Picked my .375HH up today from my gunsmith and he started talking about how it would be a good gun for Africa, bear in Alaska, etc. He then said he recalled an article from about 4-5yrs ago in (American Rifelemen maybe?? I might be completely wrong about the magazine he quoted)about feral bulls in southern Texas sugar cane fields that had become pests and could be hunted as varmit (w/ landowner's concent). Anyone heard or know if this is possible and if so where?

Never head of it, but sounds like a great excuse to break in your new 375

The subject has some up here from time to time but I think it dates back more than a few years.

Do a search for "feral cattle Texas" and some discussions will pop up, like this one.

Dream on.

I suppose it depends on your definition of "feral"

I'm fairly familiar with South Texas and I can say with some certainty that any feral bulls running around unbranded were made into barbacoa decades ago, landowner permission or not. That's not to say that there aren't wild cattle but mostly on big working ranches. And I never met a vaquero that was afraid of them. Respectful, maybe but not fearful.

cattle may be "wild" but not without brands, which means no no to shoot. Unless of course they are already dead... but then they get stinky stinky when they pop.

stoinski,

The feral hog problem is real here in Texas, look into that for your culling training

A while back, I was telling my Dad about the Feral Bull hunting story I read on here. He currently manages a 10,000 acre ranch in South Texas, but at one point (probably close to 30 years ago), the man he works for had bought a big ranch down around Eagle Pass. Part of the deal was they got to keep all the livestock on the place. None of the cattle had ever been worked and were basically wild. They rounded as many up as they could on horseback, but a few of them were too wild and ornery to get penned. They had several bulls charge them and even got one cowboy hurt. It wasn't anything severe...broken arm or something.

Anyway, after they had loaded up all they could, they took out and shot what they couldn't catch, and even used helicopters for some of the real tough stragglers.

Now, with that said, these days, I think you'd probably have better luck finding a chupacabra (real one, not a mangey coyote) than you would finding any hunts for feral bulls.

-Dan

I spent the winter in the hill country, near Wimberly. A "hunter" paid $1000 to kill a Watusi steer on a neiboring ranch. The guy that sold the so-called hunt told me: "The idiot even had the kill videotaped."

quote:

Originally posted by stoinski:He then said he recalled an article from about 4-5yrs ago in (American Rifelemen maybe??

I believe that was "Bulls of the Rio Bravo" by Finn Aagard. and it was several years ago.

I wrote a piece for Sporting Classics a year or so ago about hunting feral cattle in Texas and in Georgia in the 1800s. Email me and I'll shoot you a copy.

Remember reading the article. Don't recall anybody ever actually hunting any wild cattle in Texas other than the writer. Sometimes they have to come up with something new and different to write about.

John Wooters wrote an article for Petersen's Hunting about the feral bulls in Texas but that was probably 25 years ago. IIRC, he hunted them down along the Rio Grande and claimed they were quite wild. It has been a number of years ago though.

"They rounded as many up as they could on horseback, but a few of them were too wild and ornery to get penned. They had several bulls charge them and even got one cowboy hurt. It wasn't anything severe...broken arm or something."


My family is in the cattle business, and I've spent quite a lot of time working on a working ranch... not too many "feral" bulls on the ranch, but this sort of thing happens a few times a year. That's just screwing with primarily yearling steers.

In my experience, bulls are often tamer than their counterparts, unless they are bread and/or raised otherwise. I used to partake in the "wild cow milking" in a ranch rodeo in Amarillo (they have them in many ranch rodeo's). Now that's a randy way to get your heart going. That said, cowboy poker is even better. Let's just say it requires a kevlar jacket, and they don't get big bore rifles for protection.

Like I said, this particular ranch hadn't been managed in years. There were generations of animals out there that had probably never seen a person or horse. I don't know if that was the inference, but I think my Dad knows the difference between yearling steers and wild/feral cattle.

It was neither and inference nor an assumption. It also wasn't an attack of any sort. You'll notice that I never said that I doubted either you or your dad (I also never said that he didn't know the difference between a yearling steer and a feral bull).

I don't know your dad, and I don't know what he knows about cattle. I was just saying that you don't need randy bulls, or "feral" bulls for that matter, for cowboys to get hurt. Perhaps I was stating the obvious.

My apologies if it came off wrong, but no need to be defensive.

I have never heard of anyone using a helicopter as a means of putting down a few head of cattle. Especially on such a small ranch. It must have been rough country, and they must have really wanted them off the ranch (i.e. tearing down fences and breading with the ladies when they shouldn't have). Although, I still think it strange they used a helicopter (I'm assuming they didn't own their own and they didn't own their own copter fuel)... again, not doubting your story. Merely commenting that it's a strange deal.

Maybe they should have set up feral bull hunts instead of burning cash on a helicopter to take care of them. A good excuse for somebody to have fun with their brand new big bore rifle.

I saw an article recently about hunting feral cattle,but I think it was in australia, not texas

I don't recall how big this particular ranch is, but I wouldn't exactly call it small. I want to say it was in the 7-10,000 acre range. That may not be much when we're talking New Mexico or Wyoming or something, but a lot of cattle can hide on a place that size in South Texas.

The helicopter wasn't there to put the cattle down, but to locate/flush them out of the brush. The ones they couldn't round up and couldn't put down on horseback or out of trucks were the ones taken with the helicopter.

I've still never heard of anyone rounding up cattle out of brush, or otherwise, with a helicopter... tough to due with anything other than a horse in a large enough pasture in my experience, and most others. Still tough even with a 4 wheeler. I bet they were just spotting the cattle, and shooting them as you said. If you're going to spend the cash on the copter to spot them, might as well shoot them while you're there. They'll be gone by the time you get your shtuff together and get landed anyways.

10,000 acres isn't considered a large working ranch in Texas either... unless, you're talking about a game ranch (which I bet was the case. In said case, 10,000 acres is certainly a good size. East Texas and some South Texas ranches are proportionally smaller b/c they get more grass per acre than we do in North and West Texas.

This is off subject, but I don't think it's going to get much action regardless, as "feral" cattle hunts are probably few and far between in Texas, to say the least.

Maybe it's just me, but it sure seems you're calling BS on my story, so this will be my last post on the subject because I don't feel like getting in a pissing match.

First, I highly doubt my Dad was making the story up or embellishing things. He's not usually prone to such as he's been there and done that. Second, I don't recall ever saying it was a "working" ranch. I said they bought a large ranch that had cattle on it. Some of these cattle were wild or feral...whatever you want to call it. Lastly, the way things are done in the South Texas Brush Country is not the way they are done in West Texas or the Panhandle...two drastically different landscapes. Helicopters are used quite frequently back home.

I don't have a dog in this fight. However, the King Ranch does use helicopters for round-ups. They are a rather famous and very large ranch in south Texas(for those reading that may not be from Texas). Helicopters have been proven efficient, quick, and very effective for getting cattle from a large area into a more manageable zone. They are not Hueys! They are very small. Kinda like the medivac choppers seen on the intro to the popular tv series MASH.

Andy

I'm really not calling you out, as they say. I was just trying to figure out what the hell they were doing chasing cattle with a helicopter; this is foreign to me. You made some generalized claims about the size of ranches in Wyoming in proportion to the size of ranches in South Texas etc. (folks at the King ranch would be much more informed about this than I am). I just mentioned that this was not necessarily the case.

You are, however, being a bit critical of my posts. I'm fairly well aware of how things work on South Texas ranches, relatively at least. I could qualify this by citing various bits of information, but that would be ridiculous because I'm not sure my efforts would necessarily move the conversation on its way (although, I'd be happy to clarify this via PM if you feel I must, though I doubt it would change your assessment of the situation).


I'm not trying to unnecessarily perpetuate an irrelevant conversation, but when I have been accused of misinformation, I like to defend myself because so rarely do I get to converse about subject matters on this forum to which I am somewhat informed. Also, maybe I should clarify so that other forum members don't think that I've personally attacked you in any way.

Also, it's very easy to say that you are finished with a conversation, as you have, when you have just publicly called into question the accuracy of my statements. I too am bored with this thread of conversation, but I have too much pride to be accused of inaccurate statements without defending myself. Of that, I am guilty.

Again, I didn't even mention your Dad in any of the previous posts, and I certainly didn't suggest that he was prone to hyperbole or was stretching the truth in any way. It seems that maybe I've confused you into thinking I've attacked you or your father. I've never had a problem on this forum with others (at least not that I can recall), and I'd like to think that I have better manners than that in general. I wouldn't blame you for being defensive if I had said something inappropriate about your father. Please reread what I've said, and you'll see this to be the truth.

P.S. You stated that helicopters are used quite differently back home (I too live in Austin), and I assume you are regarding helicopters as used in the gathering of cattle ("feral" or otherwise). I'm sure that helicopters are indeed used differently in this part of Texas, but I do know that cattle pretty much behave very similarly in this part of Texas as they do in the Panhandle. We import cattle from this region rather frequently. In fact, it seems even more unlikely that those cattle that have become "feral" and have not had human contact, were wrangled by a helicopter.

This is not to say I doubt your father. Perhaps, I can offer a compromise of sorts. Maybe the information your father was given was slightly exaggerated, or maybe it was lost in translation (just two such possibilities that would allow both my position, and your assertion, to work).

Please do PM me if you do, in any way, feel offended or feel that I offended your father with any of my posts. I don't recall doing either, and with a quick glance over what I've written, it seems that maybe you've misconstrued some of the things I've posted.

Thank you, and I do hope this mitigates the situation somewhat.

I there was an article in (I believe) "Texas Parks and Wildlife" about wild cattle along the Rio Grande. They seemed to be loose cattle belonging to no one and wandering back and forth across the river. Just and information article warning people that they could be dangerous. It was several years ago.

maddenwh
Google helicopter service in TX and you will find out very quickly that helos are used all the time in rounding up cattle in South TX. They are used along side of the vaqueros as much as a rope is.

As for feral bulls... every ranch has a story of a particularly nasty tempered bull, usually one that is lost for a season or two and decides he likes his freedom. On a ranch were no human has been seen for years I don't doubt at all that there would be some VERY wild bulls.

P

I certainly don't doubt that there are some loose bulls roaming the area, and I know some are nasty, as you say.

I'm not sure that helicopters are used 'as frequently as ropes are by the vaqueros", but I have confirmed that they do use helicopters infrequently o the King Ranch... the problem, as I suspected, is cost. I don't, however, think they are used "all the time."

Thanks everyone for the posts. Glad to see my smithy wasn't telling a good story but there was something behind it. I tried without any luck to search the internet for Finn's Rio Bravo article as it sounds like the one being refrenced. And I agree from one of the posts that feral hogs are the more logical alternative.
Thanks again for the information and a happy (early East coast) Father's Day to the fathers on AR.

Hogs are fun, easy, cheap, and readily available... unlike "feral" bulls.

Using a helicopter is common in my country. I did it on my ranch when I bought it, because there was no other way. Sure, you could get some out with horses, but no way to clean it out without the helicopter.

You have to have cowboys on horses as well. Copter can't do it all on his own.

It is not as common as horses, but it is common.

quote:

Originally posted by Wendell Reich:
Using a helicopter is common in my country. I did it on my ranch when I bought it, because there was no other way. Sure, you could get some out with horses, but no way to clean it out without the helicopter.

You have to have cowboys on horses as well. Copter can't do it all on his own.

It is not as common as horses, but it is common.

True. No one suggested that helicopter use is as common as horses. But some people on here, like maddenwh, seem to think their experience and knowledge are the only ways things are done. Grow up.....

Finally, I've got several hundred REALLY wild Texas Longhorns (you'll get trampled if you walk out there with bag of cubes unless you're careful) and if anyone wants to try out anything from a .22 LR on up to a .700 NE on one, it can be arranged. Prices would start at about $500 for a 2 year old plus bull which would weigh probably 900 to 1100 pounds on hoof. Older bulls with wider horn spreads for the true trophy hunters would cost substantially more. Let me know before I make my annual gather and sell all my hunting stock. I'm pretty sure we can track down wounded animals, but if you shoot, you pay. Above fees include hanging bull and field dressing him. Caping, skining, and/or cutting up would be more, substantially more if the hunter doesn't want to help. A 2 yr old is not a deer, I can tell you that, don't bring a 48 qt ice chest and expect to take the meat home.

Longhorn beef is nearly as low in fat as deer but it is not noted for tenderness on the hoof, be advised that if you want anything but hamburger or roasts then we need to switch to brangus.....they cost more.

quote:

GATOGORDO-

True. No one suggested that helicopter use is as common as horses. But some people on here, like maddenwh, seem to think their experience and knowledge are the only ways things are done. Grow up.....

Wow. It's easy to get into a fight ex post facto, particularly when you aren't involved (not to say that there was any fighting going on to begin with).

I'm not going to specifically defend myself to you regarding posts made with another (at least not to Gatorgo, but I will to other forum members), but I clearly never insulted him or his father in any of my posts. I also pointed out that helicopters are sometimes used to roundup cattle on the King Ranch. I spent the majority of my time defending the attacks that were made on me during my threads. Again, please reread all of my threads.

I find it strange that you, Gatorgo, state that I should "grow up." I should be impressed because myriad brilliant folks before you have spent eons developing such original insults for the english vernacular, let alone for me...

You (Gatorgo) are also completely correct in another matter. No one ever did say that helicopters are used as common as horses. However, Perry did say, and I quote, "They (helicopters) are used along side the vaqueros as much as a rope is." You'll notice from my post that I never said anything about horses.

When you say, "some people on here, like maddenwh, seem to think that their experience and knowledge are the only way(s) things are done," to which people are you referring? I'm sorry you think so little of some of the AR posters.

Again, I never said anything about my way being the "only" way things are done, as you stated. I'll point out again that I even said that I had confirmed that helicopters are infrequently used on the King ranch. I was wrong in assuming otherwise. I don't know what else you want, and i don't know what else to do in order to keep from being attacked. Maybe you should consider contributing otherwise instead of misquoting me to others.

I challenge you to present this to moderators if you think that your efforts are so justified, Gatorgo.

You're an idiot. Present that to the moderators.

quote:

Originally posted by Gatogordo:
You're an idiot. Present that to the moderators.

Something else you said to me on this thread, "Grow up....." Although I might be an "idiot," as you say, I still know when to appreciate irony.

I never said I was going to present anything to a moderator. I just challenged you to present your case to a moderator, but I shouldn't be too surprised you've been unable to interpret my writing.

I've just briefly scanned over some of your previous posts on other topics, and clearly I'm not the first forum member that's been lucky enough to be on the receiving end of that wonderfully charming wit of yours. It seems recently you called another member's ethics and intelligence into question, and I'm sure I could find more bits of evidence for your sparkling personality if I really cared.

I think I'll be the adult and end this discussion now before you really have to start stretching your intellect in an attempt to come up with yet even more creative insults.

Please feel free to PM me with anything else you'd enjoy getting off your chest. I understand that insulting me may be a bit more rewarding when done in front of other forum members, but this is a public site.

I apologize to anyone that I've offended. I've been very careful in an attempt not to actually insult anyone. I've admitted I'm wrong on some things, and I've admitted that I am guilty of defending what I've said (more so than myself). I also apologize for inciting Gatogordo's inappropriate remark. Although he chose to print it on a public forum/thread, I'm sure it was only meant to offend me. Thanks.

quote:

Originally posted by drewhenrytnt:
I don't have a dog in this fight. However, the King Ranch does use helicopters for round-ups. They are a rather famous and very large ranch in south Texas(for those reading that may not be from Texas). Helicopters have been proven efficient, quick, and very effective for getting cattle from a large area into a more manageable zone. They are not Hueys! They are very small. Kinda like the medivac choppers seen on the intro to the popular tv series MASH.

Andy

The Santa Fe below the king Ranch uses them frequently. Best way to move a herd in a 90,000 acre pasture. Did you ever look at one of the copters real close? Frayed plug wires, no safety wire on the bolt heads, oil everywhere, goober welding here and there on the frame (prolly from chopping two to make one); I bet they hadn't been certified in a decade or two. But those guys can sure fly....

Former Governor Dolph Briscoe, largest landowner in Texas, uses helicopters extensively for round-up.

quote:

Originally posted by tiggertate:

quote:

Originally posted by drewhenrytnt:
I don't have a dog in this fight. However, the King Ranch does use helicopters for round-ups. They are a rather famous and very large ranch in south Texas(for those reading that may not be from Texas). Helicopters have been proven efficient, quick, and very effective for getting cattle from a large area into a more manageable zone. They are not Hueys! They are very small. Kinda like the medivac choppers seen on the intro to the popular tv series MASH.

Andy

The Santa Fe below the king Ranch uses them frequently. Best way to move a herd in a 90,000 acre pasture. Did you ever look at one of the copters real close? Frayed plug wires, no safety wire on the bolt heads, oil everywhere, goober welding here and there on the frame (prolly from chopping two to make one); I bet they hadn't been certified in a decade or two. But those guys can sure fly....

I beg to differ... I would bet that the most effective way to gather cattle in a 90,000 acre pasture is not a helicopter, but ten helicopters.

I suspect that for 90,000 acre pastures, helicopters are the best means for gathering cattle. The ranch that we were discussing earlier was a "10,000" acre ranch... not pasture. I'm assuming that the ranch was then broken up into even smaller pastures as most working ranches are.

This is what lead me to my initial confusion, as choppers on huge pastures make more since than choppers on smaller pastures (I guess whole ranch could have consisted of just a few large pastures).

When I suggested that choppers weren't cheap, I meant that using them couldn't be that cheap... cost of fuel, cost of pilot, etc. I imagine that many choppers in Texas are made very inexpensively.

Finally, choppers can only be used for gathering, or round-up, to a certain extent. Gathering cattle in a huge pasture with a copter is one thing, but working cattle through a fence into other pastures and on into other pastures (as is often the case on most ranches of significant size) is different. Not to mention moving them into pens and various shoots, scales, etc..

hate to interupt a good pissing match, but if you are interested in feral cattle, Phil Shoemaker did an article a while back in Successful hunter about feral cattle on some island in the Aleutian chain... he did get there by helicopter

I don't know about Texas, but here is feral cattle hunt in Hawaii. Take the wife and make a vacation out of it.

http://forums.accuratereloadin...=913104728#913104728

And if you still want stateside I am sure you can get a buzz-saw bull at the local auction for less than $1,500 and turn him out on a local ranch.

All this arguing and not a one person has asked to read my article from Sporting Classics. Or even replied, "Hey I remember reading that piece. You rock Gayne."

Yes, writers are very insecure

I hunt a 12K acre ranch outside Laredo, Texas. The ranch is broken up into two pastures 8K and 4K; they use helicopters and 4 wheelers to move cattle between pastures. Does cost more money on a per day basis but they have found it to be a wash compared to hiring a crew to perform this function (helicopter crew and 4 wheelers can perform the same function in 1/4 to 1/2 the time ). The helicopter get the cattle moving in the desired direction and can cover a lot of ground. The 4 wheelers do the herding and final chute and corral work is done from horseback.

They also use this same set up to Triple T their excess whitetail does.

Just my 2 cents.