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Much discussion has been held in here about hunting shows and videos. More fuel for the fire! Success no matter the cost or attempt!  Filmed on location in idaho! IDAHO FALLS - Filming the shooting of a big 6 x 6 bull elk in Idaho is something that should have been the perfect film subject for Glen Berry, owner of Big Bull Productions, a company that specializes in the producing videos of big game hunts all around the globe. The problem was that Berry was hunting the bull with a Montana tag! While the video that witnesses reported seeing being shot was never recovered, their precise GPS (Global Positioning System) marking of the kill site and nearly instantaneous reporting of the incident via cell phone to IDFG Senior Conservation Officer Lew Huddleston, helped earn Berry a film credit for poaching. On September 19, 2005, witnesses observed Berry kill the big 6 x 6 bull elk approximately ½ a mile inside Idaho. The site was astride the Idaho side of the Continental Divide, so little doubt could have existed as to what state the party was hunting. Additional confirmation regarding Berry's knowledge of the exact location of the kill site was confirmed by the fact that he purchased an Idaho elk tag after the bull had been shot! The witnesses observed the kill site and recorded its location with a GPS and immediately reported the information to Officer Huddleston. This information and the ensuing investigation resulted in a 27 hour-long work day for Huddleston, something that is not all that uncommon for an Idaho Conservation Officer during the fall hunting season! Whereas some film stars reap millions for their productions, Berry ended up costing him! He pled guilty to the four charges; Possession of an unlawfully taken big game animal, Hunting without an Idaho elk permit, Failure to validate his elk tag, and Violating the U.S. Forest Service Travel Plan. The penalties were the maximum for the possession, $1,000 plus court costs, $750 civil penalty, 180 days in jail and 3 years license revocation. The other three violations resulted in $9,000 in fines, plus court costs! Because Idaho is a member of the Wildlife Violator Compact, Berry will also not be able to hunt as part of his filming during the next three years in any of the 20 other member states! Because his son Chad Berry was part of this big game shooting gone bad, he is scheduled for trial on possession of unlawfully taken animal in Clark County in January. Here's a link to the source. http://fishandgame.idaho.gov/apps/releases/view.cfm?NewsID=2894 | ||
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I have a feeling most trophy hunters in the limelight are bending the rules. I know of a guy whose articles I have seen in magazines, that was caught trespassing on private. I ended up meeting his stepson, and he had a lot of stories like that. | |||
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Success at all costs! That is what I think they live by. | |||
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Wow ! Six months in jail ..  So now if the chap is a convicted criminal .. he probably can't leave the U.S. to hunt in other countries .. | |||
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It's really disheartening to see people trying to profit off their illegal ways. I think most hunters buy videos and books to learn and appreciate from others with the anticipation that what we are getting is of some ethical and moral quality of the sport we love. Wasn't it Noel Feather, a popular bowhunter that got caught a few years ago killing elk in Yellowstone, and was making a video of it? 6 months and $9k in fines is cheap punishment if you ask me. I think you should lose your hunting rights in the 50 states and territories, that might be an incentive. NRA Life Memeber SCI Life Member Dallas Safari Life Member DRSS We Band of Bubbas | |||
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Yep, that would do it. Canada would also refuse them on that same basis. DB | |||
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Here's something I found on another forum--It's interesting. I am Glen Berry and I would like to make this statement so all will know the truth. Until you have dealt with Fish and Wildlife you have no idea what I've been through. I would have the same opinion as most of you of a violator before this happened. The events start on Sept. 16, 2005. My son, a good friend of mine, and myself arrive in unit 59 of Idaho and set up camp at Middle Fork Bench. We plan on bowhunting elk in Montana by accessing Montana through Mill Fork Canyon of Middle Creek Road, which is located in Idaho. The end of Middle Creek Road stops less than 1/2 mile from the Montana border. It is easier to access this area through Idaho, than it is through Montana. We were hunting in Montana for 2 1/2 days by accessing exactly the same way and were getting into several bulls. On the afternoon of Sept. 18 we had split up and Chad went with my friend. I walked up into a patch of timber. Suprisingly enough I spooked a herd of elk, with a 6x6 bull trailing a few cows. The bull stopped on the ridge, and gave me enough time for a shot. The herd ran over top into Idaho. I was unable to find my arrow and was unsure if I hit the bull. I met back up with Chad and my friend, and it was almost dark. The elk we had been hunting had moved further east into Montana. We decided that we were going to move camp the next day to hunt a different area, but decided we should make one more attempt to assure the bull I shot at hadn't been hit. On the morning of Sept. 19 we slept in until 7:00 a.m. and drove up Middle Creek Road. We parked the vehicle in the same place we had the previous 3 days. I decided to access Montana by walking up a drainage in Mill Fork Canyon to the east, since I wanted to return to the area I had shot at the bull in Montana the afternoon before, and this was the best way. We began walking up the drainage, when Chad said he was going to go to the bathroom and would catch up. My friend and myself continued up the drainage and heard a bull on the border. When I reached the very top of the ridge, a 6x6 bull stuck his head up. Thinking it was the same bull I had shot the previous afternoon, I shot the bull and the hit was in the neck. The bull ran down the 60 degree slope into Idaho. I recovered the bull approximately 400 yards into Idaho. I had shot the bull, and it appeared to have cut the bulls wind pipe. I was confused what to do, because although I had shot the bull in Montana, it had died in Idaho. I knew what the right thing to do was, and began to put my Montana tag on the bull, when my friend suggested I go buy an Idaho tag, because it wasn't worth taking a chance. Since we were packing the bull out through Idaho, and going to transport the bull out on the only dirt road, which was in Idaho, if by some chance we were stopped by a game warden and the bull has a Montana tag on it, and the game warden requests to go to where the bull died, it would be in Idaho, and then we would have to prove that the bull was shot in Montana. Against my better judgement, I decided to buy an Idaho tag, which was over-the-counter. When we returned with the tag, I realized that something was up, when a sheriff and the game warden had both went by our camp. Realizing that I had not tagged the bull immediately I was in big trouble. I was questioned and arrested. I signed a consent to search affadavit for the camera bag, my truck, and my trailor. They found no video tapes of the event because there were no video tapes. I plead guilty to all four charges although I hadn't shot the bull in Idaho. I knew it was the right thing to do because I hadn't put my tag on it immediately and took possession of the bull. To me it really doesn't make a difference if you have 2 or 3 or 4 violations, if you have one violation you are a violator. So, I decided against fighting the hunting without a tag charge and plead guilty to all four. I know that the witness said he saw me shoot the bull in Idaho. To let you know he changed that statement under oath at my review stating that he first saw us when we were at the bull, where it had died. For five to ten minutes he watched us. When we had left, he went down to the bull with another friend and saw it was untagged. This is when they called fish and game because they believed it had been illegally taken. The witnesses took dna samples and gps coordinates of where the bull was found dead. The game warden never went to examine the bull or the site, or tried to figure out what really happened. My son was also charged with unlawful possession. He was not hunting, he did not have a weapon in camp, and was only there to help. He never touched or took possession of this animal, until the game warden requested Chad and my friend to retrieve the bull so it would be salvaged. He made no decisions on the taking of this bull verbally or physically. I had an Idaho hunting license. If I wanted to hunt the Beaverhead zone, I would of simply bought a $370.00 tag. I have been bowhunting for 33 years and have never had a game violation. I have made it a point never to take the easy route. I made a mistake, and paid my price. I spent 30 days in jail, and paid just over $3,000 in fines. I also received 3 years loss of hunting rights in 23 states and am currently on probation. I was given such a stiff penalty not because of what I did, but who I am. Assumptions were made and they felt I was trying to profit off the state of Idaho, by intentionally hunting and attempting to film a hunt illegally, which is not the truth. I do not hunt exclusively in front of a video camera. I am a family man, who enjoys hunting with my daughter, my son, and my friends, the same way I did 30 years ago. I have never considered myself a celebrity. The people I deal with at sport shows or seminars have always looked up to me because I have always came across as a down-to-earth, average guy, who likes to hunt. Maybe some people make millions off hunting videos and outdoor t.v. shows, but I have never made very much money from t.v. or videos. I have built a business around my game call company. People know my morals and my character. I have been doing this for 23 years. I know what happened out there and I am not going to hang my head with shame. I know I have made a mistake, but I feel people should be entitled to atleast one mistake in their life. This is the first time I have ever hunted near a state line, and not had tags for both states. To the organizations I belong to and the individuals who support me, I would like them to take in consideration what I have contributed to the sport of archery and bowhunting over the past 23 years. I ask them to judge my character for who I am, not one unfortunate incident. Glen Berry | |||
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I'm going to try not to pass judgement, everyone get's their day in court, but I do have an opinion. If I was hunting that close to the border of two or three states, maybe it would be wise to have tags and licenses for both states, cheaper than legal fees and jail time. I think if you put a good hit on an animal there would be good sign at the point you first hit him. If the game warden wanted to see where the animal died, you can show him where he fell, and backtrack to where you first hit him. So what should have been done? I think, knowing that I shot the bull in MT, even though he died in Idaho, I tag him and haul him out.... it seems less suspicious and follows the story you would have to relay to GW... I haven't seen a hunting law/rule that specifically covers this in TX... how about you northern guys in your states... NRA Life Memeber SCI Life Member Dallas Safari Life Member DRSS We Band of Bubbas | |||
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I personally would have called the warden myself right away and explained that I had shot a bull in Montana and it expired in Idaho. I think the penaltys, if any, would have been much less harsh. i think the fact that he tried to buy an Idaho tag and passit off as an Idaho kill is what did him in. | |||
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We will never know for sure what happened. I do hunt in that area, sometimes literally on the border between Idaho and Montana. The game trails and forest service trails by necessity wander back and forth across state lines, so I may cross the state line several times a day -- not intending to hunt in the wrong state, but just moving from point "A" to point "B". Likewise it is common to see Montana hunters meandering into Idaho. I have often wondered what I would do if a wounded animal ran across the state line. Regarding the suggestion to buy a tag for both states, besides the expense, the seasons are different. When the season is open in Idaho, it may not be open in Montana, and visa versa. Or it may be spike-only in Idaho, or cow only, or so forth. Our rules are very complicated. Furthermore, Idaho is divided into a gazillion different hunting units, with each unit having its own season and rules. In many cases, the boundary follows a ridgeline. Ridgelines are often the best place to hunt and the most natural place to walk in the rugged terrain, so even if you never leave the state, you still face the same boundary issues. I can personally vouch for the fact that if you kill an animal in one unit, and then pass through another unit on the drive home, Idaho Fish and Game will assume you are guilty until proven innocent. Idaho Fish and Game has very little respect here -- instead of prowling the woods for real poachers, who don't operate during the hunting season anyway -- their main focus is on interrogating hunters who are driving home and conducting illegal vehicle searches. I don't know what IFG really did or didn't do in this incident, but I find it easy to believe Berry's version of events. I also used to hunt along the border with Yellowstone Park and faced the same issues there. A hunter has a MORAL obligation to recover wounded game, but a LEGAL obligation to respect political boundaries. The sad fact is that if you shoot an animal and it crosses a boundary line, you're safest bet is to let the coyotes have it. | |||
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I don't know Glenn Barry, and can't remember seeing one of his videos. After reading the newspaper account, then reading Barry's, I reckon I would believe Barry's. It's easy to tun afoul of the regs in one state, much less when two are involved. I know that his buying an Idaho tag was wrong. What SHOULD he have done? Can he legally recover a bull that crosses the line? Don_G ...from Texas, by way of Mason, Ohio and Aurora, Colorado! | |||
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Barrys account seems pretty believable to me.I have on occasion dealt with people in a position of authority who had no interest in doing what was right, but rather just wanted to teach people a lesson. I am sure we have all dealt with people like that. If what Barry says is true then a careful inspection of the area may have showed a blood trail on the other side of the state line. Although I am not sure what you are supposed to do if you have a dead animal where that animal is illegal, even though it was shot somewhere else. I guess the best thing would be to tag it and stand your ground. But I think Idaho might still think you are lying.Idaho probably looses a lot of game to poachers who cross the border, and most of them probably say they shot it on the other side.I'll bet that story gets old real quick, even if it is on occasion, true. Sand Creek November 29 1864 | |||
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not sure what to believe--there's a guy on another forum that says Mr. Barry used this same story on an Oregon elk that died in a refuge that was shot outside of it--but there's no more details on that event so take it for what it is-- I think he should've tagged it with his Montana tag and called the warden--but he didn't so now he paying the price--chris | |||
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okay guys this is not the same but as close as I can get with a personal experience. Very close to my home there is a State park. No one is allowed to hunt on state park property, but I had seen several big deer on the edge of the property so I called the local agent to let him know of my intentions. and setup 20 yards from the property line. sure enough a nice buck came by my stand and I shot him. he ran strait for the state land. I didn't touch anything. stand, arrow, blood, nothing instead I went to the truck, put up my bow and called the agent. He came to me and we tracked him together. when he saw arrow, stand location and blood trail he was fine. moral of the story C.Y.A. Married men live longer than single men do, but married men are a lot more willing to die. | |||
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I had a similar experience. Bowhunting elk near the Prince Albert National Park in Sk. I arrowed an elk high in the chest 1/2 mile from the park boundary. Arrow went thru. He ran for the park. I waited about 30 min.Picked up my arrow and went looking for him. Left my bow as didn't want to carry it in the park.(no shooting in National Parks)He had laid down in some thick brush about 200 yd. inside the park. I spooked him up and he ran back outside the park and again laid down, this time in the open. I waited again and then approached with a drawn bow. Was already dead. The fish cops flew over and in 25 min. were at my side.At first they were rude to say the least. I told them the story and one of them called my a liar. 20 yr. ago there would have been a fist fight for sure, but I kept my cool,retraced my steps,writing all the distances and details in a small notebook with a dull pencil. When we came to the spot where the elk had laid down in the park one of the fishcops stated 'this is where you shot the elk' He stayed at this spot while the other one and I proceed to follow a two hr. old blood trail in the grass. Luckally there was a bit of snow and the outline of where I set my bow down was visable. When we got to the spot where I had picked up my arrow (had taken a piss there) the cop was getting the picture. Him and I walked across cuontry to the dead elk and he radiod the other guy. After about 20 min. of threats and bullshit from 'the kill site guy' they gave me a ride to my truck and then searched my camp. I got on my quad and left them in camp. When I got back to civilization I called the DNR office in P.A. to see what was up.The fellow there had heard the story already and apoligized for the 'kill site guys' behavior. Turned out ok for me but would have been the shits if I hadn't set my bow down in the snow. I'm sure there are lots of folks have had similar incidents, but this one left a bad taste, as this is the only elk I have killed with a bow.Mark A liberal is someone who feels a great debt to his fellow man, which he proposes to pay off with your money. Gordon Liddy | |||
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If he has been hunting as long as he says he has, then at best this is plain stupidity. I hunt the border between two states all the time and always make sure to have tags in both states. If nothing else, you can legally hunt in both, even if the weapon changes, as it is in my case. Kansas is rifle season and Nebraska is ML season. He also should have never left the bull untagged, period. If he had tagged the bull, he might have had a defense, which brings me to my second point...if he had a lawyer, the lawyer was stupid as well. Never plead guilty to anything you didn't do wrong, especially if your entire reputation relies on it. At least give the judge a chance to hear your full side. It is also interesting that a guy who has a tag line like, "Kill a wolf! Save 100 elk!" from Wyoming brings up an ethics issue. Isn't it illegal to kill wolves in Wyoming? Larry "Peace is that brief glorious moment in history, when everybody stands around reloading" -- Thomas Jefferson | |||
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If I hunt along a border which I have, I sure won't buy a tag for both states, doesn't make sense. It is pretty unusual for the season to coincide to start with. Game officers can be pretty unreasonable as well. I had an experience once with one from Iowa, as we hunted a farm that bordered ours and was about 1/3 in Iowa, 2/3 in Mo., but to haul out a deer, you had to drive in through Iowa. My son shot one, tagged it immediately, we left our rifles with the deer, drove around the road opened the gate, and drove in and loaded the deer. When we pulled out flashing lights pulled us over, gave us the third degree about where we shot it which was 1/2 mile from the line, and since it was dark when we loaded it they sure as hell knew how far down in the open cornfield we were as they sat and watched us drive up from the fenceline of our own farm. They even questioned whether I knew where the line was until I showed them a survey marker at the edge of the road that marked the line and the altitude. Fortunately as I was right next to our own farm I was way more intimately familiar with the area than they were, so they made no attempt to write us a ticket. It was a very unimpressive first meeting with a game officer for a 12-year old (my son who shot the buck) who was left with a bad feeling that we were treated like we were fools, when we went by the letter of the law. I wouldn't bet my life that the game officers that wrote the ticket to this guy would have even known within a quarter of a mile where the line was if some self righteous soul hadn't marked it on his GPS for them. By the way if he'd shot a Mo. deer and was from Iowa, they get fined $150, the NR tag costs $125, you figure that out. A shot not taken is always a miss | |||
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jstevens is almost right. A MO non-res permit for Iowa residents is $170, so the fine is really less than the tag. They charge some folks more just because they don't like the fees for the state you live in. I know, KS residents get the same treatment, and I hunt MO as well. I have also found that the Wildlife folks do patrol the borders more than usual because of guys thinking the borders don't matter. MO found over 200 guys last year that said they were residents of MO that were really Iowa residents, so they are very sensitive to it. Big fines for those idiots. Computers are catching up with the Wildlife folks and if there is a chance there will be hunting in both states, get the tags. I know I am getting tired of the Iowa idiots in the area I hunt just coming down and "road hunting" and then taking off back to Iowa. I hunt north of Bethany and it is a real problem, so those wardens have their hands full. Larry "Peace is that brief glorious moment in history, when everybody stands around reloading" -- Thomas Jefferson | |||
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I agree 100% with this statement. He would have probalby got to go home with the elk and no fines... He got what he diserved. | |||
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Larry Where do you hunt north of Bethany? Our farm is between Allendale and Hatfield, Mo. That's 20 miles north of Bethany. A shot not taken is always a miss | |||
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Just like most hunters, this guy put very little thought into his hunt. What do you expect would happen if you hunt right along the state line? And with a bow, the critter is going to run off even with a good shot...the size of the bull and the greed of this individual to take the bull probably clouded his judgement. I have read all the bitching and moaning going on here...the guy got what he deserved for doing a stupid thing...no different that shooting an animal on one private ranch, then having it go to the next one. Instead of trying to contact someone with the fish and game in MT and ID to tell them what happened, he tries to cover up his mistake with poor judgement. No different than trespassing on another's property to pick up an animal you shot someplace else. There are a lot of things this guy could have done right and he didn't do any of them. He should have went to find a game warden right away. I don't feel sorry for him. Folks like this claim to be "professional hunters". Too bad they don't act like them. His sob story is a bunch of bull shit if you ask me. MG | |||
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I don't know about that. We just let Fifty Cent into our country for crimes worse than Berry's. Depends on your name, I guess. | |||
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DUMB, DUMB, DUMB! To compare the retrieval of a wounded animal from another state to tresspassing is just ridiculous. Public land is just that...PUBLIC! Assuming you have cell phone service in an area or a sat phone in a scenario like this, calling the local G&F dept. might not have been a bad idea as a way to avoid any problems but it is a sad state when this becomes necessary. For example, I shot a Bison in Custer State Park and drove through Wind Cave with a load of meat and hide...should I have been worried about PROVING I didn't poach it from a National Park? Of course not. Further, people drive through states hauling game that wasn't shot there all the time, what the hell difference does it make if the animal runs wounded or is being dragged rather than driven across the same state line? NONE! Any game warden in the area is going to know how nearby the border is and, frankly, the burden of proof is on THEM to show that you screwed up, not the hunter to PROVE that he shot the game in the legal state. There are, however, a few morals to this story...and yes Mr. Berry forgot all of them. 1) DON'T act guilty if you have no reason to be. Assuming a legal shot in the state where you are holding a license, tag the beast where he falls regardless of state and drag him out. If you run into a game warden, calmly explain the situation and invite him to camp for dinner. 99 times out of 100, that would be the end of the situation. 2) NEVER sign a damn thing...especially something like a "consent to search" form. They are your rights, KEEP THEM! 3) NEVER plead to something you didn't do out of some misplaced sense of guilt. JMHO, John | |||
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I'm certainly not going to try to pass judgement on a situation where I was not present. On the other hand, the following does occur to me: from the description of the violator, it appears that he has hunted that area multiple times - at least he sounds very familar with the area, access and where to hunt. Any hunt, but in particular an elk hunt with a bow, involves the chance of the animal going some distance before it expires after a (hopefully) lethal shot. Surely, this can't have escaped the hunter in question. If that was the case, what was his plan, with 33 years of hunting experience, for dealing with the option of his quarry taking off in the wrong direction?? When you choose to hunt right on a border, and there may be good reasons to do so, surely you have to figure you might end up with a dead animal on the wrong side sooner or later. Then what?? Chance it, or have a plan?? - mike ********************* The rifle is a noble weapon... It entices its bearer into primeval forests, into mountains and deserts untenanted by man. - Horace Kephart | |||
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You must be careful any time you cross state lines with game, and I would NEVER enter into a refuge with meat or hide in the back of my truck. If you are pulled over, you have to prove that you legally took the animal, and the wardens are often not that forgiving. To be honest, I get nervous crossing state lines with processed venision. I have heard some real horror stories about the Iowa DNR. | |||
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jstevens, My B-I-L has a farm just north and east of Bethany in Cainsville. Close to the Ridgeway locker. Going up this weekend to see if we can find some does. All we saw during regular season was spikes and 6pt bucks. I shot the smallest legal 7pt possible. One side, 4 points 1-1.5"each. It was the only deer shot between 3 of us. Didn't even see a doe. Did see a couple that were shot, not legal and left lay. Poachers galore. Larry "Peace is that brief glorious moment in history, when everybody stands around reloading" -- Thomas Jefferson | |||
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larrys There are always plenty of those. We've been a little lucky in that an out of state landowner purchased 5500 acres of land next to us to hunt on, so it is pretty much a sanctuary. An adjoining neighbor is a hunting buddy of mine and has 1000 acres adjoining his that begins at a dead end road that he has a gate across, so access is really been limited and it will grow some big bucks, some of which will end up on our place. It is a bit backwards, but the land being closed off from all but trophy hunting, as well as being impossible to road hunt will improve quality in the whole area, as we won't shoot any that aren't in the 145-150 range, at least not intentionally. It's not always possible to size up a whitetail properly. A shot not taken is always a miss | |||
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FWIW Dept. A long time Game Warden read this and commented; The "I shot it legally, but it ran to where it was illegal" stories are a dime a dozen. I personally think that big game outfitting/guiding and production of hunting videos has reached such a point that abuses are common. It boils down to MONEY. And Money turns into greed all to often. Shoot the biggest and the best and You get paid the most. Been hunting a long time and in those years one sees a few true trophy animals. Makes you wonder how people can come up with those trophy animals (legally) on a weekly basis. FN in MT 'I'm tryin' to think, but nothin' happens"! Curly Howard Definitive Stooge | |||
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He can say all he wants, but it is illegal everywhere I know of to take an animal and then buy the license. Thats what sealed the deal. IMO | |||
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That IS what sealed the deal but not because the action was itself illegal. If his story is true (a big "if") then it seems all he did wrong was fail to tag the animal with his MT permit. Buying the Idaho tag just made him LOOK more guilty given that he hadn't. Now, if he'd tagged the bull and bought the license from Idaho, a simple statement like "Yes Officer, we saw a damn nice bull run toward Idaho yesterday and thought we'd go after him tomorrow...wanna stay legal after all!" may have meant an end to the whole debacle. JMHO, John | |||
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Sorry Glen, you plead guilty on all counts. I don't want to hear your sob story about how you're now not guilty. The "I received a harsher punishment because of who I am" rings hollow with me as well. Grow a pair and deal with the situation you put yourself into. ______________________________ "Truth is the daughter of time." Francis Bacon | |||
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Great point! There is no other reasoning behind consistent success on trophy animals, I don't care how good of a hunter a person is, to do it year in and year out is more than luck and skill! | |||
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I watched this subject with interest on another site where someone claiming to be the game warden purported to tell "the rest of the story". Whether that person's account was true or not, I remain dumfounded my Mr. Berry's story. As a practical matter, in 99% of the cases I've been involved in (I'm a prosecutor), folks simply don't plead guilty to multiple charges without some compelling reason to do so. Typically, 1 or more of the counts is dismissed in exchange for a guilty plea in a multi count indictment. In my experience, the only time folks ever plead guilty as charged to a multi-count indictment is if it's in exchange for a promise not to add new charges, or perhaps, certain sentencing recommendations. From the sound of it, it doesn't appear Mr. Berry got much of a break at sentencing. I wasn't there and don't know what happened. I do know that it would be really xtraordinary for someone to be required to plead guilty to multiple counts if the facts were as simple as they have been portrayed by Mr. Berry. This is particularly the case where a defendant has so much to loose--like his ability to hunt in a big part of the country. Everyone I know (myself included) has made stupid mistakes at one point or another in their life. I personally have alot of respect for folks who admits their mistakes, come clean on what really happended, and move forward accepting the consequences. Has that happened here? | |||
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I would disagree with you JohnTheGreek. This guy had no legal means to pursue and retrieve his elk in Idaho with a MT tag. The guy knew this, and this is why he went and bought an Idaho license. If he went into Idaho and tagged the elk with the Montana license, essentially he has voided his Montana tag and in the eyes of the wardens in Idaho, this guy still has no legal way to possess the elk. Does a Colorado elk license give a guy the right to possess an elk in New Mexico? HECK NO!! Same thing applys for private land. Just because you shot an deer on one ranch, and it runs on to the other, if you don't have a legal means to be on the other person's place (and shooting something just to have it cross on to another's ranch isn't justification) you can't legally retrieve your animal without trespassing. If this guy would have tried to contact someone from the F&G, it would be different. Heck, he had the time to go to town to cover up his mistake by purchasing another license, I'm sure the license agent had a phone and the number of the local warden?? He chose not to do things the right way, and I would be pretty sure this guy would then try to fill his MT tag again, since it was not used in the first place! Elkaddiction is right...if this was such a simple mistake, why did this guy go to such great lengths to cover it up and why did he plead guilty if he was not in the wrong?? The guy got what he deserved...when money is involved with wildlife, whether it be outfitters, professional hunters, or film makers like this guy, bending the rules is an every day occurance. MG | |||
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Mauser, I believe that when one applies for the gun permit for hunting purposes (in either direction, U.S./Can.) something like a DUI will get you denied let alone a game violation conviction. DB | |||
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I am also from Idaho and agree with popenmann. The Idaho Fish and Game is greedy and interested in money rather than management. Barry may or may not have been in the wrong but the IFG just saw his incident as a source of income, not justice. | |||
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Gosh, then it looks like I am in deep shit! I have a freezer full of meat in Utah that was taken in another state. Is Utah going to bust me for poaching? HECK NO! Again, assuming his version of the story, I will say that there was NOTHING even tangentially resembling trespassing here...he was on public land for Christ's sake. I would also argue that he not only had the right to pursue a wounded animal (and retrieve a dead one) on public land regardless of state but AN OBLIGATION. If he hadn't acted guilty I doubt very much local game wardens would have cited him. Even if they had, why not have the guts to stand by your principles and NOT waste that wounded animal. I would bet dollars to doughnuts that even if he were cited by some over-zealous F&G officer, a couple of letters and phone calls to a reasonable superior would have ended the conflict. JMHO, John | |||
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John, Berry knew exactly where he was, knew the possibilities and yet chose to try a cover up. He got caught. Assuming that tags were available in both states, for those respective areas, he couldn't just buy both tags and be safe all the way around, film and enjoy his hunt? Couldn't afford it? He got nailed and he deserved it. "Over-zealous wardens and calls to their superiors", my ass and what a crock. Dollars to doughnuts, I hope you like doughnuts. "OBLIGATION", you say? Yeah, it's obligatory to break the law when it's convenient, right? Gotta get that elk. After all - it's on PUBLIC PROPERTY. Yeah. The wardens did their job and they did a good job. Hunting on borders (States, GMU's and Private Property) has attachments and you better well know where your feet are. AKKT. To ignore that invites just what happened here and it all could have been prevented by simply buying both States' permits. Berry's cheap ass stupidity was amply rewarded. No sympathy here. DB | |||
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Dungbeetle, Have you even read this thread? Yes, he knew where he was but, if his story is correct, there was NOTHING that needed covering up in the first place. Yes, he should have bought both tags to avoid the possible "appearance" of a violation but I don't see the necessity of it so one can retrieve wounded or down game that is legally taken in one state and runs to another. It is quite possible that Berry is only truly guilty of trying to look more innocent than he was. As for an "obligation" to find the wounded animal...YES there IS such a thing regardless of state borders. If I legally shoot an animal in one state and it runs into another, I don't give a shit about silly legal wranglings, I am going to retrieve that animal and not waste it. It's not about ego, it's about responsibility! I also find it very likely that a game warden would cite you for "wonton destruction of wildlife" if you DIDN'T do everything possible to retrieve a wounded animal. JMHO, John | |||
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Good one John. That's rich. I think most lawbreakers do this, no? Prior to their convictions, anyhow. Your last sentence? Does "everything possible" include breaking the Law? Yeah, damn the torpedos. Let's agree to disagree on this one.  DB | |||
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