All bullets have a tendency to turn over as they run out of steam when they hit the off side skin, actually most turn just before contact with the off side skin..effects nada one way or the other, it they flip too soon the petals come off and you get a caliber size exit hole thus the internal soup most refer to...That bullet did its job big time, the lack of a big exit hole gives therefore gives a false impression.

quote:

Originally posted by surefire7:
Question: has the tipped 'all metal bullets' solved the occational problem of 'all metal bullets' without the tip of not opening up?

I have never used 'all metal' hunting bullets, but I am considering using the Hornady GMX 250 gr. in my 375 H&H on my next safari. At 2,900 fps, it should shoot flat enough for an anticpated long shot.

I have read on this forum of 'all metal bullets' sometimes not opening and acting like a solid. Just wondering from all of you out there with experinece with the tipped variety, if the tip has solved this problem?

Any information is apprecaited.

I have hunted regularly for many years, using a variety of bullets, most of which I do not use any longer. For the last 15 years or more, I hunt almost exclusively with Barnes X-bullets, in various forms. In a nutshell, they are the closest thing to throwing an "on/off" switch I have found. They do have some special considerations: First, I've found that expansion at 1,800 fps or below is usually poor; I try to keep impact velocities at 2,000+. Impact velocity is what determines my max range when using Barnes bullets (I suspect - but do not know - that it would be similar with other homogeneous expanding bullets). Second, in cartridges with lower velocities and slow rates of twist, the long, solid bullets often do not stabilize and are inaccurate (for example: 250 and 286 grain homogeneous bullets in a 9.3x57 with a 1:14" twist). For heavy homogeneous bullets you need higher velocity or faster twist or both. I have found 1:10" in 9.3 much better than the CPI standard 1:14".

Barnes has successfully resolved several issues that existed with the first X-bullets were released, notably, pressure and copper fouling.

I rarely recover a Barnes bullet. The last were two of the five 150 gr. bullets from a 7mm-08 at a mv of 2,560 which I fired into the boiler room of a running moose at 165 yards. Both those were recovered under the hide on the far side after hitting bone and were well expanded; each had a petal or two broken off. The other three exited. From where he was first hit to where he crumpled was 35 - 40 yards.

When Barnes came out with the original X bullets there were claims of an increased percentage of DRT examples, even where the central nervous system was not touched, or did not seem to be touched.

I may have seen that in '95 when I first tried the X-bullets in a 270. I remember taking two warthogs across a larger than football-stadium low-grass area amid taller grass. The warthogs were feeding. The first warthog didn't move and the second ran off and came back to see his friend. He flipped in the air at the shot and landed on the ground next to his dead buddy. Neither shot appeared to hit the spine, certainly not the one what flipped in the air. But DRT can be explained as an instant cerebral hemorrhage under the right conditions.

I also remember the first reedbuck that my son took with a TTSX in 338. The animal (whitetail sized) dropped in its tracks. No apparent spine contact. The entrance hole was bigger than the exit hole. I was puzzled. A quarter-sized entry and a dime-sized exit. Damage inside was extensive and a shattered leg bone may have sent something to touch and paralyze the nervous system. It's hard to say when field dressing. The animal had not taken a step.

Well, the bullet was not recovered and it was a great success. I have two theories on the small exit hole. "One" is that the petals blew off the 225gnTTSX and the resulting cylinder popped a smaller exit hole after leaving MASSIVE internal damage. Not bad. "Two" is that the petals are sharper than a lead mushroom and can cut their way out of a hide creating a relatively smaller exit hole. There may be other things going on as well.

What I have learned over the years is that monolithics are amazing hunting bullets. They are maybe the closest thing to bullets that guarantee penetration, and after accuracy, the most important feature of a bullet is "guaranteed" penetration.

As for tips, I am very happy with the TTSX. The tips add to the BC, which aids accuracy in resisting wind drift, and adds to damage by helping to preserve velocity. I have not hunted with enough TSX's to know if the TTSX helps expansion. But if either a TSX or TTSX is put in the right place, the animal isn't going too far. Exit wounds are nice, too.

416Tanzan,

You touch on an interesting aspect of the Barnes X-series of bullets: the wounding characteristics, especially entry and exit wounds.

I was quite puzzled by it at first, and even thought I had somehow mistaken which side of the animal was presented to me when I fired, even though I knew I wasn't. All Barnes homogeneous HP bullets (X, XLC, MRX, TSX, TTSX, LRX)(I mention the out-of-production ones because many people still have some) open instantly upon impact, creating massive entry wounds, (heck, I think they open on the hair or hide). This is very unlike conventional bullets, which if they open instantly either shatter or stop penetrating (frangible varmint bullets). X bullets keep going and doing significant damage along the way. The few I have recovered, most under the off-side hide, have simply run out of steam to cut their way through thick hide; most have had all their petals intact but a few had lost a petal or two to hitting bone.

My experience convinces me that X bullets penetrate and kill by instantly opening and cutting, not mushrooming and plowing.

I think the plastic tip aids in increasing the B.C. of the bullet for better aerodynamics but I don't think it can make the bullet open any quicker than it already does. If it allows the bullet to open at lower velocities than the non-tipped version, I don't know. That would be a benefit.

Thanks everyone for all of the info!

On these bullet post, when I read where mr. who dunnit shot 15 deer, 20 elk or 100 rabbits for that matter and everyone of them dropped dead at the shot, I write that suckers credibility off, it just does not happen like that, some of the, run a little ways or more no matter what..

Ive shot a lot of Impala, Sprinbok, whitetail deer with the 375, 416 and 404 and one with a 458 lott, they all tend to run up to 75 yards..With a 22-250 or its ilk, the usually drop on the spot but if they do run, you may never see them again...

At what point did the animal die of the failed bullet since you recovered it is a worn out post that started with a snide remark by a Sierra employee...

To that I may well have replied., When I put two or three more of your bullets into the animal and dead isn't always dead!!

quote:

Originally posted by Atkinson:
On these bullet post, when I read where mr. who dunnit shot 15 deer, 20 elk or 100 rabbits for that matter and everyone of them dropped dead at the shot, I write that suckers credibility off, it just does not happen like that, some of the, run a little ways or more no matter what..

Ive shot a lot of Impala, Sprinbok, whitetail deer with the 375, 416 and 404 and one with a 458 lott, they all tend to run up to 75 yards..With a 22-250 or its ilk, the usually drop on the spot but if they do run, you may never see them again...

Ray, I have shot a mule deer and a whitetail through both lungs on the whitetail, and just below the spine on the mule deer. Using the 160 grain TSX in my 7mm Remington Magnum, both dropped instantly.

Ok......

That's 2 animals