I love the old 375 H&H and wouldn't be without one but it is neither fish nor fowl..Its argueably too small for Buffalo and too big for plainsgame in one school, and it is the answer to all things holy in the other school..

As for me, I'll never decide that one and if I do I will change back and fourth as sure as the weather does. Today I'll take a 338 and a 40 caliber combo...

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Ray Atkinson

ray@atkinsonhunting.com
atkinsonhunting.com

According to JBM ballistic calculator, a 300 gr matchking started at 2500fps would retain over 1500 fps and 1500 ft lbs of energy at 1000 yards. That sounds to me like a heavy tactical rifle.

The 375 cannot compete in that arena.

I own a .338 WinMag, but not a .375 H&H. A friend of mine near Harlowton, Montana has a .375 H&H that he used to kill a pissed-off, runnin through fences, runnin for miles Bison. Used 3 rounds for a mobility kill and finished the job with a .41 Mag between the runnin lights. MM

I don' think there will be too many people on these forums ever shoot enough big game to show up any real difference by the time differenct components are factored in, shot placement etc.

However, I think the 338 is an "easier" way to go and the 375 is a "nicer" way to go.

Mike

In other words, there are very few animals on earth we are likely to hunt that the .338 will not handle with ease. Of the few animals left over, they tend to be nasty and good insurance is to use as much gun as you can competently handle.

Steve

quote:

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Originally posted by Zero Drift:
With a .338 and a .416, nothing on this planet scares me other than my mother-in-law.

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You are scared of her even with a .416?? I am almost scared to ask but how big and dangerous is she?

BB

If you like "nice" things then the 375 is better.

If you like "easy" things then the 338 is better.

Mike

The 338 is "easier" but the 375 is not difficult.

I think you just mentioned the 375

Mike

quote:

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Originally posted by MontanaMarine:
I own a .338 WinMag, but not a .375 H&H. A friend of mine near Harlowton, Montana has a .375 H&H that he used to kill a pissed-off, runnin through fences, runnin for miles Bison. Used 3 rounds for a mobility kill and finished the job with a .41 Mag between the runnin lights. MM

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Do you think the .338 WM would have performed differently under the exact same conditions with the exact same bullet placement?

Anecdotes such as this lend no credibility whatsoever to cartridge justification.

~Holmes

quote:

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Originally posted by John S:
But when all you have is a 375 you are never perfectly armed for anything, IMO.

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Alternatively, when all you have is a .375 you are not imperfectly armed for anything.

~Holmes

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knowledge is power and you never have enough knowledge

Now, the advantage of the .375 over the .338 is when bullets heavier than 300 grains are used. The 300-grain Woodleigh bullets for the .338 are the upper limit for it, while there are some heavier than 300-grain bullets for the .375 H&H. Another difference with some gun users is that since .375 rifles are heavier than .338 rifles, it seems that the .338's recoil may be more difficult to tolerate.

I have communicated with two hunters that were using both the .338 WM and .375 H&H to kill a brown bear. Both shot the bear with their guns, but the bear ran into the brush. After some tracking, they finally saw the bear when it charged. They started firing their guns again, and finally the bear dropped dead in front of them. These guys now don't want to use their rifles to hunt bears with. They now want "at least a .416."

Is it possible that reason why the bear didn't drop at the beginning, was because they missed the vitals? A good shot through the heart/lungs from a .30-06 and a 220-grain bullet may have done the job, but since I was not there shooting I can't tell what happened.

Larry Kaniut's "Some Bears Kill" has a great number of stories about human/bear confrontations, and you will notice that those bears killed where the ones that were hit in the right spot. Some of the guns used were quite small, while the rest started with the .30-06. One of the stories relates to a hunter near Anchorage, who stepped too close to three bears that were feeding on a moose carcass.

The bears charged, and he fired his .338 five times with 250-grain NOS bullets. According to the story, he fired his gun, reloaded another round, and then fired one more time-all within five seconds. He reloaded his rifle to use the fifth bullet to finish the last bear that was still alive. I bet this guy would have accomplished the same with a .375 H&H. The difference here was the guy behind the gun.

One thing for sure: Both the .338 WM and the .375 H&H offer great penetration. Both can get the bullet where it needs to be to kill any North American game. I have only retrieved one bullet from the last seven moose I have killed with my .338. I have used from 230-grain to 250-grain bullets, and all but one have zipped right through. The moose I killed this year was 250-yards out, and the 250-grainer went right through the lungs, leaving a moose dead almost on the spot. I have broken both shoulder bones on moose with one 230-grain FS bullet. Could a .375 H&H do that? You bet it could. Both benefit from a great bullet selection.

[This message has been edited by Ray, Alaska (edited 12-17-2001).]

Other then that, I can't see any advantage to the 338 over the 375. I happen to be a wee bit eccentric, so I have a 35 whelen ackley, but for all but dangerous game, I'd take any of the 3 knowing that for all intents and purposes their performance would be indesitnguishable.

For dangerous game, I'd always take the 375, but be happier with a 416, or bigger

I guess the question is, do you like a Chevy, or do you like a Bentley?

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Gerard Schultz
GS Custom Bullets

I can't pass judgement on either as I have never tried them.Elmer Keith,who killed more game than most of us here (in North America at least),loved the 338 Winchester Magnum (he designed it)and 375 H&H (which he prodded Winchester into making in the M70),but if push came to shove,for North American and African game,Elmer would always say go with the 338.Of course Elmer suggested not using the 375 for cape buffalo,and restricting it to plains game only,which is a good theory that still stands today.In that case the 338 has the upper hand with a flatter trajectory and a bit less recoil.

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I'm out to wrong rights,depress the opressed,and generaly make an ass of myself!

It starts where the 375 leaves off, and, with a lighter, cast bullet, LBT, might really punch a serious hole at long range, on any planes game animal.

I'm really attracted to the 400 grain vs. 300 grain bullet weight difference, and the much higher velocity out of the Rigby.

Not to mention the acolades of all who have taken DG with it.

What I can't figure out is why more people don't use it for everything. With a lighter, maybe 270 or 300 grain bullet, it's very flat, high velocity, with good bullet weight, and would be ideal for long shots on relatively larger game, like elk, and bear.
I also like the more then 3 rounds in the magazine, since, if you found yourself being charged by a lion, buffalo, or elephant, sometimes it takes at least 5 rounds to turn em...

Let's see.
Muzzle break, pad, mercury in stock, and a nice, heavy, glass bedded stock should do the trick, for the 416.

Now, all I have to do is pull the trigger, and not flinch...

gs

Regards PC

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MED

The sole purpose of a rifle is to please its owner

quote:

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Originally posted by Brian M:
Alaska's first Master Guide (can't remember his name),called the 338 Winchester Magnum "Heap of smoke and no fire".

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Hal Waugh was his name, he packed a 375 Whby Mag.

I don't see much of a difference, having owned several 338 mags, and one 375 Whby mag, with not having shot any animals with them.

Try this comparison, a 340 Whby mag and a 375-338 mag... ~~~Suluuq

My load is 250 gr speer, 77.5gr of Imr 4350 at 2780fps. '43 M98 with 24" barrel. Good for 1 inch at 100 meters if I do my part.

Back on the subject I would take the 375 over the 338

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I got my Ruger 77RS (not MkII) 338 Winmag about 7 years ago (LOVE it!), and have a 375 H&H Encore barrel on the way. If I'd have gotten the 375 first, I probably would have never needed (or bought) a 338. So, I'd say get the 338 first, so you have something to look forward to in the 375! Can't speak for the 375 (yet), but the 338 is a fine cartridge.

Bill

I was just looking at some people who say the 338 shoots flatter, may be it does.I think not a whole lot,a GSCustom bullet,265 grain HV has a BC of .580.And if load to 2900fps,which I have been told will even do more,sighted in at 3 inchs+ at a 100 yards, will be -2.5 at 300yards, ME 3,484. And will only be -13.7 at 400 yards and have a ME of 3,082.That is great I think as most hunters including myself would have a hard time making good hits at that range in the field.Thanks,Kev

For example, a Hornady 270-grain SP-HM for the .375 H&H develops somewhere around 2,870 fps. As you may know, Hornady and Federal have achieved such velocities by using special blends of powders. With most "factory" ammo for the .375 H&H sighted from +2.0" to +3" at 100 yards, only the PMC 270-grain X hits -23.4" at 400 yards. This load sighted +2.0" at 100 yards hits -8.2" at 300 yards. The rest of factory ammo bullets hit from -23" to -42" depending on the ammo and bullet weight. The lightest .375 factory load I can think of is the 235-grain Kynoch with a SP bullet. This one is a little mild (2,800 fps at the muzzle), and the heaviest I can see in the ballistics tables I use end at 300 grains. Some of the heavy weights in solid form drop to -43" at 400 yards.

You can experiment with reloading data using a ballistics computer program to get a pretty good answer. It would be very difficult to safely handload a 265-grain bullet for the .375 H&H (and even the .338 WM) to hit the -2.5" mark at 300 yards. To accomplish such a task, you would have to sight the rifle much higher than +3" at 100 yards. Such a handload would be a "dream come true" to 1,000-yard shooters. Something like -20 to -30" at 400 yards from hunting bullets is more like it if you can keep the weight under 300 grains.

However, there is nothing wrong with those numbers, because within 300 yards ( a good hunting range) you can drop a moose with one shot with either the .338 WM or the .375 H&H. The difference between the two is not great enough to argue about. Now, one of the .416's talked above would make a BIG difference.