I have been playing with RL-17 in my 30-06 and in my 9.3x62 where it shines..

I am getting 2417 FPS average in one 9.3x62 and a bit less in another with 320 gr. Woodleighs. My book data calls for 59.5 grs. of RL-17 and velocity of 2353 FPS. I was able to go beyond that in my 24 inch 9.3x62 without pressure ( probably because it has a long throat or the book is afraid of frivoulous lawsuits?) I worked up to obvious pressure signs then cut back several grains and got 2417 FPS, considerably better than any other powder I have used..The load I settled on is fine in both of my 9.3x62s, but I suspect I get less velocity in my 20" barrel than the 24 inch barrel I chronographed..I will chronograph the 20 inch gun soon, but bet I beat 2350 with it, and thats fine for a 320 gr. soft or solid..I had to go a ways to get a ever so slightly sticky bolt, and then a light extractor mark, so I cut back several grains to the 2417 average..Using three cases I loaded those loads 6 times so far and still have tight primers and at the 6th loading I need to trim to continue.

61 grs. of RL-17 gave me a clean 2534 FPS av. with a 286 gr. Woodleigh and that was the book max and I didn't see any reason to work up a warmer load than that, its very mild in my guns, but the needed velocity is there. the 286 Nosler is listed at 61.5 grs of RL-17 for 2501. In both cases my guns took a couple of extra grs. and remained very suitable pressure wise and below their max..

I addressed the 30-06 in the "200 grs Accubond in the 30-06" thread below, and RL 17 is working wonders there also..

What I have gleaned from all this is it accomplishs it velocity due to a less bulky, perhaps slow burning powder?? and you can get more powder in the case and according to the book quotes the pressure is considerbly less with this new powder. The problem with the heavy bullets is they take up power space and previous powders took up too much room in the 9.3x62 and to a lesser degree the 30-06, at least thats my present impression and there is more work to be done....

I won't quote my loads, but that will give you an idea where to start if your interested..Cut back 5% from 59.5 or RL 15 with the 320 gr. in the 9.3x62 and work up from there.

Damn. Powder and primers are scarce up here, but I saw a pound or two of RE-17. Guess I should have picked it up. I've been using RE-15.

You keep referring to book data with RL-17. What book are you using?

Ray is probably using the website data

He is correct that RL17 is very worthwhile to work with. I currently use it

6.5 rem mag - 3175 fps with 130 gr SSII
280AI - 3030 fps with 160 gr Accubond
30-06 - 2725 fps with 200 gr Accubond
375 Ruger - 2850 fps with 270 gr TSX

In all of these I went beyond a little but had a target velocity in mind for each bullet/caliber. So when I reached that I started doing seating depth tests for lowest ES & SD. In each of these cases I have reused the cases many times and primers are tight and velocities remain very constant although I do not have as wide a range of temps as some might since I shoot mostly in Texas.

IMO it will work well and exceed your expectations in any caliber that does not have a huge powder capacity. I do not use it in my 300 win mag or my 338 RUM

Try RL17 and work with it and you will like it

I just couldn't find data on Alliant's website for that caliber. Sounds like it works well, just trying to find the data so I can see what other bullets they list.

Quickload has RL17 in the data base.

It a bit "optimistic" on MV, but it also seems a bit pessimistic on pressure.

In my VZ500 based 8X57IS W/a 23 1/2" bbl, it will = Mv of Vv N550 @ what seems to be less pressure according to primer appearance.

I'm getting 2700fps W/Speer 20gr Hotcores W/RL17.

In non-magnum cartridges, QL has RL17 at the top of the Mv range @ a given pressure.

Even in the 8X68S W/light for caliber bullets (170-180gr) is predicts RL17 as the fastest @ a given pressure. Go above 180gr & slower powders surpass it in the 8X68S.

quote:

Originally posted by scottfromdallas:
I just couldn't find data on Alliant's website for that caliber. Sounds like it works well, just trying to find the data so I can see what other bullets they list.

RL17 is very close to IMR4350

In cases where no load data is given I start at a medium load for that caliber for IMR4350 and work up carefully. Usually I have a long way to go but best be safe

I forget where, but I read a guy's post saying his experience was Rl17 was fairly susceptible to temp changes. Have you seen this?

I have also heard Ramshot Big Game is great in the 9.3 I have been dancing around the 9.3 (either x62 or x64) for a while so all this is interesting.

thanks!

quote:

Originally posted by woods:

quote:

Originally posted by scottfromdallas:
I just couldn't find data on Alliant's website for that caliber. Sounds like it works well, just trying to find the data so I can see what other bullets they list.

RL17 is very close to IMR4350

In cases where no load data is given I start at a medium load for that caliber for IMR4350 and work up carefully. Usually I have a long way to go but best be safe

W/IMR 4350 I could never get past 2600fps W/a 200gr Partition despite what noslers data says. that was W/compressed loads @ 107% usable case capacity.

With RL17 I could easily get to 2700fps W/O any pressure signs.

QL predicted 2770ish but as I said, QL is overly optimistic W/RL17.

The data I have was on AR, topic was apparantly "9.3x62, Work in Progress" Three of five pages. and it included a "UPDATED INFO-LATEST FROM WEBSITE" Its a copy of an AR post, out of New Zeland on July 2, 2008. followed by a post by Dave Bush stating NO. Forks should be a good bullet alternative on May 24th, 2013 at 23:22...

Some of you more tech minded posters may be able to pull this up?? I cannot.but I will post the RL 17 loads in the updated list...

270 Speer 66grs. RL-17 2629 FPS
286 Hornady 63.5 grs. RL-17 2525 FPS
286 Nosler 61.5 grs. RL-17 2501 FPS
286 No. Fork 61.0 grs. RL-17 2510
286 Barnes solid 59.0 grs or RL-17 2464 FPS
320 Woodleigh 59.0 grs. of RL-17 2372
325 Norma Oryx 59.5 grs of RL-17 2353 FPS

I found the above loads to be quit mild in some instances and as you can see they listed the 286 gr. Hornady at 63.5 grs. and the other at 59 to 61 grs. In my particular rifles I settled on 63.5 for all the 286 gr. loads, but that just applies to my guns, yours may not be able to do that..I was able to increas velocity by about 50 FPS (2422 FPS) with 320 gr. Woodleigh bullets, and had room to go beyond that it appeared, but I really saw no need in going beyond the magic 2400 FPS load, as that is pure buffalo medicine and only 80 grs short of bullet weight, and equal velocity to a 416, but of course .366 compared to .416 cross section of bullet still allows the .416 a commanding lead in stopping power, if your in that group of believers, and I am an advocate of cross section within reason....

In the whole extensive list of 9.3x62 loads furnished here, and the extensive list of loads including all the reloading book data from nemorous reloading books both foriegn and domestic, in Pierre van der Walts great book "African Dangerous Game Cartridges", RL-17 outshines them all by a bunch. However RL 17 did not exist at the time of Walts book was published I don't believe, as he does not include it nor did any of the reloading books of the time frame, nor do the present books list it as far as I can find out....

Bottom line is RL-17 is the best performer in the 9.3x62, and showing to be the best in the 30-06 with 200 and 220 gr. bullets, but thats another thread.

Lets give the boys at Alleint a big hand.

Has anyone tried RL17 with 250s, like the NAB, in the 9.3 x 62 ?

Thank You Ray!!!

I have one in process on a Brazilian 1908 action I got here awhile back.

You welcome Idaho Sharpshooter..

Secondtry,
I have not tried RL-17 with 250 gr. bullets but the book sez, 61 grs of Ball C 2 will give you 2620 FPS, in my rifle I only got a bit over 2500 with that load. I have read of some getting 2700 or so FPS in the 9.3x62 with 250 gr. bullets..Some powders like Somchem and Vectan tub get you up in the 2600s apparantly.

I will work up some 250 gr. loads with RL 17 one of these days soon, and see what it will do.

I've had good luck with Ram Shot Big Game with 286 gr NP's and Hornady Interlock SP's (for target practice). I don't have a chronograph, but it's been very accurate. Since I have a pound of RL 17, I may just give it a try.

quote:

Originally posted by Atkinson:

Secondtry,
I have not tried RL-17 with 250 gr. bullets but the book sez, 61 grs of Ball C 2 will give you 2620 FPS, in my rifle I only got a bit over 2500 with that load. I have read of some getting 2700 or so FPS in the 9.3x62 with 250 gr. bullets..Some powders like Somchem and Vectan tub get you up in the 2600s apparantly.

I will work up some 250 gr. loads with RL 17 one of these days soon, and see what it will do.

Thanks Ray. I get around 2420/2450 with 250s and Varget. RL15 was slower and less accurate. 22.5"barrel.
This seems to be a little more speed than what is average from the 35 whelen, which seems reasonable given the slightly greater case capacity and the slightly larger bore.
I do wonder what pressures those 2650fps loads are running at. Reliable writers seem to achieve it, often, it seems, with CZ550s.

I think I need the "special" chrono, not the "special" load data

R-17 been good in my 300WSM,270WSM,280AI and 284 and was accurate in 30-06 but was pretty slow.

I've been a fan of R-17 for several years and it works for crtridges that may surprise people.

For example, the 416 Rigby is not considered a "cramped" capacity, though it too can benefit from the better energy density of R-17. We use 102.5 grains R-17 with the Barnes 350 grain TSX and adjust to 101.5 grains R-17 with the 350 grain TTSX, both for 2825fps. (Because of the large powder charges we are now saving our Fed 215match primers for the 416 and 500 loads.)

With the 338 WinMag I use 71 grains R-17, Rem9.5mag primer, with the Barnes 225gn TTSX for 2835 fps. (Caution is advised since the chamber is on the large side and allows the cases to expand to .516-.5165" after firing. Primers and extraction are normal.) The resulting velocity means that our 416 and 338 have the same trajectory within 1 inch out to 400 yards.

The powder is accurate in an accurate rifle. We had to bed our CZ in 416Rigby. The 338 is a Tikka and shoots tight groups when the load matches the barrel harmonics.

So yes, thank you Aliant. The powder is accurate, powerful, and seems as temperature resistent as H4350. I use Fed 215Match with the Rigby, and often with the 338 and a 270. However, due to primer shortages I've found that Rem9.5magnum seems to produce the same tight accuracy in the 338 as the Federal, despite the lower brisance/flame.

Thanks Ray. I never get too much data for the 9.3

up to now i had good chance with Varget, RL15 and Big Game not tried yet the RL17.

first hard to find and i dont know how they re in temp sensitive side ...

will try when we ll get cold maybe ...

Oh my! As effective as the 286 gr NPT is at 2425 adding another 100 fps would be interesting indeed.

I wonder how RL-17 would work with the 338-06 and 200 to 210 gr projectiles.

Mstarling it works great with my 338-06AI using 210 Sciroccos. I used 62.0gr. With that amount the case was full. Velocities average 2865fps and can sneak just under an inch. Primers are fine and extraction normal. Get some and try. You'll be impressed.
But remember, start low. I started at 57gr. Good luck.

The use of RL17 and the VV high energy powders clearly puts the old 9.3x62 into the 338WinMag velocity class. We don't know how lucky we are to be reloaders and shooters in these times.

quote:

Originally posted by tom holland:
R-17 been good in my 300WSM,270WSM,280AI and 284 and was accurate in 30-06 but was pretty slow.

30-06 doing 2900 with a 180 grain NPT

My new 9.3 x 62 has been very disappointing velocity wise w/ RL 15. Today , I bought RL 17. I'm hopeful.

We owe a lot to thanks to Daniel Kocur, he has supplied me and others with some of the most worthwhile loading data I have seen in a long time..I have known Daniel for some time now, done business with him, and he is first rate, mates!

Texas Killartist,
The 9.3x62 has been around for a long time, proven itself many times over and it did it with those long heavy bullets at moderate velocity that was kind to bullet construction and penetration, they just kept penetrating, couldn't be stopped, and were and are presently being used for all of Africas Big 4 or 5 as the case may be...Don't be disgruntled by a 286 or 300 gr. .366 bullet at 2200 to 2300, it will penetrate with any of the big bores and kills very well indeed. I have found it more than suitable for buffalo, Hippo, Bison, Moose, elk, Eland along with all sorts of plainsgame, and were I to confront a mad bull elephant and I had a gun full of solids I would be confident in the outcome.

Yes, I am making it cook with modern powders like RL-17, a good thing?, perhaps it is, and it will flatten trajectory a bit, but not a hell of a lot, and only time will tell if the added velocity is all its cracked up to be, I hope so, but if not I will still be an avid fan of the 286 or 300 gr. bullet at 2350 FPS on anything that bites, hooks or claws...And it seems to shoot flatter than the charts say..I have made some very long shots with it and keep in mind a 250 gr. bullet at the same velocity as a 180 gr. 30-06 is in my mind and my hunting stle, a long distance shooter, and it has a lot of umph when it gets out there.

I have owned a number of 9.3x62s, and I assure anyone that the calibers really benifits from a 26 inch barrel particularly with the 320 gr. Woodligh. My two present 9.3x62s have a 24 and a 20 inch barrel, the 20 inch suffers to a degree and RL-17 sure benefited the carbine length a great deal..

quote:

Originally posted by f224:
The use of RL17 and the VV high energy powders clearly puts the old 9.3x62 into the 338WinMag velocity class. We don't know how lucky we are to be reloaders and shooters in these times.

R-17 gives the .338 WM a little boost as well. Excellent powder here too!

Ray, thanks. My smith test fired it w/ the 286 Horn factory loads. It shoots them very well. I first shot it w/ the privi factory loads and had close to touching holes at 100 yds. Same w/ the Hornadys.
Then I shot them over the speed gun. Avg speed. 2147. Nowhere near the 2360 on the box. My test loads using 286 Normas and up to 58g of RL 15 only gave me 2250ish.
I have some of the CEB non cons (both solids and HPs) and as you know, they like speed.
Next, RL 17 !

Am eagerly awaiting your results TK!

the reports from the cold seems that powder is a little sensitive just be aware about that fact.

Phil

quote:

Originally posted by medved:
the reports from the cold seems that powder is a little sensitive just be aware about that fact.

Phil

That is always worth checking, especially on newer powders. However, a lot of comments on powder and temperatures are difficult to reproduce, even the so-called stability of Hodgdon Extreme powders. One of the biggest factors is lot to lot variability of the various powders.

FWIW, I just did a little testing with R17 in both a 338 WM and 416 Rigby at 90degrees F. Both the 225 gn TTSX in 338 (71gn R17, Rem9.5Mprimer) and 350 TTSX in 416 (101.5gn R17, Fed215match) produced their expected drops at 300 yards sighted-in at 2" high/110yd (-6", -7" respectively). That was reliable enough to go buffalo hunting last week. However, margins of error render such verification inconclusive and one doesn't get the opportunity in Africa to burn up a hundred rounds or so to get more reliable results.

My test shooting here in Idaho has been in some mighty cold weather lately and velocity or accuracy has not changed at all..Its been down around zero on the days I shot, and at best its been up to 22 degrees..Its supposed to warm up soon, but today doesn't show much...As for Alaska or Canada, I probably will be watching TV if its that cold..Over the years I have never noticed much change in any of the powders?? in the heat or cold...

I plainly LOVE the 9.3 x 62.

CONTRARY to what is posted here, because of personal Experience, for European, not so heavy Game ( which means under 200 lbs ), a LIGHTER Bullet than 286 grs is preferrably ... my next try is the RWS KS ...

( which is SOFT, and therefore only for European Game! )

For Africa, or Alaska, I would use 286 grs ... NPRT first!

Hermann

Test loads worked up.
285 PPU
PPU case
Rem 9 1/2 primer
59, 59.5, 60, 60.5, 61, 61.5. & 62 grains RL 17
Speed gun ready
Now, if this 'global warming' will pass, I'll test this weekend.
I'm hopeful !
Thanks Ray .

I've been using Varget to push the 250gr Accubond and TTSX bullets, seems to work fine. I don't need high speed or long range though, 57 to 58 grains have been good, Lapua cases, CCI 200s.

NO joy at the range.
62g RL 17 , 285 PPU only averaged just over 2200 fps. No pressure signs, so I'll add more.
59g gave me less than 2000 fps
The Hornadys gave me 2170 fps. The box claims 2360. ?

TKA,
I don't understand that, my loads with 286s got right up there with Daniel Kocurs and the loads listed in another persons tests..all right around 2500 plus FPS...Have you checked your chronograph lately...what brand is it..and I had better check mine while were at it. they can be finicky little boogers for sure.

At any rate it appears that you can keep going up and see where you end up..

PPU brass will take more powder than any other brass btw so that might be a factor and it also lasts longer than other brass I have used.

Just cleared my competition electronics pro chrono.
Going up. 62.5, 63, 63.5 & 64g.
We'll see.

quote:

Originally posted by Texas Killartist:
NO joy at the range.
62g RL 17 , 285 PPU only averaged just over 2200 fps. No pressure signs, so I'll add more.
59g gave me less than 2000 fps
The Hornadys gave me 2170 fps. The box claims 2360. ?

There is a relatively common phenomena known as a "SLOW BARREL", just as there are "fast Barrels". If you have a new barrel that has not been lapped,(i.e. Douglas and some others) a couple hundred rounds down the spout may help. There are also variations in primers, bullets, powder lots etc. Unless you put some bullets down range and mix things up a bit, you may not ever know.

Global warming kept me off the range yesterday . Too windy for the speed gun.
I've now loaded up to 65g of RL 17 in .5g increments.
If that does not work, I'll switch primers and start again.
I cleaned the bore and it feels very smooth. It is supposed to have a benchmark barrel, but I do not know much a/b them. Went w/ the smith's recommendation.
It is no longer grouping as well as it did, so I cleaned it.
I am one of Whelen's disciples and believe 'Only accurate rifles are interesting'.
I will endeavor to persevere.