quote:

Originally posted by mrbofus:
Greetings,
I am looking to get educated by the plethora of knowledge on this site regarding the popularity of the .308 Bolt action rifle.

My intent was/is varmits, paper and deer gun.

Just looking for the pros and cons of this caliber.

Thanks,

Well you've heard history,loves and hates, OPINIONS, pros and cons, and some warm and cool feelings.

( See first clap) A well made .257 Roberts or 250-3000 seems to be the right answer.
roger

Mr bofus, I like the 308. I like the 30'06. As a matter of fact I can't think of any gun that I haven't liked. Get what ever you have a feel for.
Roger is right. The 308 is/was developed about 40 years late since the Swiss developed it's ballistic twin. The 7.5X55 was developed in 1908 and introduced GP-11 ammo in 1911. And in the 1920's Hatcher and the gov modified the Swiss VLD projectile for national match competion by shortening the bullet length, increasing the bearing surface and changing the jacketing composition some. The Swiss didn't have much in the way of fouling prolems with the thin cupro/nickel plating on their steel jackets and got longer barrel life. The US and the Danes didn't have as good luck with not having fouling problems. How about their barrel cleaning techniques? Shoot, grease the bore, store,degrease before shooting again with something very close to a bore snake, ad infinitum. AlltheBest

quote:

Originally posted by mrbofus:
just recently picked up a 7/08 and so far really like it.
With a 7/08 and a 30.06 dont see the "need" for the 308 except I never owned one

You've already acknowledged that this isn't about need, so what I'm about to say may not matter to you, but I honestly see no real benefit for you to get a 308.

Bullet weights 150-160 grains and down? Your 7mm08 will handle them just fine, and being 0.284 versus 0.308 will give you a bit of a ballistic advantage.

As to 180-220 grain 0.308 bullets, your 30-06 takes the advantage over the 308 there, by sheer case volume and hence velocity.

That said, if you have simply decided you want a 308, there is absolutely nothing wrong with them; choose a good rifle and have at 'er. Have fun, and good shooting!

Davis

quote:

Originally posted by Davis Goertzen:

quote:

Originally posted by mrbofus:
just recently picked up a 7/08 and so far really like it.
With a 7/08 and a 30.06 dont see the "need" for the 308 except I never owned one

You've already acknowledged that this isn't about need, so what I'm about to say may not matter to you, but I honestly see no real benefit for you to get a 308.

Bullet weights 150-160 grains and down? Your 7mm08 will handle them just fine, and being 0.284 versus 0.308 will give you a bit of a ballistic advantage.

As to 180-220 grain 0.308 bullets, your 30-06 takes the advantage over the 308 there, by sheer case volume and hence velocity.

That said, if you have simply decided you want a 308, there is absolutely nothing wrong with them; choose a good rifle and have at 'er. Have fun, and good shooting!

Davis

Thank you and I believe you are right.

I was just curious about the 308 and never really thought much about it. After getting the 7/08 I began to look more at the 308 but I already have the range covered.
I do like the fact that many have stated it is quite easy to develop hand accurate loads for. So maybe someday if I have nothing else on my wish list I may give one a try.

thank again,

If you've already got something very similar, then of course you don't "need" a 308.

If a fellow needs a good hunting for general big game or mid range target shooting round that is convenient for ammo and is starting from scratch then the 308 is very good round.

It's the .22rf of centrefire cartridges, if that makes sense.

I got both the 308 and 30-06 - just in case I get bored with one or the other!

Friday I went out-house rat crazy and blew my stach on a Ruger hawkeye Stainless Steel walnut RSI in 308. They were listed on the Ruger web sight, but don't seem to be now. Noon Day Gun Trader in NoonDay Texas. Might not be able to get my model 12 shotgun from the gunsmith for a while. I knew better than to go there. There is always temptation there

[QUOTE]Originally posted by MLG:
I got both the 308 and 30-06 - just in case I get bored with one or the other! [/QUOTE

I like your way of thinking,

I have those moments myself. Like 7/08 vs 308 vs 270 vs 30.06 vs 7mm mag vs 280 AI vs 300 win mag vs 338-06 etc..

I guess that is why I have never seen a 1 slot Gun Safe!

Low recoil, accurate, cheap, tons of ammo available, reasonably flat shooting, it's an "inherited" caliber, it's 30 caliber, it's "american", the list goes on on and on and on.

quote:

Originally posted by Tyler Kemp:
Low recoil, accurate, cheap, tons of ammo available, reasonably flat shooting, it's an "inherited" caliber, it's 30 caliber, it's "american", the list goes on on and on and on.

+1

not my idea of a varmint gun, but hard to beat for big game on the NA continent, perhaps big bears excluded and i say perhaps. whatever one can say for the 30-06 one can say for the .308 from practical and realistic standpoint

-short action
-available in darn near everything
-available darn near everywhere (ammo)
-lots of bullet sizes
-shoots accurately
-kills a good way out
-not a finicky reload
-hits harder than a 270 or 7X57 and just as hard as a Rem 280.
It just looks kick-ass. A perfectly proportioned cartridge. (OK that's bogus. A 7X57 is closer to perfection in proportion. Strictly asthetic.)

quote:

Originally posted by Sylvaneous:

-hits harder than a 270 or 7X57 and just as hard as a Rem 280.

I think that's a little bit of a stretch! roger

quote:

As to 180-220 grain 0.308 bullets, your 30-06 takes the advantage over the 308 there, by sheer case volume and hence velocity.

That advantage may not be as great as you think. I got tired of hearing how the ,308 just doesn't have the case capacity to handle 200 and 220 gr. bullets so after digging around a bit, I found that W760 can and will shoot the 220 gr. Sierra RNs quite handily and very accurately as well. According to the ads, factory 30-06 does 2400 FPS with a220 gr. RN. Nobody around here seems to have any in stock from any maker and they refuse to order just a couple of boxes for me to test. No matter, but based on advertised velocity, the .308 is less than 100 FPS behind the 06.
Using W760, Winchester brass and primer, I've run the 220 gr. Sierra RN bullet to 2310 FPS over my chronograph. Groups from my 22" Winchester M70 run from .375" to .50".
For the record the data is as follows:
Powder: W760
Bullet: 220 gr. Sierra round nose.
Start load: 42.0 gr. for 2177 FPS at 42,000 C.U.P.
Maximum load: 44.0 gr. for 2295 FPS at 46,900 C.U.P.
I worked up to the max load in my rifle with 22" barrel and got 2310 FPS according to my chronograph.
From my 18.5" barreled Ruger M77 RSI, velocity was right at 2200 FPS with 1.5" groups. Not all that bad regarding accuracy as it will only do 1.25" with it's favorite load.
My point is, there are too many old wives tales coming from some of the gun writers who repeat crap because sosme other gun writer "eggspurt" said it.
Another good one is a 30-06 with a 1 in 12" twist barrel will not stabilize 220 gr. bullets. Wanna bet? A cople of years back i took on a gun writer on that very subject. Even sent him targets to back my statements up. I even invited him to stop by if he wee in the area to check out the rilfe's twist rate, load the ammo himself and shoot it at the range. He declined and in a later article hinted that maybe I might be lying. Needless to say, I consider his writings with some prejudice these days.
Just because some yahoo gets to write for some gun rag doesn't mean he knows everything. I like to experiment stuff like the two subjects just mentioned. Just because Joe Gunwriter sez it doesn't mean it's true.
I ask no one to take my word on the .308 and 220 gr. bullets. I'ne done it and I know what my results were. If you're curious, try it.
Paul B.

I have six 308s and six 3006's. I believe the 308 is popular because it was the US military cartridge, support by gunwriters and the fact it is quite effective on game. However I have never found it is as easy to get an accurate load for the 308 as for the 3006, in fact I don't have one 308,that matches the accuracy of my 3006s. I dont know why but that is the way it is for me.

It's pure poison on deer, no matter the terrain or distance up to 600 yards, and that about sums it up on the American side of things.

quote:

Originally posted by bbell:
I have six 308s and six 3006's. I believe the 308 is popular because it was the US military cartridge, support by gunwriters and the fact it is quite effective on game. However I have never found it is as easy to get an accurate load for the 308 as for the 3006, in fact I don't have one 308,that matches the accuracy of my 3006s. I dont know why but that is the way it is for me.

Strange, not that the '06 isn't an accurate round but the .308 is almost universally noted for its inherent accuracy. I love that word, inherent, gunwriters love to use it when describing the .308's accuracy.

All mine have been exceptional shooters. The worst was still good enough to hit a deer with at 600 yds, on paper anyway.

1. plenty of power for 99% of the game hunted in the world.

2. one of the, if not the most accurate round for long distance shooting by the average shooter.

3. about the limit in recoil for accurate bullet placement by the average shooter.

4. must be a billion round of military surplus once-fired cases out there for 4-5 cents a case.

5. easy to reload, with a huge selection of bullets, powders, etc to choose from.

Did I miss anything...?

Rich

quote:

Originally posted by bartsche:

quote:

Originally posted by Sylvaneous:

-hits harder than a 270 or 7X57 and just as hard as a Rem 280.

I think that's a little bit of a stretch! roger

Pretty much, yes. K.E = 1/2 m(v)squared. They are all in the same ballpark.

Well once again, you all have convienced me that I shouldnt over look the .308 so add another Rifle to the wish list.
Doing load developement for the 7-08 and 30.06 so if I get those dialed in to where I need a new challenge, well maybe a .308 will find its way hamoe with me.
(there still are a few empty slots in the gun safe)

Thanks and I appreciate the positive feedback.
MB

You won't be sorry. I started my hunting with a 308 my wife gave me for an anniversary and now I never go hunting without one of the three I own. I am having one of them re-barreled again to 308, as we speak. The only thing I don't/can't use them for is the last day of the season "I need another deer REAL bad" long distance shooting. But that is what I have the 6.5s for. I have plenty of other rifles, the 308s are just the "go to" rifles.

I love it in my Savage 99

quote:

Originally posted by Abob:
Military connection

30-06 Springfield
7.62×51mm NATO (commercial .308 Winchester)
5.56×45mm NATO (commercial .223 Remington)

Spot on mate. The 308 is also a relativley modern design as well what with its fairly straight walls and slightly higher pressure levels. A case nearly 1/2" shorter than an 06 that can match it with 150-165 gn slugs and do it with an average of 10 gns or more of LESS powder is nothing to scoff at. It is quite an achievment really, and it is inherintly accurate and easy to load for. Whats not to like?

I'm not sure how to verify this but I would not be surprised if there are more types of .308 bullets available than for any other bullet diameter.