lets say cloven hooved game in north america,<BR>150 yards,standing broadsidewhere do you hold on broadside gameshouldersbehind the shouldershead and neck

I voted behind the shoulders as it is a most common shot for me however in some instances a different hold is required.
If I were looking at a Moose who was next to a pond/stream/river/lake I would want a shot that drops him on the spot ( I don't want to work on a Moose in the water) so I would opt for the head/neck shot. If I were in a similar situation to the shot I had a few years back on my largest Bull Elk I would take a high shoulder shot as I did in that situation and dropped him in his tracks. He was 80 to 100 yards away from a STEEP canyon and offered no head/neck shot and my only shot was offhand at 180 yards with a sling through a narrow shooting lane.
So ultimately I normally take a heart/lung shot but each situation is assessed individually and I don't try to force a favorite shot into every situation.

shoulder is always my first choice.

I voted for the shoulders just because it works and most likely they'll drop not just from they're shoulders being broken but also from the shock to the CNS and if you go high on the shoulder you'll hit the spine. Ive never had to track one with a shoulder shot. Now the only down side of this is you'll get alot of bloodshot meat from the shoulders and most likely they wont be consumable. JMHO

Shoulders. Break 'em down.

It depends what I'm shooting with. I voted behind the shoulders. The large majority of my deer are killed with a compound bow, shot behind the shoulders, or aiming at the far shoulder.
With a rifle, I tend to shoot the same shots as with a bow.

That doesn't work well with the bigger guns and callibers I have been using lately. 458 Win Mag/400's, 35 Whelen/250's, 30-06/180's all left running deer and tracking.

Low up tight behind the shoulder. I want the bullet 3 inches above the sternum. Inside 50 yards it winds up being a head shot better than half the time. But at 150 I shoot to pass the bullet 3 inches over the sternum and prefer quartering to or away to give me a little more travel inside the chest. I will head shoot them out beyond fifty if they are already hit though.

It tends to depend on the situation. If I am meat hunting, then it is behind the shoulder. If I am 12 hours backpack from the quads, and half way up a mountain, shoulders it is, several times so there is less to track and less to pack . I have read from a butcher, possibly here on the Forum, that lung shots are better for meat than head shots because the heart helps to bleed out the animal. I experimented last year and it seems to work well.
Good hunting,
Graham

I always prefer a shoulder shot on elk. I hate to loose the meat but i hate chasin them for miles worse. They need to die where they stand.

cross hairs between the legs, aim 1/3 to 1/2 of the way up the body, angled at the far shoulder generally works EVERY time...

I go for the behind the shoulder on deer or antelope. On stuff that bites or is larger I go for the shoulder shot. I do not like the head shot. Over the years I have encountered 3 deer that had their bottom jaw blown off by people attempting a head shot. Two were recently shot, but one, a very nice 4 pt muley had been suffering for a few days.

shoulder

I like to hit at least one shoulder, going in or out, both if possible. I could care less about the loss of meat, I want the animal on the ground, then I can trim. Good shooting.

I too voted for behind the shoulders. In reality, I think it gives you the largest deadly target area. We hunt moose & caribou for the meat but I always go behind the shoulders if possible. The problem for moose is that there is usually little reaction from them of their being hit. They just stand there. You'd swear it was a good hit but he just stands there. Once they realize "something's wrong", they'll take off for the deepest water they can find - then ya really gotta problem. In short, on moose. I'll put one behind the shoulders but if I become concerned that he's gonna take off, I'll put another one into his shoulder to break it. It ruins a lot of meat but at least he's down.
I've never tried a head/neck shot and from what I've read, they're too "iffy" so I won't try one. I know most of you guys are mainly conceerned with deer so my comments may not apply.
Bear in Fairbanks

On all animals I hold and advise hunters to hold tight behin the shoulder about 1/3 of the way up. In my experience shoulder shots especially with moose & bear (humps) the tendency to shoot too high is always there. The biggest bear in Alaska hasn't got a chance with a shot through the top of his heart and lungs. If you get a shoulder as well its a bonus.

I shoot for the exit wound and I want that shot to at least take out the lungs. If perfect broadside then I hold tight behind the shoulders 1/3+ up from the bottom of the rib cage. I don't like losing a shoulder as well but I'm not against it if the animal goes down in a hurry.

The only time I've ever taken the high shoulder shot (CNS) was in Alaska. I was hunting black bear and I didn't want to track a bear period. I wanted him to drop and stay down. That shot is very effective to say the least.

I tend to aim at the shoulders. Gives me the most room for error.

ddj

I voted "shoulders" but I actually aim right at the point of the shoulder usually. It almost always results in a heart shot with both front legs useless, thus a quick kill and short tracking job.

Earlier in my hunting career I placed a shot behind the shoulder. I will still do so if an early morning or good light shot presents itself and the shoulder is not available. Now I work hard to position mmyself for a shoulder shot and if at last light, I only take a shoulder shot or pass.

behind the shoulder, or angled thru one side to exit thru the far shoulder.

right here.DRT ,150 yds ,took out the arteries on top of the heart.30-06,150 gr

jb,

That looks eerily similar to a shot I made a few years back. 280 yards, exact same placement, 140 gr ballistic tip out of a 7mm Rem Mag. Dropped on the spot. Problem is, that shot doesn't always result in a DRT game animal. Made the same shot, same gun/bullet/etc, at 60 yards this past fall. Deer went roughly 70-80 yards (and no blood... ). If I'd been sitting next to a cedar swamp, I would have been in trouble, given that there was zero blood trail and no snow.

My personal thoughts:
-I've seen quite a few deer drop on the spot with heart/lung shots. ALL of them drop with a shoulder/spine shot.
-I've never seen a bullet that will give a good blood trail 100% of the time, so given the option, I'll anchor them in their tracks with either a neck or shoulder shot (the objective being to sever the spine).
-In all situations, I want a bullet that expends as much energy within the animal as possible - my worst tracking episode was a double lung hit whitetail doe with nosler partitions. I'm sure that they work well for the situations intended, but that was not one of them. 300 yards, no blood trail (small diameter entry and exit, fat plugged the holes immediately). Found her by persistence, and a bit of luck.
-bullet construction matters less than shot placement, but not by much... If a bullet don't expand, or has limited expansion in soft tissue, it will not deliver most of its energy to its intended target (with very big game being the exception). I don't care for thin or non-existent blood trails.
-I may lose a little meat, but I won't lose any deer that way. Which do you think is worse? JMHO

gd

Uncle Joe,

Like you need advise after killing all of God's creatures over most of the Western US and AK. Yeah! I know you were just bored and were curious about what others did. Well when I'm not completely winded I attempt to shoot through the heart/lung area regardless of angle presented. To specifically answer your question I try to hold right behind the front shoulder. I do thing though that a shot directly through the shoulders is more likely to give you a DRT result. The head/neck shot is too risky 99.9% of the time as the spine or brain have to be hit to cause a humane death. Flesh wounds in the neck or a jaw blown away from poor shooting is just not acceptable as it could have been avoided.

Mark

Behind the shoulder in the mornings on a doe for the freezer from a stand with sturdy rest for the rifle.

Shoulder for everything else.


Those that always aim behind the shoulder have never lost a nice animal.....that is why they still take that shot.

mark,i can't hold a candle to the pile of salt you need for your graveyard,but the words were kind and apprieciated.
i was curious to "others" reasons and holds and have myself held shoulders on game depending on set up and species.
that said i was taught to hold behind the shoulders as every ounce of that game animal ended up on the table and it was unaceptable to waste any portion.
truth be told the hair on the back of my neck goes up a bit when i hear someone say"always shoulders,no exceptions", thou i have been reminded in this conversation that there is country and cover that makes a shoulder DRT
shot the norm as tracking sign is not as easy or apparent as the conditions i am used to hunting with or in.
its all a learning process and the post was 50%
bored and 50% lets hear from others and i might learn something

Behind the shoulder, unless I want the animal down right there, then I go to break the shoulders and get the animal off its feet.

I'll go for a "mobility kill" every time, as it allows me "leisure time" to decide if I need to shoot again

I go for the shoulder BECAUSE I want the animal immobilized. or atleast have it's mobility compromised

I greatly prefer a "less then perfect", or semi-broadside shot
because my "ideal target" is the OFFSIDE shoulder
With an offside shoulder shot I get to make a mess of the boiler room AND get a mobility kill

In 20-odd years of hunting I've never had to track an animal more than 60yards, and that ONE was actually hit
with my brother's (4 month old at the time) 1985 Saab turboSPG

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quote:

I always prefer a shoulder shot on elk. I hate to loose the meat but i hate chasin them for miles worse. They need to die where they stand.

I agree on this one especially if dark is setting in or in brushy steep country.



Cal30

I voted shoulders, but it really depends on the country I'm hunting. In thick stuff, I'd rather break them down and not have to do much tracking.

If its open country, I'll shoot behind the shoulder for the lung shot.

Troy

Shoulder, every time.

Offside shoulder is preferred - I voted behind the shoulder - best room for error / lower meat loss combination.

But if I am close or want an immediate stop or don't have any other option I'm happy with a neck shot - I've taken several with immediately lethal results - and is much better than the texas heart shot on a deer facing away as well.

I like the shoulder shot on elk but rarely use it on deer. Most of my deer have dropped within 50yds when hit behind the shoulder, the rest were not much further.

generally for the game mentioned behind the shoulder
post mortem on the elk I shot this past fall was one hole thru the heart ran 15-20 yards dead on the hoof

I haven't shot a game animal standing broadside for so long, I almost don't know where to hold! I usually shoulder shoot them, but I often use a harder bullet than some. If I were using a BT or Sierra on deer, I'd shoot behind the shoulder, if a NP or TSX I'd break some bone.

Found out this weekend that my wife prefers high shoulder shots that disrupt the CNS in a big way. 2 shots = 2 deer.

Used to go shoulders, then got cocky and decided to shoot neck shots. Worked well for some time, but it cost me a deer last fall - hit but not kilt, resulted in lost deer.

From this point on, I will proceed to shoot the shoulders out of my deer. DRT(dead right there) is a good acronym! Onward!!

I voted behind the shoulder but it really depends on the situation and the rifle. I generally hunt deer with a 375 H&H just because I love that rifle and thats what it is chambered in. When I take the 308 out I'll go for the shoulder unless a good head/neck is available, emphasis being on the head. Same with the 223 rem.

I always desire at least one shoulder and prefer bof`um. They do not go far with both shoulders destroyed. 1/3 up is what I prefer also, because it typically results in a fine Blood Trail if it is needed.

And I use an Adequate Cartridge for the Game at hand.

The easy answer is "aim for the exit hole". How the animal is standing determines where you're gonna aim.
Take a toy animal, any one will do. Then rotate the animal and determine where the bullet will pass OUT or the animal and what it will pass THRU while in transit, then you will see that "behind the shoulder", "thru the shoulder", "etc" doesn't count for a lot.
At the right angle, a behind the shoulder shot can render you a gut shot deer or a shoulder shot can give you a three legged deer that can go miles and miles before he dies.
I understand the question was "broadside game" but I just never seem to get those Christmas card poses from the game I'm hunting. And fwiw, I much prefer a angling shot.