quote:

Originally posted by help:
DC Roxby

Please explain this https://forums.accuratereloading.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/...=821109059#821109059 I can see you are real ethical!!! Shooting at running elk WTF is that… Then you just assume you missed without looking for blood, and then shoot a cow… then another bull while you still didn’t know for sure if you hit the other bull on your first shot.

DUDE you give SLOB hunter’s new meaning!!!!

I would rather have JWP shooting at an elk at a 1000 yards that has no clue that he is there than have you spraying lead around at 100 yards at running animals. Your are a nut job.

Oh My!!! Just read that thread--that one HAS TO HURT!! OUCH!!!!!!

congratulations on the beautiful elk, truly a trophy.

also, thanks for confirming my belief that SMKs are not for hunting.

The sad part is Roxby… thinks that kind of crap is ethical!!!! But an elk or deer shot standing or grazing at 6,7,8,9, or 1000 yards is not. A true long-range hunter won’t shoot unless everything’s prefect.

To bad the average hunter can’t understand that….

Hey, where did all of he self-righteous, "ethical" hunters go??

whitworth, not to get into a urination competition, but folks are entitled to their opinion; no one here should expect to change anyone's mind, but everyone, from you and jwp to rox etc., has the right to ahve and express opinion, even if someone thinks them wrong.

quote:

Originally posted by DC Roxby:
To each his own but I would be well and truly ashamed of any animal shot at 1/2 a mile. The animals deserve better. Just because you CAN shoot an animal at a thousand yards does not make it ethical or sporting in my book.

Somehow the idea of hauling a 12lb rifle around with the intent of sniping elk at 1000 yards with garbage bullets just doesn't do much for me I'm afraid. I like to actually hunt.

Deserves better!!!! Would that include shooting at one and before you can confirm if it was hit or not by looking for blood you run up and shoot a couple of more???

I guess you aren’t ashamed for doing that so you must be proud of that fact. It’s no wonder you like a light rifle, easy to handle you can get a lot of rounds into a heard that way. Some things got to fall down sooner or later.

quote:

Originally posted by tasunkawitko:
also, thanks for confirming my belief that SMKs are not for hunting.

That WAS sarcasm wasn't it? I've seen all types of 'hunting' bullets ruin more meat than that and also disintegrate.

If it wasn't sarcasm, please let me know what a 'hunting' bullet is supposed to do to an elk at 150yds from a rifle with around 5000 pounds energy at the muzzle!

AJ

quote:

Originally posted by tasunkawitko:
whitworth, not to get into a urination competition, but folks are entitled to their opinion; no one here should expect to change anyone's mind, but everyone, from you and jwp to rox etc., has the right to ahve and express opinion, even if someone thinks them wrong.

Yes indeed, but soon after jwp posted, the "ethical ones" (for lack of better term) jumped all over him and started a pissing contest. Now that they have been piled on, I am wondering where they went.

I'm not one to start crap over here, but it pisses me off when folks feel the compulsion to judge. And that, is my opinion, take it or leave it.

quote:

Originally posted by Kamo Gari:
DC, I am with you on your sentiment. Funny, but I've never seen anyone, ever, post about the animals that were 'missed', or worse, badly wounded and unrecovered at half a mile. Does that never happen, or is it that when these long/silly range target shooters miss/wound, they have nothing to show, so don't mention it? I think everyone knows the answer. How many misses/wounded animals are there for every success? Come on, long range shooters: how about an answer. How many animals have you missed for every one you've connected on? Wounded and not recovered?

The shooting skill to make a shot at those distances is very impressive, no doubt. Shooting at a game critter, though? Too much can go wrong IMO, and as important, to me, sitting half a mile away and shooting just isn't what I consider hunting; it's sniping/target shooting. If your percentages are less than maybe 85%, I think you should reevaluate. But then, I'm not silly enough to think I'm going to change anyone's that does this kind of thing. For me I guess the bottom line is as has already been said: the critters deserve better.

KG

I'll start. I've shot several animals at long range. I missed one shot at an elk (because I misread my drop chart), it didn't move and I corrected that on the next shot. The other animals where all 1 shot 1 kill. The most movement I've had after the shot was a Muley that went about 40yds before dropping.

I believe animals shot at long range move less and are EASIER to find because they are undisturbed when they are shot (instead of being spooked and then shot) and because I am ALWAYS in a position to keep them in my vision after the shot (due to the terrain I use), this will enable me to take followup shots if they are ever required. My approach to long range hunting is similar to all of the other long range hunters I know personally.

As far as the likelihood of wounding or not finding an animal; I'd put my rifle shot from a bipod at 700yds up against 99% of hunters 75yd offhand shot (mine included). Considering I only shoot at animals that are not moving and others (DC Roxy for example) take shots at running animals, I feel it is significantly less likely that I would injure an animal than the average hunter that shoots once or twice a year getting ready for hunting season; then flings lead at animals as they run by.

I watched a 4x4 bull elk being shot by a group of hunters this year. They fired 7 shots at it offhand and then had to track it into the black timber.

I've helped at my local rifle range (I'm a range safety officer) several times during 'rifle sight-in days' over the last few years, so I know what the average 'rifleman' is capable of!


AJ

quote:

Originally posted by DC Roxby:
I have no doubt that I could become proficient at that distance if I set my mind to it. I have no desire to hunt that way. I've hunted for 30 years and quit counting big game taken at 50-something. I have never lost an animal in that time. I have managed that record because I limit my shots to reasonable ranges and make every attempt to close on the animals I hunt. Old fashioned ideas I know.

There are so many things about this new trend that make me ill I don't know where to start. For every person who diligently practices at 1000 yards there are 10 yahoos blasting away at long range with no idea where their bullet is going to impact. I've seen enough elk left with jaws ands legs shot off to last me a lifetime.
.

It would be a good idea if you just try to master shooting at close range first!!! Shooting off hand at a RUNNING animal is a very low percentage shot IMO the animal deserves so much better. Just curious as how did you know if you didn’t gut shoot that animal? A gut shot elk with full adrenaline is going to show little to no sign of being hit.

I’m sure there is many things about long range hunting that would make you ill first of all it takes patient’s discipline, and commitment, and you would have to spend an untold amount of time shooting.

What happened to DC Roxby???

quote:

I'm not one to start crap over here, but it pisses me off when folks feel the compulsion to judge.

is that not a judgement in itself that you feel a compulsion to share?

tasunkawitko, weak very weak

quote:

Originally posted by help:
DC Roxby

Please explain this https://forums.accuratereloading.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/...=821109059#821109059 I can see you are real ethical!!! Shooting at running elk WTF is that… Then you just assume you missed without looking for blood, and then shoot a cow… then another bull while you still didn’t know for sure if you hit the other bull on your first shot.

DUDE you give SLOB hunter’s new meaning!!!!

I would rather have JWP shooting at an elk at a 1000 yards that has no clue that he is there than have you spraying lead around at 100 yards at running animals. Your are a nut job.

I would hardly call one shot at 60 yards "spraying lead". After the shot I watched the bull I shot at run and join the herd that I killed the two elk from. I got a very good look at him for nearly a minute and he was clearly unhurt, and in fact actually chased a cow at one point.

Having said that, I am going to apologize to jwp475 now. When I made my original posts I was having a shitty day and posted some inappropriate comments. I do feel strongly about long range shooting, but I should have
posted my comments somewhere else, if at all. I had no right to start a pissing match on his post. Fact is he shot his bull at the same range I shot mine.

My posts were uncalled for and I apologize.

well, I saw the post on another site and decided to lend my support to the JWP team here. I am sure that hunters have made the same arguement against long range shots when: rifles were invented; percussion caps; metalic cartidges; smokeless powder; and most definately optical sights! It is newer technology, better marksmanship, and still a very dead animal who never knew what hit him (which is probably the most humane thing that could have happened!).

I hate to see people take shots that they shouldn't take. Dedicated Long rangers don't go out to wound an animal, they do what they can to take the game in one shot and only one shot at distance.


an earlier poster stated that it was unethical to take a shot unless they were 85% sure that the shot would be good. I happen to agree with the idea. Well, I trust that JWP could put about 85% of his rounds on target at that range if not more. Hey, who wants to walk 1000 yards in the wilderness only to follow a blood trail for a long ways? ---> I'm going to call not it for that!

Ethics of hunting??? I mean my god man... how about tricking a bull into thinking it was going to get lucky with a cow only to have an arrow stuck in it's chest ... LOL!

well, that's just my $0.02

quote:

... how about tricking a bull into thinking it was going to get lucky with a cow only to have an arrow stuck in it's chest ... LOL!

Britz, I didn't know you had such a good sense of humor.

I agree, is more humane when the animal never knew what happened!