Fellow shooters-

I would like to branch out and get a new .308 Win. What, in your opinions, is the best .308 out of the box for under $1200 or so? I had a local dealer suggest a Remington 700P, but thought I'd be wise to listen to the voices of experience here, first. No official plan for the gun, but I would prefer something along a varmint design with good long-range accuracy.

Thanks,

Chris

I'd get the Kimber.

I would take a look at the CZ with the laminate stock that has the vent holes. Don't know anyone who has fired one but I bet it shoots awfully well...tj3006

Springfield M1A.
(I didn't know they made a 308 bolt gun)

I shoot a Sako Finnwolf, a Belgian FN FAL and an FN SPR-A1, all in .308. All these are made for different purposes. The SPR is down right ornery with 168 grain bullets. The Finnwolf is the best rifle I have ever shot from a standing position. I can get real, repeatable accuracy from a standing position with open sights on this rifle.

If the criteria is a long range target/varmint gun (and if you can find one), my vote would go for a Remington 700 SS with a 5R rifled barrel.

This is a mil spec gun that was produced out of the custom shop...used by Army snipers as a 600yd and under gun....

The local shop here purchased several of them a couple years ago. On the advice of one of the guy's in the shop I purchased one...loaded up with Lapua Brass, Sierra 175MK, and Varget, my first five shot (100yd) group was .170"

As soon as I got off the range, I went and purchased another one...they will flat shoot out of the box...only thing I had done was adjust the factory trigger a bit...

Hard to find but worth it!

Get the 700P in 308. The LTR is nice but the 308 appreciates the longer barrel to get the velocity up. 150gr Accubonds for hunting and Berger 135s for paper punching to 300. Berger 175s past 300yds. IMR-3031, IMR-4064 and Varget are top powder choices.

I shoot w/ two guys that have the 700 Police Models chambered in 308 Win. One has the LTR and the other has the heavier 700P w/ the 26" tube. I have the 700P chambered in 300WM. All three of our rifles are very accurate w/ the right handloads for each.

If you are looking for a Lighter rig, the LTR is a good one. If you are just going to shoot it from the bench and don't mind alittle more weight the 700P is a good choice.

You can usually find them for around $700. I did see some 308s for 669 last year.

Good Luck

Reloader

I have to vote for Remington on this as well. My 700 VSSF has been an honest .35 MOA rifle with several different loads. That's five shots inside a nickel, good enough for me!

if you like the remington go for the ltr the 20 in is enough and far handier I have both and dont cary the long one hardly at all sience the ltr purchase.
I was at a sniper school and shot next to a guy with a 18in 308 700 at the 1000 meter range and he did have to dial more dope than me but he could hit the target very efectively at all ranges. so the short bbl is not that much a hindrance.

Obviously there are a lot of Remington fans here. 700's a good chasis. Personaly, if I were looking for a budget rifle, for strick out-of-box performance, I'd lean twards Savage. Stock options leave room for personal preference.

mike

I do not know what is available in your territory. If the Tikka T3 is. Run for it..

it is light, dependable and accurate, and (at least in europe) affordable.

rem700 again.

Another vote for the 700. Seriously, look at the rem 700 VLS. It may not have a synthetic stock but it has a gorgeous laminated stock with a varimint barrel which is a varmint design with long range accuracy designed in mind. Unfortunately they don't make it in the VS SF model otherwise i'd be all over it. Also, you can get the VLS for about 600-650 and spend the rest on the best glass u can get and it will be worth it.

Eventhough I'm a huge Ruger fan, for out-of-box performance, I'd probably go for the Savage16FHSS in .308. (AccuTriggerTM, stainless barreled action, free-floating and button-rifled barrel, new hinged floorplate, and swivel studs) Savage's "suggested retail value" is $602, but they can be found for considerably less.

mike

Out of the box would be a CZ550.

If you're gonna hunt with, get the American.

If you're just going to try to make little touching holes at 200 yards, get the Varmint.

Another vote for the Tikka T3

Have a look at the varmint or varmint stainless, they come with great Sako barrel and trigger and everyone i've seen has shot extremely well out of the box, smoothest action around too.

www.tikka.fi

Tikka T3 for me too!

For dollar invested, Remington 700 PSS is real value. Huge advantage Remington has over the others is the endless aftermarket items available for the 700. If desired, stock, triggers, sight systems, etc. all available for future mods if desired. Simply take a look at what a lot of Mil/LE groups purhcase and use-Rem. 700. For serious long range work, would suggest the 26" barrel, but out to 600 the shorter version will work nicely and is handy. Mil/LE like it for getting in and out of vehicles plus urban settings. Twist is 1/12 and will stabilize host of bullet weights. Send the Sierra 175's down range at 2700fps plus and it will remain stable out to 1K in the longer tube. Lapua brass, 210M primers, varget/imr4064, Sierra 155Palma, 175MK, and the 190MK all work very well indeed. Check Sierra manual for accuracy loads, they are excellent. Good Luck.

Well, I bit the bullet today and bought a 700P with the longer 26" barrel. My decision was based primarily on cost/feature/accuracy and as some mentioned the available after market improvements available for the 700. Now, I've just got to get my press set up for .308.

BTW- I noticed as I was shopping around that the shop where I purchased my 700P also had the 20" LTR model. I was surprised that the LTR was almost $100 more than the standard model. As far as I can tell, the only difference is the shorter, fluted barrel. Is the required extra machining the reason for the additional cost, or are they just charging more for the "uniqueness?"

Thanks to everyone for the helpful responses! Next time it may be the Tikka. Looks like an incredible gun! for now, the Remington will be more than satisfactory, I think.

Chris

Since you have purchased the 700PSS, some adjustments many use on the rifle are that you can torque the action screws on this rifle fairly stout due to the full length bedding block in the stock. Actually runs from end of forearm to and thrugh pistol grip-operative word is stout or stouter than standard. Believe your rifle will have allen head action screws and can use pound/inch torque wrench to set fasteners to 56 pounds/inch for front and rear. Some us more or less poundage, this has always worked on the rifles I have dealt with over the years. Do the front one first, then the second one. If wrench not available, use allen wrench and use short end of wrench first, tighten as much as you can with fingers, little leverage that way, and then switch to using long end,( lever, moment, physics, etc) and again tighten/torque approx 1.4-1/3 turn. You will be close to desired amount of torque and good field approach. Once this is done, take small paint ball pen, white, red, yellow, etc., strike line through front and head of screw, back side and this serves as indicator if the fasteners have loosened. Serves as quick field check. Some stake with puch, but unless military do not suggest that.

Be advised, the barrels on these rifles are fine, but do require a fair amount of burnishing/polishing to lessen the amount of copper build up. Imagination is only limit as to how many ways there are to accomplish this, but to get down and dirty with it, take worn 30 caliber brush, wrap it with patch, coat patch with JB compound, and do 15-20 strokes through bore prior to shooting. If alread shot, no matter still do the same thing. Be sure and clean out the residue and shoot five times and do the same. By the second time around, put three to four wet patches of GM top engnine cleaner throught the bore, let sit for some 20-30 minutes, drink coffee, etc., dry patch and shoot five more times. Use wet patch again, let sit for a while, check for blue copper indicator. You should be good to go and if still getting copper, repeat. In closing, these rifles are used in all parts of the world for Mil/LE purposes as many other brands are, but overall the 700 when properly set up, cared for, deployed, very hard to overcome. Many manuals written on this rifle can share some good load data with you if desired, jus private mail me and glad to share whatever. Good Luck.

PS As from factory, mag cap. is 4 rounds. Small,thin washer under front and rear of bottom metal will normally allow for 5 rounds down mag. Doubt your rifle is set up for stripper clip, but when they are, clips hold five and need this mod. Could never get Remington to understand this!!

Look for a Cooper. Check with First Stop Guns 605-341-5211. You should be able to get close to the $1200 figure

For a top of the line Looker and Shooter Kimber 84M For the best value and a good shooter Ruger 77 MK II remember they come with great rings!!!

CRUSHER & Reloader
I see that you both have access to both the 20" & 26" barrels. Have you chronographed both barrels with the same load? I believe that the 18" mentioned before is too short but some say the difference between the 20 & 26 is not too bad. What have you seen?

CZ, but that is only if you demand the best possible accuracy for your dollars.

Take a Tikka or Sako if you can have for $1200 in Usa.
These are real performer

quote:

CRUSHER & Reloader
I see that you both have access to both the 20" & 26" barrels. Have you chronographed both barrels with the same load? I believe that the 18" mentioned before is too short but some say the difference between the 20 & 26 is not too bad. What have you seen?

Rod,

I have only chronoed the 26, I've shot the 20 but not chroned it.

I think you are right, the fast powders that are used in the 308 loads probably don't need the extra length. The extra length has more meaning in the carts that burn more powder.


Reloader

I have a Featherweight Stainless in .308 Win, an excellent rifle. But I think the Sprinfield Armory would be a great rifle as well. Fact is, there probably ain't a bad .308 Win rifle.

Rod

the diference in vel between my two is about 175 fps average to me not enough to make any real big deal over thats both with the remington match ammo that was free to me at the time. and if I handload for the shorter rifle the velo is just fine but the mony is in the ease of use with the shorter bbl. realy handy in a hide even more handy on a march/stalk.
I had one with a supressor in use for about two weeks and it only had 12 in of bbl I did not work with the load and it was provided with a dope sheet for drop it seemed like a lot of clicks for 500 meter but was on target just the same.

How long is the m14 bbl? and it is gas operated right?

quote:

Originally posted by cndrm:
Obviously there are a lot of Remington fans here. 700's a good chasis. Personaly, if I were looking for a budget rifle, for strick out-of-box performance, I'd lean twards Savage. Stock options leave room for personal preference.

mike

Yuppers.....me too.

quote:

Originally posted by CRUSHER:
How long is the m14 bbl? and it is gas operated right?

Drool here. Nate
M1A

Get a Tikka you wont regret it!

My choices for "out of the box" rifles would be a CZ first and the Savage second. If someone gave me a Remington rifle, I'd trade it in on a CZ.

Sako 308

I bought by wife a Tikka .308 bolt in wood for Valentine's Day. It's my first, but not last Tikka. Paid $585 for it and it had an awesome piece of dark fiddle wood from the factory - better than most custom rifles. The rifle dealer I bought it from was amazed with the stock. The trigger is awesome and easy to adjust. I love the scope mounting they have - I can't stand the standard drilled holes everyone has. The action is smooth and the bolt throw short. I put a prefit Limb Saver pad on it. It is an awesome rifle.

My wife shot her first animal ever with it 5 days later - a 31" Axis from 244 yards - in the shoulder and dropped like a bag of rocks where it stood. We were using Hornady SST 150 grains - sub .5" MOA at the range.

Chris
The best value in a 308 varmint/sniper type of 308 is a Remington 700. Either the Varmint model, the Police model or the LTR.
Which ever model you like the best.

I have been involved with these rifles for over 23 years. I have seen several hundred of them on the range in various Police Sniper Schools. I have never seen one that did not shoot very good.
You cannot go wrong with one of them.

Out of the box it is all junk until you get to $2,500.00. Having said that, the nice thing about the Remington is you can keep replacing parts until it is the way you want it. Actually they often shoot very well, as NE 450 No 2 stated above. He has seen more than I have. The one area where they will drive you nuts is if you reload. The factory chambers are often somewhat "generous".

Everybody under the sun accurizes them, if that proves necessary.

The 700 P grip is awkward for a lot of people.
The varmint synthetic bedding block doesn't go all the way to the front of the fore arm, so it can get noodly if you bear down on the sling.
The LTR is the best of the three IMO. The 20" barrel is no handicap until you get beyond 600 yards. Best of all, you can put on a suppressor - that will ruin you for shooting with loud guns ever again.

Handle all three, and see which one feels the best to you. Balance is important, even in one of these type of rifles.

You will liely need to tape some sleeping pad foam to the stock, or put on a velcro on cheek pad from Eagle industies (part #350001) or Black Hawk (Tactical Outfitter of Liberace).

Even with the bedding block, you will benefit from bedding. Marine Tex is fine for a .308. Send the trigger off to the triggerman in Wyoming for tuning (3 1/4#).

Enjoy

PS If you are going to shoot a lot of long range (>600 Yards), get a longer barrel and use 175 grain MatchKings or Lapua Scenars).