There's a range of options, but the core is "how do you feel about it being legal and handled just like booze"?
https://www.foxnews.com/opinio...ve-rule-law-goes-pot

Question:
Where do you stand on legalization of pot

Choices:
None - should be entirely illegal
Medical Only - by Rx
Recreational legal for 21+

 

I voted recreationally legal at 21.

I don’t condone it but:

1) I don’t want cartels profiting and lacing with fentanyl.

2) I am 90% Libertarian

I have been through it in Washington State since day one. The Amount of Driving under the Influence Rose 55%. (Marijuana is the same Charge as Alcohol.) There were MASSIVE Complaints about The Smell of The Grows. Actual Shoot Outs when they were Stealing from The Grows at Night. Mold in The Pot and the Growers are washing it in Hydrogen Peroxide. Testing was only being done from a Tip of a Bud which escalated the THC reports by Double of the actual Content. NO OVERSIGHT AT ALL!!! They just get the Tax Money!!! And the money from Fines for misconduct at The Grows. Abd from DUI's. When they Pull you over you are run to the Police Station for a Blood Test!!! The Retail Stores are selling Illegal Pot at their stores under the table. The List is Endless. I was pulled over by State Patrol for NO REASON and they Checked my eyes with a Flashlight!!! WHY? To see if they were Diolated!!!

quote:

I was pulled over by State Patrol for NO REASON and they Checked my eyes with a Flashlight!!! WHY? To see if they were Diolated!!!

Were they?

Of Course not!!!

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
I voted recreationally legal at 21.

I don’t condone it but:

1) I don’t want cartels profiting and lacing with fentanyl.

2) I am 90% Libertarian

I am basically with Lane on this one, with caveats. There is a slice of society that can't handle the curves on that road, and it's troublesome to see it. I have been in favor of legalization for decades, but am bothered by some of what I see now that it's here and now.

The black market never went away, the business just moved to rural counties where law enforcement resources are thin.

It's tough, seeing virtue in opposing points of view. Not for sissies...

Legal pot will never do 1% of the harm legal alcohol does.

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:
Legal pot will never do 1% of the harm legal alcohol does.

This is correct.

The real rationale for legalization however is that people are going to smoke weed one way or the other. Wasting police and court resources on enforcement, not to mention the impact on the folks getting arrested, just doesn't make any sense. We've tried that model for the last 100 years and it just doesn't work. People are going to smoke weed. Legalize it, tax it, control it by keeping it away from schools and minors if possible.

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Mitchell:

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:
Legal pot will never do 1% of the harm legal alcohol does.

This is correct.

The real rationale for legalization however is that people are going to smoke weed one way or the other. Wasting police and court resources on enforcement, not to mention the impact on the folks getting arrested, just doesn't make any sense. We've tried that model for the last 100 years and it just doesn't work. People are going to smoke weed. Legalize it, tax it, control it by keeping it away from schools and minors if possible.

But Prohibition worked so well with alcohol!

I voted legalize. Not much to argue about, really. And I've never smoked a joint in my life. I knew an old couple who did the bluegrass music festival circuit for several decades. The 80+ year old woman told me they always camped near the potheads as they were never any problem. The beer drinkers they stayed clear of. Pretty much my experience as well when we had our family band & traveled.

I’m in the boat that it should be prescription only.

The damage THC does is different than alcohol.

It’s associated with psychotic breaks and also problems with brain development which continues into the mid 20’s.

So far, legalization hasn’t resolved all the criminal issues that the advocates claimed it would.

It’s a genie that we had better not open up the bottle on.

I’ve had too many people who get in the psych hospital every time they use it buy into Jeffive and MM’s argument that it’s better than alcohol and thus justify their use.

From a medical perspective, it’s not better/safer. It’s just different in its harms.

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:
Legal pot will never do 1% of the harm legal alcohol does.

LOL Pot is 10 Times more Carcinogenic than Tobacco.

I have walked out of stores where there was a stoned clerk at the counter, who didnt know shit. Maybe they didnt anyway? But, legal or not, working stoned is the same as working drunk. I will not deal with it. Accidents among young folks driving stoned is way more than driving drunk in my area.

quote:

Originally posted by Slider:

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:
Legal pot will never do 1% of the harm legal alcohol does.

LOL Pot is 10 Times more Carcinogenic than Tobacco.

Then Willy Nelson should have been dead and gone 30 years ago!

quote:

Originally posted by Slider:

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:
Legal pot will never do 1% of the harm legal alcohol does.

LOL Pot is 10 Times more Carcinogenic than Tobacco.

First I am hearing that take.. or toke... the stat is usually presented the otherway round... I don't think there is data supporting this claim. There are certain demographics that would be dropping like flies if this were the case

quote:

Originally posted by Slider:
https://www.nbcnews.com/health...udy-finds-rcna165651

This says

quote:

Regular heavy marijuana use may increase a person’s risk of developing some head and neck cancers, a study published Thursday in JAMA Otolaryngology-Head & Neck Surgery found.

The study found that heavy cannabis users were between 3.5 and 5 times more likely to develop head and neck cancers than those who didn’t use the drug regularly .

Your statement was 10x more than tabacco.. the article says it can develop SOME conditions more than non-users of same

No comparison in the article to tabacco

Don’t confuse Slider with facts….

Canada legalized it a few years back, with the same general regulations as alcohol. After an initial flurry of a lot of people wanting to try it, things died down to a ‘ho hum’ attitude - once it was legal, it became boring. Kids don’t want to use the stuff their weird old hippy uncle uses.

My wife and I both tried it (and the CBD derivative) in oil capsules for arthritis relief, and it didn’t do a damn thing except give us both weird dreams and mess up our sleep. I think the medical angle is all bullshit just to get your money.

Since then, at least half of the outlets have closed, as have some of the larger (very heavily regulated, inspected and secured) grow ops. I wouldn’t be surprised if overall, total consumption is no greater now than it was before it was legal. Users are allowed four plants for their own use, and Facebook is full of ‘barely used’ grow gear.

It’s the addictive stuff like meth and fentanyl that’s really causing the problems. Weed is neither here nor there.

Legal in Canada, now we have pot stores on just about every block. Me ? I think it's stupid and inevitably leads to a decline in society, it's not benign as advocates would have us believe. When legalization was first proposed there were no end of companies planning on making millions, most have now gone bankrupt. Then there is a thriving gray market largely based on Native reserves in eastern Canada, that undercuts the legal options.

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
I’m in the boat that it should be prescription only.

The damage THC does is different than alcohol.

It’s associated with psychotic breaks and also problems with brain development which continues into the mid 20’s.

So far, legalization hasn’t resolved all the criminal issues that the advocates claimed it would.

It’s a genie that we had better not open up the bottle on.

I’ve had too many people who get in the psych hospital every time they use it buy into Jeffive and MM’s argument that it’s better than alcohol and thus justify their use.

From a medical perspective, it’s not better/safer. It’s just different in its harms.

I trust what you have to say on it Dr. B. I am sure you are likely correct. Except for kids…I just don’t care anymore. Libertarianism says if adult let’em have it.

Protect the kids at all costs and don’t give users wellfare.

Yet, let users possess firearms?

What will happen will be the same w alcohol. The Feds will abandon the space Turing it over exclusively to the states.

The harm may be different than alcohol, but not enough to make a difference.

Some states will then let individual counties decide as they have done w alcohol.

Some counties in KY are still dry.

The prescription thing is a scam and hoax. One could have alcohol prescribed to them, including children, bourbon to be exact during Prohibition.

Legalize it and tax it.

We do not prosecute it.

Heck we still occasionally prescribe it (alcohol) for patients in nursing homes.

How is the prescription argument a scam and hoax?

I agree there isn’t a lot of good evidence based studies showing its (THC) effectiveness in treating chronic pain or neuropathy.

There isn’t a lot of research in its effect on epilepsy.

There is a pretty good body on chemo associated loss of appetite.

We prescribe lots of things off label. One thing to note is that a DEA license (with very rare research exceptions) does not allow a physician to prescribe marijuana although it does allow marinol (synthetic THC).

There are states that have allowed some healthcare professional types to certify people as having a medical condition that allows them to access medical marijuana.

I don’t do it, but some do.

Your we don’t prosecute is a bad idea as an overall policy. Illicit dealers should be arrested and convicted. People selling to kids should be prosecuted and IMO, get the death penalty.

As far as just a recreational user with minimal amounts and no other issue, sure letting them go is fine. It’s when there are other issues it should be prosecuted vigorously.

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:
Yet, let users possess firearms?

What will happen will be the same w alcohol. The Feds will abandon the space Turing it over exclusively to the states.

The harm may be different than alcohol, but not enough to make a difference.

Some states will then let individual counties decide as they have done w alcohol.

Some counties in KY are still dry.

The prescription thing is a scam and hoax. One could have alcohol prescribed to them, including children, bourbon to be exact during Prohibition.

Legalize it and tax it.

We do not prosecute it.

quote:

No comparison in the article to tabacco

I never said that article compared it. It just shows that Pot is Worse than Alcohol!!!

quote:

Originally posted by Slider:

quote:

No comparison in the article to tabacco

I never said that article compared it. It just shows that Pot is Worse than Alcohol!!!

Man, you said pot was 10x worse than tabacco

quote:

Originally posted by Slider:
LOL Pot is 10 Times more Carcinogenic than Tobacco.

You made no mention of Booze. Your article says pot use way be worse than no pot use. We agree.. it neither compares alcohol or tobacco to pot.

Do you have a link asserting pot is 10x more carcinogenic than tobacco?

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
Heck we still occasionally prescribe it (alcohol) for patients in nursing homes.

How is the prescription argument a scam and hoax?

I agree there isn’t a lot of good evidence based studies showing its (THC) effectiveness in treating chronic pain or neuropathy.

There isn’t a lot of research in its effect on epilepsy.

There is a pretty good body on chemo associated loss of appetite.

We prescribe lots of things off label. One thing to note is that a DEA license (with very rare research exceptions) does not allow a physician to prescribe marijuana although it does allow marinol (synthetic THC).

There are states that have allowed some healthcare professional types to certify people as having a medical condition that allows them to access medical marijuana.

I don’t do it, but some do.

Your we don’t prosecute is a bad idea as an overall policy. Illicit dealers should be arrested and convicted. People selling to kids should be prosecuted and IMO, get the death penalty.

As far as just a recreational user with minimal amounts and no other issue, sure letting them go is fine. It’s when there are other issues it should be prosecuted vigorously.

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:
Yet, let users possess firearms?

What will happen will be the same w alcohol. The Feds will abandon the space Turing it over exclusively to the states.

The harm may be different than alcohol, but not enough to make a difference.

Some states will then let individual counties decide as they have done w alcohol.

Some counties in KY are still dry.

The prescription thing is a scam and hoax. One could have alcohol prescribed to them, including children, bourbon to be exact during Prohibition.

Legalize it and tax it.

We do not prosecute it.

It is a scam bc I have never seen a prescription denied. KY started recognizing prescriptions from TN. Awful lot of med weed being handed out. Just like back in the day they would right bourbon to small children.

When someone runs a truck load of grass, I’ll let you know. I know a lot of prosecutors walking around w TN weed prescriptions.

When we get all the child abusers and murders I’ll care about 10 marijuana plants.

You've never seen a prescription denied?

What does that mean? You have never seen a physician not elect to prescribe what the patient wants? It happens, but I agree less than before because we have "empowered" the patients.

Back when did they prescribe bourbon to kids? Did you actually see that?

(I know it happened back at the turn of the last century from historical anecdotes... but they also thought bleeding a person would cure a fever and fresh desert air would cure tuberculosis... science has advanced...)

If you go to a cannabis clinic, what the heck do you think you are going to get?

In MN the majority of the folks who prescribed medical marijuana were... chiropractors. Because the folks passing the law said most physicians would refuse to do so, they added a bunch of nonphysicians to the list who could get MJ prescribing permission.

We have since allowed recreational marijuana during Governor Walz's term in office.

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
Heck we still occasionally prescribe it (alcohol) for patients in nursing homes.

How is the prescription argument a scam and hoax?

I agree there isn’t a lot of good evidence based studies showing its (THC) effectiveness in treating chronic pain or neuropathy.

There isn’t a lot of research in its effect on epilepsy.

There is a pretty good body on chemo associated loss of appetite.

We prescribe lots of things off label. One thing to note is that a DEA license (with very rare research exceptions) does not allow a physician to prescribe marijuana although it does allow marinol (synthetic THC).

There are states that have allowed some healthcare professional types to certify people as having a medical condition that allows them to access medical marijuana.

I don’t do it, but some do.

Your we don’t prosecute is a bad idea as an overall policy. Illicit dealers should be arrested and convicted. People selling to kids should be prosecuted and IMO, get the death penalty.

As far as just a recreational user with minimal amounts and no other issue, sure letting them go is fine. It’s when there are other issues it should be prosecuted vigorously.

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:
Yet, let users possess firearms?

What will happen will be the same w alcohol. The Feds will abandon the space Turing it over exclusively to the states.

The harm may be different than alcohol, but not enough to make a difference.

Some states will then let individual counties decide as they have done w alcohol.

Some counties in KY are still dry.

The prescription thing is a scam and hoax. One could have alcohol prescribed to them, including children, bourbon to be exact during Prohibition.

Legalize it and tax it.

We do not prosecute it.

It is a scam bc I have never seen a prescription denied. KY started recognizing prescriptions from TN. Awful lot of med weed being handed out. Just like back in the day they would right bourbon to small children.

When someone runs a truck load of grass, I’ll let you know. I know a lot of prosecutors walking around w TN weed prescriptions.

When we get all the child abusers and murders I’ll care about 10 marijuana plants.

I mean I know lots of healthy people professionals and not running down to TN to get their prescription led since KY has agreed to recognize marijuana prescriptions from other states.

We do not even revoke bonds over marijuana anymore bc they are all prescription.

It is a scam.

Legalize it, regulate it, tax it, put restrictions on where one can smoke it and move on.

Good for Walz. You have answered your own question on why medical marijuana is a scam. See chiropractor’s writing prescriptions.

Not a fan and my gut is keep it illegal, but it's along the lines of alcohol and Prohibition. It doesn't work. So my vote is legalize it, regulate it, tax it and cut out the cartels.

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
I’m in the boat that it should be prescription only.

The damage THC does is different than alcohol.

It’s associated with psychotic breaks and also problems with brain development which continues into the mid 20’s.

So far, legalization hasn’t resolved all the criminal issues that the advocates claimed it would.

It’s a genie that we had better not open up the bottle on.

I’ve had too many people who get in the psych hospital every time they use it buy into Jeffive and MM’s argument that it’s better than alcohol and thus justify their use.

From a medical perspective, it’s not better/safer. It’s just different in its harms.

I had this conversation with a cop mate who was working in the field. he felt that rather than pot causing mental issues, it was a flag of potential existing mental problems. IE schizophrenics tend to search for self medication even before they are identified?

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
I voted recreationally legal at 21.

I don’t condone it but:

1) I don’t want cartels profiting and lacing with fentanyl.

2) I am 90% Libertarian

Pretty much my views too. lets face it, it does harm, but so does alcohol, and getting it legally has to have a detrimental impact on the criminal elements.
Id like to see real punishment if children are allowed access though. I grew up and went to school in a low Socio economic area and saw how it dulled down the drive of intelligent young people with poor parents..., In both senses.

quote:

Originally posted by theback40:
I have walked out of stores where there was a stoned clerk at the counter, who didnt know shit. Maybe they didnt anyway? But, legal or not, working stoned is the same as working drunk. I will not deal with it. Accidents among young folks driving stoned is way more than driving drunk in my area.

And agree with this as well.

Up here I have seen no real benefit to marijuana use. I am told anecdotally that the Native Alaskans are less inclined to violence when stoned as opposed to drunk. Still seems like to much intoxicated stupidity and crime going around.

I do know several who can't take certain jobs and even loose employment because of the drug tests.

I don't use, I have no interest. I have a hard to get Coast Guard license as well as a commercial drivers license that I'll be darned if I loose to booze or weed.

I guess I think if you wanna be stoned, have at it, it just narrows the competition for my career opportunities.

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
I’m in the boat that it should be prescription only.

The damage THC does is different than alcohol.

It’s associated with psychotic breaks and also problems with brain development which continues into the mid 20’s.

So far, legalization hasn’t resolved all the criminal issues that the advocates claimed it would.

It’s a genie that we had better not open up the bottle on.

I’ve had too many people who get in the psych hospital every time they use it buy into Jeffive and MM’s argument that it’s better than alcohol and thus justify their use.

From a medical perspective, it’s not better/safer. It’s just different in its harms.

Doc, you sound like one of those goofy movies they used to show us when I was in junior high about how dangerous weed is and it will make you go psycho. That is nonsense. While I have no doubt weed has caused some tiny fraction of users to have some sort of psychotic break, that is extremely rare.

And, I didn't say it's "better" than alcohol. I said it is less harmful and I'll stand by that one. The physical harm done by alcohol is only one part of it although that is obviously significant. Domestic violence, drunk driving, bar fights, and on and on.

How many people do you know that have overdosed on weed or died from it's effects? I'm not talking about car accidents, just from the use of the substance itself? I'll answer for you: none. Now, compare that with alcohol.

When you look at it, it is bizarre that alcohol is legal and weed still isn't in so many places. The harm that alcohol does is far greater in my opinion. I'm not advocating weed use, it ain't good for you either. But, putting people in jail for using it is stupid.

I am against anything that alters the mind.

And creates addicts.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
I am against anything that alters the mind.

And creates addicts.

I get it. So am I and I don't understand it....but, being against something is very different than criminalizing it.

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Mitchell:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
I am against anything that alters the mind.

And creates addicts.

I get it. So am I and I don't understand it....but, being against something is very different than criminalizing it.

Very true. I wish the establishment of the Democratic Party could see that.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Mitchell:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
I am against anything that alters the mind.

And creates addicts.

I get it. So am I and I don't understand it....but, being against something is very different than criminalizing it.

Very true. I wish the establishment of the Democratic Party could see that.

The problem you have is that your candidate is a criminal. Reasonable minds might disagree about the criminalization of the use of weed....Nobody disagrees that falsifying financial documents to cover up bribes/payoffs is, and should be, a crime. Other than MAGAtts like you.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Mitchell:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
I am against anything that alters the mind.

And creates addicts.

I get it. So am I and I don't understand it....but, being against something is very different than criminalizing it.

Very true. I wish the establishment of the Democratic Party could see that.

Alcohol alters the mind. It is a depressant.

It’s one thing to not charge people for low level possession, it’s another thing to legalize it.

I don’t have much issue with a 30 year old having a joint at home by himself.

I do have an issue with a 30 year old having a joint at a party with a bunch of juveniles.

You know damn well he’s sharing it.

I have no issue with Willie Nelson smoking weed.

I think it’s wrong for him to tell others how great it is.

And given that THC and its metabolites stay in your system for days, I think it’s highly improper for physicians, lawyers, teachers, and such to use it recreationally on the weekend and then go to work.

As to schizophrenics self medicating, sure, but the data says it increases the number of psychosis events and seems to increase the incidence of mental illness when used by the under 25 population.

Does alcohol cause problems? Absolutely. But the social policy issues with THC have kept a lot of people away from it who otherwise would use… we are seeing the clear evidence of that in places with legalized recreational use.

Marijuana is probably worse per volume used than tobacco for emphysema and other lung problems. It’s associated with these diseases and folks don’t typically use anywhere near as many joints a day as folks use cigarettes.

As to social ills, like drunk driving, assault, etc. I think saying it’s less is an unknown as we are definitely seeing an increase in social problems in places where it has been legalized.

In short, I don’t see a positive by legalizing it. I can see some fairness arguments that state marijuana should be treated like alcohol, but legalization does nothing “good” for society.

If you want to be libertarian about it, fine, but then its use should disqualify you for the social safety net. And I’m fine with the same for alcohol.