The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Hunting American Big Game Hunting TSX Bullet Failure?Go | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
| TSX Bullet Failure? | Login/Join |
One of Us |
.300 WSM 165gr Fed Prem Barnes TSX After shooting a Bull Nilgai, I recovered almost all of my bullets, none exited. There was one that I noticed, had all of it's petals broken off. The remaining bullets that we recovered had perfectly intact petals peeled back & nearly full weight retention. Is this considered Bullet Failure? "A Lone Hunter is the Best Hunter..." | ||
|
| One of Us |
Nope. You shot the animal and the bullets killed said animal. The bullet did what was expected. In my mind that does not constitute bullet failure. | |||
|
| one of us |
Failure, I would say no. And I am not an X bullet freek. But... Any time the wife or I have used an X bullet it has performed great. DOUBLE RIFLE SHOOTERS SOCIETY | |||
|
One of Us |
I am an "X" bullet freak, and while I normally prefer to have an exit wound, in case the critter don't decide to die on the spot, but in my opinion your bullets did just exactly what they were designed to do. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
|
| one of us |
There have been several studies on this exact phenomenon. A vast majority of the Barnes X and TSX bullets that have their petals broken off have slowed down within the animal, and reversed their orientation. It performed perfectly, and as it slowed it then turned and acted like a parachute. The petals then folded back on themselves and broke off. The animal still died. This is seen most often in light for caliber rounds that do not exit. | |||
|
One of Us |
animal is dead, right? | |||
|
| One of Us |
Tried to tell you.........  We Band of Bubbas N.R.A Life Member TDR Cummins Power All The Way Certified member of the Whompers Club | |||
|
One of Us |
Nilgai are tough and tenacious animals. It can and many times does, require a lot of killing. I'd say the bullets worked. Sometimes OTC cartridges aren't loaded to our expectations, and a few are medium loads. But if you had full mushrooming, I'd say they are fine. Congrats on your blue bull! Gray Ghost Hunting Safaris http://grayghostsafaris.com Phone: 615-860-4333 Email: hunts@grayghostsafaris.com NRA Benefactor DSC Professional Member SCI Member RMEF Life Member NWTF Guardian Life Sponsor NAHC Life Member Rowland Ward - SCI Scorer Took the wife the Eastern Cape for her first hunt: http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6881000262 Hunting in the Stormberg, Winterberg and Hankey Mountains of the Eastern Cape 2018 http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/4801073142 Hunting the Eastern Cape, RSA May 22nd - June 15th 2007 http://forums.accuratereloadin...=810104007#810104007 16 Days in Zimbabwe: Leopard, plains game, fowl and more: http://forums.accuratereloadin...=212108409#212108409 Natal: Rhino, Croc, Nyala, Bushbuck and more http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6341092311 Recent hunt in the Eastern Cape, August 2010: Pics added http://forums.accuratereloadin...261039941#9261039941 10 days in the Stormberg Mountains http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/7781081322 Back in the Stormberg Mountains with friends: May-June 2017 http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6001078232 "Peace is that brief glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading" - Thomas Jefferson Every morning the Zebra wakes up knowing it must outrun the fastest Lion if it wants to stay alive. Every morning the Lion wakes up knowing it must outrun the slowest Zebra or it will starve. It makes no difference if you are a Zebra or a Lion; when the Sun comes up in Africa, you must wake up running...... "If you're being chased by a Lion, you don't have to be faster than the Lion, you just have to be faster than the person next to you." | |||
|
| One of Us |
Interesting.... hadnt thought of that before!! I would suggest that it is unusual for them to loose their petals!! A day spent in the bush is a day added to your life Hunt Australia - Website Hunt Australia - Facebook Hunt Australia - TV | |||
|
| Moderator |
You don't say where your bullets struck the nilgai, shot presentation, distance, or bullet velocity. In my opinion, examples of bullet failures include: 1) not making it to the target (e.g., blowing up a few feet from the muzzle due to improper construction); 2) blowing up on impact with the animal (again, due to improper construction for the task); 3) not making it into the vitals (due to fragmentation or over-expansion); 4) failure to expand, if a 'soft-point' improper construction). The rest of what is referred to as bullet failure is due to either mis-application of the bullet (match or varmint bullet instead of big game bullet, or 'deer' bullets on elk), poor shot selection (stem-to-stern shot at 400yds. instead of a broadside shot at 200yds.), driving a bullet too fast or too slowly for its design (e.g., .308/165gr. Ballistic Tips at 1600fps or 3600fps), or incorrect assumptions by the shooter (expecting every bullet to penetrate both sides of every animal. I used a .375H&H with 300gr. Swift A-Frames on my nilgai, and punched a hole through both sides of it. The animal ran 50yds. and keeled over. George  | |||
|
one of us |
What George said  Bullet failure would be if a bullet fragments and fails to penetrate to the vitals or one that fails to expand. If you kill an animal with a C&C bullet and you find the core separated from the jacket in the vitals is that bullet failure? Is the animal dead? Did the bullet penetrate into the vitals? All we can expect from a bullet is accuracy and consistency. After that it's up to us. Have gun- Will travel The value of a trophy is computed directly in terms of personal investment in its acquisition. Robert Ruark | |||
|
| one of us |
Nope! And I'm not a Barnes user either. Bear in Fairbanks Unless you're the lead dog, the scenery never changes. I never thought that I'd live to see a President worse than Jimmy Carter. Well, I have. Gun control means using two hands. | |||
|
| One of Us |
They failed big time.Just send what you have left to me so I can dispose them in the proper manner!!!!  | |||
|
| One of Us |
Usually a recovered TSX, on the few occasions they are recovered, will have most or all its petals. This is normal. However, sometimes one will be recovered minus any petals. This is because the impact velocity was over 3000 fps or it hit a large bone. What kind of penetration did you get? 168s out of my .30-06 have given 32"+ of penetration. It's rare that one is recovered except on a very large animal or a stem to stern shot. LWD | |||
|
One of Us |
You don't get many exit wounds on Nilgai with their tough rubbery skin, I don't care what you shoot. | |||
|
| One of Us |
You will usually see some sort of deformation out of every kind of bullet when it hits the bones of a mature nilgai. I have seen every bullet under the sun "fail" on nilgai if that is the definition used of "failure". That said we still push the TSX as the best all around bullet for them. Perry | |||
|
| One of Us |
Food for thought: In his excellent book, Rifles for Africa, author Gregor Woods cites the following study results on pp. 121-122: Dr. Ed Ashby, ret US PUblic Health Service doc, in conjunction with Dr. john hilliard, began a 5 year study in 1994 with barnes x bullets. Test group 1: Impala shot with 22 hornet and 22-250 using 45 gr x bullets Findings: 22 hornet at 2442 mv exited 100% of the time while 22-250 mv 3571 hardly ever did. approx number of test tagrgets: 100+ Test group 2: animals between impala and those in the kudu/zebra/wildebeest weight class using 30 06. Findings: best penetration and weight retention when mv approx 2484 while 2792 fps mv resulted in less pentration. Test group 3: kudu/zebra/wildebeest 375 H&H 270 gr barnes x bullet Findings: optimal mv 2400 resulting in petals peeling back to 90 degrees from bullet shank rather than peeling further back to form mushroom which must push rather than slice to do internal damage. certainly an interesting bit of reading and clearly from the perspective of lower velocity vs high velocity. YMMV | |||
|
| one of us |
Bullet "failure" in monometal bullets is more typicaly associated with the occasional failure to open at all. A monometal that loses its petals probably produces greater trauma to vital organs than one which retains its petals in the classic "magazine ad" form. | |||
|
| One of Us |
I was just curious, interesting results. The TSX bullet did kill the animal, but not as quickly & cleanly as I'd expected it to. Of all the TSX bullets I've ever recovered, I just have never seen one w/ it's petals broken off. However, this bull is the largest animal I've shot w/ the TSX & it was the shot through it's pelvis region that was totally destroyed into a boney splintered mess. In conclusion, the TSX did NOT fail; I was curious if it was normal for the petals to break off after expansion. "A Lone Hunter is the Best Hunter..." | |||
|
| one of us |
How many 30 caliber bullets did you have to pump into that critter until he gave up the ghost? I think, like GeorgeS, a bigger caliber would be prudent for that large and tough game animal. | |||
|
| One of Us |
I agree a bigger caliber is preferred, as well as a more precise shot. My Shot was far from perfect; it was from a 15' tower blind on a hill, to my far right & at a moving target. My rifle/scope combo was set up for long range big game, zero'd at 50 & 200, 1" high @ 100. The first shot @ 90yds was only 1/2" too high in relation to the spine; if I had hit that, I think it would have been a one shot - DRT. I'm not satisified w/ this performance, mostly on my part & will do better next time. "A Lone Hunter is the Best Hunter..." | |||
|
| One of Us |
J, Don't pay no 'tention to that chevy luver. He ain't never kilt nothin anyway. Just likes to come on here and run his mouth. I can't wait to meet his zr2 with my 5.9CUMMINS. Your shot placement was fine considering the circumstances. We Band of Bubbas N.R.A Life Member TDR Cummins Power All The Way Certified member of the Whompers Club | |||
|
one of us |
Sounds like they worked great. -------------------- THANOS WAS RIGHT! | |||
|
| One of Us |
I had two fail last night. We shot two does, both heart/lung and when we got up to them neither had been field dressed. That TSX is supposed to do it all...what a bunch of crap. Perry | |||
|
| one of us |
Stonecreek hit the nail on the head. Others may have seen them not open up but I have never had the Barnes fail to open and do their thing. Good shooting. phurley | |||
|
One of Us |
I have shot a bunch of big game animals with my .300 WSM shooting 180 grain TTSX. The only interesting issue I have found is that on many of the animals had very minor blood loss. Even with hard hit heart/lung shots with complete pass through. It never really mattered much in the end, very little tracking needed. Internally the animals were devastated and died in 40 yards or less. They are great bullets, very accurate. They are the only bullet I load and shoot in my .300 WSM. | |||
|
| Powered by Social Strata |
 | Please Wait. Your request is being processed... |
|
Visit our on-line store for AR Memorabilia