I often wonder how much all the gizmos and gadgets really help folks who never quite learn the craft of riflery, but who are always up to the minute when it comes to the latest super magnum, the highest powered scope, or some obscure loading die maker's latest offering.

I know folks who have over 1500 dollars invested in reloading equipment, but who understand little about what makes for an accurate load. They obsess over insignificant intricacies, always believing that "this helps, and if it doesn't, it sure can't hurt."

I know folks with twenty-five hundred dollar rifles who understand little about trajectory, and environmental effects on POI.

I know at least one fellow who owns a nine hundred dollar American made scope, but he can't tell you what "minute of angle" means.

Many are victims of shrewd marketing campaigns by vendors who sell their wares at extremely inflated prices. They seek that last tiny bit of an accuracy edge. Be it overpriced rifles, or overpriced optics, or overpriced loading dies and accessories, none of these things would seem to give the customer a leg up if he doesn't first learn the basics of the craft.

I began thinking along this line when I took to the field with a 1912 Swedish Mauser (M96, Carl Gustav). It really wasn't as hard to hit MOA sized targets at long range as I had though, and the rifle even handled well enough for some fairly tough off hand shots. The M96 is a joy to shoot, and extremely accurate. MOA is the rule with the correct load, even using the rifle's iron sights...

I just wonder... Much in the same way technology has robbed many of us of basic math skills (calculators), I believe that we may be moving too far toward that end with regard to riflery. Just zap the target with a laser range finder, adjust the scope to hit that target, and fire.

But much like the mathematically inept when the calculator batteries die, the technology dependent rifleman will be hard pressed to hold his own in the field if he too often avails himself of gadgetry.

A rifle and a rifleman that will shoot MOA will serve well for all practical purposes of riflery. This is the goal I have set for myself--to become less and less dependent on the gadgets voted "most likely to fail in the field."

Dan Newberry
green 788

Nothing....not all the gizmos in the world...takes the place of PRACTICE. Set a row of clay pigeons up against a dirt bank, back off a hundred yards, and keep practicing until you can hit them consistently with iron sights. You'd be surprised how satisfying it is to know that YOU did it - not the gizmos.

I know a guy who learned to shoot a M-1 in the Korean war, he has the same Remington semi-auto 30-06 that hes had for over 35 years and never uses anything more than factory ammo.

Ive seen him pull off some shots that leave me dumbfounded and it never takes him more than one, hes a deadeye with that rifle! Knowing your weapon is irreplacable.

Does it really matter? Different people enjoy different things. It seems to me that shooters and hunters should especially appreciate that point and celebrate it.

The fact that many people buy expensive gizmos -- in whatever field, whether it be shooting, archery, photography, golf, or whatever -- that they cannot really understand or adequately utilize nevertheless means that the manufacturers and suppliers of those gizmos are thereby enabled to stay in business and keep making those things. If not for that, they wouldn't be available for that smaller number of people who can really appreciate, understand, and fully use those creations.

I follow you but I don't think a M96 is a good place to start. I would feel better with a rifle with a better trigger, stock and sights. So I guess that's my minumum gizzmo level.

I bring so much junk with me that I have a canvas bag full of it. There is a multi tool, camera, rule book, matches, compass, gps, FSR radios and more. I keep looking in catalogs too for more gizzmos.

Don, I can't speak for all M96's, but my two have extremely good triggers. No creep, and let off at 3 to 4 pounds.

I have an Oberndorf M38 (German made Swedish military rifle) which could use some trigger work.

I'm not advocating that folks revert to 100 year old rifles (though the Swede Mausers can hold their own against any current production rifle). I just believe it's easy to get sucked into the technology vortex and end up with a bunch of expensive toys that you can't shoot without.

From laser rangefinders to lighted reticles to digital wind meters et al, anything battery powered would be on my list of items likely to fail.

Now I will admit that my laser rangefinder has taught me a lot about estimating range, and I'm grateful for that. But anytime I use it to range a target in the field, I first estimate the range in my head, and then see how close I am. You do get better and better. Learing the subtension of your riflescope's thin duplex is a good secondary range estimating tool, provided you know the approximate size of your target.

I'm like you, I do take modern technology to the field with me. (Wouldn't it be foolish to leave behind a cell phone if you have one?) But as I said, I'm working on becoming less reliant on such things...

Dan

I did not know how happy I was but now I am as I don't have a rangefinder nor even a scope on by side hammer muzzleloader!

One of my friends that came up to the camp buys a lot of stuff. He has ESP hearing aids (to protect hearing), scents, fancy Gore Tex clothing, gps, fsr's and what not. He got a deer however!

We do this for fun so if some guy wants to hunt with a M96 I really don't get worked up over it as it's better than black powder.

After buying guns for 34 plus years I really try and limit myself to stuff that works.But I do like new stuff that works I love my laser range finder. Mil dot scopes ect. But there is lots of junk one can buy allso.

I'm not much of a "gizmo guy". I like good quality stuff that works.

Feel like I'm past that stage of my life, have nearly all the gear and guns I need, just need more time to use them.

Did the reloading thing for a few years, understand the concept and agree that you can get more accurate ammo, but don't feel the need for it. If I do my job, I can shoot 1/2" 100 yard groups off the bench with factory ammo. Don't need any better than that. That reloading stuff is now all boxed away in the closet.

I shoot good quality guns with good optics, trigger jobs, glass bedded, etc. I own good quality clothing, binos & misc. gear and that stuff lasts a long time if you take care of it.

A couple gadgets I wouldn't mind owning include a laser range finder and a GPS, however every time I consider taking the plunge I think ... That's just one more piece of gear I don't want to be toting around.

Most of my expenditures these days go towards hunting trips, licenses and such.

My bowhunting partner made a telling remark to me one day. He asked, "How can you stand shooting an outdated, out classed, underpowered recurve yet be so meticulous and anlyitical about your riflery?" I told him he simply wouldn't understand. Why? Because he himself is a gadget guru. His bows and rifles all have to be the biggest, baddest, fastest thing out there. And he will use every trick, technique, and gizmo to eek every last drop of "performance" from his equipment even to the point of jeprodizing reliability. I tease him regularly about not being able to maintain a zero (with either a rifle or compound) for more than 24hrs! Truth be told-- he freely admits that pushing the envelope is what he enjoys in his equipment. I guess this works for him-- he has a trophy room to prove it. However, I would rather enjoy the equipment and my practice time than 'enjoy' it's upkeep and frustration. And I have a trophy room to prove that as well. In the end, to each his own; but whatever you do, do it well!

[ 11-29-2002, 06:09: Message edited by: waldog ]

I'm definately not a gizmo type, I am a rifleman and a hunter..

I do use good equipment however...I like small scopes, blue and wood rifles of which I have the right ones for the job, but I don't use range finders, attached rifle rests on my gun, funny lighted scopes or busy reticles, huge varibles on hunting rifles, etc...I like to keep everything, including my hunting gear, as light as possible, Knives, binocs, everything, as simple as possible...

In my shop I make most of my stock making tools out of old screwdrivers and files...

I have enough nostalgia in me to save me from the gadget world...up to a point.

Never been a gadget guy,
Probably just the opposite, The one gadget I would like is a good range finder.
Hell you can find me in november chasing elk wearing old drab clothes that look like hell but get the job done. and if the snow aint to deep I will even wear a pair of tennis shoes, (much quieter)
the one place I wont skimp is my rifle and ammo.
I do reload my own ammo, I just don't trust factory ammo.

Michael,

I reload too. Mainly because I can get the best accuracy from my own loads.

I have a modest press, and the necessary equipment needed to create good, accurate handloads. My fanciest reloading gizmo is a concentricity gauge, which I believe is much more important than a chronograph when it comes to building accurate ammo. Chronographs provide interesting information, but the final proof of a load must always be the downrange results.

I'm not into the "Rube Goldberg" progressive loading presses, automatic metering scales, etc. I believe that some folks have passed the point where reloading is a means to an end. It's more like the laborious process for these folks is shooting up the ammo so that they can hurry back home and use their elaborate reloading set-ups! Their fancy presses and expensive dies are the focus; their guns have become live round dischargers.

Dan

Gizmos and gadgets are great in there place but nothing makes up for trigger time,practice practice practice.I find myself useing a lot of stuff for finetuning & settup but for hunting use very little exept long range(>600yards)=CJ

I'll have to reflect on my post somewhat, One mans Gizmo is another mans junk or something on that order...So, I supose we should define what a gizmo is or is not. Now that ought to complicate this thread....

I'm grateful for every gizmo on the market because many of them such as smokeless powder, sling swivels, and the scope sight passed from Gizmo status to regular hunt'en stuff, a trend we should preserve for the future generation.....

I, however, will continue to let those brave souls who chose to walk where no man has walked before and who cherish this sort of stuff continue to do so and I will take the iceing and let them keep the cake.

Uh, yes? - Dan

Ray makes -- in a much more eloquent way -- the point(s) I was trying to make.

I like the traditions of different hunts. In the process of building a kentucky long rifle that I think would be just 'fun' to hunt with. Also take out my iron sighted M71 Winchester to the northern woods of WI most years for a good-old deer HUNT. Having said that, I also like accurate rifles, so I enjoy shooting a few bolt guns with custom barrels and triggers that just plain shoot. I lean towards smaller variable scopes (1.75-6 B&L Balvar being my favorite).

I don't think I'm too taken by 'gizmos', as I don't own bipods, rangefinders, lighted reticles, etc..., but I do carry a small pair of binoculars.

Still enjoy hunting with a newly acquired 'toy' though, and lately it has been a bolt gun of some sort, the last being a Win 70 in 308 with a 4X Nikon Monarch.

Always seem to be playing with a new rifle or two, but I guess I don't consider them gizmos, as you can't gun hunt without them!

Dan N.

I confess, I recently became a chrony gizmo guy, I would reccomend it. You may find that some of your pet loads have some unbelievable deviation, I sure did! Its made me give the extreme extruded type powders more consideration as I saw the most deviation in previously loded cases that may have been exposed to some temps that effected them. Im also using the loads with the least deviation as a basis for further development.

Hoping to give it a go again tomorrow, the last time out I had a ball and Ive since got more powder and primers to play with..

I use a laser rangefinder-I guess you could call that a gizmo.When hunting with something along the lines of my 45/70,it's a handy tool to be able to tell if the deer is 100 or 150 yards away.The difference could mean either a perfect heart shot or a complete miss.

I have now taken to carrying a camera with me hunting,simply because I like in-the-field game photos.Can't really call that a gizmo though as folks have been packing camera with them hunting for as long as cameras have been around.

Other than that,I guess I'm "gizmo free".I mostly hunt with single shot rifles and small scopes.That's just what I like the most.I also hunt with bolt action rifles,though nothing considered whizz-bang by todays standards.

Brian.

I guess I could be called the gizmo KING. Whatever increases my odds, I'm a sucker for it. For practice I enjoy shooting kill zone size steel plates at long range mostly, nothin like it.

My reloading I take seriously, as I do load development also. That said, it is merely a means to an end that could be avoided. I wish someone would load for me, after I've done the development that is. Could I get that to go please.

Rangefinders, wow have they taught me range estemation, don't think nothin else would have, matter of fact I know nothing else would.

Fast guns and highpower lighted optics, yeh I'm in. Best quality gear, that too...hate to buy twice.

Learning the LR game taught me the most. Drop charts, wind, temp, angles etc. Pretty much my cup of tea now. More challenging I guess is part of it.

Any kind of huntin though, I'm in, lets go. See ya.

No gizmo fan here. Some of the items that don't register on my gotta-have meter: rangefinder, stainless steel barrels, non-wood stocks, ATV, bipod, in-line muzzleloader, lighted reticles, ghillie suits, shooting sticks, animal scent, scent-block material.......

I've reloaded for more than forty years. Love the process of putting together and hunting with a load, but don't give a rats-ass for "working up a load". I find a max load in my old books, not the new PC reduced load books, take off about 10%, fire one, look at the primer, back off a little if the primer is flattened, and call it good if the next one looks right.

To me the fun of reloading is that it relaxes me, gets my mind off work, stress, problems, etc. My intent isn't ten shots in the same hole, it's one shot quick kills.

Gizmo Guru in the reloading room.
Have most of the trendy reloading goodies, runout gage, bullet comparator, Wilson case trimmer, Redding dies, OAL gage etc. The only gizmo I don't use is the Sinclair neck turning tool. Either I am doing it wrong or the tool is a big POS. I am inclined to believe the latter while my wonderful wife says it is "pilot error".

I have a chronograph which I consider a necessity rather than a gizmo. Saves me lots of time and money during load development.

Out in the field I am decidedly low tech. No GPS, fancy clothes or any of that kind of stuff. Just a pair of old binoculars and some munchies and water in the backpack as well as some last resort survival gear(such as a revolver and a few speedloaders).

My rifle is decidedly low tech. I gave it a trigger job, bedding job and free-float, a sling and nifty flip-up scope covers. No fancy custom stuff. If it is not broke, I won't fix it.

Practice is pretty strange, multiple golf balls at various distances. Tie a string around a potato let it swing back and forth and try to hit it, up to 100 yards now(started at 25yds). Sometimes I'll trudge up and down the deep dark canyons around here and see if I can hit a golf ball on the first try, offhand, while being all wiped out on adrenalin. Don't always succeed, but I keep trying. I practice with the same load I hunt with. Got 600 bullets really cheap at a "going out of business sale".
Gizmos are nice, but practice, practice and more practice makes a better shooter.
I guess that out in the field I am a rifleman.

ZM

I don't think the problem here is the gizmos or how much our buddies spend on their equipment. The propblem is judgements on their abilities relative to the equipment they have. Sounds very self serving to me. If your ego needs to denigrade someone else for what they use in the field, I think you need to look closer to home for the answers to the problem.

I have a good friend whom I hunt with every year. He has become not only unhappy with all the gadgets and he has very few. This year he left his model 70 with the 6X Leupold MX8 at home and took a 94 winchester on our November hunt in Idaho. He was the first to take a deer, a 4X4 at approx 175 yards. The rest of us were thrilled for him.

Chic,
Would really like a hunt like that with my M94 in .38/55 but about 75 yds. closer. It's the eyes you know! Sounds like fun again.

Matt Salm got my attention, I have this picture of slipping around in a nice calm snowy day in Wisconsinm, with an iron sighted Win. 71 in its 348 caliber chucked full of 250 gr. handloads, with not a breath of air blowing...Jeeeez that sounds fantastic...

Gotta have a red checkered wool coat and cap with snow flakes sprinkled on the sleeves and top of the cap...Lord I hate this computer, it has nothing to offer....I can't get that picture out of my mind...

Ray,
You must have been watching my friend Earl hunt with his 94. He wears a black and red wool cap with a bill and ear flaps. And most times he still uses a very heavy wool checked hunting coat. Wool pants and Sorrel packs. The guy can build a fire in the blink of an eye and spent some time last summer learning how to create a fire with a bow and a stick spun onto a block of wood. Hard to find a better guy to go into the back country with.

Well I'm cheap so I have very little gizzmo's. I hunted deer this year with my M94 30-30 and the firing pin snapped in 2 after shooting a deer. I had to go grab my "newer" 30-06 with scope because of old tech left me picking parts off the snowy ground.

I have a GPS which I use hunting, flying, canoeing, etc.

I just started reloading and bought Lee equipment.

I bought a magnum but bought the tried and true 300 Win Mag.

Each his own but experence counts more than toys.

I don't have any gadgets, beyond a lighted reticle on one of my scopes...and I never have hunted with it. I just use it for play after dark.

But honestly I think I could live comfortably in either the gizmo world or the non-gizmo world.

The most FUN hunts I've made for deer have been hunts when I had nothing but a rifle, not even a scope. A sling was my luxury item and the rifle was a little .357 mag. It makes you HUNT.

But I think I could enjoy some gizmo's too. The danger with gizmos IMHO is shooters will start letting the gadgets do the thinking and they will forget the plain old marksmanship that a hunter needs ultimately regardless of the gadgets.

Anyway, I won't throw rocks at either crowd. Whatever works for you; go for it.