quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:
Whatever you do ME, don't consider the possibility that your team could be part of the problem.


The lefts version of Lane.......



It's all the other guy and my team is lilly white.

If it was all the other team, the Democrats would not be polling at the lowest point in decades.

Darn, Steve.

My "team"? I don't have a team, and they don't have me.

The flip side of Lane? That's ridiculous. On a scale of 1 to 10 radicalized, Lane is about 8, in my estimation. Not a 10 only because he doesn't advocate murder. He's okay with some violence though and perhaps some deaths, if someone else does it to the "them" in his us vs them.

It would take a really radicalized Leftist to be the flip side of Lane. I'm sure there are some, but I don't know any and IMO there are none on this forum.

I never said it was all one side or the other.

If democrats are polling low, all that means is that the republican lies are working.

If the Left was "lilly white" then we would all be racists.

Here's something that I find shocking. Unless that video of CK saying it is faked, it must be true. I'm sure Snoops wouldn't publish something fake.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news...Avs?ocid=socialshare

What Charlie Kirk actually said about Biden getting 'the death penalty'
Story by Nur Ibrahim • 1h •
3 min read

And

https://www.msn.com/en-us/vide...YdE?ocid=socialshare

Kimmel calls out JD Vance for pointing finger at the left in wake of Charlie Kirk assassination

=================================

It looks like republican rage is working too. Free speech is ok so long as it supports the Right narratives.

Kimmel got cancelled.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:

quote:

Originally posted by Scott King:

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
She got what she deserved. A bunch of others unfortunately escaped getting the same thing they deserved too.

The entire world has learned a valuable lesson from January 6th. You can in fact attack the Capitol of The United States intending to overthrow the function and get away with it right down to Presidential pardons.

A the Taliban and ISIS all said "Noted!".

The memory folks should have of January 6 is not of pardons for insurrectionists but of dozens of body bags being carried out of the Capitol.

Dozens of body bags?
When did this happen?

The pardons were based on the lack of due process afforded the many accused.
Did you not notice that there was literally zero opposition to the pardons?
You’d think that if there was unequivocal evidence against the many J6 agitators, the pardons would have been a bigger news story.
It wasn’t because the Left knew it was a losing proposition .

quote:

Originally posted by Huvius:

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:

quote:

Originally posted by Scott King:

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
She got what she deserved. A bunch of others unfortunately escaped getting the same thing they deserved too.

The entire world has learned a valuable lesson from January 6th. You can in fact attack the Capitol of The United States intending to overthrow the function and get away with it right down to Presidential pardons.

A the Taliban and ISIS all said "Noted!".

The memory folks should have of January 6 is not of pardons for insurrectionists but of dozens of body bags being carried out of the Capitol.

Dozens of body bags?
When did this happen?

The pardons were based on the lack of due process afforded the many accused.
Did you not notice that there was literally zero opposition to the pardons?
You’d think that if there was unequivocal evidence against the many J6 agitators, the pardons would have been a bigger news story.
It wasn’t because the Left knew it was a losing proposition .

No one questions THE ORANGE MAGA ARSEHOLE.

It has gone so far that the Supreme Court allows him all sorts of things which are diametrically opposite to common sense!

Good diversion Saeed.
Now go back to your charmed life..

Let him answer the question.

quote:

The pardons were based on the lack of due process afforded the many accused.
Did you not notice that there was literally zero opposition to the pardons?
You’d think that if there was unequivocal evidence against the many J6 agitators, the pardons would have been a bigger news story.
It wasn’t because the Left knew it was a losing proposition .

I think it is amazing that anyone actually believes that BS.

Did I mention republican lies are actually working?

But apparently you are correct about the body bags:

AI Overview
No, people were not hauled out of the Capitol in body bags after the January 6, 2021, riot. This claim is a false narrative that has circulated on social media.

https://www.google.com/search?...sclient=gws-wiz-serp

So sitting in a jail for a few years with access to an attorney only once every three to six months is your idea of affording Constitutional rights of the accused?

Were they treated any differently from other convicted felons?

They were sitting in their cells in prison because that's where the law sent them.

Trump pardoned them because they were his followers. Denial of due process is a nonsense excuse.

quote:

Originally posted by Huvius:

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:

quote:

Originally posted by Scott King:

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
She got what she deserved. A bunch of others unfortunately escaped getting the same thing they deserved too.

The entire world has learned a valuable lesson from January 6th. You can in fact attack the Capitol of The United States intending to overthrow the function and get away with it right down to Presidential pardons.

A the Taliban and ISIS all said "Noted!".

The memory folks should have of January 6 is not of pardons for insurrectionists but of dozens of body bags being carried out of the Capitol.

Dozens of body bags?
When did this happen?

The pardons were based on the lack of due process afforded the many accused.
Did you not notice that there was literally zero opposition to the pardons?
You’d think that if there was unequivocal evidence against the many J6 agitators, the pardons would have been a bigger news story.
It wasn’t because the Left knew it was a losing proposition .

I don't believe your reading comprehension here is exactly on point and our perception of the opinion of the pardons greatly differes.

To be plain, I wasn't going to vote for Trump last year regardless. I never did and never would. Trumps plan to pardon the January 6th convicts only added hundreds of yards of concrete to my opinion.

That you dismiss the judicial systems convictions also adds weight to my opinion that MAGA has no interest in law and order. Tried, convicted and sentenced any you say, "yeah right.". I can only hope when the shoe is on the other foot and its you seeking justice you get what you've asked for here.

I don't know if that's true, Huv.

You made the claim re due process, so prove it.

https://www.npr.org/2024/06/14...t-jan-6-prosecutions

That’s just from 6 seconds of searching.

As I said, in this day of countering every move of the Trump administration, it’s telling how mute the Left has been about the J6 pardons.

71 awaiting trial in 2024 on obstruction charges on which they were being held?
When did this obstruction occur?
Hmm.

Swift, certain and fair?

quote:

it’s telling how mute the Left has been about the J6 pardons.

In my news feed it was not mute.

quote:

Originally posted by Huvius:
https://www.npr.org/2024/06/14...t-jan-6-prosecutions

That’s just from 6 seconds of searching.

Well, that's impressive, especially from NPR.

I quickly read the article, but didn't study it, yet.

I see how you could draw conclusions from it, even bias or incorrect conclusions.

Excerpts:

But while Friday's decision might intuitively be seen as a devastating blow to prosecutors, a deep dive into the data concludes the effects will be “minimal.” NYU law professor Ryan Goodman is the lead author of the study, published by “Just Security, which relied on NPR’s detailed data base of Jan 6 Capitol riot cases.

Goodman notes that Trump is different from the Capitol rioters because the obstruction charges against him involve efforts to interfere with the electoral college certificates arriving at the desk to be counted on Jan. 6th, and the use of false elector certificates—all of which would seem to fall under the tampering-with-evidence provision of the obstruction statute.

As for the Jan. 6 rioters, the study found that of the 1417 people charged so far in connection with the Jan. 6 invasion, only 346, or 24 per cent, were charged under the obstruction statute. Of that 346, 128 defendants were convicted by a jury of obstruction and another crime, most often another felony, which would still stand.

A different cohort of 48 people pleaded guilty to the obstruction charge, which now goes away. But hovering over all of these pleas is the fact that the plea agreement uniformly included an important caveat: In the event that the conviction were to be “vacated for any reason,” the government reserved the right to prosecute for other alleged crimes that prosecutors had either agreed not to prosecute or agreed to dismiss at sentencing.

Finally, the study, found that until Friday, 71 people were still awaiting trial on the obstruction charge, but more than half are also charged with another felony. While those felonies may not have penalties as severe as the obstruction charge, if the defendants are found guilty of those other crimes, the sentencing judge is permitted to consider the conduct charged in the obstruction case in determining the length of the sentence.

=========================================

Also, it seems to me that often prosecutors load the wagon so to speak with charges, some of which often get dropped. But the core charge also often results in conviction or plea deal. Sometimes, if appealed, some of the charges leading to conviction are reversed and some not.

=========================================

quote:

Originally posted by Huvius:
71 awaiting trial in 2024 on obstruction charges on which they were being held?
When did this obstruction occur?
Hmm.

The article explains that too. Obstruction did occur. It looks like the prosecution stretched the legal definition and Roberts corrected that.

=======================================

The point is that the article actually supports the premise of due process. Not the lack of it.

The only due process violation or corruption seems to me to be the pardons.

========================================

Also, as I recall, some of those criminals on 1/6 were convicted of seditious conspiracy. That's a high bar for the prosecution re burden of proof.

My reference to dozens of body bags being what we should remember was not a statement of what did happen, it was a statement of what should have happened. Babbitt should have had a lot more company at the morgue. Insurrectionists taking over the Capitol should be addressed with deadly force.

quote:

Also, as I recall, some of those criminals on 1/6 were convicted of seditious conspiracy. That's a high bar for the prosecution re burden of proof.

High bar indeed.
So all A-OK to imprison defendants indefinitely while the prosecution conjures up a case.

As I said, this isn’t a hill any leftist is dying on.
“Nothing to see here… carry on” has been the directive.

So. If the J6 incident was such an attack on democracy, as so many here in the ARPF would have you believe, why was it so readily abandoned?
You all know the answer to that.

My opinion on that, Jines, is that the fact that it didn't happen that way should be considered evidence of the benevolence of the capitol police, and their regard for life.

Instead, ironically, the Right made the claim of incompetence instead.

quote:

Originally posted by Huvius:
So. If the J6 incident was such an attack on democracy, as so many here in the ARPF would have you believe, why was it so readily abandoned?
You all know the answer to that.

Was it readily abandoned?

They quit when they realized they weren't going to catch Pence or Pelosi to hang in public, and the certification was gonna happen that day despite them. The guy with the zip-tie handcuffs must have been disappointed. It might even be, despite all their zealotry, they realized they had been used and Trump was a puff dragon.

Readily abandoned? Your efforts to spin this come across as absurd. Dozens of prosecutions and convictions, jail and prison time for many, Congressional investigations, etc. The President has the right to pardon individuals, he wrongly did so. There was plenty of condemnation for that action as well. Try your spin somewhere else.

Put yourself against the might of the United States government and I’d bet a plea deal would be quite a consolation.

Tell me, what news outlet or political think tank gave the pardons more than a cursory consideration?

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
My reference to dozens of body bags being what we should remember was not a statement of what did happen, it was a statement of what should have happened. Babbitt should have had a lot more company at the morgue. Insurrectionists taking over the Capitol should be addressed with deadly force.

Anyone who disagrees with the above is either a traitor or delusional to the point of insanity.

MAGA will curse the day they set this precedent of pardons for Sedition.

AI:

Former President Donald Trump sparked widespread controversy in January 2025 when he issued broad pardons and commutations to hundreds of people involved in the January 6, 2021, attack on the U.S. Capitol. The move, which fulfilled a campaign promise, drew immediate and intense criticism from across the political spectrum.

If you wanted a real answer you could do the Internet research yourself. Fact is, you know the answer. You are just throwing out a baseless narrative to stir the pot. Troll elsewhere.

quote:

Originally posted by Huvius:

quote:

Also, as I recall, some of those criminals on 1/6 were convicted of seditious conspiracy. That's a high bar for the prosecution re burden of proof.

High bar indeed.
So all A-OK to imprison defendants indefinitely while the prosecution conjures up a case.

As I said, this isn’t a hill any leftist is dying on.
“Nothing to see here… carry on” has been the directive.

I have been "nice" to you, haven't I?

I engaged in a debate with you. You presented claims, unfounded.

I'm not going to continue. That post quoted above is just crazy spew.

You, in my estimation have nothing I can work with. Indoctrination is a pitiful thing.

was the attempt of coup considered for a while internal or domestic terrorism? when that charge was removed?

Very weak coup,
Need to look at video of central African coups, they bring lots of guns

Fake electors sent to congress, the capital violently stormed, the Orange Turd calling Raffensperger and asking him to find 11,780 votes.....

The fact of the matter is that the rat bastard Trump tried to steal the election, then pardoned those who tried to help him.

You cannot justify that behavior, though those of you who support Trump have somehow found a way to do so

quote:

This, as represented by the deletion of the study, on the DOJ website, is about the std fascist playbook.

This “study” and its publication is NOT deleted. It is readily available for all to see and read to their heart’s content.

Having the study up on a website is affirmation of its accuracy and importance. It is widely believed the study was flawed…thus DOJ decided to not affirm its conclusions…wise decision on their part.

Lane and ME, opposite sides of the same coin "it's not my team, it's the other guys". While anybody who takes an honest look can plainly see both sides engage in political violence, too much of it, and it needs to stop.

Instead of acknowledging this simple fact, you both engage in a game of back and forth denial.

Adulting includes accountability....it's hard sometimes.

Here is the fact of the matter. No person, no “team” is perfect. If you agree 80% of the time with a group/team/party…that is as good as it gets.

I agree with virtually nothing from the Democratic Party of the 21st century.

I agree with the very imperfect Republican Party at least a majority of the time and when it is boiled down to individual GOP members…some I agree with 80% of the time. Donald Trump is an 80%er for me. Governor Abbott is and 80%er. Rick Perry was 80+%er. GWB never made it 80.

Yes, there are ALL TYPES of wackos out there and I support getting rid of them all.

As I said in another thread, prosecute and convict the people who killed those Minnesota lawmakers and I will personally volunteer to trip the gallows on them. This is totally unlike “Team Left” who still continues to celebrate the assassination of Charlie — albeit many are paying a price and rightfully so.

Well, we do have TEAMS!

One consists of a bunch of stupid right IDIOTS.

And the other consists of a bunch of left wing IDIOTS.

Both are using the current sad incident, which is really has no relevance to normal life, to their advantage!

Proof of what steve said is,
that independent voters now control which way the tide goes for president.

quote:

Originally posted by MLindsay:
Very weak coup,
Need to look at video of central African coups, they bring lots of guns

i lived 6 coups in africa and sometimes with less people than what happened in your country but sometimes way more but most of the time a lot of noise not that much victims and transition with some trials and executions ... c est l afrique or this is africa if you prefer ...

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Well, we do have TEAMS!

One consists of a bunch of stupid right IDIOTS.

And the other consists of a bunch of left wing IDIOTS.

Both are using the current sad incident, which is really has no relevance to normal life, to their advantage!

I see defense and offense.

Trump and his sickophants are on the offense and using the tragedy for that purpose.

And

BTW, the shooter in no way represents the offense or defense of a TEAM.

By this then, the Dems kneeling in the rotunda re Floyd should have been shot as well…

It’s a slippery slope if anything that a group of LEO’s decide is insurrection gets shooting…

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
My reference to dozens of body bags being what we should remember was not a statement of what did happen, it was a statement of what should have happened. Babbitt should have had a lot more company at the morgue. Insurrectionists taking over the Capitol should be addressed with deadly force.

quote:

Originally posted by Huvius:

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:

quote:

Originally posted by Scott King:

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
She got what she deserved. A bunch of others unfortunately escaped getting the same thing they deserved too.

The entire world has learned a valuable lesson from January 6th. You can in fact attack the Capitol of The United States intending to overthrow the function and get away with it right down to Presidential pardons.

A the Taliban and ISIS all said "Noted!".

The memory folks should have of January 6 is not of pardons for insurrectionists but of dozens of body bags being carried out of the Capitol.

Dozens of body bags?
When did this happen?

The pardons were based on the lack of due process afforded the many accused.
Did you not notice that there was literally zero opposition to the pardons?
You’d think that if there was unequivocal evidence against the many J6 agitators, the pardons would have been a bigger news story.
It wasn’t because the Left knew it was a losing proposition .

Where on earth do you get this nonsense?

The pardons were based on trump's pardon power. Nothing else. There's no process to oppose a pardon. The president's power to pardon is based on the Constitution and is almost unlimited in relation to federal criminal convictions and charges.

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
By this then, the Dems kneeling in the rotunda re Floyd should have been shot as well…

It’s a slippery slope if anything that a group of LEO’s decide is insurrection gets shooting…

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
My reference to dozens of body bags being what we should remember was not a statement of what did happen, it was a statement of what should have happened. Babbitt should have had a lot more company at the morgue. Insurrectionists taking over the Capitol should be addressed with deadly force.

Yeah, you're right. Folks breaking down doors, smashing windows, fighting with law enforcement, taking over Congressional offices, taking over the floor of the House, etc. is exactly like people kneeling in the rotunda. Sometimes you really do embarrass yourself with your apologist approach to everything.

Medved please name some of your coups that did not involve the shooting of firearms or the brandishing and the threat of shooting them.
Thanks

Here is a question that I have yet to be answered, why did the police either did not call for help from other law enforcement organizations or nobody came.

Example the shooting yesterday in Pa., I no time they had choppers and law enforcement from several jurisdictions on the scene.

You are obviously a BIG fan of Trump's sly tactics.

"Both sides have good people".

Trump invented the term "Alt left" to minimise the Alt Right that has taken over the GOP.

The Right does not know the difference between "right & wrong". No moral compass.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:
Whatever you do ME, don't consider the possibility that your team could be part of the problem.


The lefts version of Lane.......



It's all the other guy and my team is lilly white.

If it was all the other team, the Democrats would not be polling at the lowest point in decades.