Here's the setup: You let loose with your perfect bear killing rifle, with the perfect shoulder, lung, heart, lung combination shot to bring down the bear, you thought, but wait........ the bear doesn't know he's dead yet, and charges you. Question?
Would drill him again, or would you piss your pants and run like hell............I'll give you hint: The flier that the ALASKA DEPT. OF FISH AND GAME produces for hunting bears mentions it.

Here's another one for you; You make the same shot as mention above, that drops the bear, but he lift his head again. Do you drill him again, or do you just watch?

What I'm giving you is 25 years of real life hunting experiences from Kodiak to Yakutat, that I've had to deal with while hunting bears in Alaska.

What would you do, and would you be ashamed that you had to shoot again to make sure the bear was really dead?

[This message has been edited by CK (edited 02-16-2002).]

...Peter

"Bragging on a 7-1/2' Brownie,is like bragging on a forked horn buck.
To add merit to the harvest of such a "beast",I'd not brag that it took me two shots(from any rifle)let alone a 30-06 with 220gr projectiles. That failed to help your cause."

You be the judge on this...............

You stated:

"John S-
And I'm proud you, because this debate could go on forever. Your right, this is apples and oranges - Pick whatever floats your boat - I took a nice 7 1/2 brown bear with my 30-06 using a Partition 220 gr. at 40 yards. A lung, heart, lung and shoulder combination anchored him, followed by a quick neck shot......Bottom line....The proof is in the pudding, APPLES & ORANGES.
Take your pick."

Stated as such,that it was a colossal deed and extolled some hidden vurtue,housed within the 30-06.

I rebutted,as you mention.

Not once did I say,that you should quit shooting before the job is done.

I implied and plainly stated,that busting a rat Brown Bear twice with a 30-06,was far from an earth shaking event. When argueing the merits of a cartridge. Nor a convincing arguement for anything.

Perhaps that info will win the hearts and minds of countless upcoming Hunters and they'll clamor to stores,in order to purchase an '06.

But I doubt it and that IS my point............

2.) As long as he did not start to get up I would let him bleed out were he was.

Kent

I didn't bring your name up for reason, because I knew you would take the bait and do it yourself - My, my........How quick we are to judge.......About my recent 7 1/2 FT. "RAT BROWN BEAR" that you don't know a thing about..........Nor the reason it was taken. And further more, referring to any size Alaskan Brown BEAR as a "RAT" does a discredit to the species. Your words speak for them self.
I think you missed my the point, I COULD CARE LESS WHAT ROUND ANYBODY USES! IT'S APPLES AND ORANGES. GET IT! I DON'T CARE! I was sharing my own experiences with the people.....remember how to share, and thou shall not cast the first stone.....Dude, I don't what your beef is........But maybe you'll raise above it one of these days.

So, with that said, the bottom line here, pump as much lead, (with your choice of a bear killing rifle) as needed to get the job done, whether it's a 3 ft glacier bear to a 10 ft Kodiak. And you don't have to feel ashamed about taking two or more shots at a bear, because that is what you are suppose to do....These bears are tough SOB's and they don't know they are suppose to be dead as they maul you to death.

[This message has been edited by CK (edited 02-16-2002).]

I am deeply embarassed by my performance in this situation and my only advice is to shoot until the beast stops all movement and noise, but reserve at least one bullet for surprises even when he's "dead". Heck, it might be worthwhile to shoot the carcass upon approaching it just like they do with buffalo. Even a little 300 lb bear can turn you inside out. I don't know the best policy for following up. I suppose it depends on how well you think he's been hit, but I was mistaken in my judgment of that.

[This message has been edited by Harald (edited 02-16-2002).]

quote:

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Originally posted by CK:
Big Stick,

I didn't bring your name up for reason, because I knew you would take the bait and do it yourself - My, my........How quick we are to judge.......About my recent 7 1/2 FT. "RAT BROWN BEAR" that you don't know a thing about..........Nor the reason it was taken. And further more, referring to any size Alaskan Brown BEAR as a "RAT" does a discredit to the species. Your words speak for them for them self.
I think you missed my the point, I COULD CARE LESS WHAT ROUND ANYBODY USES! IT'S APPLES AND ORANGES. GET IT! I DON'T CARE! I was sharing my own experiences with the people.....remember how to share, and thou shall not cast the first stone.....Dude, I don't what your beef is........But maybe you'll raise above it one of these days.

So, with that said, the bottom line here, pump as much lead, (with your choice of a bear killing rifle) as needed to get the job done, whether it's a 3 ft glacier bear to a 10 ft Kodiak. And you don't have to feel ashamed about taking two or more shots at a bear, because that is what you are suppose to do....These bears are tough SOB's and they don't know they are suppose to be dead as they maul you to death.

[This message has been edited by CK (edited 02-16-2002).]

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DITTO!!!!!!!

That wasn't a personal afront,rather an observation.

I'm sure there are untold thousands of Deer killed annualy,that need more than one shot,when hit with a myriad of cartridges,that cover a huge spectrum of "power" levels.

Once you start a job,you simply must finish it and that should be so obvious,as to not need mention.

We'll disagree on the magnitude of killing cubs,as opposed to the harvest of a more mature representation of the species..........

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Brent

Like I said before, know what you are talking about before speaking - A 7 to 8 year old Alaskan Brown Bear (an approximation by the ADF&G Biologist) is far away from being a cub.....And did you know that some Alaskan Bears don't have diet to grow up to 10 footers.......This is true. Not all places in Alaska have the perfect food to grow big tall brown bears.

Please allow others share there pride without being put down.........The second request. Thank you.

As I said before, if you are satisfied with your brownie, and there are any number of "HUNTERS" that would be tickled with him, then don't let some keyboard jockey ruin your day. "Building" a rifle or spouting ballistics tables is one thing; doing the deed is another. I even think, from another post, the jockey wants to tell us which bear to eat. Maybe he should write a book.......maybe we should just buy the boy new crayons.

Dangerous Coup de Grace cause you are not stupid.

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MED

The sole purpose of a rifle is to please its owner

This should apply to any big game, nothing worse than having an animal get away wounded.

Not pissing in your punch,but you made the mention of a 3' Glacier Bear..........

Big50,

I've seen my share and in no place,does a 7-1/2 Coastal Brownie rate "big".

I live in Alaska,so needn't guess...............

[This message has been edited by beemanbeme (edited 02-17-2002).]

Calling a forked-horn a forked-horn,is somehow without tact? I don't subscribe to everything a man kills,as being a "Trophy".

I shoot much,just for the table and try to do just that. Others hang on the wall,or are mounted lifesize. I can discern one of my forked-horns,from something that will go in the All Time Book.

Why would any of that,pose a problem?..............

The simple answer is "If he is on his feet, hit him again. If he is down, and you are doubt, hit him again"

Why mess with a bear?

The Brown Bear at Phil Shomakers camp will mostly go 9' and bigger..thats in the katmai and Becharof areas...I book for Phil.

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Ray Atkinson

ray@atkinsonhunting.com
atkinsonhunting.com

I have rode along on many a bear trip with my father to guide hunts. I dont care who you are, a 7 1/2 foot tall bear is a GREAT bear. I have seen my 358 Norma drop a 10 ft grizly, but the same load, and shot placment didnt even faze a small 6' he took 5 before he gave up the fight. And im shure of my placement because the hear lung area was devistated, he had 2 broken sholders, and a broken back and he still wanted to fight, only he was too broken down to do so. So even a small bear can bring about greater memories than a 10 footer i personaly like my 6' fighter over the 10 foot that rolled over.

I think a 7-1/2' Black Bear,is a big animal. But not a 7-1/2' Coastal Brownie of the same size.

First rule about Bears,is no two will react the same. All will hit the ground on the first poke,but not all will stay there.

I'm not interested in any undue excitement and would much prefer to shoot once and then have the Hunt over................

[This message has been edited by Big Stick (edited 02-18-2002).]

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I love 45
santilli@singleaction45.com

But I'd sooner have a second hole in the bear,
than ANY amount in me!!

quote:

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Originally posted by Mike Dettorre:
Let see...any animal, shoot it until it is down period. Non Dangerous Coup de Grace if required because you are a Sportsmen.

Dangerous Coup de Grace cause you are not stupid.

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Big Stick, as far as a Bear will go down on the 1st shot , not always true, try 3 shoots with a 7mag 220 gr's on a 8 1/2 ft Gizz charge started about 60 yds out. 1st 2 shoots went to chest, heart and lungs were both destroyed, 3rd shot brook left shoulder. That was what put him down. Gave a 4th shot for security

Hoping it would..........

quote:

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Originally posted by Big Stick:
I've seen lots of 7-1/2' Black Bears,the best I've seen killed was an honest 8'.......

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Big Stick,
Mind indulging us with a little geographic information? I would very much enjoy a crack at a 7 1/2 footer blackie. I would settle for GPS coordinates!
Would dearly love to top the 19 15/16" I have now. (You can understand my desire better now, I think.)
best,
bhtr

I've got it more or less to my self and rather enjoy that luxury. Besides,I don't have a GPS.

Will be happy to post photos of this coming Spring's HOG. I expect to start seeing them,in less than a month,with weather being the determining factor.

All my photo accounts,have went tits up,or I'd post some photos of some pretty nice ones................

I wasn't aware that the Anchorage Zoo had a bunch of BIG black bears. "stick" must have drawn one of their coveted hunting permits. The co-ordinates for the Zoo are probably available from the Chamber of Commerce.

Juneau & CK,

I think you're right, but I'm too old to care. IMHO, guys like you know that any Alaskan bear is a good one. Too bad there are people so caught up in their own importance that they miss sharing in the successes of others. I think that's what I like about real Alaskans the most; belief that some things may be better than others but they're all good.

Thank God for Alaska, the Last Great Place!

Good Bears abound within the State. A man so inclined,can routinely bump into them,without a visit to the zoo. Give it a try sometime.

I suppose a "Humpy" is a great example of a Salmonid? There is zero shame in calling things as they are,regardless of the State a man resides in.

Some people can tell no difference,between fresh and frozen Halibut. Others think that a Humpy on a fly rod is a true Trophy. Others yet shoot rat critters and figure others won't know the difference.

I make no apologies for discerning the differences,despite the amount of cynicism.

Give me my Seafood fresh and I understand the "magnitude" of a forked-horn........

ps. Just print a copy of a map; the gps won't matter then!

We are weather dependant here,for when they emerge from the den,just like most places.

I've always seen a dandy or two,by mid-March. I think last year was March 6 and I saw him from the gas pump in town,feeding on a tide flat.

I am pretty serious,by the first week of April. Our Winter here has been fairly mild,but it dumped snow pretty good,the last two days. We could still get a bunch more,one never knows.

If we get more snow,they'll den a little longer. SE has the craziest weather in the world,it is pretty early yet,to speculate as to when things will be going pretty good. Nobody here,is foolish enough to guess on the weather.

I'll be looking here directly,but that doesn't mean I'll be seeing anything. You don't know,'til you go. Looking is cheap.

Are you seriously contemplating coming down,chasing after them? I'm going to be headed back to Camp tomorrow or the next,but if you are thinking about coming down,I'll shoot you a word on when things are starting to look petty good. I'm not sure how often I'll get to come home(weather),but I can shoot you a message here or something. Will have a cell phone this afternoon too,so that gives me options,as there is finally enough coverage here to allow them to work.

Take pictures up there,after the ball gets to rolling. Be happy to swap lies and photos. I'm hoping to have a new digital still camera in my grubby mitts,within a couple weeks. My intent is to get some superb live photos,while I'm pickin' and choosin'. Certainly before Spring is over,I'll have some great photos of some good ones.................

[This message has been edited by Sheister (edited 02-21-2002).]