At least a few new M-70 were received at Davidsons for distribution today.

They may be all gone by now but the trickle has started!

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:
At least a few Mew M-70 were received at Davidsons for distribution today. ...

My inside source had not told me they were going to make a Crat Model!

quote:

My inside source had not told me they were going to make a Crat Model!

I see I need spell check....but it's corrected now.

The crat models are for the Carolina deer as I understand it......

It looks like the new model 70 is the rifle to get.
I’ve been reading about them and want to purchase one hopefully by the year end.
I’d like to see them produce a featherweight in stainless.

There is a review of one in the new american rifleman this month. The writer ravers over it, but the accuracy chart doesnot impress me at all.
The avarage acuracy for 5 5shot groups for 3 differnt loads was 2.02 2.62 & 2.35
He was using a 30,06 featherweight.

I don't know if that means a whole lot,
If I was testing it, I would have used 3 shot groups, can't remember ever getting 5 shots at 1 buck.
The Hornady 180 grain interlock load (factory ammo I asume) only gave 2480 fPS.
I think you could do that with a 300 savage, or come darn close.
I think I want a .308 or .243 featherweight.
A short action model 70, just rings my chimes a little...tj3006

From what I've just been told things are NOT going good at Winchester already.

til later

quote:

Originally posted by EP:
From what I've just been told things are NOT going good at Winchester already.

til later

care to elaborate?

High production pressure from FN. My son-in laws dad has worked for Win a LONG time,is now in manufacturing and is not happy with the how things are going at all.

til later

I was thinking of checking out the Extreme Weather SS myself. I really don't need a rifle but with the way everyone is writing about them, they are really pushing these things hard.

My biggest gripe is that their accuracy claim is kind of bogus. The small print accompanying their accuracy claims is quite detailed and specific, and nowhere does it say they will fix the gun if it doesn't meet its accuracy claim. It's more sales pitch than anything else, especially since most gun rags are showing poor accuracy results but then claim the rifles will be much more accurate with handloads. I don't know too many people who bring shooting rests and match-grade ammo into the field regularly.

It's in poor form for Winchester. I can buy a Weatherby Vanguard that is guaranteed to out hit 1.5 MOA with factory ammo or it doesn't leave the factory. Sure, it's bolted to a bench, but I know of one in particular, a .300 Weatherby, that was shooting around 2 MOA at the range. The owner called Weatherby and they replaced the stock, and it didn't fix the problem. It went back again, and came back wearing a Fibermark stock and never had an accuracy problem since. That's a realistic accuracy claim (and good customer service).

It's really hard to justify purchasing something new like that when there are other options which cost less and are backed by a real guarantee instead of just an accuracy claim.

If they try to replace what were excellent rifles with crap, shooting crap accuracy, then they'll go under. There are just too many economical rifles on the market that will shoot MOA or therabouts for Winchester to produce a 2-MOA rifle and think it's going to sell.

They shot 2 moa & worse before they stopped producing them in New Haven. I love M70s........I hated the "out of box" accuracy I got on the last two I bought at the news of the close. The Stocks looked like they were painted instead of being stained. Runs all over. Crappy Italian wood.

They would be hard pressed to be worse than those. If they truely are....they will not be around long either.

quote:

Originally posted by vinnyg:
It looks like the new model 70 is the rifle to get..

Why? roger

quote:

Originally posted by vinnyg:
It looks like the new model 70 is the rifle to get.
I’ve been reading about them and want to purchase one hopefully by the year end.
I’d like to see them produce a featherweight in stainless.

You might read the long article in the October American Rifleman. They got 2.6" groups with some loads. Thread on new M70

quote:

Originally posted by Iron Buck:
They shot 2 moa & worse before they stopped producing them in New Haven. I love M70s........I hated the "out of box" accuracy I got on the last two I bought at the news of the close. The Stocks looked like they were painted instead of being stained. Runs all over. Crappy Italian wood.

.

I got one of the last LH Safari Classics in .375 that they made. I had a $40.00 trigger job done on it and pressed on. 1100 rounds and a one-shot dead buffalo later , with a few more animals thrown in, I can say that there are no fleas on this rifle. It shoots MOA with Remington 270 SP's, Remmy 300 A Frames, and my 300 gr A Frame, 350 Woodleigh and 300 Hornady handloads. The wood's good, the fit and finish are excellent, and although I own more expensive rifles, this is my favorite. I've heard stories about lousy quality near the end, but mine certainly isn't among them. I'll never sell it.

Doesnt sound like the new trigger is much of an improvement either. Non adjustable proprietary.

The price seems to be really high for an inferior rifle.

This will probably drive the price even higher on the old UNION MADE (quality built)model.

I have a new Super Grade on order. My guy says when it comes if I am not happy He wont have a problem moving it if I don't want it. Hopefully when it comes its looks don't blind me. I will be pretty po'd if it only shoots 2.5in.

quote:

Originally posted by RMiller:
Doesnt sound like the new trigger is much of an improvement either. Non adjustable proprietary.

Now that is just assanine! that would keep my from buying one right there!

sounds like they have had their day. might aswell go buy a savage.

As I said earlier,Paul,my sil's dad is not satisfied at all with the way things are going and is thinking about giving it up after 40+yrs.He had alot to do with the set up of the manufacturing process and is saying that the problem is not in the metal components but in the final assembly of the firearm where they are not being given adequate time for proper fit and function due to the HIGH production requirement set by FN. So you may be more correct in your assumption than you know.

til later

Ladies and Gentlemen:

I've owned six pre-64 Model 70's and I think four classic 1990's CRF Model 70's. They were all pretty well made, and the pre-64's were quite accurate.

The 1990's CRF's were not very accurate: 1.75"-2.00" five shot groups, using handloads, if I remember correctly. I am pretty sure that they were hammer forged barrels.

My question is if the FN plant in South Carolina already has button rifling machinery to make the M-16 barrels (as gleaned from the American Rifleman article), why use the hammer forging equipment to make barrels for the Model 70?

I have never had much luck with factory hammer forged barrels, except for a Sako A-V in 6.5x55 with a heavy contour barrel. Hell, my old 1968 Model 700 Remington ADL in 243 Winchester never grouped over an inch with five shots, again using handloaded ammunition, and the 22" barrel was button rifled.

If FN had spent a bit more time and charged a bit more, they could have given Savage a run for its money by using button rifled factory barrels.

Sincerely,

Chris Bemis

I was wanting one of the CRAT models, in 243 for longer range shooting. The NRA article was intresting. But I am aware of accuracy problems with those FN model 70 SWAT rifles from five or six years ago and it just makes me a little hesitant. It would be great if they were superb though. But from the article, it will be a heckuva QC thing to pull off. I just recall few conventionally manufactured bolt guns with superior accuracy reputations.

quote:

Originally posted by Fish30114:

quote:

Originally posted by RMiller:
Doesnt sound like the new trigger is much of an improvement either. Non adjustable proprietary.

Now that is just assanine! that would keep my from buying one right there!

The new trigger is proprietary but it is adjustable for sear engagement and pull weight.

Read the article on the new Model 70 in this month's "American Rifleman" magazine.

Can someone post the article? My copy is already gone. I'm glad I switched to the CZ550's!

quote:

Originally posted by vinnyg:
It looks like the new model 70 is the rifle to get..

Why? roger[/QUOTE]

Roger, Gentleman,
I’m getting tired of my Remington’s and would like something with the Mauser type bolt.
I don’t have the money like some of you guys to spend on a rifle. I read that the push feed and claw extractor is the top action desired among sportsman.
Yes I do want an accurate rifle even though it’s for hunting but after reading what you guys are saying maybe the M70 is not the ticket to the big show?

So, what’s my (rifle) option under $1K in a 7mm08 with a mauser type action?

quote:

quote:

Originally posted by vinnyg:

quote:

Originally posted by vinnyg:
It looks like the new model 70 is the rifle to get..

Why? roger

Roger, Gentleman,
I’m getting tired of my Remington’s and would like something with the Mauser type bolt.
I don’t have the money like some of you guys to spend on a rifle. I read that the push feed and claw extractor is the top action desired among sportsman.
Yes I do want an accurate rifle even though it’s for hunting but after reading what you guys are saying maybe the M70 is not the ticket to the big show?

So, what’s my (rifle) option under $1K in a 7mm08 with a mauser type action?

CZ makes EXCELLENT rifles featuring controlled round feeding. Check out a 550 American. Ruger also does a CRF action, but I've not used them much myself.

Wait, my bad. No 7mm-08 in the CZ. .243/.308/.270/6.5x55 are in the same range though if the rifle is enough to sway you.

Might also be able to find a Kimber for under $1000 US, they're only a little pricier up here. And I don't know what Sako's run for but they are great guns, might want to look into them as well.

It's fun to try different things, but Mauser-style does not mean more accurate or better built, or stronger, just easier to control extraction. It depends on what you ultimately want.

quote:

Originally posted by vinnyg:
Yes I do want an accurate rifle even though it’s for hunting but after reading what you guys are saying maybe the M70 is not the ticket to the big show?

So, what’s my (rifle) option under $1K in a 7mm08 with a mauser type action?

There's a M-70 classic in 7-08 right now in the classifieds. It may be on page two or three by now. here it is

I saw one of the new barrelled actions in .308 a couple of weeks ago. It was Parkerized and rough as a cob. It looks good but the jury is still out as far as I'm concerned.

quote:

Originally posted by clowdis:
I saw one of the new barrelled actions in .308 a couple of weeks ago. It was Parkerized and rough as a cob. It looks good but the jury is still out as far as I'm concerned.

Sounds like the FN PBR barrelled actions that CDNN is selling, not the new M70.

Glad I have my 'old' M70s

How about a 7mm-08 RUGER. I have had several M-77s and all have been very good on accuracy and one or two superior. I can't say that about the m-70s for the last 20 years.

If you want one now, and dont want to worry about getting a "new" 70 with possible issues, then the Ruger or CZ are excellent choices. Doesnt cz make one in 7 mauser, basically a twin to the 7mm-08

vinnyg:
your best pick would probably be a CZ or Ruger(depending on cartridge choice).
or you could just forget a Mauser action and buy a Weatherby Vanguard

quote:

Originally posted by hikerbum:
If you want one now, and dont want to worry about getting a "new" 70 with possible issues, then the Ruger or CZ are excellent choices. Doesnt cz make one in 7 mauser, basically a twin to the 7mm-08

CZ dropped the 7x57 a couple of years ago. I would go with a new Ruger Hawkeye in 7-08. Darn nice rifle, no rings or bases to worry about and Ruger will stand behind it.
g

Look folks the news just isn't going to be out on the new M-70 for a while. Before firm judgements are made we need to read reports from a couple dozen real owners - like some of the people that post here - before we can really know how they are going to be.
I'm looking forward to seeing them as I've been a big M-70 fan for a long time.
Surely they will be an improvement over the "UNION MADE" crap that was coming out of New Haven the last couple of years before the Union drove Winchester out of Conneticut. Talking with people who have actually been involved in the new production have mentioned the stresses being made on quality. We'll see..................................DJ

The downfall at New Haven was every bit (and more) the fault of management as it was the Unions...

This afternoon, I had the opportunity to actually inspect a new FN Model 70, at my local dealer. It was a Classic blue/walnut Featherweight in 30-06. To be perfectly honest, it was a very nice rifle. Yeah, I know I'm swimming upstream here, against all the negativity.

The fit/finish on this rifle was very nice, the only complaint I could find in this department was that the barrel channel was a bit off, nearly touching on the left side of the barrel right near the fore-end, but to me, this is a relatively minor issue. I've used up a ton of sandpaper opening up the barrel channels on Remington 700's, so I am familiar with this issue. Altho, this particular rifle may not have needed much, if any, relieving in this area.

The rifle does not appear to be an exact copy of previous Featherweights, even the latest version of Featherweights. The stock was definitely thicker through the pistol grip and buttstock areas. The wood on this rifle was very nice, with a lot of figure. It has to be one of the nicest stocks I have ever seen on a Featherweight. It was satin finished, and looked very nice, IMHO.

Mechanically, other than the trigger, I couldn't actually discern many differences between this rifle and previous Classics, except for the bolt release button. The floorplate also is redesigned a bit, at least from an older push-feed Featherweight we compared it to. The new floorplate is nicer looking. The trigger lever itself is smooth, not grooved like previous Classics. Other than that, it seems to incorporate all the latest improvements made in New Haven, such as the machined extractor, flanged bolt shroud and recessed target crown. The bluing was very nice, not the chitty blue some have suggested.

I did notice the serialization has now changed. No more "G" prefixes, apparently. The left side of the action was marked "Winchester" with "Made in U.S.A." in very small letters underneath.

If I can remember all this correctly, the barrel was marked "Model 70 Featherweight 30-06" with (in very small letters) "Made in U.S.A. BACO, Inc. Morgan, Utah" underneath. No "FN" anywhere I saw.

The trigger was crisp, with no discernible creep. We didn't put a gauge on it, but it felt like in the 4-5 pound range to me. Easily adjustable it is said.

Oh, yeah, the floorplate was marked with something that said to the effect of "Limited Edition" and "2008" or something like that. I pretty much ignore any factory attempts to create instant collectibles just because something is scratched on the floorplates. Remington, are you listening?

The price quoted me by this dealer was $900, which I don't feel is out of the ball park on this rifle. A friggin' 700CDL is in that range. I don't much care what Savages and Mossbergs and such go for, but then, thats just me. Yeah, I know, you might could get a Kimber for that much money, but then what you'll probably have is a very purdy rifle, that either won't shoot, or won't feed!

Of course, I have no idear whether the new Model 70's will shoot. All I can say is, all my New Haven Model 70's shoot extremely well. And until I actually own a new FN Model 70 myself, I will choose to give them the benefit of the doubt.

This morning I picked up and thoroughly inspected two of the Featherweight Models in Whittakers gun shop in West Louisville KY. (just outside Owensboro Ky) They were for sale at just under $800.00 and impressed me as to fit and finish and had absolutely buttery smooth actions. I did not buy, one was 30-06 the other .270 Win. I am waiting for the Stainless All Weather Model in .270 WSM, then I will leap with both feet. Good shooting.

I have been giving some thought to the New Model 70's and even going so far as to considering selling my RSM in 375HH to help fund a Winchester 70 and Leupold scope set up, but after reading the American Rifleman report/article on the rifle, have taken a less enthusiastic approach. Believe the report stated something in the area of 2" plus for a common caliber as 06 or 270 and I simply do not feel that is an acceptable group/accuracy for a highly touted, precision made, state of the art facility to offer to the buying public. The lowly Savage and Reminton rifles will outdo that level of performance. Side swing safety, long claw exractor, CRF, nice wood, etc. are all secondary to the performance of the rifle in the accuarcy department or at least to me they are. I have pre'64's and they are very good rifles and shoot well, and if one of those gave such accuracy would not care for them at all. Perhaps it is just the new ones that gave this performance and I understand that the barrels are not actually produced, blanks anyway, at the FNH plant in S.C, but would suggest that management take a second look at their "outsourcing" of barrels and raise the bar on quality. I hope others out there with experience of the New 70's are having better experience than the AR report gave for it would be nice to be able to buy a reasonably accurate, at least 1moa, smooth operating Model 70 with all the features mentioned again. One can buy a Ruger 77 with all the same features and at less money.

With the demise of the "Classic", I swore Winchester rifles off. If FN resorts to tricks such as limited production to keep prices artificially high, I will not own one. And with a price approaching $1000.00, I'll be keeping my eyes on pre '64 model 70's.

I was looking on the Winchester website and liked the looks of the Stainless all weather version. Until I saw the price. Over $1100 for one. The good thing is they put a Bell Carlson stock on it instead of those cheap plastic ones.

They will not sell very well---same problems with quality. Accuracy, fit and finish---got to read what is not said in the reviews more that what you read in them!!! A lesson taught to me by Ken Howell and John Barsness.

Not a very inpressive write up all things considered even with the pressure put on the writers. Maybe they should have left it dead--I will not be buying one.