I just became the proud Papa of a 300 HH rifle. This is my first experience with this caliber. Any members using this caliber? Source for brass? Pet loads?

Thanks

quote:

Originally posted by Rob Haught:
I just became the proud Papa of a 300 HH rifle. This is my first experience with this caliber. Any members using this caliber? Source for brass? Pet loads?

Thanks

Lots of us using this classic caliber. In my opinion, it's the most versatile caliber out there in the .30 cal range. Depending on barrel twist, the .300 H&H does really well with 200-240 gr bullets and can also be an extremely flat shooter with 165-180 gr bullets. What rifle did you pick up?

Which model rifle did you get? I've owned a number one, and a guy I know has a 721 and a model 70. I only loaded 220 grain hornady round noses in the Ruger, before it went down the road. My friend shoots 180 partitions with healthy doses of H4350 in both of his rifles. The powder charges and bullet seating depths are different for both rifles. I hope this info points you in the right direction. BTW, he uses reloaded Federal brass from Federal factory loads. Nosler was selling premium brass, but I don't know if they still do.

I shoot a 1951 vintage Model 70. I haven't reloaded for it yet as I ran into a gun shop going out of business that had 8 boxes of Federal Premium ammo with the 180 grain Partition. The rifle thought they were made just for it and it puts three into 3/4 in. at 100 yds. So until its gone, I just shoot that load. Took it to S. Africa as a light rifle safari before last and it killed everything DRT. When they are gone I might play with the 220 or just duplicate the Federal load. I have other 300's so I can load them up with whatever too. Why change?

I bought a Dakota at DSC

Called my friend with the 300 H&H. He uses IMR-4350, not H4350. His Winchester pre-64 was plenty accurate, but the 721 is a real tack driver. He sold the Winchester.

Great thing about loading for the H&H is you can bring it up to its true potential far beyond what the factory loads offer.

I've never owned one one but I'm always on the lookout. My favorite has always been the .300 Weatherby but the right H&H could always change that.

quote:

Originally posted by Rob Haught:
I just became the proud Papa of a 300 H&H rifle. This is my first experience with this caliber. Any members using this caliber? Source for brass? Pet loads?

Thanks

Yes, a custom 721. Hornady is available, but chamfer new brass. H4831SC and a 180-grain TSX -- work up to 70 grains. Two kudu, a mountain reedbuck, Cape bushbuck, ...

PFL resizing is your friend to maximize brass life.

When my oldest son graduated high school in 1991 I told him I would buy him a good rifle, within reason. Now this kid researches buying socks and like his father he does not want what everyone else has. Good thing I told him at the beginning of the school year because he didn't decide until spring. He picked a Mod. 70 XTR in 300 H&H. It is one tack driving rifle. I don't remember his bullet choice but know he still uses IMR-4831. Excellent cartridge.

Wonderful caliber. Mine is a Ruger No. 1. So far I've only used Federal premium factory ammo with Barnes 180 TSX bullets. They don't offer that any longer. I've used it to take plains game in Namibia and a red stag in NZ. Excellent results on everything from Springbok to Eland.

Vary comfortably push a Barnes 180gr TTSX at 3000 fps out of a pre 64 Mod 70

I've had one in the stable for over 25 years now. My first was an extremely accurate 721. It was in that rifle that one of the first elk to fall to an original Barnes X was taken. It loved the original X bullets in 165 grains.

I wanted a left handed 300 H&H and was able to talk Remington's custom shop into chambering one of their left handed KS Mountain rifles in the grand old round. It however did not like X bullets in any weight, original or TSX/TTSX. It does love Partitions though.

I've had such good luck with Nosler Partitions that I don't use anything else in the 300. I keep it loaded with 220 Partitions.

It's a great round. 4350 and 4831 are your friends. It seems to like everything from 130 to 220 grain bullets. I've used 150, 165, 180 and 220 grain Partitions on game with mine. All of them shoot superbly.

Congrats on the 300. You'll love it.

My co favorite caliber/cartridge alongside the 30-06, the 300 H&H is IMO the perfect balanced 30 caliber, low recoil and low report with the benefit of sending 220 grain Nosler Partitions out at 2750 fps with lower chamber pressures than the 06 and other 300 mags. And there is no other cartridge that feeds better out of a magazine fed bolt action rifle. Pet load is with IMR 4350 60 grains w/220 NP bullet.

Strictly a pest gun; as are any and all 300 Magnums; just a waste of bullets. If the game is too big for a 30-06, then you need a much larger caliber.
Per Elmer, but I subscribe to the philosophy.

Rob,Did you buy the .300 H&H that Gulf Breeze had there? Midway has Norma brass, good stuff.

Yes I did!

quote:

Originally posted by mart

I wanted a left handed 300 H&H and was able to talk Remington's custom shop into chambering one of their left handed KS Mountain rifles in the grand old round. It however did not like X bullets in any weight, original or TSX/TTSX. It does love Partitions though.

You didn't happen to post a picture of that rifle on 24 hour campfire a while back?

I have hunted with a Remington 721 in 300 H&H since about 1968.
Fantastic cartridge for any North American game and the old rifle has never let me down.
The long tapered case is a dream to handload and in my rifle practically any bullet weight makes excellent groups, however my hunting load has always been a 165 bullet preferably the old dependable Partition.

G'day mate, and welcome to the .300H&H club! It's a fantastic cartridge and will serve you well.

My first rifle chambered for .300H&H was a Ruger No.1. It worked well, and accompanied me on my first trip to Africa, where it killed three kudu, two impala (helped with a third), one warthog and one blesbok. In my own backyard it killed a tremendous buffalo bull and quite a few pigs including two great boars. It also killed wild cattle and donkeys. All this was with the Woodleigh 180 grain PPSN. I sold this rifle because I couldn't shoot it well and I needed to finance a Rigby .275.

But, I absolutely loved the cartridge...

After a build time of several years, I am now the proud owner of a 1938 Mauser Oberndorf custom .300H&H, made by Tony Small of Nickal Traditional Gunsmithing. It is just early days, but it has already killed four buffalo, one scrub bull, one donkey and several pigs (a couple of which were huge sows).

I am moving away from Woodleigh 180 grain PPSNs, as they are not emphatic enough on buffalo. However, results with the Woodleigh 180 grain Hydro and Woodleigh 220 grain solids are excellent.

As always, I am conservative with bullet speed.

Kind regards,

Ben

My old Browning Safari grade 300 h&h likes 69 gr RL19 and 180 gr bullet. IMR 4350 would be a good place to start.

I have found .300 H&H to be very useful. It is versatile and does surprisingly well when loaded to a wide range of velocities with nearly anything .308" diameter.

My .300 H&H is a Sako L61R and it simply refuses to shoot a group any larger than 3/4" with any 180 grain bullet I've tried. I settled on a 180 grain Accubond propelled by IMR 7828 SSC at the somewhat traditional velocity of about 2960 fps. It will easily exceed 3,000 fps with this powder and bullet, but I like the idea of running it at around its original velocity. I've taken an elk (one shot), a whitetail, and a couple of feral hogs with it. If I'm ever able to make it back to Africa it will be my primary rifle.

I have a pre 64 in 300 H&H Magnum and it is an excellent shooting machine. This rifle has been through a number of hands before it got to me, and someone added a rubber recoil pad. This was actually all to the good as this rifle would surely kick hard with a steel butt plate.





The last owner used the rifle on Elk and Moose, said it worked just fine. I am more of a paper puncher. I have taken it out to the CMP range at Talladega Alabama and zero’d the rifle at 300 yards with an excellent load of 190’s and 4350. Any of the 4350’s work fine, that is AA4350, IMR 4350 or H4350, just buy by price.

The headspace for these rimmed cartridges is controlled off the belt, the base to shoulder distance is not controlled. For that reason, these belted magnum cases are often stretched excessively on the first firing, leading to early case head separation. These cases are about running around $1.50 to $2.00 apiece, when you can find them, and for that reason, I lubricate the heck out of them on the first firing. This is a practice followed by World Champion Benchrest shooters who fireform their cases lubed, so they get perfect, stress free cases. Lube will allow the case to slide to the bolt face without case wall stretch. Based on my experiments, greased bullets foul less. Rifle competitors used to routinely grease their bullets back in the days of cupro-nickel bullets, because greased bullets did not foul the barrel. I can tell for a certain number of my rifles, that greasing the bullets reduces fouling, and I have been doing that regularly during load development. I have included pictures of my cases being greased at the range prior to firing.














After firing, I use a Sinclair case gage to measure the base to shoulder length, of one of those fired, but lubed cases, pictures of the gage are here: Extending Cartridge Case Life http://www.realguns.com/Commentary/comar46.htm If you don’t use case gages to set up your dies, and these belted magnums require special case gages, then it is highly probable that you will push the case shoulder back too much and experience short case lives due to headspace separation.

Slamfire. This is the first I have heard of greasing cases and bullets. Very interesting.

Love the 300 H&H. A 200 gr. Nosler at 3000 FPS with specific loads is deadly on all that walks..It feeds and extracts like poop thu a goose..Been hunting with one for many years, never a complaint..It also takes heavy bullets like most 300s don't, the long neck allows that..Its the best 300 for the 240 gr. Woodleigh by a long shot..Im not including the RUM etc. that's a whole nudder chapter in 300s, but only by a tad.

I can't imagine a better all around caliber for the NA continent unles perhaps the .338 Win. abd that's a maybe, allowing for my prejudice for the .338.

Thanks everyone!

quote:

Originally posted by Cougarz:

quote:

Originally posted by mart

I wanted a left handed 300 H&H and was able to talk Remington's custom shop into chambering one of their left handed KS Mountain rifles in the grand old round. It however did not like X bullets in any weight, original or TSX/TTSX. It does love Partitions though.

You didn't happen to post a picture of that rifle on 24 hour campfire a while back?

Yes. I did post some pics on 24HCF. When I get next to my computer I'll post some here also.

Pet Load for 300 H&H in pre-64 Mod 70 is
72 gr H-4831 with a 168 gr. Sierra. Longest
shot resulting in kill was Pronghorn Antelope at
700 yds. Not normal but the only shot I had. Got
the buck. Good shooting, great cartridge.

Tetonka
DRSS

Here's a picture of the lefty KS Mountain in 300 H&H. Not as purty as that Winchester but it gets the job done. I really should write to Remington and request a letter. I suspect it's the only factory left handed KS Mountain rifle ever done in 300 H&H.

quote:

Slamfire. This is the first I have heard of greasing cases and bullets. Very interesting.

Actually weapon systems that used oilers or greased ammunition were very common. Just tonight, at an indoor Bullseye Pistol match, I talked to a Vietnam Veteran who used the Oerlikon 20mm cannon on his Army Barge. The barge did not have any armament till these entrepreneuring Americans drilled, welded, gun mounts to the superstructure. The Army guys stole the Oerlikon from the Air Force, along with a huge amount of ammunition. This guy shot his Oerlikon in 1969 and it had an oiler on it. He said, when they came to a couple of bends in the river, they almost always took incoming from the tree lines. He would of course, reply in kind with his Oerlikon, which had explosive shells, and that always made the hostiles go away! The general public has never seen an Oerlikon and very few of those who used the thing in combat are still alive. This was an advanced primer ignition blow back, used by the Army, Navy, Air Force, Merchant Marine from WW2 all the way through Vietnam. One reference states that 150,000 of the things were made and were in service during WW2. The WW2 era cannons required greased ammunition to function or it would rip the case in half.

You can see at exactly 2:14 on this WW2 video a Sailor’s hand painting grease on the 20 mm ammunition loading machine for the Oerlikon anti aircraft machine guns.

http://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=9dR3h2HdnBQ


This is a WW2 manual, ammunition greasing instructions are on page 105. \

Oerlikon 20mm machine cannon, Ordnance Pamphlet 911

http://archive.hnsa.org/doc/gun20mm/part4.htm#pg105

Oilers were very common, you can see the oiler function at minute 14 for the Type 92 Japanese Machine gun:

http://www.forgottenweapons.co...mg-at-james-d-julia/


You will find patents for friction reducing coatings if you look:


http://www.google.com/patents/US4041868

Polytetrafluoroethylene
US 4041868 A 1977

quote:

A thin walled steel cartridge case having a substantially larger internal volume than a conventional cartridge case. The cartridge case is fabricated from a high strength, heat treated carbon steel or boron steel and the wall contour in the head area is designed to avoid localized high stress. A low friction coating is applied to the outer surface of the cartridge case and serves to reduce stress concentrations in the head area and to reduce extraction force in the event of interference between the case and the chamber during extraction

quote:

Surely there's a pint for the trouble that's in it.

The point is that I don’t have case head separations. That saves me money.

I have over the last couple years picked up two pre-64 M70's in .300H&H. Due to other rifles to develop loads for my wife and son, I've only recently started working with the first of these two.

Initial results were not great using IMR4350. Okay, but not great. Velocity was nothing to get excited about and accuracy came in at about 1.5".

Last month I started working with Peregrine bullets which are made in South Africa, but a local shop in the Phoenix area stocks them.

I picked up some of their Plains Master bullets in 165gr and 180gr. Results with the 165gr continued to be not so exciting.

But then I worked up loads using the 180gr using H4831 and VV N560. Accuracy came in at less than 1" consistently with both powders. But accuracy was slightly better with the N560 and velocity was nearly 100fps faster with most accurate load in comparison to the most accurate H4831 load.

So it would seem at least for this rifle that slower powder with at least 180gr projectiles works best. The load I got with the 180gr Peregrines and N560 pushed the bullet at about 3010fps.

I also have a .300WM M70 that loves H4831 with 180 and 200 grain bullets. I got an equally accurate load with H4831 and the 180gr Peregrines to the load for the .300H&H. But the velocity was 2950fps. I thought that very interesting that it was slower than the .300H&H which isn't supposed to be the case.

Slam: Great WWII footage. Thanks for posting.

My first 300 H&H was a 721. A couple of years later I bought a pre-64 Model 70 from a buddy and that has been my go-to gun ever since. 4350 and 180 grain Noslers were all I ever used.

It's been to Africa twice, and hunted many, many times here in Canada. I always said I'd take it to my grave with me because almost anything I pointed that gun at died, save for one unfortunate Kudu. The story is in my sig.

Two months ago another buddy, who's always coveted that gun, made me an offer I couldn't refuse on a double rifle. So I let go my favourite gun.

Two weeks after that, I found a custom Mauser 300 H&H at a gun show. No idea who built it, but they did a nice job, except for the porting, but I'll live with that. And I came out $1000 ahead on the whole deal.

Haven't had a chance to fire it yet.

I picked up a pre 64 M70 300 H&H last year. I worked up a load with some 180 gr Sierra Gamekings and RL23 and was very impressed with the accuracy I was getting and the speeds. I'm getting consistent groups of about 3/4" at 3150 fps. I think I'm gonna try to work up a load with some 200 gr Partitions pretty soon and see if it likes them.

quote:

posted 11 January 2017 18:03 Hide Post
I have over the last couple years picked up two pre-64 M70's in .300H&H. Due to other rifles to develop loads for my wife and son, I've only recently started working with the first of these two.

Initial results were not great using IMR4350. Okay, but not great. Velocity was nothing to get excited about and accuracy came in at about 1.5".

I am going to say, 1.5" groups for a period hunting rifle are just fine. These never were target rifles, even if the cartridge is capable of target grade accuracy. I hate to say accuracy is over rated, but, at what level is the inherent accuracy enough?



My Talladega groups pictured in a previous post are at 300 yards, and I have decided that 300 yards is a very long way. Beyond 300 yards bullets drop very quickly and I do not want to attempt a shot over 300 yards, even if I had a way of measuring the distance real time.

Something else, has anyone here really, really seen where their first bullet hit after a cold bore shot? Because I can shoot at CMP Talladega, at distance, I can see the shot placement. The groups I post are after the barrel is nicely fouled, but the first shots, as the barrel fouls, they are all over the place. Plus, estimates based on 100 yard zero's, are way off. It is surprising to find that my best estimate of a 300 yard zero, based on my 100 yard settings, may be in the black. Does not have to be in the black. I think to date, all have been in the black, but some might have been in the seven ring, I do remember some eight ring shots, before the barrel fouled and I dialed in the correct windage and elevation. The lesson to be learned is that zeros have to be determined at the range, not on a calculator or ballistic table. In many threads comparing cartridges, lots and lots of posters quote book values of velocity and ballistics claiming the superiority of their favorite cartridge at 400, 500, 600, 800 yards. You will read this stuff all the time, book values being used to ballyhoo, and it comes from Gunwriters shilling for the latest and greatest. I don't think any of those posters ever shot at anything at distance, and if they did, never actually looked where their first shot went at 400, 500, 600, 800 yards. I am very certain that the first shot was not in the X ring. I typically read Internet where shooters claim to be hitting tea cups at 1000 yards, first shot, and based on my match participation, I don't believe it.



The unstated assumption, is that the shooter can hit the deer. In actual fact, 99.9% of the time, while the rifle is capable of 2 MOA, the shooter's capability is not. It is more probable that the shooter will hit the mountain over on the left side of the picture than hit the deer.

I am comfortable being able to hit a license plate at 300 yards, and if my hunting rifle can do that, then that is good enough. Now my target rifles, they better be able to hit the tea cup at 1000 yards, because that is a different game. Known distances, sighting shots, one minute per shot.

Also, something that needs to be looked at for any pre 64 M70, particularly the pre war M70's (I am old enough to remember that the only war around was WW2) is the bedding. I am currently bedding two pre war M70's and am thinking of bedding a third. The bedding on these rifles is poor. The wood to metal fit is not tight around the receiver. Undo the screws and the receiver lifts out easily. The receiver will slide around in the stock which will show up as left to right movement. Also, barrel bedding is awful. Not only is there a barrel screw through the fore end, but the barrel is purposely "bedded" in the fore end. From what I can tell, rifle makers and shooters wanted to nail the barrel down. They wanted tight barrel to stock fit. This is abhorrent to accuracy. I have spent about two to three hours per pre War M70 carefully removing wood from the barrel channels, checking that a piece of card stock will slide without resistance between the barrel and stock. The side to side gap between barrel and stock is just at the thickness of card stock, the bottom distance is larger. I am also in the process of bedding the second pre War M70, the first I have already bedded. I pillar bedded the things, casting pillars of Devcon stainless filled epoxy, and then I routed an enormous amount of wood behind, below the recoil lug, off the mid sectional ares of the stock. These Devcon epoxies are much stronger than wood and given the skin tight nature of the fit between action and stock and that I have free floated the barrel, I am confident I will be bragging about the post bedding groups. My pre 64 M70 in 300 H&H has a free floated barrel and bedded action and that is a major reason the thing shoots well.

Has anyone shot an animal with the Barnes 175 gr LRX with their H&H?
Worked up to 71.5 H4831sc in my pre 64. Comes in at 1/2-3/4" at 100. Ready to find an animal to confirm bullet.

I shot a deer and a couple of Pronghorns with a Barnes X bullet, in my 300 H&H, not sure but believe it was a 150 or 165 gr. with a max load, it was incredibly distructive, so I went to the 200 gr. Nosler partition for everything, it worked on everything both large and small, so I stuck with that for a lifetime.

My first 300 H&H was a P14 Enfield rebarreled. Good rifle, heavy though. Not that long ago I came across a Sako Mauser actioned 300 H&H. Some one played with it a bit, so I'll have to clean it up and find a nice wood stock for it, but it's nice to have one back in the stable again. - dan

I took a 300H&H to Namibia in 2013 and it worked perfectly loaded with a mild charge of IMR 4831 and the Lapua Naturalis in 170grs.

At the range that load would put 3 shots into .4 to .5 every time.

I shot a common zebra at 280 yards and it was on its nose and rolling down the kopjie.
Took a lot of red hartebeest in a cull.
And the round feeds and ejects much better than newer, sharp shoulder designs.

My high school aged son took his 300 H&H on our last Africa trip. He shot everything from Jackal to Eland with 180 TSX. He also shot 3 zebras stallions for leopard baits. All one shot kills, and nothing ran more 30 yards.