“In a country that has been racked by one mass shooting after another, you might be relieved to hear that Congress is finally taking action in the face of all this horrific gun violence: Four Republicans are sponsoring a bill to declare the AR-15 America’s national gun.

….Reps. Barry Moore (Ala.), Andrew S. Clyde (Ga.), Lauren Boebert (Colo.) and, of course, George Santos (N.Y.) have looked at our gun violence epidemic and said: There is something we can do. HR 1095 is excited “to declare an AR-15 style rifle chambered in a .223 Remington round or a 5.56x45mm NATO round to be the National Gun of the United States.””

http://forums.accuratereloadin...3811043/m/8261097372

What was said the other day about low information voters?
I just wouldn't know what to say to these idiots nor their constituents.

It would make me happy if every American family took the responsibility to learn to shoot and maintain an AR-15 and owned 2.

It is likely that in the next 50 years we will need them when China believes it is time to pull the trigger. That time may be sooner rather than later. The warning signs are out there.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
It would make me happy if every American family took the responsibility to learn to shoot and maintain an AR-15 and owned 2.

It is likely that in the next 50 years we will need them when China believes it is time to pull the trigger. That time may be sooner rather than later. The warning signs are out there.

Not likely for me, I have made it this far without the need to own a plastic gun, I don't think change is in my future. To each their own but I'm more likely to take up underwater basket weaving, I have more interest in that than in than plastic AR's.

I did just buy three more percussion English sporting rifles though, THOSE are interesting, maybe not as interesting as falling block rifles, but darn close.

quote:

Originally posted by skb:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
It would make me happy if every American family took the responsibility to learn to shoot and maintain an AR-15 and owned 2.

It is likely that in the next 50 years we will need them when China believes it is time to pull the trigger. That time may be sooner rather than later. The warning signs are out there.

Not likely for me, I have made this far without the need to own a plastic gun, I don't think change is in my future. To each their own but I'm more likely to take up underwater basket weaving, I have more interest in that than in than plastic AR's.

I did just buy three more percussion English sporting rifles though, THOSE are interesting, maybe not as interesting as falling block rifles, but darn close.

I own 3 or 4. I shoot one occasionally to keep in practice. I include my son and my wife in that practice and we also shoot our side arms at the same time. They have a place and a purpose.

I hunt with my classic old M-70s and various old .22 LRs, SXS and A5 shotguns, and my double rifles for big things in Africa.

I wish AR15s was a non-issue.

quote:

Originally posted by Magine Enigam:
I wish AR15s was a non-issue.

I take a very dim view of the AR.

The thing is made for "spray and pray" like any auto. The Ruger 10/22, the AR, the AK has done more to ruin marksmanship than anything I can think of.

Here, the "AR enthusiast" invests thousands and tens of thousands of $ in Tacticool silliness that never makes it past the municipal gun range. The "Gun range Green Berets" rally like Jr high gangs, salivating over their can't make it much further than the pickup bed cnc mass production. All telling their 50 year old selves they're deadly.
It's disgusting.

From our perspective, ( some kind of mature outdoor sportsman, feel free to not include me if you like,) the divorce from craftsmanship, tradition, artistry and ethics should be appalling. Stuff another 30 round mag full of factory ammo and let fly!

A fellow here sold himself to me as quite the AR guy so at his insistence I payed him in advance to build a 6.8 spc for me. I can't think of anything I need less than a .223. So anyway, after the agreement the price was doubled and the time frame quadrupled and by the way, it don't shoot! Don't shoot as I mean chamber a round and the gun goes click. Double the price, quadruple the time and I've got a pry bar, a fencepost.

I took my new 400 H&H out today and it shoots! It groups. I can chamber a round, squeeze the Timney trigger and put one 400 grain round after another in roughly the same place.

The AR is no more or less than a hammer, a chainsaw, a base model Toyota Tacoma.

I walk away with my nose in the air, pinkie finger extended away fromy grip on the teacup.

my 1/2" [on demand] varmint shooting AR's beg to differ with your opinion about their capabilities.

I admit to having one, but I'm no fan. The AR-15 is made to kill people, not game; and I currently have no reason to kill people.

That said, I do believe we have the Second Amendment right to own them. You never know, someday they might be needed for their intended purpose.

quote:

Originally posted by Lamar:
my 1/2" [on demand] varmint shooting AR's beg to differ with your opinion about their capabilities.

Yeah, I know some do.

Tell me about how your AR shoots more accurately than a 50 year old model 722, model 70, a model 700 or most new Savage's.

My model 700 -06 is slick, accurate and deadly. Regardless the politics, a mono metal copper bullet out of that thing is lights out with the first and only shot, 30 round mag no required.

I read an NRA magazine article not to long ago about a 500 S&W in an AR. Cool! I thought. Until the article mentioned it was a ten pound gun. A ten pound pistol cartridge.

The DOD is so impressed with the AR in .223, they've moved on to the 6.8 Sig. Come on Man, what is it your .223 does that the average Remington doesn't for half the price and 1/4 of the drama?

My local deer hunting gun is an AR pistol (we have some goofy laws).

One of my most accurate rifles is a sub .25 MOA Les Baer AR 10.

I shoot 3 gun regularly with an AR rifle (and a AK based shotgun).

I probably shoot more rounds through an AR rifle in .223/5.56 than any other round/rifle.

I don't think much of the standard AR in .223 as a hunting gun, but that's the round, not the rifle. If I hunted varmints more, maybe then.

I do collect military style rifles, so there is that.

I do see more silliness with guys at the range involving ARs and AK's than any other rifle... the zombie shoot types in particular. I don't get mag dumps at 5 yards, but some do that... a beta c mag dump at that distance is a waste of money and barrel life, but no skin off my rear. If you want to play with full auto, that's fun, but hard to think of a practical reason for it, personally.

quote:

Originally posted by RolandtheHeadless:
I admit to having one, but I'm no fan. The AR-15 is made to kill people, not game; and I currently have no reason to kill people.

That said, I do believe we have the Second Amendment right to own them. You never know, someday they might be needed for their intended purpose.

I wouldn't say you shouldn't have it anymore than I'd say you shouldn't have a base model Toyota Tacoma like mine.

But it sure ain't iconic, it sure ain't symbolic, and it sure don't represent anything more than American mass mechanization.
Stamp me out another belt buckle, another Chevy fender, another Bud Lite can.

My late BIL bought an expensive variation, it was a waste of money, time, & ammo. He bought only the cheapest ammo he could find because the damn thing wouldn't shoot anyway. His cheapie Savage 110 shot rings around it regardless of ammo.

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
My local deer hunting gun is an AR pistol (we have some goofy laws).

One of my most accurate rifles is a sub .25 MOA Les Baer AR 10.

I shoot 3 gun regularly with an AR rifle (and a AK based shotgun).

I probably shoot more rounds through an AR rifle in .223/5.56 than any other round/rifle.

I don't think much of the standard AR in .223 as a hunting gun, but that's the round, not the rifle. If I hunted varmints more, maybe then.

I do collect military style rifles, so there is that.

I do see more silliness with guys at the range involving ARs and AK's than any other rifle... the zombie shoot types in particular. I don't get mag dumps at 5 yards, but some do that... a beta c mag dump at that distance is a waste of money and barrel life, but no skin off my rear. If you want to play with full auto, that's fun, but hard to think of a practical reason for it, personally.

Oh my God!

Never wrestle with a pig, because you'll both get dirty and the pig likes it.

quote:

The Ruger 10/22, the AR, the AK has done more to ruin marksmanship than anything I can think of.

My 10/22 rides around the farm with me every day. It's whacked more varmints than any of the rest of my firearms at a reasonable price.

I have a great idea! Those that dont like them, dont buy one. Oh wait, you already have that option.
I'm a blued steel and wood stock guy, but the majority of the AR clones are very accurate. I hate finding my brass from any semi though.

quote:

Originally posted by Magine Enigam:
I wish AR15s was a non-issue.

They were in 1964. What changed in the last 20 years? Guns and ammo didn't change enough to be more lethal. Whatever it was/is the guns didn't cause it.

Meanwhile, in tumbleweeds country, the liberals are busy banning Ruger #1’s. A single shot, “assault” rifle. It’s too bad our countries are populated by so many that put no value on items such as freedom, and liberty.

I will be very happy to give up all my guns.

As soon as someone demonstrates to me how a gun kills anyone.

All by itself.

AR may not be good gun in inexperienced hands but it sure intimidates opposition
The spray and pray is only for full auto
Semi auto is great gun and in fight you don’t want to use full auto anyway as then it’s easy to miss and you run out of ammo too quick and then what…

My father-in-law was a top level operator in Special Forces for a number of years in the 60's and 70's. He carried a Swedish K Submachine gun quite a bit. I asked him if he would have been comfortable taking an AR15 into a fire fight. His immediate response was "that would be suicide". He was black ops for 18 years out of 22 years in service. I think of his response every time I hear a liberal call an AR15 a weapon of war.

All guns are weapons of war if used as such. There are plenty of people killed with AR's who would think so. You can say they are less effective than a larger caliber, but you'd certainly take cover under fire.

To say taking the M16 into a firefight is suicide is a bit much. Keep it remotely clean and it does fine. Ive spent enough time with both, the swedish K and the 16 to say, the FN FAL beats them both!