The USA is not fine. We are not just going to be fine no matter what. Ronald Reagan was correct: “Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction.”

The country is DEEPLY divided. It is not a R vs D thing. It is not really right vs left. It is kind of rural vs urban but only because that is where the 2 sides of the rift migrate towards.

The divide is between Traditional America vs Progressive America and it is getting wider and deeper by the day. The 2 sides are getting more entrenched hourly. I don’t believe anything will unite this country ever again.

Daily I watch our representatives in our government just fight. They fight over everything. There is almost nothing the 2 sides can agree upon any longer.

Then I come on here and see a thread where people are in doubt that people pouring through our southern border. Something I have seen scores of times now with my own eyes.

When I read that…I realized exactly how vulnerable we as a nation are…just a Reagan prophetically spoke.

I am like Scott…I no longer have a lot of hope for this country. I keep fighting on the traditional America side for the sake of my kids. Otherwise I would turn off the news, turn off ARPF, turn off X and just recluse to the ranch and hunt, fish, and be merry until I expire.

Seems very plausable that there are terrorists being allowed into the Interior.

quote:

Originally posted by Aspen Hill Adventures:
Seems very plausable that there are terrorists being allowed into the Interior.

Wray (whom I am not fond of) basically guaranteed Congress the other day that that^^^is a given.

Biggest thing nowadays…open border
For the life of me, how can anyone be for open border
Just shut her down plain and simple and after awhile, figure out if there is need for immigration labor then figure out how to do it on guest permit

Productive types that apply legally to immigrate .......years and expense, proof of financial responsibility, knowledge of US civics and history...... Biden's bandits? Nothing....


Do any of you find it odd that there are so many males, between 20 and 30 years old fleeing here for "sanctuary" without their families? What type of men "flee" persecution without their families????

Other than democrats, I can't think of any.....

.

Another way to characterize the division you describe is a division based on perspective. On the one hand you the crowd that believes that everything was better back when. They find change disturbing. They spend their life looking in the rear view mirror wondering how heterosexual white males ended up having to share time with minorities, women and gays. They give lip service to diversity but in their hearts they abhor diversity. Oh yeah, and young people, they’re worthless too because they insist on thinking for themselves. On the other hand you have the group that says times change and we need to change with it. It has been true since the beginning of time. They believe that diversity is a strength not a weakness since it allows us to draw on multiple perspectives. They embrace change. They recognize that just because the world does not look the same as it did 50 years ago, that’s a good thing, not a bad thing. They are realists and chose to see the glass as half full not half empty.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Another way to characterize the division you describe is a division based on perspective. On the one hand you the crowd that believes that everything was better back when. They find change disturbing. They spend their life looking in the rear view mirror wondering how heterosexual white males ended up having to share time with minorities, women and gays. They give lip service to diversity but in their hearts they abhor diversity. Oh yeah, and young people, they’re worthless too because they insist on thinking for themselves. On the other hand you have the group that says times change and we need to change with it. It has been true since the beginning of time. They believe that diversity is a strength not a weakness since it allows us to draw on multiple perspectives. They embrace change. They recognize that just because the world does not look the same as it did 50 years ago, that’s a good thing, not a bad thing. They are realists and chose to see the glass as half full not half empty.

The REAL terrorists are your own politicians.

Who are OWNED by foreign countries.

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Another way to characterize the division you describe is a division based on perspective. On the one hand you the crowd that believes that everything was better back when. They find change disturbing. They spend their life looking in the rear view mirror wondering how heterosexual white males ended up having to share time with minorities, women and gays. They give lip service to diversity but in their hearts they abhor diversity. Oh yeah, and young people, they’re worthless too because they insist on thinking for themselves. On the other hand you have the group that says times change and we need to change with it. It has been true since the beginning of time. They believe that diversity is a strength not a weakness since it allows us to draw on multiple perspectives. They embrace change. They recognize that just because the world does not look the same as it did 50 years ago, that’s a good thing, not a bad thing. They are realists and chose to see the glass as half full not half empty.

. . . Says a white heterosexual male that drives looking in the rear view mirror singing Those Were the Days My Friend.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Another way to characterize the division you describe is a division based on perspective. On the one hand you the crowd that believes that everything was better back when. They find change disturbing. They spend their life looking in the rear view mirror wondering how heterosexual white males ended up having to share time with minorities, women and gays. They give lip service to diversity but in their hearts they abhor diversity. Oh yeah, and young people, they’re worthless too because they insist on thinking for themselves. On the other hand you have the group that says times change and we need to change with it. It has been true since the beginning of time. They believe that diversity is a strength not a weakness since it allows us to draw on multiple perspectives. They embrace change. They recognize that just because the world does not look the same as it did 50 years ago, that’s a good thing, not a bad thing. They are realists and chose to see the glass as half full not half empty.

. . . Says a white heterosexual male that drives looking in the rear view mirror singing Those Were the Days My Friend.

Says a white heterosexual male, that pays taxes, spent 30years as a productive member of society providing good carreers with benefits and retirement for hundreds of employees. Making a living providing needed and value added services and infrastructure.

Raising a family while never taking a handout, and a family raised that has never taken a handout. A man that has taken responsibility for his decisions, that has raised children that take responsibility for their decisions.

A heterosexual,male that has spent his life as a responsible citizen that has given back to society and has always helped people in need.

One of those evil bastards that takes care of his family, A reprobate that takes his responsibilities seriously, one that doesn't expect society to pay for his bad decisions.

Yep, I'm a danger to our country!!!! A dinosaur, I should be banned, people like me should never have a say in your modern progressive society......

I should just shut up and pay taxes so you moderates can feel good, and keep on losing, I know.....

Frankly, I don’t give a shit anymore. At age 75 with no children, I don’t worry about future generations and I have more than enough money to live and die quite comfortably. Selfish? Yes, and I still don’t give shit. I’m leaving salvation to the night shift. Good luck but I hold out little hope….

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Another way to characterize the division you describe is a division based on perspective. On the one hand you the crowd that believes that everything was better back when. They find change disturbing. They spend their life looking in the rear view mirror wondering how heterosexual white males ended up having to share time with minorities, women and gays. They give lip service to diversity but in their hearts they abhor diversity. Oh yeah, and young people, they’re worthless too because they insist on thinking for themselves. On the other hand you have the group that says times change and we need to change with it. It has been true since the beginning of time. They believe that diversity is a strength not a weakness since it allows us to draw on multiple perspectives. They embrace change. They recognize that just because the world does not look the same as it did 50 years ago, that’s a good thing, not a bad thing. They are realists and chose to see the glass as half full not half empty.

. . . Says a white heterosexual male that drives looking in the rear view mirror singing Those Were the Days My Friend.

Says a white heterosexual male, that pays taxes, spent 30years as a productive member of society providing good carreers with benefits and retirement for hundreds of employees. Making a living providing needed and value added services and infrastructure.

Raising a family while never taking a handout, and a family raised that has never taken a handout. A man that has taken responsibility for his decisions, that has raised children that take responsibility for their decisions.

A heterosexual,male that has spent his life as a responsible citizen that has given back to society and has always helped people in need.

One of those evil bastards that takes care of his family, A reprobate that takes his responsibilities seriously, one that doesn't expect society to pay for his bad decisions.

Yep, I'm a danger to our country!!!! A dinosaur, I should be banned, people like me should never have a say in your modern progressive society......

I should just shut up and pay taxes so you moderates can feel good, and keep on losing, I know.....

You think that makes you unique? There are plenty of folks that have done the exact same thing that happen to see the world differently. You and Lane have no lock on being responsible citizens and that certainly does not mean your views are right and others are wrong.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:


You think that makes you unique? There are plenty of folks that have done the exact same thing that happen to see the world differently. You and Lane have no lock on being responsible citizens and that certainly does not mean your views are right and others are wrong.

Sorry Mike, but have YOU done the same?

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Another way to characterize the division you describe is a division based on perspective. On the one hand you the crowd that believes that everything was better back when. They find change disturbing. They spend their life looking in the rear view mirror wondering how heterosexual white males ended up having to share time with minorities, women and gays. They give lip service to diversity but in their hearts they abhor diversity. Oh yeah, and young people, they’re worthless too because they insist on thinking for themselves. On the other hand you have the group that says times change and we need to change with it. It has been true since the beginning of time. They believe that diversity is a strength not a weakness since it allows us to draw on multiple perspectives. They embrace change. They recognize that just because the world does not look the same as it did 50 years ago, that’s a good thing, not a bad thing. They are realists and chose to see the glass as half full not half empty.

Well said. I grew up in the rural South, in my County black people were only allowed to live in defined areas of the two small towns, exactly one black family lived "out of town", Swan Johnson was a butcher, and a damned good one, everybody had him kill and butcher their hogs.

I didn't even know that was strange until I graduated from high school and joined the Army and went places where everybody could pretty much live where they wanted to.

A bunch on this Board think blacks and browns should still "know their place" and women should be subservient and quiet.

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Another way to characterize the division you describe is a division based on perspective. On the one hand you the crowd that believes that everything was better back when. They find change disturbing. They spend their life looking in the rear view mirror wondering how heterosexual white males ended up having to share time with minorities, women and gays. They give lip service to diversity but in their hearts they abhor diversity. Oh yeah, and young people, they’re worthless too because they insist on thinking for themselves. On the other hand you have the group that says times change and we need to change with it. It has been true since the beginning of time. They believe that diversity is a strength not a weakness since it allows us to draw on multiple perspectives. They embrace change. They recognize that just because the world does not look the same as it did 50 years ago, that’s a good thing, not a bad thing. They are realists and chose to see the glass as half full not half empty.

Well said. I grew up in the rural South, in my County black people were only allowed to live in defined areas of the two small towns, exactly one black family lived "out of town", Swan Johnson was a butcher, and a damned good one, everybody had him kill and butcher their hogs.

I didn't even know that was strange until I graduated from high school and joined the Army and went places where everybody could pretty much live where they wanted to.

A bunch on this Board think blacks and browns should still "know their place" and women should be subservient and quiet.

Tell us, again, why you have CHOSEN to retire in a racist, bible-belt state?

the irony is amazing

quote:

Originally posted by jdollar:
Frankly, I don’t give a shit anymore. At age 75 with no children, I don’t worry about future generations and I have more than enough money to live and die quite comfortably. Selfish? Yes, and I still don’t give shit. I’m leaving salvation to the night shift. Good luck but I hold out little hope….

Want to adopt me? I'll be a perfect son, you won't see me or hear from me, you don't need to remember my birthday or Christmas, we won't have family reunions and when you cash in your chips they can just send me a check for what's left and I'll break my "No drinking" habit and lift a toast...

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Another way to characterize the division you describe is a division based on perspective. On the one hand you the crowd that believes that everything was better back when. They find change disturbing. They spend their life looking in the rear view mirror wondering how heterosexual white males ended up having to share time with minorities, women and gays. They give lip service to diversity but in their hearts they abhor diversity. Oh yeah, and young people, they’re worthless too because they insist on thinking for themselves. On the other hand you have the group that says times change and we need to change with it. It has been true since the beginning of time. They believe that diversity is a strength not a weakness since it allows us to draw on multiple perspectives. They embrace change. They recognize that just because the world does not look the same as it did 50 years ago, that’s a good thing, not a bad thing. They are realists and chose to see the glass as half full not half empty.

Good post!

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Another way to characterize the division you describe is a division based on perspective. On the one hand you the crowd that believes that everything was better back when. They find change disturbing. They spend their life looking in the rear view mirror wondering how heterosexual white males ended up having to share time with minorities, women and gays. They give lip service to diversity but in their hearts they abhor diversity. Oh yeah, and young people, they’re worthless too because they insist on thinking for themselves. On the other hand you have the group that says times change and we need to change with it. It has been true since the beginning of time. They believe that diversity is a strength not a weakness since it allows us to draw on multiple perspectives. They embrace change. They recognize that just because the world does not look the same as it did 50 years ago, that’s a good thing, not a bad thing. They are realists and chose to see the glass as half full not half empty.

Well said. I grew up in the rural South, in my County black people were only allowed to live in defined areas of the two small towns, exactly one black family lived "out of town", Swan Johnson was a butcher, and a damned good one, everybody had him kill and butcher their hogs.

I didn't even know that was strange until I graduated from high school and joined the Army and went places where everybody could pretty much live where they wanted to.

A bunch on this Board think blacks and browns should still "know their place" and women should be subservient and quiet.

Tell us, again, why you have CHOSEN to retire in a racist, bible-belt state?

the irony is amazing

As always, hitting "view post" on somebody worthy of Ignore is a waste, but here goes:

I was raised in Tennessee from the age of 6, which wasn't lately, and except for the 7 years my big Uncle bounced me around here, there and yonder I've been a Tennesseean since, and expect to rot into the ground here.

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:

quote:

Originally posted by jdollar:
Frankly, I don’t give a shit anymore. At age 75 with no children, I don’t worry about future generations and I have more than enough money to live and die quite comfortably. Selfish? Yes, and I still don’t give shit. I’m leaving salvation to the night shift. Good luck but I hold out little hope….

Want to adopt me? I'll be a perfect son, you won't see me or hear from me, you don't need to remember my birthday or Christmas, we won't have family reunions and when you cash in your chips they can just send me a check for what's left and I'll break my "No drinking" habit and lift a toast...

Through 4 wives I made it a point to have NO kids. Won’t start now. As I said, I’m too selfish. I’m enjoying retirement. Ideally I die after 10-11 good years and leave my wife more than enough to live on until her time comes. I smoke and drink too much so anything beyond 10 years of fun is gravy on the potatoes and anything less is karma.

Keeping politics out of it, I do look back fondly on the memories and stories about pheasant and duck clubs, good public land hunting, pack horses, hunting rifles and bird guns that weren't made via CNC and had nice wood. I do prefer good leather boots, steel pickup trucks, bird dogs that learned to hunt from its owner's training and experience with its owner in the field. I miss decency and manners in the workplace, a public education system that favored The Three R's, and neighbors/ a neighborhood that wasn't suspicious.

In politics, I remember Ford being thought of as clumsy but decent. I remember Carter being thought of as a crummy executive but a good man. I remember Reagan being controversial in his political leaning and agenda, but I think universally seen as virtuous and a leader..

I am genuinely appalled that Americans elect Ilan Omar, Rashida Tlab, Don Trump, Hillary Clinton Bob Menendez, etc. I thought Ted Stevens was a good enough or something senator, but oce he earned that conviction, Uncle Ted was dead to me so to speak. I voted Democrat for the first time ever emphatically to get rid of Ted.
There was no way, no frigging way I was ever going to vote for Palin in 2022 so I voted for the second time ever for a Democrat and so far am very happy with Mary Peltola.

I have no understanding of and have no interest in conversing with my fellow Americans that vote for Tlab or have a tranny kid or participate in a BLM riot. I think there is a virtual Iron Curtain between myself and any American that is pro Palestinian/ anti Israel, cheers an open border supports PETA and animal rights, I wish all of the above well, Jesus loves them and so do I, and would consider it my duty and a privilege to prepare and serve them a meal, but please, no conversation, just simply smile, nod and eat.

I am not, nor will I be training my daughter to fight for our nation. Afghanistan is plenty for me, no more, not one single drop of blood. My daughter will hunt and shoot, she will defend herself with her brains and fists, but she'll also have the sense enough to see thru the Chickenhawks like we have here on the pf that saber rattle for others to go off, fight and die, see thru the politicians and "Rulers" that "rule" for their own selfish benefit and see thru the duplicity and irrational ranting of her fellow citizens. My girl will understand the value and prudence of a Bug Out Bag.

How do Americans like some of us here civilly occupy the same space as a Gavin Newsom? I don't see it.

Bingo. Spot on.

The tactics of the Far right to sanitise history and narratives is just not covered enough.

I read a recent article that was titled something like "The Abortion Lie of the Evangelical conservatives". It basically highlighted how abortion became a GOP political issue only after 1978 mid terms. As segregation became an untenable political position and the tax exemptions for the pro segregation Universities were abolished, the so called Evangelical Conservatives switched from segregation to abortion as their political platform.

I also look at the rear view mirror based on my Christian values from a different social environment.

As I have posted many times here over the last 15 years, Jesus was a liberal and he condemned the self righteous Pharisees.

America has abandoned God and embraced money, power and Trumpism.

Instead of propagating Love, Joy and Peace, we see hate and falsehood being spread.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Another way to characterize the division you describe is a division based on perspective. On the one hand you the crowd that believes that everything was better back when. They find change disturbing. They spend their life looking in the rear view mirror wondering how heterosexual white males ended up having to share time with minorities, women and gays. They give lip service to diversity but in their hearts they abhor diversity. Oh yeah, and young people, they’re worthless too because they insist on thinking for themselves. On the other hand you have the group that says times change and we need to change with it. It has been true since the beginning of time. They believe that diversity is a strength not a weakness since it allows us to draw on multiple perspectives. They embrace change. They recognize that just because the world does not look the same as it did 50 years ago, that’s a good thing, not a bad thing. They are realists and chose to see the glass as half full not half empty.

quote:

How do Americans like some of us here civilly occupy the same space as a Gavin Newsom? I don't see it.

He is far more credible than Trump, Desantis, McCarthy, Ted Cruiz, Jordan, and so many other GOP fakers who still cannot accept the horrors of Jan 6.

America is in decline because the Right decided to give up on God, family values and the Truth in favour of power. They have now given up on basic human decency and Democracy.

Karl Rove's strategy of fake news to discredit Democrats was the opening of the slippery slope highway to some extent.

I cannot even begin to comprehend the GOP Far Right supporting Putin!

quote:

Originally posted by Nakihunter:
Bingo. Spot on.

The tactics of the Far right to sanitise history and narratives is just not covered enough.

I read a recent article that was titled something like "The Abortion Lie of the Evangelical conservatives". It basically highlighted how abortion became a GOP political issue only after 1978 mid terms. As segregation became an untenable political position and the tax exemptions for the pro segregation Universities were abolished, the so called Evangelical Conservatives switched from segregation to abortion as their political platform.

I also look at the rear view mirror based on my Christian values from a different social environment.

As I have posted many times here over the last 15 years, Jesus was a liberal and he condemned the self righteous Pharisees.

America has abandoned God and embraced money, power and Trumpism.

Instead of propagating Love, Joy and Peace, we see hate and falsehood being spread.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Another way to characterize the division you describe is a division based on perspective. On the one hand you the crowd that believes that everything was better back when. They find change disturbing. They spend their life looking in the rear view mirror wondering how heterosexual white males ended up having to share time with minorities, women and gays. They give lip service to diversity but in their hearts they abhor diversity. Oh yeah, and young people, they’re worthless too because they insist on thinking for themselves. On the other hand you have the group that says times change and we need to change with it. It has been true since the beginning of time. They believe that diversity is a strength not a weakness since it allows us to draw on multiple perspectives. They embrace change. They recognize that just because the world does not look the same as it did 50 years ago, that’s a good thing, not a bad thing. They are realists and chose to see the glass as half full not half empty.

The RIGHT sanitizing history??

Where have you been?

It is the bloody stupid LEFT that is erasing history!

A bunch of fuckwits who brought you political correctness, BLM and wokeness!

quote:

Originally posted by Nakihunter:
Bingo. Spot on.

The tactics of the Far right to sanitise history and narratives is just not covered enough.

I read a recent article that was titled something like "The Abortion Lie of the Evangelical conservatives". It basically highlighted how abortion became a GOP political issue only after 1978 mid terms. As segregation became an untenable political position and the tax exemptions for the pro segregation Universities were abolished, the so called Evangelical Conservatives switched from segregation to abortion as their political platform.

I also look at the rear view mirror based on my Christian values from a different social environment.

As I have posted many times here over the last 15 years, Jesus was a liberal and he condemned the self righteous Pharisees.

America has abandoned God and embraced money, power and Trumpism.

Instead of propagating Love, Joy and Peace, we see hate and falsehood being spread.

Naki, I think your assessment it correct, but I believe your condemnation it to narrow.

If there was a virtuous or righteous side I think more would follow, but there isn't.

The United States is the modern day Tower of Babel. America is the image of the Roman Empire stretching from Egypt to Britain and not a single person all along the way feels "Unified".

quote:

Originally posted by Nakihunter:

quote:

How do Americans like some of us here civilly occupy the same space as a Gavin Newsom? I don't see it.

He is far more credible than Trump, Desantis, McCarthy, Ted Cruiz, Jordan, and so many other GOP fakers who still cannot accept the horrors of Jan 6.

America is in decline because the Right decided to give up on God, family values and the Truth in favour of power. They have now given up on basic human decency and Democracy.

Karl Rove's strategy of fake news to discredit Democrats was the opening of the slippery slope highway to some extent.

I cannot even begin to comprehend the GOP Far Right supporting Putin!

Your distance makes you clueless.

The division IS real. The gap is widening. The thought processes of the 2 sides are as similar as night and day, oil and water, fire and ice. There is no common ground. I see nothing on the horizon to make it better.

2 things brought this home to me:

1) The numbers of people within our country willing to justify the action taken by Hamas against Israel.
2) The fact that illegal migrants are flooding into our nation and many do not even care. And now, some are starting to say it is not even happening and only propaganda.

I have a hard time believing those 2 lines of thought even exist in this country…much less how to rebut them. Some days I think I woke up on Mars.

I think US is doing just fine
Every generation thinks that it was better back then and younger generation is worthless…I can still hear my dad
Yes, things could be better and border can be taken care of with the stroke of a pen
World conflicts can go to hell as far I’m concerned as we need to take care of our own
Racial division seems to always raise its own ugly head only because of the so called benefits to minority groups and you would think we’d be past that and consider ourselves Americans only
Anyway, that’s just being eternal optimist in me

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
The division IS real. The gap is widening. The thought processes of the 2 sides are as similar as night and day, oil and water, fire and ice. There is no common ground. I see nothing on the horizon to make it better.

2 things brought this home to me:

1) The numbers of people within our country willing to justify the action taken by Hamas against Israel.
2) The fact that illegal migrants are flooding into our nation and many do not even care. And now, some are starting to say it is not even happening and only propaganda.

I have a hard time believing those 2 lines of thought even exist in this country…much less how to rebut them. Some days I think I woke up on Mars.

Its incredible isn't it?

Its nothing but willful ignorance.....or pure evil.....


.

quote:

Originally posted by Bivoj:
I think US is doing just fine
Every generation thinks that it was better back then and younger generation is worthless…I can still hear my dad
Yes, things could be better and border can be taken care of with the stroke of a pen
World conflicts can go to hell as far I’m concerned as we need to take care of our own
Racial division seems to always raise its own ugly head only because of the so called benefits to minority groups and you would think we’d be past that and consider ourselves Americans only
Anyway, that’s just being eternal optimist in me

Well damn, we finally find something to agree on. You are exactly right. This thread could also be called the "old man syndrome" thread. In the 60's, the folks from the 20's complained the world was going to hell. In the 70's, the folks from the 30's complained that the world was going to hell. Etc. Not that surprising when you spend your life looking and wanting to walk backwards.

Fool yourself all you want to. I used to believe it true…the USA will always be fine. I am sure many Romans said it as well…even believed it.

I do not any longer. The USA is not fine. It is deeply divided…so much so the 2 parties couldn’t agree that the sky is blue…each with their own shade of pink and purple.

Ronald Reagan saw it and things were just beginning to unravel is his time.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Fool yourself all you want to. I used to believe it true…the USA will always be fine. I am sure many Romans said it as well…even believed it.

I do not any longer. The USA is not fine. It is deeply divided…so much so the 2 parties couldn’t agree that the sky is blue…each with their own shade of pink and purple.

Ronald Reagan saw it and things were just beginning to unravel is his time.

We've always been deeply divided. We just didn't have the interweb to quack about it all the time until fairly recently.

Settle down, Lane. Things are going to be OK.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
The division IS real. The gap is widening. The thought processes of the 2 sides are as similar as night and day, oil and water, fire and ice. There is no common ground. I see nothing on the horizon to make it better.

2 things brought this home to me:

1) The numbers of people within our country willing to justify the action taken by Hamas against Israel.
2) The fact that illegal migrants are flooding into our nation and many do not even care. And now, some are starting to say it is not even happening and only propaganda.

I have a hard time believing those 2 lines of thought even exist in this country…much less how to rebut them. Some days I think I woke up on Mars.

Some days, we think you woke up on Mars too.

The United States exists in more than one "reality" simultaneously, largely due to the Balkanization of media.

Most of the United States lives in objective reality, a world of facts and science and technology where the economy is improving every time new numbers come out and the climate is changing because of our actions.

A substantial minority lives in a different reality where Joe Biden is evil and the Mongol hordes are streaming across the border and Michelle Obama is a man in drag and all the evidence of climate change is coincidence and made up by liberals and school children identify as cats and crap in litter boxes.

A smaller minority, which has considerable overlap with the mainstream Republicans above, think everything is being orchestrated to their personal detriment and COVID was just a bad cold and JFK Jr. didn't die in a plane crash and Donald Trump is a leader who is being unfairly maligned by his enemies and January 6th was just normal tourists or ANTIFA or maybe crisis actors hired for the day.

And none of the three can understand what's wrong with the rest.

We are in a time, and its not just the US, of over reaction too each other. And we are in a time of excess.

Excess of information. So much that it takes more time than we have to process it and so we choose the information we like. Excess of freedom, without understanding what freedom actually is. So that we believe our freedom allows us to behave as we wish, even if that means forcing our way onto others and reducing thier freedoms.
Excess of comfort and safety. So that we invent problems or minor ones become major in our minds, because there is nothing against which to compare.

But it is a pendulum, and it will swing back.
We will slowly discard the bad ideas whilst keeping hold of the real improvements.
We just have to ride out the shitstorm.

As all politics are local, we have always become more divided and separate while things are subjectively doing well.

When there is an external threat we come together. Unfortunately, we do tend to not recognize threats until too late at times.

While I am upset that we are not getting along that well, and that we can’t even agree on what our problems are, I do think we will come together at some point as needed. The biggest issue is more relative priorities than total lack of understanding.

I think we will be different (and while not necessarily better from my point of view) but fine.

quote:

hordes are streaming across the border

This is indeed a fact. You can drive to Del Rio and witness it yourself most days.

And that is our biggest issue right now…border and country invasion
Scary and absolutely treasonous from our politicians, who can’t do absolutely nothing about that and refuse to do nothing

Your post is evidence of my comment.

It was the conservatives that hid Winston Churchill's racist agenda dight through his life and 60 years after that.

The Republicans and the conservatives (Right wing) are the ones hiding the evidence of genocide in US history against blacks and Native Americans.

Autocratic Arab regimes are also conservative Right. They hide and falsify pre Islamic history and destroy archaeological evidence.

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Originally posted by Saeed:

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Originally posted by Nakihunter:
Bingo. Spot on.

The tactics of the Far right to sanitise history and narratives is just not covered enough.

I read a recent article that was titled something like "The Abortion Lie of the Evangelical conservatives". It basically highlighted how abortion became a GOP political issue only after 1978 mid terms. As segregation became an untenable political position and the tax exemptions for the pro segregation Universities were abolished, the so called Evangelical Conservatives switched from segregation to abortion as their political platform.

I also look at the rear view mirror based on my Christian values from a different social environment.

As I have posted many times here over the last 15 years, Jesus was a liberal and he condemned the self righteous Pharisees.

America has abandoned God and embraced money, power and Trumpism.

Instead of propagating Love, Joy and Peace, we see hate and falsehood being spread.

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Originally posted by MJines:
Another way to characterize the division you describe is a division based on perspective. On the one hand you the crowd that believes that everything was better back when. They find change disturbing. They spend their life looking in the rear view mirror wondering how heterosexual white males ended up having to share time with minorities, women and gays. They give lip service to diversity but in their hearts they abhor diversity. Oh yeah, and young people, they’re worthless too because they insist on thinking for themselves. On the other hand you have the group that says times change and we need to change with it. It has been true since the beginning of time. They believe that diversity is a strength not a weakness since it allows us to draw on multiple perspectives. They embrace change. They recognize that just because the world does not look the same as it did 50 years ago, that’s a good thing, not a bad thing. They are realists and chose to see the glass as half full not half empty.

The RIGHT sanitizing history??

Where have you been?

It is the bloody stupid LEFT that is erasing history!

A bunch of fuckwits who brought you political correctness, BLM and wokeness!

Your proximity makes you blind with no moral compass

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Originally posted by Scott King:

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Originally posted by Nakihunter:

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How do Americans like some of us here civilly occupy the same space as a Gavin Newsom? I don't see it.

He is far more credible than Trump, Desantis, McCarthy, Ted Cruiz, Jordan, and so many other GOP fakers who still cannot accept the horrors of Jan 6.

America is in decline because the Right decided to give up on God, family values and the Truth in favour of power. They have now given up on basic human decency and Democracy.

Karl Rove's strategy of fake news to discredit Democrats was the opening of the slippery slope highway to some extent.

I cannot even begin to comprehend the GOP Far Right supporting Putin!

Your distance makes you clueless.

Lane

I am shocked that you are not ashamed of the racist values and heritage of conservatives and so called Christian Evangelicals. You are so dishonest that the very roots of the division are ignored in all your posts. You keep lamenting about traditional America the way it used to be (a blatantly racist and genocidal America) that you want to go back to!

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Originally posted by ledvm:
The division IS real. The gap is widening. The thought processes of the 2 sides are as similar as night and day, oil and water, fire and ice. There is no common ground. I see nothing on the horizon to make it better.

2 things brought this home to me:

1) The numbers of people within our country willing to justify the action taken by Hamas against Israel.
2) The fact that illegal migrants are flooding into our nation and many do not even care. And now, some are starting to say it is not even happening and only propaganda.

I have a hard time believing those 2 lines of thought even exist in this country…much less how to rebut them. Some days I think I woke up on Mars.