Ok, here is a question that I am sure that has been asked before. But here goes anyway... My son is turning 9 next month and I want to get him a rifle. He is to young to hunt big game now, but I would like to get him practicing with something larger than a 22lr. He is left handed, so that limits the make of the rifle right away. As for caliber, I am thinking about a .243, .260. or the 7mm-08. He's a pretty tough kid, plays in a tackle football league and hits like Ronnie Lott!!!, but I don't want to get him flinching by getting something that recoils like a beast. Any ideas?

25cal:

I am in the same boat. My son turned 9 in May.

I have ordered a Ruger Compact in 223 for him to start. I figure the gun will always see some use regardless of age.

I also am getting him a Left handed Ruger Stainless with a Grey Laminate Stock in 270. This rifle has been hanging around the gun store for 2 yrs, and has not sold because it is a lefty. However the way rifles go up every year, I figured I had better get it now. In another 3 yrs or so, it could be $700.00. I am getting it for $450.00 now. Also traded off something I don't need anymore for about $350.00 of that.

Although I may also look long and hard at Browning is making their Micro Hunter in a left handed version in calibers from 22 Hornet up thru 308. A 7/08 is what I am really thinking of. We just got a right handed one for a 14 yr old niece recently. Very Nice rifle.

I have a batch of Rugers for my own in various calibers, from 22/250 and up. As he gets older, I can see taking the 270 barrel off and putting a 243 barrel on it for a while. Then when he out grows that, screwing back on the original 270 barrel.

Ruger does make a 243 in a lefty with a stainless steel barrel and grey laminated stock.
I went with the 270 for the long action. I can put a short action cartridge on the long action receiver, but not vice versa.


[ 08-28-2003, 01:02: Message edited by: seafire ]

25cal, I started mine on a Chipmunk. Their first "big" rifle was a Savage 223 I dropped into a Outers "cadet" stock.

I load them lots of rounds with 10 gr. of Bluedot, and they think they are hot stuff! We go to the Sporting Clays range and pick up the rabbit clays people miss. They can hit them out to just about 200 yards from a rest, without a problem. Lots of shooting, lots of fun, lots of practice without breaking the bank (or the barrel).

I can't imagine starting a 9 year old out on a 260 class rifle. Mine don't even like shooting my 6PPC off the bench..... HTH, Dutch.

Maybe a cheap Rossi or NEF single shot? You could pick any reasonable caliber up through 30-06 and just handload it for low velocity. Start with cast bullets at 1000fps and let them plink all day. You could cut the barrel off to 20" or so so It'll be handy to carry and shoot. You could cut the stock off short enough for now, then when he grows, you could add 2" back on at a time. Maybe drill the stockout to take a piece of pipe to align the stock or a 1/4" bolt on top and bottom? My wife recently got a Ruger 270 Stainless Laminated and has yet to shoot anything but cast loads in it. I don't want her to develope a flinch. When it comes time for jacketed bullets, I can load to any level that she is comfortable shooting at and just limit the range accordingly.

dutch:

You can use Blue Dot loads in a 260 just as easily as in a 223. Accuracy is just as good as it is in a 223.

I think a 260 would be better than a 243, for one reason. 6.5 mm bullets are designed to open up at lower velocities than most 6mm bullets, based on their use in the older Carcano, MannlicherShoenauers, etc. Or course this strictly applies to handloaders only.

When my boys reached 9 (been 11 yrs ago since the younger one did!) I got them a Contender carbine, with a 410 barrel for small game and a 7-30 Waters for deer. I figured it was a gun they could hang onto for the rest of their lives and pass down to their kids someday. It doesn't hurt to start them off with a single shot.

I couldn't imagine my nine year old son to shoot a centrefire rifle. He and his 11 year old sister have been shooting my .22 magnum rimfire, and after some 20 shots in a sleeveless T-shirt, she started complaining that it hurt. We stopped. Things are turning colder now, and with a fleece on she'll be OK. My son is smallish, lightweight, and has trouble holding the little Marlin. I suppose I'll just have to be patient.

Frans

A .223 is really good for it's quietness and basically no reecoil in a full size rifle. You can cut the butt stock short or just have your son put the butt end in his armpit and shoot that way like my nephew did.

25CalNut
I assume by your screen name you like 25 cal., so way not a 250 savage?
I have a 250 AI. Shooting factory 250 savage loads in it, making brass, I sometimes wonder why I just didn't leave a 250 savage. It has hardly no recoil.
I see 250 savages every once in a while on the auction sites.
I have yet to shoot a deer with it, but to here others talk it has killing power far beyond its size.
Good luck
Shawn

How fun!!! I can't wait until my son is old enough to go out with me.

Out of the choices you gave, a 243 Win would be my pick. I'd make it a heavy barrel so it would absorb more recoil and be steadier to shoot from a bench. A heavy barrel would also be nice for varminting (even when he got older). In addition, kids aren't nearly as interested in letting a barrel cool down between shots so he'll have more success during longer sessions with that heavier barrel. I know for me, it's always more fun to shoot when I can hit what I'm aiming at. If he shoots enough, you/he can always rebarrel/stock that gun to a lighter field gun when he's ready and able to take advantage of a lighter outfit. Just a thought....

[ 08-28-2003, 11:12: Message edited by: Nebraska ]

My nephew will be 1 next week and I got him a CZ 527 in 223 with a 26 inch bull barrel. It is a small gun, it's inexpensive and looks nice. I will hold it for him until I think he is ready for a rifle of his own.

I would suggest a the following:

1. Ruger No. 1 chambered for 6.5x55 swede

2. NEF handi rifle in the same 6.5 or if that is not available the 243 win

3. Marlin 336 -- 30-30 win.

Man, I didn't think I would get all these responses in one evening!! But thanks for all the ideas! Gander Mountain actually had a Browning left hand in the store, and my son held it. It fit him ok and he liked it, but he wasn't sure if he wanted it, so I told him we would keep looking. I hadn't thought of the Handi Rifle, so I will check into that. I will also check into the Ruger. The Contender is also a great idea! I can see that my son and I are going to be having a lot of fun in the next few months trying to decide what to get him!!!!!!!!!! The rifle will be his Christmas present. He wants some video games for his birthday instead of the rifle. Kids!

As for the question if my son has ever shot anything bigger than a 22lr. Yes he has. We were at the range together and I was shooting my 25-06, and he asked to shoot it. I had some Win 85 gr Silvertips that I was shooting, so I put one in the chamber for him, and put a folded towel between his shoulder and the recoil pad. I got him situated as best I could, he had to stretch his neck to see through the scope. He took off the safety, and holding the rifle really tightly, squeezed the trigger. BANG! went the rifle, and boy did his eyes get BIG! He said it was great, and it didn't hurt at all, but he didn't want to shoot again. Then I pulled out my 8mm Mauser, and he wanted to take a crack at that thing. I told him maybe in a few years. So only that one shot, and it went pretty good!

I grew up in MN, and lived in the shotgun zone for deer hunting. We used the shotguns for everything else as well. My first shot was with an Ithaca 12 ga at the age of 7!!! My old man figured if I shot that and got hurt, then a 410 would be really easy to shoot. He was right. One shot of 12 ga, wiped away the tears, and the dirt off my ass, and I was ready for the 410. My old man had hidden a 410 double in the house for over a year. That 410 was great, no recoil what so ever, wish I still had it. It took 3 years before I shot a 12 ga again. So I am looking to teach my son a different way. Not that my dad did it wrong, just different.

I appreciate all the ideas. That's why this forum is great. Lots of diverse ideas from people that grew up in different times, places and circumstances. So if you guys think of any other choices, keep them coming.

This also gives me another excuse to get into handloading.

Thanks again!

My son is big for his age and got a Rem ADL Synthetic Youth in 7mm-08 for his 10th birthday. I am loading Speer 120 grain spitzers to 2562 fps in a very consistent, accurate load. He wears a PAST recoil shield, and does fine from the bench.

I am not a big fan of the .243. For me a starter rifle or kids/womans rig, or really light mountain rig, would be a .260rem. You can download 90gr bullets for parctice from the bench & in no time he'll be ready for 120gr hunting loads.

I'll mention this again because I think it's such a great idea.
If you don't cast your own, then pick up a box of 500 cast bullets. Lazer Cast usually runs somewhere around $30, and a can of 700x or similar. You can create piles of plinking ammo for cheap and he will get very familiar with the gun. My 15yo Son and I load up a big box to go with our 06s and use them for small game while hunting, just carry a few in your pocket so you don't explode Mr. Cottentail with a 165 pspcl!

When my younger daughter was about 9, she had shot a .22 rimfire a lot on benchrest, and was good at it. So one day at the range, I let her shoot a .260 Remington, a Browning single shot, that I was experimenting with. The kick startled her a lot, and she shot it only once, although she did very good with that one shot.

I think that 9 year olds should be introduced to centerfire rifles with something smaller than that -- I'd suggest that a .243 is the largest that should be used, and a .223 is better.

I should add, however, that body size and weight, as well as the particular person's recoil sensitivity, are important considerations. If your 9 year old happens to weigh a lean 120 pounds or more, then he can probably handle something larger than a .243, and if he is quite small, then something much smaller may be appropriate.

[ 08-28-2003, 22:37: Message edited by: LE270 ]

I think there is a lesson in the stories above about kids wanting to shoot only one shot. Centerfire rifles can be pretty scary when they recoil, heck even I wear a Past recoil pad, and I'm slightly bigger and heavier (mostly heavier, actually ) than a nine year old. So why on earth run the risk of getting a caliber, which will do the opposite of what you are intending: educating your son to become a good and keen shot, and gaining a shooting partner in the family at the same time. Start out with something, which you can almost guarantee won't be too scary. I really like the suggestions about a .223 - although the rifle can't be too heavy for a nine year old to handle it. A .22 Hornet would be even better. At first, all you want to achieve is to make holes in paper or make soda cans fly, so who cares what caliber the lad shoots. Either a .223 or a .22 Hornet would be cartridge to be used for a lifetime, so apart from the stock, you would not be wasting $$$ on a caliber like that.

The Contender is not a bad choice. The standard stock is set up for open sights - probably a good idea for first time shooters. Get them used to open sights in a single shot, graduate to scoped repeaters later...

Lucky you to have your son for a partner!
- mike

All this discussion whets my appetite for the future -- many years into the future, mind you!

My son Max is just 1 month old now. I can't wait, though, until he's old enough to get him his first centerfire rifle. By coincidence, my gunsmith and friend recently acquired an old Remington 725 in .243. I like that rifle because it seems to me to be the ultimate Remington action: all the accuracy and safety benefits of the 700 combined with strong, simple safety of the grand old 1917 Enfield.

Needless to say, I told my friend that in about a decade I'd be after him to buy that Remington!

Whoa, there, P-17. Check out what Jack Belk has to say about the trigger/safety on the Remington 721/725. As I recall, he's thinks even less of it than the murderous 700.

I bought my 6 year old daughter 410,22 combo Rossie she killed 3 squirrels with it last year, One of my buddys bought his 9 year old son a 223cal. New England Arms in youth model good starter gun fits him good shoots good he shot his first deer with it last year the exit wond suprised me. But all the Cal. you named i would go with the 243.

If I still had any of my kids at home I'd get them a G-2 Carbine with .22 LR, .410, .223 Rem and 7-30 Waters barrels. Makes me feel good that they are shooting a single shot, makes them feel good that they can hunt anything. If they need more shotgun, they can use one of mine. The barrels will hold resale value, the cartridges are mild kickers, even in this lightweight format, and it packs up in a small space when they leave home.

25cal,

My son turns 10 next week. Last year I cut down a 6.5 swede to fit him and put an oversize recoil pad on it. I loaded some very light charged 100 grain bullets and just worked up from there to full load 140gr noslers. by the time he was up to the full loads he was shooting 1 gallon water filled milk jugs at 100 yards from a sitting postion. Never had any problem with the recoil and was ready for caribou that winter, but that is another story. My point being that the calibre really doesn't matter(280,7-08,243,6.5 etc) as you can reload some VERY light safe loads to start with. Smokey

Again, thanks to all of you guys for the great responses! I would have never thought that I would get all of these ideas. Once I do get him his rifle, I will definitly post what I got him and how he likes it.

Thanks to all!

I'm right-handed and left-eye dominant and, since I haven't shot a rifle in about nine years, am switching to a left-handed long gun. I am opting for the 7mm-08 totally left-handed. I'm 5'1" and weigh about 112 lbs, so there's not much difference between me and most of the kids you guys are talking about. I'll let you know how it goes.

25C - For a boy that young, I'd go with .223 just for the ammo/simplicity of it all. Plus you won't have to wonder and worry about the recoil issue at such a tender age. You KNOW it will never hurt him or teach any bad habits. But the positive point is the .223 will teach all the marksmanship issues about hunting with a high powered rifle about as well as anything.
---------------------------

Now, I want to raise a new issue with you. I'm right handed, so no problem for me. But a lot of people in my shooting life were lefties. The thing is I can't recall a ONE of them who shot a LEFT handed bolt.

On the contrary, a post college pal of mine received a left handed .243 from his wife for Xmas one year. Very pretty rifle. But he confessed privately to me that he hated it because it FELT WEIRD to him. He had shot RH bolt action rifles all his life and the LH bolt felt about as goofy to him as it did me.

My question to you or any LH shooter that ones to comment, is do you really want to start the LH rifle thing? Is it worth it?

I never knew a LH shooter who was handicapped in any form or fashion by shooting LH rifles. They shot them just as good and just as fast as anything I could do. And they never knew they were at a "disadvantage" because they'd never know anything else.

Anyway, I had to ask. Good luck with your boy. Glad you two are sharing and enjoying the sport. Make a reloader out of him as well. That will triple his pleasure.

25C - Wow, it just dawned on me we have all overlooked a wonderful candidate...especially since you love the .25 bore. Wouldn't it be neat if you could find your son a good 250/3000?

It's such a sweet, effective, low recoil rifle!

Hey goto, why are you switching to a left handed gun? I too am right handed and left eye'd. The only problem(in some peoples opinions) that I suffer from being this way is that I don't shoot with both eyes open. I learned how to do so when I was young and have never gave it another thought. I spent 10 years in the Army and qualified expert every time I went to qualify. I also am a good wing shooter. I once went 11 for 11 pass shooting blue winged teal with a single shot 20 ga. Just curious as to why you are going lefty? I do like your caliber choice, very useful cartridge. I wish you the best of luck using the "right" rifle!

I started my grandson shooting at age 7. We used .22 centerfires--up to 22-250. We used both jacketed and cast bullets. With cast bullets as Lars pointed out,you can tame them down even 30-06. I did not want to subject him to too much recoil. We also shot air guns a lot. I have purple martin houses and thus lots of sparrows needing to be shot. I have one air rifle that is heavier than any of my centerfires,shooting that from a unipod is good experience from him. Most kids don't like shooting paper---make it fun. They like something to happen. Golfballs work pretty good as do charcoal briquettes or ice cubes. He got his first deer at age 9. I gradually moved him up to the .243 and haven't found a need to go higher. He is 14 now and has killed atleast one deer every year since the first one. Most years more. He got his first buck while my grandson was setting in my lap.(Had to word that carefully so it wouldn't sound like the buck was setting in my lap). We were in a stand and a spike came in on my side. Rather than both of us move,I had my grandson set on my knees. About three years ago,he got a nice 8 pointer during the special youth season and another 8 pointer opening day of regular season. Besides the hunting,we've had fun making plaques to mount the antlers.

My recommendation is a bit different than the others and with a reason. I would recommend the CZ550 in 7x57 Mauser. I am in process with one now for my 4 year old grandson. He won't get to shoot it or use it for some years yet but here is what I plan to do: I'll buy a synthetic stock for the CZ and preserve the nice wood stock. Cut the syn. stock to fit and save the pieces, adding back as needed to get correct LOP. I'll reload for him, starting off with reduced loads and virtually no recoil, taking him up to full power loads as he grows and becomes better able to handle the recoil. I have no problems with the 7-08 or the 260 Remington, I just know and love the 7x57 and believe it to be a superior caliber to either of the others.
One problem you have that must be addressed is the issue of being left-handed and I don't think the CZ is available in a left-handed version. Here I would give serious consideration to the Ruger No 1 and still look for one in 7x57. This is just my idea and I'm not knocking anyone else though admittedly biased toward the 7x57 Mauser.
Good luck with the lad and keep us posted.

[ 08-30-2003, 16:50: Message edited by: 'Trapper' ]

I am glad to see lots of posts on youth and hunting. Would like to offer some tips on making them a trophy out of their kills. If they get a buck,for sure they'll want the antlers---even a spike. The easiest way I've found is leave the skin on the skull. This is done by sawing from behind the base of the antler to down below them and out with one straight cut. Can be done with a handsaw. Remove as much of the brain fragments and fleshy tissue as possible. Will be some left. To keep that from stinking,mix very thorougly about one cup of 20 Mule Team Borax(can be obtained at supermarket in detergent section)to a gallon of water. Soak the skull section only in this mixture for about three days and then rinse real well. Do not let the antlers get in the mixture or you will discolor them. I do this by placing the borax mixture in a coffee can then place the skull section in,but propped to where the antlers don't enter. After the three days and they have been rinsed,let dry and you are ready to mount them. You can drill through the hair and skull and use a couple of screws to mount them to the plaque and the hair will hide the screws. If they get a doe, you can make them some nice trophies as well. Take the legs from below the knee and the tail with the bone removed and soak them in the Borax mixture same as above. Do this with the leg bent at I guess it would be the ankle. That bend will set that way. Get about a 30 inch board about 4 inches wide. Mount a leg a few inches from each end of the board with the hooves pointed up. To mount them,drill a hole through the board and recess the hole on backside so that the head of a lag bolt will be flush. Screw the lag bolt into the leg. You can mount the tail on the board to add decoration. Polish the hooves with shoe polish. You now have a handy rack for a baseball bat,a gun,bow or whatever. The Borax mixture also works for rattlesnake skins. If my directions were confusing,ask and I'll try again.

What a great topic...I teach a lot of kids gun safety and marksmanship and the YOUTH aspect of this site is important.

Anyway, my experience is not to make too much of a big deal about recoil when moving up from rimfires to centerfires. I stress eye and double hearing protection along with premium recoil pads. Start them off standing with the focus on hitting cans at 25 yards. This is important, as they will have no idea what the distribution of resting mass is unless they support the whole rifle themselves. It will come back in a predictable way.

Moving to the bench keep the rest very high so they don't lean forward too much. Again, start with can sized targets at close range and then go to 100 yard targets.

The worst possible experience with a new round is to start off on the bench leaning into the butt with your neck craned forward and then to shoot at a 1 inch bull 100 yards away. Other than for sighting in and basic skills, the bench is useless for hunting preparation anyway, and should be discouraged at all costs. The rifle simply will not shoot to the same point of impact in the field unless you bring your bench and rest with you.

While I agree with many that a 223 is a near perfect caliber for that age, Ill throw another suggestion into the hat. How about the classic Wal-Mart model 94? Its just as natural for a southpaw as it is for the rest of us and mild mannered, especially if you load up some cast bullets.

Dare to be different

A 250 Savage bolt action

ZM

My grandson is 9, and I thought he and I needed a little time together, and that he needed to do something that his classmates haven't done.

I picked up the little Rossi break-action single shot. The combo I got has a .22 barrel and a 20 ga. barrel, and the whole thing was under $150.

He shovels ammo through that thing just as fast as he can! If it weren't a single shot, I'd be broke!

The Rossi's are available in a lot of different combo's... .223/20 ga. would probably be about right, though several others are available.

The .22 is a bit heavy.... has a lot of steel in the rear of the barrel.

I set him up a target at 12 1/2 yards, and let him shoot the rifle. I set up at 25 yards, and shoot with my .41 Mag. He has to beat me before he gets to shoot anything else, like the Ruger Single Six in .22. Makes him practice. Somehow, he always comes out a point or two ahead of me :-). He has become a favorite at the range... all the guys talk with him, show him what they are shooting, and encourage him. It's really great. He's very safety conscious, and is learning good procedure.

What he really wants now is to shoot my .223....

25Cal - I'm switching because when I keep both eyes open the target blurs - only happens when I shoot. I guess it has something to do with looking down sights on a pistol or through a scope on a rifle. Same thing with a shotgun. If you want to see all the opinions on the subject, see my previous post on the African Game Hunting Forum. Thanks for the help though!

Almost forgot an obvious youth rifle -

The CZ 527 Carbine in 7.62X39.

Count mine as a vote for the .257 Rbts. More effective than the .243 but lesser recoil than the 7-08 makes it about a perfect rifle for the deer hunter, young or old.