Hot core... The almighty is only watching from above now, and not responding. You see, we are but just a mere flock to this great man, he has stated this has been known this for sometime. Perhaps the 6 or 7 people (who "know who they are") that he would share his campfire with, will now lead the flock for him, answering any questions we sadly do not have the opportunity to ask him.

huntsonora,

Sometimes when a guy doesn't know what to say, he just doesn't say anything. I just sent a "Get Well" card to a young Lt. who was all busted up when his convoy came under attack. He's a home town boy I watched grow up and I'm hoping he can walk, run, love, etc...again but with 2 shattered legs, feet, and a busted hip it doesn't look too promising. I have a son in Bagdad. He requested reasignment from a cushy job in San Antonio to a job at Ft. Bragg that he knew meant a sure trip to Iraq. Yeah, Pat Tillman a hero but so are the other 2 just mentioned along with many, many others.

Rich ELliott

Rich,
My prayers and utmost respect are with your son and the young man you mentioned. I don't know Huntsonora but I get the feeling he was voicing frustration over an event that touched him deeply. We all have our nerves pretty close to the skin over what a despicable enemy has forced upon this country. Pat Tillman's death put a public face on the sacrifice all of our troops are making. As you said, sometimes when someone doesn't know what to say they don;t say anything. On the flip side sometimes when someone doesn't know exactly how to express their emotions what comes out can be taken the wrong way. I really belive Huntsonora's heart was in the right place.

Jeff

Skibum,

Yeah, me too!

Rich Elliott

Hey smallfry, Apparently you hit it square in the X-ring. Looks like some huntsonora buddies have kinda joined in, but still no answers to what I thought were fairly simple questions.

I'm really not being judgmental since I've not followed any of those folks posts well enough to know what is going on. So, I'll try this:

If anyone out there can tell me what elevated Mr.Tillman's death to a "Hero" Status level I'd sure be interested.

Did he save a bunch of the good guys before he was killed? Did he put himself in harms way intentionally to defend a position? Did he single handedly provide the opportunity for a bunch of the bad guys to become "martyrs" that the Ultra-Liberal Radical-Left seems to think is a bad thing? What made him a Hero?

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Just for everyone's information, getting wounded or killed in battle does not automatically bestow "Hero Status" on that person. The words courage, daring, self-sacrafice, integrity, knowledge, decisiveness, initiative, bearing, endurance, unselfishness, loyalty and honor are often used in a true Hero's Award Ceremony.

The people that attempted to overthrow the hijackers in the airplane which was headed for the White House realized the graveness of the situation due to cellphone conversations with the outside world. Some of them mustered up their courage, balanced self-sacrafice against the known eventual outcome, made a very decisive decision, took the initiative, and with daring and great honor defeated the "enemy's plan". Those that were involved in the actual attempt at recovering the controls from the hijackers are indeed Heros in the true sense of the word. The people who sat terrified and just rode the plane in is indeed a sad loss, but that does not make them Heros.

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I saw a small bit of the news this morning and without listening to the "Media Skewed Spin", it looked like the MARINES finally got around to making a good many martyrs.

HooRahh!!! and Semper Fi to those MARINES!

Each man is a hero and oracle to somebody. --Emerson


I had previously stated that I felt that my opinions and viewpoints were quite different than that of the majority on this website and stated that my previous post would be my last. It was not a knock on any one person or a group of individuals but rather a difference of opinion between what I feel is the majority and I.

I had an email saying that there were questions being asked of me so I am now back to answer these questions and move on. I hope that I cover them all as I am 99.9% positive this will be my last post.

Here is one definition of the word hero that I have found
Hero

\He"ro\, n.; pl. Heroes. [F. h['e]ros, L. heros, Gr. ?.] 1. (Myth.) An illustrious man, supposed to be exalted, after death, to a place among the gods; a demigod, as Hercules.

2. A man of distinguished valor or enterprise in danger, or fortitude in suffering; a prominent or central personage in any remarkable action or event; hence, a great or illustrious person.

I would also like to share my original post on this subject
"His death is no more saddening than the other soldiers that have died over there but having seen him play and watched him walk away from millions to fight for the freedoms that many take for granted sure makes this hit home. Pat Tillman is a true American hero and he will be sorely missed. My hats off to him and my prayers are with his family and the families of all our soldiers tonight and throughout the war."

I think that I clearly stated that his life was no more or less important than any of the other soldiers that have died during this war. Pat Tillman was an "adopted son" of an entire state, he was an inspiration to an entire country because of the the manner in which he enlisted. He definitely inspired me by walking away from millions of dollars and a rather plush lifestyle to defend my freedom. I don�t think that there is any question that he enlisted for all of the right reasons. I don�t want anybody to think that I am implying that other soldiers did not enlist for the right reasons. This soldier rates no higher than any of the other soldiers but being a public figure I think that Pat Tillman was a public link to all of the soldiers in our Armed Forces so to speak. Somebody wrote in a previous post that there are many nameless and faceless soldiers dying every day that do not get recognized and in Pat Tillmans death I feel that these soldiers are now getting some recognition because Americans that did not have a direct link to the war now feel as if they have lost a friend. I think that Pat Tillman has done as much in death as he had done on the battleground by raising the awareness of the dangers our soldiers face everyday. I feel that we as Americans sometimes don�t understand these dangers because we have been so fortunate to live here and not have to worry about imminent threats to our homeland. I feel that we are sometime numb to what is going on overseas and to see men and women lay their lives on the line to prevent another 9/11 is inspiring to me.

A few questions were asked so I will answer and step down off my soapbox.

1. What exactly elevated him to hero status? I really don't know because I don't follow the news all that much.
I feel that this was answered in another post so I will paraphrase; "The words courage, daring, self-sacrifice, integrity, knowledge, decisiveness, initiative, bearing, endurance, unselfishness, loyalty and honor are often used in a true Hero's Award Ceremony. I think that Pat Tillman exemplifies all of these traits.

2. What has you so tied to this particular fellow? Is he a relative?
No, he is not a relative or somebody I knew but he will be somebody I admire forever along with each and every person that has died fighting for America.

3. Have you been in the Military? (I'll guess no.)
Your guess was correct; I have never been in the military. I do come from a military family though and regret not having served my country as my family has. I have a brother-in-law that is a Ranger and has spent a lot of time in Iraq, my sister is a 2nd LT in the Army, I have cousins that are serving in the Air Force and my Grandfather was a West Point Grad that served in Korea and later was an operative for the CIA in Southeast Asia in the 60's and 70's.

There you have it; I apologize for not being prompt.

My disgust was not with any one person but I see how many responses other threads that were really unimportant in the whole scheme of things were getting and I could not and still cannot understand why the same people could not say a few words of encouragement for our military and pay tribute to a true role model for Americans. WOW, could it be true, an athlete that is a true role model? Interesting! I am also amazed at how many people said that this was out of place in a hunting forum. I have always had great conversations around the campfire on hunting trips about subjects such as this and I don�t think that this subject would be out of place on any kind of forum. I was also amazed at how many people just king of shrugged his death off as just another casualty of war. I may have taken those responses out of context but this is how I read them. That is the saddest thing yet and is one of the reasons I don�t think I will be back.

I hope that this answers all questions, there were a lot and I tried to cover them all. If anybody would like to discuss this further with me please feel free to email me at huntsonora@sbcglobal.net or call me at (806)543-1890.

Drummond Lindsey

Hey huntsonora, Thank you for the response.

First off, I'd like to encourage you to remain posting right here at AR. When we don't agree with people is when we all have a chance to learn.

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I felt that my opinions and viewpoints were quite different than that of the majority on this website and stated that my previous post would be my last. It was not a knock on any one person or a group of individuals but rather a difference of opinion between what I feel is the majority and I.

...I hope that I cover them all as I am 99.9% positive this will be my last post.

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If that ran me off, I'd be gone after a couple of posts. It is easy to get caught up in a heated exchange, but nothing really good comes from it.

When I see a difference of opinion from my own, I try my best to remember that person possibly has some experience about that subject that I don't have. If I can learn from him by a simple exchange of words, good for me. As the discussion progresses, perhaps I can see where the other person is correct, or wrong. Then he has an opportunity to learn from my experience.

But, shutting off communication does no good for either side.

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Pat Tillman is a true American hero and he will be sorely missed. Pat Tillman was an "adopted son" of an entire state,...

1. What exactly elevated him to hero status? I really don't know because I don't follow the news all that much.
I feel that this was answered in another post so I will paraphrase; "The words courage, daring, self-sacrifice, integrity, knowledge, decisiveness, initiative, bearing, endurance, unselfishness, loyalty and honor are often used in a true Hero's Award Ceremony. I think that Pat Tillman exemplifies all of these traits.

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I didn't know Pat Tillman when he played sports. Don't even know what sport he played in. If you are refering to him as a "Sports Hero", then I can understand your post.

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2. What has you so tied to this particular fellow? Is he a relative?
No, he is not a relative or somebody I knew but he will be somebody I admire forever...

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I also have some "Personal Heros", people that made a positive difference in my life. I aspire to pass along some of their wisdom and give them due credit.

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3. Have you been in the Military? (I'll guess no.)
Your guess was correct; I have never been in the military.

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Nothing wrong with that.(I'll stop there, cause additional comments from me could be easily misunderstood.) It did help clarify your position in my mind.

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My disgust was not with any one person but I see how many responses other threads that were really unimportant in the whole scheme of things...

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I believe those thoughts are what got under most folks skin. I personally come here to relax, learn something, share some experience and perhaps trade a few nonmalicious barbs with people I like. Occasionally I get in a heated discussion and regret doing it each time.

Because the topics are "unimportant in the whole scheme of things" is what makes it relaxing for me.

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I have always had great conversations around the campfire on hunting trips about subjects such as this and I don’t think that this subject would be out of place on any kind of forum.

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I agree and see similar Threads concerning people passing on each Board from time to time.

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I am also amazed at how many people said that this was out of place in a hunting forum.

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I didn't look at the first Thread on Pat Tillman, cause I had no knowledge of his name. So, I can't comment on anything said in that Thread.

I did look at the "Sad Day" thread and did not appreciate the "Sermon". I don't come here to be preached to by anyone. But, I'm also guilty of doing it myself as are many others. Due to that, I can understand when people get repulsed by it.

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I was also amazed at how many people just kind of shrugged his death off as just another casualty of war. I may have taken those responses out of context but this is how I read them. That is the saddest thing yet and is one of the reasons I don’t think I will be back.

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As I look back at this issue, I'll say his death is sad, simply because he died in the service of his country. I feel the same sympathy for any of our military who gave a little of their blood or gave it all.

But I've still not seen anything that elevates Pat Tillman to Hero Status "in my eyes". That in no way implies he should not be a Sports Hero in your eyes - I just don't know him. I don't remember his name as a sports figure, but may have watched him play and derived pleasure from his ability. Just don't know.

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I'd still encourage you to reconsider your decision to leave AR. If you go, that is one less person I have the opportunity to learn from. And with a bit of luck, maybe I can get on a Thread and be able to share some experience with you.

Best of luck to you!