shoot than deal with so I do agree that once in a while you get a bad one and they need to be disposed of but I don't think a blanlet all dogs of a ceratin bred are bad and should be disposed of. That is just wrong.

Would you agree that certain breeds are known for certain traits?
Pointers are poor water retrievers, Schnauzers don't point, Jerseys do t make good steaks and Brahmas are poor milkers?

We have to make generalizations everyday, it's prudent to make generalizations every day.
That rattlesnake is gonna bite me.
That thug looks like he's gonna rob me, that kid on the Harley is gonna wreck, that wasp is gonna sting me, that baby is gonna barf, this Televangelist is gonna fleece me, that slut is gonna give me an STD.
That Chihuahua is gonna bite me.

We have to generalize. A retrieving breed is likely to fetch and all common logic says pitbulls eat kids. You betcha, folks can try to prove otherwise but why? If I'm wrong about pitbulls eating kids, I keep my kid away from pitbulls and my kid isn't eaten by a pitbull my defeat seems incidental.

If you insist pitbulls don't eat kids, you kid is subsequently eaten by a pitbull and you are wrong that seems quite a serious defeat.

Relegating certain breeds with strengths or weaknesses to certain roles seems wise.

The algorithm sends me these kind of stories regularly:


https://www.msn.com/en-us/life...509c5a9e3e9e#image=3

Puppy Left In Woods With All His Belongings Waits For Someone To Notice Him
Ashley Ortiz - Yesterday 11:24 PM

For a few years, my daughter and her family lived near New Bern NC. The area was full of stray dogs. Beagles, collies and pit bulls by the dozens. During one of our visits, there was a little Foxhound, living in the woods, which had some puppies under an old tobacco shed. I was trying to get her and her pups, but she was skittish, so I was just biding my time and hoping to win her over. One day I heard a lot of barking and howling in the woods and decided I'd better go over and see what the hell. I found two pit bulls tearing at that little hound. I hollered and they looked up and came for me, growling. I was unarmed, so I took my hat off and slapped the first one to arrive, the female, across the face. back and forth. She immediately tucked her tail and rolled over on her back. The male was a second or two behind and I lunged at him, and he veered off. The bitch got up and both ran off. I went to the shed and the pups were still there and still OK, I gathered them up then gathered up the mother, still alive, and hauled her to the vet and the pups to the shelter. The foxhound was too badly injured and was suffering from a serious heartworm infestation. She died that night. The pups were all adopted right away so there was kind of a happy ending.
No question those pit bulls were vicious but cowardly at heart.
When I was visiting there, I used to ride my bicycle around the countryside (my daughter was always expressing concern for my safety and thought I was a bit nuts) and there was another pitbull which would come out from his driveway and would trot alongside me as I rode along. His demeanor was friendly, as he trotted along with that foolish PB grin on his face and his tongue lolling. I got a kick out of him trotting along with that bulldog swagger and we both enjoyed the company. When I completed my circuit, he would trot back into his driveway and that was that. Just shows the difference between individual dogs. Same apparent breed but different personalities.
By the way, I love dogs too. Regards, Bill

Horrid:

Pitbulls kill again

Neighbor’s German Shepherd ran from neighbor’s property to my back porch to kill our dog (a Pomeranian) in front of Wife last Friday. She went out to set on swing with him. She had just set him down at her feet.

I have no problem with dogs. I have a problem with people letting big dogs run loose.

Kill them all so running.
Neighbor is her close kin. I should have put my fist down when they got the GS, did not put up a fence, and let them run all over the place.

What I get for trying to go along.

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:
Neighbor’s German Shepherd ran from neighbor’s property to my back porch to kill our dog (a Pomeranian) in front of Wife last Friday. She went out to set on swing with him. She had just set him down at her feet.

I have no problem with dogs. I have a problem with people letting big dogs run loose.

Kill them all so running.
Neighbor is her close kin. I should have put my fist down when they got the GS, did not put up a fence, and let them run all over the place.

What I get for trying to go along.

Agreed

I found this on another site, I'm glad it didnt involve kids the out come would have been much worse.

https://www.bowhunting.com/art...and/?mibextid=Zxz2cZ

Pet people are the worst. Strongly trend towards anti-hunting, anti-trapping, anti-farming. Trend towards humanizing animals and Disneyfication. Particularly strong in women. I’m born and raised on the farm. A real one, with pigs cows horses chickens farm equipment and old baling wire everywhere. No one I knew kept pets in the house. We thought of dogs and cats in terms of usefulness on the farm. Any animal caught chasing livestock was subject to immediate dismissal. That all being said, I have fond memories of our old farm dogs. They lived a rich, free life the creator intended for them, that most “pets” can only dream about. You could say the same for me. I lived as a young barbarian with carte blanche so long as I kept grades up and work done. Ole Red, Ginger and Boomer were there every step. Boomer a few less as he only had 3 legs. Sickle bar got him while mowing hay.

quote:

Originally posted by tomahawker:
Pet people are the worst. Strongly trend towards anti-hunting, anti-trapping, anti-farming. Trend towards humanizing animals and Disneyfication. Particularly strong in women. I’m born and raised on the farm. A real one, with pigs cows horses chickens farm equipment and old baling wire everywhere. No one I knew kept pets in the house. We thought of dogs and cats in terms of usefulness on the farm. Any animal caught chasing livestock was subject to immediate dismissal. That all being said, I have fond memories of our old farm dogs. They lived a rich, free life the creator intended for them, that most “pets” can only dream about. You could say the same for me. I lived as a young barbarian with carte blanche so long as I kept grades up and work done. Ole Red, Ginger and Boomer were there every step. Boomer a few less as he only had 3 legs. Sickle bar got him while mowing hay.

We are kin!

There is nothing wrong with pets. You were raised no more farm, no more Hillybilly than me and mine. We grew up putting 2000-5000 pounds of tobacco. My Pa gave me my first calf to raise to beef when I was 10. That is what limousine are for.

Dogs or cats do not deserve to be mistreated, left to freeze outside in -20 weather.

I am pet people and do as much hunting as possible.

I hunted everywhere week at least 2x a week for 6 months straight.

The problem is people who let their animals run rough on other people’s propert, or when people actively bread and train for viciousness.

I usual folks like to my board unfounded statements about a class of people they are not.

If my dog attacked stock, destroyed your property, harmed your family, then I would kill it myself.

Sounds like our farm / ranch as well

quote:

Originally posted by tomahawker:
Pet people are the worst. Strongly trend towards anti-hunting, anti-trapping, anti-farming. Trend towards humanizing animals and Disneyfication. Particularly strong in women. I’m born and raised on the farm. A real one, with pigs cows horses chickens farm equipment and old baling wire everywhere. No one I knew kept pets in the house. We thought of dogs and cats in terms of usefulness on the farm. Any animal caught chasing livestock was subject to immediate dismissal. That all being said, I have fond memories of our old farm dogs. They lived a rich, free life the creator intended for them, that most “pets” can only dream about. You could say the same for me. I lived as a young barbarian with carte blanche so long as I kept grades up and work done. Ole Red, Ginger and Boomer were there every step. Boomer a few less as he only had 3 legs. Sickle bar got him while mowing hay.

I grew up farming, still share in its ownership, still help run it. And I own pets (dogs only) they live inside, have names and are part of our family. I’m not anti hunting or, obviously, anti farming. Your comments are very much a generalisation.

My dogs work for a living protecting my livestock. They live with the sheep and chickens 24/7 and have very good lives. They are keen protectors but also love any human that comes around. They never leave their pastures or their stock.

I will say there are a lot of interesting attitudes nowadays concerning dogs and other pets. Some of it isn't healthy either.

Guard dogs as Pitt, Rottweiler German shepherds etc. are simply by their own nature unpredictable
Never understood why people who have them, let them run loose…irresponsible and careless?

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by Schrodinger:
Enough pit bulls are bad news, that I would never have anything to do with.

When I was a young lawyer, I had a dog bite case. Because of that I had occasion to talk to dog control officers. Uniformity, they agreed that the most unpredictable dog was a Chow.

Some years ago, my wife and I were walking on the beach with our Lab. I have a thing for field trial Labs. I had a handgun in my pocket. My Lab was a male. (I’ve since gone to females. Like em a lot more. Anyway, some dude was walking with his two pit bulls. Big wash basin heads. My dog is running around and from about ten yards away this dude tells me to leash my dog or his dogs will kill mine.
I stopped and looked at him and said, “Your dogs attack my dog and I’ll shoot both of them. Then I’m going to beat you within an inch of your life.”

He rapidly veered off.

This is weird…but some days Doug…you remind me of me.

If it wasn't for his silly politics the old Cat would be a damned normal fella! as misguided as he is I can't help but like him!

quote:

Originally posted by nute:

quote:

Originally posted by tomahawker:
Pet people are the worst. Strongly trend towards anti-hunting, anti-trapping, anti-farming. Trend towards humanizing animals and Disneyfication. Particularly strong in women. I’m born and raised on the farm. A real one, with pigs cows horses chickens farm equipment and old baling wire everywhere. No one I knew kept pets in the house. We thought of dogs and cats in terms of usefulness on the farm. Any animal caught chasing livestock was subject to immediate dismissal. That all being said, I have fond memories of our old farm dogs. They lived a rich, free life the creator intended for them, that most “pets” can only dream about. You could say the same for me. I lived as a young barbarian with carte blanche so long as I kept grades up and work done. Ole Red, Ginger and Boomer were there every step. Boomer a few less as he only had 3 legs. Sickle bar got him while mowing hay.

I grew up farming, still share in its ownership, still help run it. And I own pets (dogs only) they live inside, have names and are part of our family. I’m not anti hunting or, obviously, anti farming. Your comments are very much a generalisation.

As I said previously in this conversation, generalization is necessary in many cases, ( unfortunately,).

A self proclaimed "Animal Lover" is likely to be generally a nut, as a rattlesnake is likely to be poisonous and a Clydesdale ain't speedy.
We agree Chesapeake Retrievers are strong water dogs but a bit aggressive true? Generally?

Really, really odd that we've devalued human life and at the same time anthropomorphize Spot and Rover.

Some of these animals aren't made to be household pets and it's demonstrable. As I've said before, I'll kill any aggressive dog breed I find loose around my place, though to be sure it'll upset me quita bit.

quote:

Originally posted by Scott King:

As I said previously in this conversation, generalization is necessary in many cases.

Insofar as generalization goes, they don't call dogs man's best friend for nothing.

If I'm an animal lover and a nutz, okay, so be it.

Right now I have 5 dogs. Two are mostly outside. Three are inside mostly, supervised 24/7, because I live near a highway, and I don't want them run over. I prefer to have two dogs, at most. But they just keep showing up. This is a dog friendly place.

The latest arrival is a bulldog mix, probably some pit bull, probably 18 months old. He is very sweet - doesn't chase or growl at the usps or ups or fedx people, etc. He takes notice but isn't intimidating acting. Some drivers are scared of him anyway because of his appearance. He has the big bulldog head and yellow eyes. He gets along well with other dogs, so far.

He has a vet appointment Monday for all his shots and checkup, etc.

He is horny so his nuts gotta go.

He eats a lot. I estimate his weight is about 75 lbs.

I named him Bo. He's just lately began to respond to his new name.

My most volatile dog is a German Shepard, lab mix. His previous owner didn't get along with him well because he tried to dominate him. I named the dog Buddy. I have never had a dog before who responded so well to kindness. He listens and obeys, and I think it's all due to mutual respect. I have to scold him carefully, when necessary, because he is very intolerant to abuse, and he decides when that threshold is crossed, and lets me know. He is very intelligent, and readily gets it when I change my tune and mannerisms. He is submissive as long as I don't behave in a threatening manner. He has taught me something. He's a good watchdog, barks at any disturbance, very alert, but not aggressive towards anyone. But he hasn't been tested either. Some might deem him aggressive, but it's all reactionary. No threat - no problem.

He also looks out for the other dogs and is protective of them even though the other males may be competitors. He even scolds them when he thinks they misbehave. He's obviously alpha. I generally just stand back and watch in amazement at the doggy interaction and intervene only when it starts to get outa bounds. They generally work it out, over time. That's something I can't train - only to a limited extent, by calling for truce. They gotta know what's ok and what's not and have boundaries. That's my job.

Funny thing - once my Buddy encountered a real German Shepard intact male about 100 lbs +++. No aggression either side, but my Buddy got really quite.

As I said, he's smart.

I have a lovely gordon setter..use him for hunting grouse in our mountains..

Two times we have been attacked by dogs out of control, fortunately I had my size 13 mil. boots on.. Lets say the attackers lost..

We have always had dogs, as far as I can remember!

Right now we have 3 sizes of poodle!

The smallest one is Sassy.

She is 14 years old??

Absolutely adorable.

Comes at night and jumps into our bed.

Sticks her head on my pillow!

And snores!

quote:

Originally posted by Aspen Hill Adventures:
That's right, another PBT

That's right. There are too many reports of incidents like that.

That's part of why I carry concealed.

There are three threats, at least. Bad people, bad dogs, and alligators.

I don't let my dogs play or anywhere near where alligators MAY be lurking. This is the south, and alligators are plentiful.

My dogs don't stand a chance from any of the three threats.

It's the alligators that bug me,.....hiding out in the water and all that. I can see the thugs or the pitbulls coming.

But seriously , it's another example of our arrogant ignorance that leads us to insist that any animal can be domestic.

Rattle snakes and alligators in apartment terrariums. Lions and tigers in Vegas shows. Pit bulls in suburban yards. The Florida pythons started off as household pets! 20' long, 200# sit with them on the soda wrapped around your arm pets!

I love dogs, even if they are Democrats. How do I know they are Democrats? They live here, but don't really have a job, but they get a roof over their head, three squares and free health care. At least they look pretty and are loyal.

They are smarter than human Democrats too, because they keep their mouth shut.

All my dogs are democrats.

Otherwise they would bite delivery drivers, chase cars, crap in the house, kill cats, etc.