It struck me while driving, today. Going by the polls, the next American presidential election could be a contest between a dead guy and another in jail.

Grizz

Special, huh. Thank the kooks in both parties for the prospect of such an election. We have Lane on one side and Jeffive on the other . . . God save us.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Special, huh. Thank the kooks in both parties for the prospect of such an election. We have Lane on one side and Jeffive on the other . . . God save us.

I doubt God will save us as we don't seem inclined to save ourselves.

Beauty of the whole thing is, we are going to be just fine so easy there Doomsayers

quote:

Originally posted by Bivoj:
Beauty of the whole thing is, we are going to be just fine so easy there Doomsayers

Maybe. Maybe not.

Long read but very interesting commentary on some of the possibilities if trump is re-elected.

https://www.washingtonpost.com...ection-robert-kagan/

Anyone willing to read past this this sentence, “Let’s stop the wishful thinking and face the stark reality: There is a clear path to dictatorship in the United States, and it is getting shorter every day;” and take anything it says seriously…

…is an idiot.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Special, huh. Thank the kooks in both parties for the prospect of such an election. We have Lane on one side and Jeffive on the other . . . God save us.

And then we have the special class of voters, those likely bullied on the playground as children, who will cut their noses off to spite their faces on policy as they don’t care for a personality.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Anyone willing to read past this this sentence, “Let’s stop the wishful thinking and face the stark reality: There is a clear path to dictatorship in the United States, and it is getting shorter every day;” and take anything it says seriously…

…is an idiot.

Says the idiot who is going to vote for trump. You're brain-dead.

Just think, if Trump had been re-elected there would have been no J6, his second term would be almost done (which means he would be gone for good) and pedo Joe would not even be in consideration for a second term or even a first term for 2024 with his obvious failing mental health.

So, with pedo Joe and dopey Kamala being elected, this saga continues on for 2024. We'd have been done with both of them very shortly had things gone the other way.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Anyone willing to read past this this sentence, “Let’s stop the wishful thinking and face the stark reality: There is a clear path to dictatorship in the United States, and it is getting shorter every day;” and take anything it says seriously…

…is an idiot.

Well, only one candidate has called for the Constitution to be suspended and he immediately reinstated to the Presidency. The guy you have declared general support for.

The same guy who gave his VP an unconstitutional directive to decertify the election. The same guy who refused to defend the Constitution, Congress, and due election.

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Mitchell:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Anyone willing to read past this this sentence, “Let’s stop the wishful thinking and face the stark reality: There is a clear path to dictatorship in the United States, and it is getting shorter every day;” and take anything it says seriously…

…is an idiot.

Says the idiot who is going to vote for trump. You're brain-dead.

Really?

I am glad you informed me. I better fire all those accountants before the end of the year and replace them with hospice.

quote:

Originally posted by Aspen Hill Adventures:
Just think, if Trump had been re-elected there would have been no J6, his second term would be almost done (which means he would be gone for good)

The fact that there was a J6 indicates the means to an end. That hasn't changed as an agenda. The means has changed with further development from the Heritage Foundation, as just one example. A second term - the constitution is no obstackle to Trump or the GOP. Why not a third term, or for life, with designated successor?

If Hillary had been elected for two terms, we wouldn't now be facing well developed GOP fascism - well - the rest is history, and we got Trump.

Same old problem, same old rationalizations.

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Anyone willing to read past this this sentence, “Let’s stop the wishful thinking and face the stark reality: There is a clear path to dictatorship in the United States, and it is getting shorter every day;” and take anything it says seriously…

…is an idiot.

Well, only one candidate has called for the Constitution to be suspended and he immediately reinstated to the Presidency. The guy you have declared general support for.

The same guy who gave his VP an unconstitutional directive to decertify the election. The same guy who refused to defend the Constitution, Congress, and due election.

So let’s accept all of that at face value…

…do you really believe that the USA is in danger of dictatorship???

If so…I would suggest a remedial civics class. If you don’t want to do that…maybe you might be interested in a beach-front condo I have for sale in OK.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Magine Enigam:
If Hillary had been elected for two terms… [QUOTE/]

We would have Merrick Garland and God knows who else sitting on the Bench.

to Donald Trump!

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

…do you really believe that the USA is in danger of dictatorship???

"Denial is not a river in Egypt".

All one needs to do is listen to Trump's exact words, be aware of Heritage Foundation's Project 25, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_2025 listen to MAGA Mike, Gym Jordon, etc. IOW, follow the evidence, take their own words and deeds seriously.

MAGA Mike assisted in the insurrection plot as an attorney, and he's rewarded for it by becoming Speaker.

And you might be turning that 6.8 PRC hog-killing AR into rebar.

quote:

that 6.8 PRC hog-killing AR

I use the 6.5 Grendel.

Working from memory…close enough.

Is your decision to support Trump's fascist trajectory fear driven? Or what?

My political decisions are based in looking at the facts which results in disgust for what the right is doing and wants to do, and the means.

Trump is just a means to an end, which makes the means and the end both vile, and self-evident.

My concerns are not fear, but love, of Country and sanity.

quote:

fascist trajectory

My intellect has kept me from noticing any fascist trajectory from Trump…

…only a large vertical spike in my portfolio.

I have noticed however that the first thing that actual fascist do though is confiscate rifles.

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Mitchell:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Anyone willing to read past this this sentence, “Let’s stop the wishful thinking and face the stark reality: There is a clear path to dictatorship in the United States, and it is getting shorter every day;” and take anything it says seriously…

…is an idiot.

Says the idiot who is going to vote for trump. You're brain-dead.

Some folks must feel that they are immune from trump's plans.

You uses the word "dictatorship".

The correct word is "Authoritarian".

At first, I think you are technically correct about "dictatorship" but vastly incorrect about Authoritarianism. Definitions are important, but in this arena, arguable. I did look it up, just to remind myself if for no other reason, to try and find a simple distinction, if any.

https://helpfulprofessor.com/a...acy-vs-dictatorship/

Autocracy Vs Dictatorship

Autocracy Example:
Fascism is a subset of autocracy, and it first arose in Italy during the 1920s, led by Benito Mussolini.

The term is derived from the fasces of Ancient Rome, which was a bundle of rods with a projecting axe, representing unity and authority. As Robertson writes, there is no coherent political doctrine of fascism, but they were all opportunistic: they exploited local fears & hatred to gather public support (2003).

Fascism then expresses this hatred (usually racism) in the form of nationalism. This is linked to a “strong man” who can supposedly a country’s problems as long as everyone was loyal to him. He leads a single party that rules by “terroristic domination”, and there is no separation of power or rule of law (Scott).

Between the two world wars, fascist parties also developed in other countries, led by Adolf Hitler in Germany and General Francisco Franco in Spain.

In modern times, “fascism” is often used to refer to any right-wing group or anyone having extreme (especially violent) views, although the term shouldn’t be used so loosely.

=================================================================

Not to confuse the definitions, there are differences in the definition of dictatorship, autocracy and Authoritarianism.

Authoritarianism:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...arianism_and_fascism

Related to Fascism:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...arianism_and_fascism

=================================================================

Perhaps you will read this article. Of course, it supports my already views, but it shows that many, many others with more knowledge than I have solid basis in experience, training and facts and evidence in support.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news...cb64dcee9cc595&ei=12

U.S. Judge Warns Public of Possible 'Authoritarian' Rule
Story by GistFest • 2h

quote:

Originally posted by Aspen Hill Adventures:
Just think, if Trump had been re-elected there would have been no J6, his second term would be almost done (which means he would be gone for good) and pedo Joe would not even be in consideration for a second term or even a first term for 2024 with his obvious failing mental health.


So, with pedo Joe and dopey Kamala being elected, this saga continues on for 2024. We'd have been done with both of them very shortly had things gone the other way.

And what makes you think trump would have left willingly after his second term was up? They would have had to send in security forces to physically remove him.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

fascist trajectory

My intellect indoctrination has kept me from noticing any fascist trajectory from Trump…

…only a large vertical leap in my portfolio. So, you can be bought

I have noticed however that the first thing that actual fascist do though is confiscate rifles.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...occupied%20countries.

Nazi gun control argument

Nazi laws systematically disarmed so-called "unreliable" persons , especially Jews while relaxing restrictions for Nazi party members. The policies were later expanded to include the confiscation of arms in occupied countries.

================================

Of course, liberals, environmentalists, humanists, etc. are "unreliable", especially the media deemed such. After all, the truth media is far more influential and powerful in the long run than guns. I'm sure Trump, in his second or third term, will create a task force to root out who are the loyalists and who are not. Heritage Foundation is a good candidate for that since that what they already do, to accomplish Steve Bannon's dream of 20,000 Shock Troops. Heritage Foundation's goal is 50,000. I'm sure you will make sure that you qualify in the loyalists group, and feel all justified and righteous and vindicated and patriotic and such.

Militias such as proud boyz, oath keepers and many others will thrive and grow in influence, especially after the pardons. Heck, the KKK may make a revival in such atmosphere. Plenty of guns to go around from the various armories and govt arsenals, free to the loyalists.

"We don't need no stinkin' dictatorship, we got the GOP Dream Machine". MAGA fulfilled.

quote:

Originally posted by ANTELOPEDUNDEE:

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Mitchell:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Anyone willing to read past this this sentence, “Let’s stop the wishful thinking and face the stark reality: There is a clear path to dictatorship in the United States, and it is getting shorter every day;” and take anything it says seriously…

…is an idiot.

Says the idiot who is going to vote for trump. You're brain-dead.

Some folks must feel that they are immune from trump's plans.

Uhhh, that's one way to look at it.

"Feel" may be a key word.

"immune" implies denial or welcoming, depending on "immune" from what, such as inclusion or exclusion from the loyalist group and the consequences of that.

Feel and immune may be descriptive of a large portion of citizens.

But that's incomplete or inaccurate for a large group, such as the MAGA bunch.

Maybe they (MAGA) are not in denial at all? Maybe they think (feel) they are beneficiaries?

quote:

Originally posted by Magine Enigam:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

fascist trajectory

My intellect indoctrination has kept me from noticing any fascist trajectory from Trump…

…only a large vertical leap in my portfolio. So, you can be bought

I have noticed however that the first thing that actual fascist do though is confiscate rifles.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...occupied%20countries.

Nazi gun control argument

Nazi laws systematically disarmed so-called "unreliable" persons , especially Jews while relaxing restrictions for Nazi party members. The policies were later expanded to include the confiscation of arms in occupied countries.

================================

Of course, liberals, environmentalists, humanists, etc. are "unreliable", especially the media deemed such. After all, the truth media is far more influential and powerful in the long run than guns. I'm sure Trump, in his second or third term, will create a task force to root out who are the loyalists and who are not. Heritage Foundation is a good candidate for that since that what they already do, to accomplish Steve Bannon's dream of 20,000 Shock Troops. Heritage Foundation's goal is 50,000. I'm sure you will make sure that you qualify in the loyalists group, and feel all justified and righteous and vindicated and patriotic and such.

Militias such as proud boyz, oath keepers and many others will thrive and grow in influence, especially after the pardons. Heck, the KKK may make a revival in such atmosphere. Plenty of guns to go around from the various armories and govt arsenals, free to the loyalists.

"We don't need no stinkin' dictatorship, we got the GOP Dream Machine". MAGA fulfilled.

ME,
You have to be the most propaganda susceptible “indoctrinated” individual to ever post on the ARPF.

It is almost humorous (if it wasn’t sad) to follow your validation of the “truth.”

But while the country still allows free-speech…by all means carry on.

Well, your propaganda ain't my propaganda.

Do you think the existence (fact) of Heritage Foundation's Project 25 is propaganda?

Or perhaps their spin on it?

Or perhaps NYT's spin (truth) on it?

Or perhaps the fact that Bannon advocated 20,000 shock troops?

Perhaps Heritage Foundation's plan was merely coincidental with Bannon's spew?

Or is it that anything that conflicts or contradicts your feelings or beliefs is deemed propaganda by you as a convenient way of dismissal?

BTW, you aren't following my "Validation" of truth. You are defaulting to dismissal primarily with feelings and belief.

If you have a basis, excluding feelings or belief, to contradict ANY premise or conclusion I make or have, please present it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Premise
Premise:

quote:

Or perhaps NYT's spin (truth) on it?

All^^^anyone needs know to pass judgement on your “objectivity.”

Where did I claim to be "objective"?

I claimed to follow the rules of argument, as defined here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Premise

I'm not perfect, but the better I can do that, the closer I am to objective.

You don't even try.

I make my living being “strictly” objective. Yes, I throw fire-balls here strictly for the entertainment of the flame…

…but I am an expert on being objective…

especially when my money is on the table.

quote:

…but I am an expert on being objective…

For a moment I thought you said you are an expert and being an expert.

Then I read it as you said you are objective at being objective.

When I read it the way you really said it, my eyes cross.

Excuse me, my bad.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Or perhaps NYT's spin (truth) on it?

All^^^anyone needs know to pass judgement on your “objectivity.”

There are several articles on the topic. Here's one:

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/p...t-with-trumps-vision

Conservatives aim to restructure U.S. government and replace it with Trump’s vision
Politics Aug 29, 2023 11:33 AM EST

BTW, just for you, I searched to see if Fox News had presented anything objective or not on the Project 25 thing.

I found nothing.

Could propaganda include omissions? Hummm

So, I changed the search title to: Fox News reporting on deep state, and found this:

https://www.google.com/search?...nt=gws-wiz-serp#ip=1

Then There's this:

https://www.govtaccountability...HaIvFKwaAuCIEALw_wcB

What is Schedule F?

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Anyone willing to read past this this sentence, “Let’s stop the wishful thinking and face the stark reality: There is a clear path to dictatorship in the United States, and it is getting shorter every day;” and take anything it says seriously…

…is an idiot.

Well, only one candidate has called for the Constitution to be suspended and he immediately reinstated to the Presidency. The guy you have declared general support for.

The same guy who gave his VP an unconstitutional directive to decertify the election. The same guy who refused to defend the Constitution, Congress, and due election.

So let’s accept all of that at face value…

…do you really believe that the USA is in danger of dictatorship???

If so…I would suggest a remedial civics class. If you don’t want to do that…maybe you might be interested in a beach-front condo I have for sale in OK.

A) All that is true and B) The above is an attempt by President Trump to make himself President unduly against constitutional requirements/norms. I a word, yes.

I also know of President Obama had done all or done of the above to deliver the presidency to HEC, you would be screaming tyranny and 2nd Amendment.

You are a hypocrite and a lier.

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Anyone willing to read past this this sentence, “Let’s stop the wishful thinking and face the stark reality: There is a clear path to dictatorship in the United States, and it is getting shorter every day;” and take anything it says seriously…

…is an idiot.

Well, only one candidate has called for the Constitution to be suspended and he immediately reinstated to the Presidency. The guy you have declared general support for.

The same guy who gave his VP an unconstitutional directive to decertify the election. The same guy who refused to defend the Constitution, Congress, and due election.

So let’s accept all of that at face value…

…do you really believe that the USA is in danger of dictatorship???

If so…I would suggest a remedial civics class. If you don’t want to do that…maybe you might be interested in a beach-front condo I have for sale in OK.

A) All that is true and B) The above is an attempt by President Trump to make himself President unduly against constitutional requirements/norms. I a word, yes.

I also know of President Obama had done all or done of the above to deliver the presidency to HEC, you would be screaming tyranny and 2nd Amendment.

You are a hypocrite and a lier.

Leaving all else aside, what Country would share intelligence information with the U.S. under Trump?

quote:

Originally posted by ANTELOPEDUNDEE:

quote:

Originally posted by Aspen Hill Adventures:
Just think, if Trump had been re-elected there would have been no J6, his second term would be almost done (which means he would be gone for good) and pedo Joe would not even be in consideration for a second term or even a first term for 2024 with his obvious failing mental health.


So, with pedo Joe and dopey Kamala being elected, this saga continues on for 2024. We'd have been done with both of them very shortly had things gone the other way.

And what makes you think trump would have left willingly after his second term was up? They would have had to send in security forces to physically remove him.

I have no reason to believe he would not have left. That isn't the point of my post.

My point is we would not be dealing with either trump or 0biden in 2024 if trump got the second term. Complete speculation as to what the candidate list would be in that situation.

The problem is since T2 didn't happen we will have trump and 0biden to pick from again. Four more years of utter BS is coming.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

fascist trajectory

My intellect has kept me from noticing any fascist trajectory from Trump…

…only a large vertical spike in my portfolio.

I have noticed however that the first thing that actual fascist do though is confiscate rifles.

...actually its peoples assets.

...and either Jeffive or you would make infinitely better POTUS's than Trump (and probably Biden)

quote:

Originally posted by Aspen Hill Adventures:

quote:

Originally posted by ANTELOPEDUNDEE:

quote:

Originally posted by Aspen Hill Adventures:
Just think, if Trump had been re-elected there would have been no J6, his second term would be almost done (which means he would be gone for good) and pedo Joe would not even be in consideration for a second term or even a first term for 2024 with his obvious failing mental health.


So, with pedo Joe and dopey Kamala being elected, this saga continues on for 2024. We'd have been done with both of them very shortly had things gone the other way.

And what makes you think trump would have left willingly after his second term was up? They would have had to send in security forces to physically remove him.

I have no reason to believe he would not have left. That isn't the point of my post.

My point is we would not be dealing with either trump or 0biden in 2024 if trump got the second term. Complete speculation as to what the candidate list would be in that situation.

The problem is since T2 didn't happen we will have trump and 0biden to pick from again. Four more years of utter BS is coming.

As someone on the outside looking in I just do not understand why anyone would think that is a good thing ... but several million of your countrymen obviously do.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Working from memory…close enough.

Hey! I have the 6.8 SPC.
Come on Man.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:


I make my living being “strictly” objective. Yes, I throw fire-balls here strictly for the entertainment of the flame…

…but I am an expert on being objective…

especially when my money is on the table.

If I had one criticism of the right in the US right now, its that they seem to have a complacency and undue faith in the constitution. Anything, anything can be corrupted given enough time and from the outside it does look like that process started at both ends of the political spectrum. And Trump very much looked like a concern in that regard.
There seems to be a massive reliance on the 2nd amendment to fix all future problems. Yet in other threads here I see the gun laws creeping in and given enough time... I mean from the sounds of it, a 16 year old in NZ has more gun rights than an 18 year old in parts of the states.
to go back too the initial thread proposal, Both parties seem intent on running a person who could loose and who cant gain acceptance from the moderates of the other side.
But at least the republicans seem to be allowing other candidates a fair crack at running.

Two different points.

Trump does say a lot of stuff that at least until Trump would have been absolutely unacceptable to any conservative. His issues with security, his populist free spending ways, his unwillingness to have the gravitas of the office all were nonstarters until he got in the election against HRC.

He has done things that are illegal.

The things he has done go pretty well beyond just being not caring for a personality.

The folks supporting him should wake up and realize that he will not do well, and now is the time to get your act behind someone who can win and move better policy forward. Trump, even if he wins (which I don't see happening), will be le plus ultra of lame ducks. He will get absolutely zero done, as any executive order he files will instantly be challenged, and they will find some leftist judge to issue an injunction... so it gets before SCOTUS just as his term ends.

The other side is all this claim of the rise of fascism.

Bull.

We have already seen that authoritarianism doesn't sell well in this country. The lib BLM/LBGTQ stuff is constantly mocked. There are serious problems for the left there... just as the right with its abortion laws is getting shellacked in the polls.

All these pipe dreams that the dems fellow travelers are trying to sell to the public about goofy GOP "fascist" behavior is no different than their own... just they call them community organizers and such. No chance in you-know-what that the country is heading to Fascism on the right... the conservatives wouldn't put up with it.

The whole fascism thing is the Fox news equivalent of the left.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Mitchell:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
Anyone willing to read past this this sentence, “Let’s stop the wishful thinking and face the stark reality: There is a clear path to dictatorship in the United States, and it is getting shorter every day;” and take anything it says seriously…

…is an idiot.

Says the idiot who is going to vote for trump. You're brain-dead.

Really?

I am glad you informed me. I better fire all those accountants before the end of the year and replace them with hospice.

If it weren't for taxes, we wouldn't need accountants...