My wife's nephew has asked me to recommend a starter rifle for his 12-year-old son for a Christmas gift. The kid is fairly big for his age and I hesitate to recommend a "youth" rifle, as he will be "fully-grow'd" in no time. Also, they don't have a lot of money, so I think they will need to be in the $350 range, including scope.

The kid hunted with me last week and shot my Ruger M-77, Mark II in .260 Remington. Though he did not get the opportunity to harvest a deer, he did exceptionally well with it at the range, and I think any deer would been in trouble. I think he could handle any caliber up to .270 Win.

So far, I've narrowed it down to the Mossberg ATR 100 (.270), Stevens Model 200 (.270 or 7-08), Marlin XL7 (.270). All three of these get good consumer reviews in terms of accuracy. There's also a few package guns by both Remington and Savage that come in at, or just a shade over $350. Of course, in any of these rifles, the scope, whether as part of a package or bought seperately, will be a "throw away" as the kid gets older and realizes that optics really do matter.

BTW, the first person that recommends a Remington 770 (the newer designation of the 710) gets drawn, quartered and publicly ostracized.

Opinions please.

I would recommend looking at the Howa line, they have proven very accurate and are not very expensive I have also had good luck with Tikka's but they cost a little more. The scopes that come on the package guns are usually only good for checking truck tires. It would be better to buy a low priced rifle and put as much money as you can into the optics. Good optics also build up confidence in young shooters.

Remington 770

Stevens 200

This gun is a top notch Savage 110 but has a flimsy cheap stock.

I reinforced the stock with Lepage Regular 60 min. epoxy:

- Cut out forestock braces then fill the entire forestock with epoxy. This adds good strength and prevents the stock from hitting the barrel.

- Fill pistol grip with sand, then spray Great Stuff foam into stock till the end. Then add anoth 1/2" layer of sand and seal off with epoxy flush with the recoil pad holes.

- Take a razor blade and trim all the sharp edges off from the mold. Take time and don't gouge.


IMO, this gun has a better finish than the Savage 110. I prefer the dull, matte finish instead of a glossy polished metal.


I do not know how accurate the XL7 is but this gun is a tack driver. Loading up Barnes 160 TSX using a 7mm Mag. and cheap Lee RGB dies, I can put 2 bullets basically into the same hole and the third 0.37" away from those.

Traded my Lee RGB dies for the Lee Deluxe yesterday and with some good RL-22 powder, wouldn't be surprised if this gun shoots 1/4 MOA.

If he hates the trigger, get this:

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=223896

I recommend the Sightron SI. This an exceptional scope:

http://theopticzone.com/detail.aspx?ID=3703

BTW, don't be afraid of the 7mm Rem. Mag for him.

I find the recoil and blast of a 30-06 or 270 to be more difficult to shoot than the 7mm Mag.

The 06 cases have a nasty "POP" to their blast and snappy kick.

The 7mm Mag. has a "BOOM" and more of a push recoil.

You can always load down. That way, he can use this rifle for years as an adult on everything he would like to hunt.

My buddy went a different way for his son and I think it makes a nice package. He bought the Howa/ Youth 2n1.
http://www.legacysports.com/products/howa/howa_youth2n1.html
Comes with two stocks. Little more than $350 but less than two rifles.

My wife uses a 7x57 for everything from varmint to elk, oryx and hog. A 7-08 would do the same.

The Stevens 200 in whatever cartridge you choose. The stock is whimpy but all seven of mine give respectable hunting accuracy right out of the box , stock et all. Being as light as they are , the .270 is a little punishing on the bench. Personally I would not rule out the .243 for southeren white tail. roger

My F-I-L came across a Mossberg 100 ATR in a .270. The trigger needed a little work, and he lapped the bore, but he fixed it himself and it turned out to be a great gun for $250. He put a Nikon prostaff scope on it for $130 and we are getting sub MOA groups at 100 yards. IMO it is great bang for the buck. Haven't had any experience with the other brands. The .270 would be a gun that he could keep in his collection even if he wants to get higher end guns in the future.

Nikon Prostaff 3-9x40 and a Stevens 200 in 270/30-06/7 Rem Mag and call it a day! Doubt you're goig to find anything cheaper then that, and that still gonna be over 350$. Any package that costs 350$ w/scope and rifle, is a package that needs to be looked past because its probably crap. Well, unless its a Handi-Rifle, don't discount those. A single shot is good for a young shooter, they're very inexpensive and very accurate. If you do your research, you MIGHT be able to get a Handi and Nikon Prostaff for roudn 350$.

Also don't rule out the Stevens 200 in 25-06, loaded with Barnes TSX bullets.

You can directly put on a 338-06 barrel to this rifle without having to change the magazine and bolt face.

25-06 would be a wonderful caliber for a youngster.

270 or 30-06 recoil is going to be quite stout without adding weight to this rifle.

Do you realy want a "Cheap" rifle or do you mean "inexpensive"?

Doc,

*%$#@^&*$% &*?^%(&^# *&^$%^&*(

So there! Consider yourself ostracized!

I've made an appointment for you at the draw-and-quarter emporium and expect you to keep it! Be there at 10:00 a.m., Thursday, and remember, there is a 24 hour cancellation policy, after which you will be charged the full price whether or not draw and quartering ever takes place.

MOSSBERG 100ATR MT.SYN. BLK. $299.00 .270 OR .308 WOOD $340.00.. shooting times gave this rifel high marks.. it shot better than the savage

The least expensive quality rifle you're likely to find is a J. C. Higgins branded Belgium made FN Mauser (Modl 50 maybe). Often in 270 Win or 30-06. (Has a left side safety.) Can sometimes be found in pawn shops or guns shops. Will take a while to find one.

Got the last one for $300 in recently refurbed shape on a Hogue stock.

GREAT rifles.

Guys I just looked at a Marlin XL7 the other day, its just a better looking gun all together than a savage of any kind. They also come in only two cartridges but good ones. I don't know how they shoot but a well put together it seems.

Stevens 200, hands down.

quote:

Originally posted by raybass:
Guys I just looked at a Marlin XL7 the other day, its just a better looking gun all together than a savage of any kind. They also come in only two cartridges but good ones. I don't know how they shoot but a well put together it seems.

+1 on the XL7....I thought....a nice looking rifle for $300 WAY better fit and finish than Stevens/Savage if it shoots as good as it looks and feels it should be a great seller.

quote:

would recommend looking at the Howa line, they have proven very accurate and are not very expensive

and the weatherby vangaard is the same rifle and might be a bit less.....good guns!

Just loan him one of your many .375s. No cost at all.

If the nephew ends up with a 270 or an '06 remember he can always start with Federal Low Recoil or Remington Managed Recoil ammo; plenty of juice without unneccessary recoil. I strongly recommend he be given a set of electronic hearing protectors to wear even while hunting. Never too early to not start losing his hearing...

GAHUNTER ; I have a suggestion do you have any pawn shops or decent Gun shops around

which may have a nice used Rifle and scope set up ?. Just an Idea .

the very first Rifle I ever bought was used it was in excellent condition I though .

Model 70 Winchester !.

A pre 64 270 in case anyone was curious and it had a Weaver K6 scope . You would cry if I told you

what it cost , that was way back then .

Still have it today as it is one of my ALL time favorites ,

Right now might be a real good time for a survey of what's become available !. BOL .

Stevens 200 in 25-06. Hands down. You can stone or file the factory trigger to acceptable field use. As he gets older, richer, more into guns and hunting, you can add barrels for 30-06, 338-06 or 35 whelen and the boy is set.

Pick up a used nikon or leupold off the classifieds here and go down the road.

I have a vanguard, it shoots great, but it's pretty heavy for a "sporter". Never seen a Marlin so can't comment on those.

get a Howa or a Weatherby you can't go wrong

quote:

Originally posted by GAHUNTER:
Doc,

*%$#@^&*$% &*?^%(&^# *&^$%^&*(

So there! Consider yourself ostracized!

I've made an appointment for you at the draw-and-quarter emporium and expect you to keep it! Be there at 10:00 a.m., Thursday, and remember, there is a 24 hour cancellation policy, after which you will be charged the full price whether or not draw and quartering ever takes place.

You know I couldn't resist!

H&R HANDI RIFLE .243 IS VERY ACCURATE PLUS YOU CAN GET MULTIPLE BARRELS EVEN SHOTGUN BARRELS FOR LESS THAN 100.OO RIFLE WAS AROUND 150.00 IN .243 LAST YEAR

Wal-Mart here puts plain Weatherby Vanguards on sale for $299 a couple of times a year. Otherwise them and academy has them for $399 everyday.

You can find the remington package rifles for around that but the scope on them is iffy at best and to be honest I haven't been impressed with what I've been seeing coming out of remington lately if your going to hunt with it stone stock.

Just my opinion.

Stevens 200, DNZ mount, Nikon Prostaff 3-9x. I'd stay away from Mossberg rifles, having heard of some issues with bolts coming apart in the 4x4 line. Marlin could be okay, but Savage has been cranking out some real decent guns for the money lately. The stock on the Stevens is shit and it isn't pretty, but it's a good, solid rifle.

Well, I think the decision has been made. Dick's Sporting Goods in Cary, North Carolina will order them a Marlin XL7 in either .270 or '06, complete with the Marlin version of the Accu-trigger, for $276. I've recommended that they purchase a Bushnell Banner Series, Dawn and Dusk scope, 3-9x40 from Dick's for $69. Not the best scope in the world, but certainly not the worst, and it comes with a lifetime warrenty. Throw in bases and rings for another 25 bucks and the whole shootin' match comes to $375 plus tax.

He can shoot reduced recoil loads up until he can handle the full power stuff.

BTW, he would have gone with the Stevens Model 200, but could not find one in Raleigh.

He made the right decision. The Marlin XL-7's stock has a better shape and finish than the Savage 110 series and it has the Marlin version of the Accu-Trigger, something that the Stevens 200 doesn't offer.

I have a Marlin XL-7 in 25-06 on order and just bought 1 for my neighbor's son in 270. I have owned several Stevens 200s and currently own 8 Savage 110 series rifles, 6 with the A/T and 2 pre-A/T, so I am not anti-Savage/Stevens, I just think that the Marlin XR-7 is a more nicely finished package than the Savage 110 series or the Stevens 200. Several wholesalers have the Marlin XL-7 priced the same as the Stevens 200, so why not go with the nicer finish and better trigger for the same $$ if a 270 or 30-06 will meet your needs?

Jeff

Old Coyote,

I only have two .375s, and I need both of them! At present, they are supporting the west wall of my gun safe. If I remove one, the whole safe will collapse!

GA I don't know what your condition is these days, but If you can why not match mom and dads money and get him a Ruger in 260? After all he is your nephew. More young hunters get turned off from hunting not so much that it take time and effort but by poor fitting and poor shooting guns that most see's fit to give to the kids. Or make a gift of the one he has been shooting, it would mean more.

quote:

Originally posted by Doc224/375:
GAHUNTER ; I have a suggestion do you have any pawn shops or decent Gun shops around

which may have a nice used Rifle and scope set up ?. Just an Idea .

the very first Rifle I ever bought was used it was in excellent condition I though .

Model 70 Winchester !.

A pre 64 270 in case anyone was curious and it had a Weaver K6 scope . You would cry if I told you

what it cost , that was way back then .

Still have it today as it is one of my ALL time favorites ,

Right now might be a real good time for a survey of what's become available !. BOL .

If a new rifle is a must then the Marlin is a good choice. If used is an option, as the quote above states there are many good rifles (Rem 700 or Win 70s) waiting to find a good home at a reasonable cost, some dare I say "cheap."

I have bought quite a few older Rem 700s and all have been decent to VERY good shooters. Just a suggestion...

John

I also like the idea of a really good gun and scope combination bought used. I've got a stainless A-Bolt in 30'06 with a Zeiss Diavari scope that I have less that $1000 in. I bought both used and they out shoot most any gun/scope combo I've ever owned... or even seen. A used Marlin with a after market replacement trigger and good used scope could be had for much less and with the new generation of ammo would be adequate for most purposes.

To be in the $350 price range including a scope, you'll need to go with something like the Stevens 200. Stevens is made by Savage and is a good gun, although very plain. They shoot great! For the money, it's hard to beat the Bushnell Banner series of scopes. I have one on my .257 Wby Mag and it is doing a great job. Should be able to get the whole package at Wal-mart for around $350. As for the caliber, I vote for the .243, but if you want a bit more gun, then my next choices would be a .25-06 or .308. Good luck.

P.S. The .30-30 is also a good deer gun for anything under 100 yds. Most deer are killed at less than 100 yds. The recoil is very mild as well.

I'd maybe look at a rifle that has an option of those Remington Lite Loads. The 270 Winchester with a 115 grain bullet. As he gets older you can go up to the full power loads.

I'd also look at a rifle that comes with a factory installed (and easily removable) rubber butt recoil pad. Take it OFF put on a thin 1/4" butt plate and feed it with those Lite Loads and you've got a short stocked "youth rifle".

When he gets bigger and progresses to the full power loads put back on the rubber butt pad and he has a full size normal length stocked rifle shooting full size loads.

One last thing! His ears are very, very sensitive to damage. Please either get him a 24" barrel or MAKE him use ear protection.

I started all three of my grown sons with Handi-Rifles in .243 once they got past the .22LR stage. I never had one anything but happy to get it. Dandy little things.

quote:

Originally posted by wymple:
I started all three of my grown sons with Handi-Rifles in .243 once they got past the .22LR stage. I never had one anything but happy to get it. Dandy little things.

+1

Terry

quote:

Originally posted by GAHUNTER:
Well, I think the decision has been made. Dick's Sporting Goods in Cary, North Carolina will order them a Marlin XL7 in either .270 or '06, complete with the Marlin version of the Accu-trigger, for $276. I've recommended that they purchase a Bushnell Banner Series, Dawn and Dusk scope, 3-9x40 from Dick's for $69. Not the best scope in the world, but certainly not the worst, and it comes with a lifetime warrenty. Throw in bases and rings for another 25 bucks and the whole shootin' match comes to $375 plus tax.

He can shoot reduced recoil loads up until he can handle the full power stuff.

BTW, he would have gone with the Stevens Model 200, but could not find one in Raleigh.

I think you/they made a good choice. I have been looking at one for my nephew, perhaps in .270. The trigger felt very good.

I'm also considering gifting him with a Remmington 700 BDL .308 that is wearing a Mountain Rifle walnut stock. It is becoming something of a safe queen, but it is a hansome rifle. I think that for $300 bucks he can beat around a Marlin until he grows to appreciate nice walnut.

I think a 270 Win would be a fine starter or the Roberts 257.

It has been a while since I have priced them but I would go with the Stevens model 200.