I am knida in a predicament here.

The biggest gun I have is a .308(And it is in retirement to pass down to my son. I deer hunt with a Sendero .25-06.

Heres my delima, I am looking into Moose, Elk, Mule Deer and Hogs over the next few years with freinds. A freind has a .300 Ultra. I have found one that I really like and am in the process of possibly buying it. I know there is a great difference between the .25-06 and the .300 Ultra Mag. But I am thinking that is a big space and for Hogs and Mulies it may be over kill not to mention cost of ammo. Heres my deal, I would like to know what caliber would in your opinion be a great caliber between the .25-06 and the .300 Ultra Mag? Maybe for the Hogs, Mulies and possibly Elk.

I Reload and have considered the 7 Mag, 7 STW, and 300 Win mag(as the in between calibers). However I have never reloaded Belted Mags and have heard they are alittle difficult in comp. to non belted cases. From what I have read on here people really like the 300 Win Mag due to the choices in bullet weights and recoil selection due to powder charges and bullet weights. Are there any others that you all may suggest as well?

*****I must add that I am not a fan of the WSM, WSSM, and SAUM; not to offend anyone. But I just will not bring them into consideration.

This may sound stupid but and been milled over thousands of times. But it is an honest question and I have really enjoyed reading everyones different inputs on other topics around here.

Thanks in advance,

CNF

280 Remington or a 30-06 would be tied for my #1 choice. If the 27 caliber floats your boat get a 270.

After you really decided you just can't live without a mag I would explore magnum options, but for the hunting you just described you really don't need it.

There is no such thing as "overkill." I suggest a 9.3x62 or .35 Whelen or .376 Steyr in non-belted cases.

Bigger? I was gonna suggest a 375 H&H but you dont want to load belted brass. SOOOOO...... is the 375 RUM big enough? Since you reload, you can load it down. Mine is fairly nice to shoot off the bench with 250gr bullets over 92-95gr RL22. My hunting load with those 250's s sitting on 98.2gr. Or, try a 338 RUM, and handload it down till you get comfortable with it. If you dont like the RUM stuff, try the 338 Lapua.

I agree wholeheartedly with interboat in regards to overkill. I use my 338/378 for everything. Deer, hogs, even jackrabbits. If it were me, I'd go ahead and get the 300 RUM. Then if you want to make it a little more tame, just load it down a tad. That way you atleast have the power in reserve if you need it. THat being said, if you wanted to go with something smaller, like a 7 Mag, or 300 Win etc. there's no big mystery or difficulty with belted cases. They resize and load just the same as everything else. What's the point in getting one of those though when you get just get the 300 RUM and be done with it.

I would go with a 300 Mag or a 338 Mag. Either would work for what you mentioned. The 338 is my favorite caliber. As to the difficulty with the belt, its all BS.

30-06 will dispatch anything you want to hunt, nuff said. Jay

CNF
Lets see if I understand.
OK you have a 25-06 Sendero, for deer, and want something bigger, for bigger game out west.

Any of the calibers you mentioned would be OK. Some of them have a lot of ballistic overlap.

I have used a 300 Magnum [Weatherby, and currently a 300 Win] and like them quite a bit.
I would get a rifle lighter than the Sendero for hunting out west.

If you have a 25-06 and a 300 Mag, you really do not need a 7Mag. Nothing wrong with them but you have that catagory covered.

I would then get a 338 or a 375 for anything your 300 would be a little light on.

I like the 338 a lot, but I use the 375 Mag.
I like the choice of lightly constructed bullets for the 375 so I can light load it for deer and pigs. Thus getting a lot more use of the rifle.

So with 25-06, a 300 Mag, and a 375 H&H, you just about have it all covered.
If you prefer the 300 ultra, go for it.

Go shoot your buddy's 300 Ultra (if you haven't already) and see what the recoil level does for you. That will help decide where to go next.

Also, what is the max range you'll take a shot? All you really get in a magnum is the power of the non-magnum a little farther out. Useful if you hunt long range but unecessary if you shoot 300 yds or less.

As far as the belt being a reloading issue, I never found it to matter. In fact, I'm 52 and hadn't heard that before your post. They all load pretty much the same.

If you want a magnum but your preference isn't particulaly developed, it's really hard to go wrong with the 300 Winchester. It's among the top three calibers on virtually every continent that has sport hunting. I think it and the 30-06 are #2 & #1 respectively in Scandinavia right now.

Second choice might be the 338 Win Mag even though I just argued against it in a lower thread (but the circumstances around the question were different than this time).

The 7 STW, 8 Mag, 300 Wby, 340 Wby and even the 375 are good choices but serve slightly narrower niches or have way more recoil than the ubiquitous 300 Win.

Your .308 is an adequate rifle for any of the game you've mentioned.

Obviously, .308 is "adequate" but if you are in the mood for something new, I would suggest a .338 RUM and put a nice muzzle brake on it. I have loaded 275 A-frames on down to 180 Nosler BT's and all shoot well. Certainly, a .338 RUM is not "magic" and shot palcement is much more important than what you shoot it with....but it is a fun gun to have.

IV

You obviously need a 9.3x62.

quote:

Originally posted by tiggertate:

The 7 STW, 8 Mag, 300 Wby, 340 Wby and even the 375 are good choices but serve slightly narrower niches or have way more recoil than the ubiquitous 300 Win.

True. you should see the look on the faces of other shooters when I start shootin the 375. Some of em might be shootin a 300, and when I offer for them to take it for a spin, they shake their heads and walk away. Definately a whole different level of recoil, and my gun weighs over 9#. The gun moves me more, but recoil is not as sharp as say an 870 shooting slugs, or a super lightweight 7mm or 300. I had to shoot my 870 the other day to get it sighted in for slugs, and I really didnt like it. Picked up the 375, and the push was actually nicer than the punch from the 870. If you scope it, you really have to be on your toes. If you do not use proper form EVERY time, you'll get whacked. Not that I am trying to scare you away from a truly bigger gun.

Thanks all, I think I have decided to go with the 300 Win Mag due to the advice that the belt is not a factor. I realize the .308 is good enough. But I want something new and like I said it is going to my boy. Sounds like it can cover the listed game. I will look into the 375 H&H ond .338 as well. I really appreciate everyones help and advice.

I know your not trying to scare me off the H&H. But is there anything in the states you can hunt with it that you can't hunt with the 300 Win Mag?

quote:

Originally posted by Cupped_N_Fallin:
I know your not trying to scare me off the H&H. But is there anything in the states you can hunt with it that you can't hunt with the 300 Win Mag?

The saber toothed ground squirrel. I bought a 375 H&H for a stopping gun.

Armadillos @ 20yd dont like the 375 either...

I don't think so. It works on bear, moose, cougar, elk, deer, rabbits, squirrels, (Armadillos are supposed to eat fire ants so I don't shoot them anymore, but I have my doubts) coyotes, wolves, assorted #@$&%! fish eating birds that I can't name (but no raptors, I promise), javelina, countless hogs, exotics of all stripes, catfish, #@$&%! fish eating turtles (wow, just try a 130 gr TSX at 3600 fps), prairie dogs, ferral cats, turkey necks, water bottles, Tannerite...

Did I leave out anything?

I think you need to consider 2 things. 1 being the biggest game on your agenda. Sounds like moose to me. And the other factor is the terrain you will be hunting in. Are long shots a real posibility ? A .338 is great for big stuff, out to 400 yards, and a 300 is a good round too. But it is not my 1st choice for moose.
By the way you will not find any real trouble reloading for the belted rounds.
A 35 whelen or a 9.3X62 would be a gass out to 300 and 250 respecivly, and I bet you would have a ball with a 45/70 if you keep your shots around 200, and when I geta chance to reload the new Hornady bullets it might be a 300 yard rifle but i doubt it...tj3006

I shot my last Elk with a 300 RUM and like it a lot but I think you might be better served overall by moving up to a 338 Win mag. If I ever get a chance to hunt Brown Bears or Grizzly's I would rather have my 338 Win Mag in hand than my 300 RUM. I see the 300 RUM as more of a long range medium game round and the 338 as a good all around medium bore. The 338 will also work better in a shorter barreled rifle if Handiness is a factor.
The 9,3x62 is also a great choice IMHO. I just finished my third one. I think that it would be harder to find ammo for it in Alaska than the 338 Win mag. In Europe or Africa it might be the other way around.
The good old 300 Win Mag is another nice round and is probably a better first Magnum round than the 300 RUM. The 300 RUM can get into the painfull to shoot range for a lot of people, whereas most experienced shooters can deal with a 300 Win without much trouble..............DJ

You're on the right track.

300 win mag

No problems loading for it.

quote:

Originally posted by schromf:
280 Remington or a 30-06 would be tied for my #1 choice. If the 27 caliber floats your boat get a 270.

After you really decided you just can't live without a mag I would explore magnum options, but for the hunting you just described you really don't need it.

A .338-06 ain't a bad option but all in all there's a lot of wisdom in the above post.

.30-06

Lets see if I can complicate things... Your 308 is a great rifle, the 300 ultra will use the same bullet around 500 fps faster. If you are going to get that level of recoil, I would seriosly look at the 338 mag. (I would suggest the 375 but that would put you in to the big bore board) Belted cases are not that much harder to reload, moast modern rifles head space off of the bottle neck anyways, you would reload it like your 25-06.

John

How about a .300WinMag and a .375H&H? I have the .300 and love it and have a .375 being made. I think that will be a perfect set for here and also for Africa. Good luck!

Depends. If you like the 300 Ultra and the recoil doesn't bother you, if you like the rifle, grab it. It is a great 'reach out there' cartridge.
Otherwise you might consider a good 30-06, or perhaps one of the other 300 mags.
My reach out and touch them rifle is an AI in 338 Lapua, a great rifle, but I doubt you will need that type of performance.
Or Vapodogs suggestion. Since you reload, perhaps a 338-06? It was the one I had originally considered, until the need to hit targets out past 1200m came along (paper or steel, not critters!).
Since an awful lot of people have voted 30-06, I reckon you wont go far wrong with that round.
JMHO

Cheers, Dave.

First forget all that crap about belted cases being hard to reload - I don't think you are going to be shooting so that you need to get into case life, etc. etc. If you are really dead set against belted cases go with the .300 WSM - just don't think about bullets heavier than 180 grains.

Since you have a 25-06 and obviously don't have a problem with heavier rifles, I'd go get a .300 Win Mag and be done with it. I did not see large bears on your list and nothing on your list can't be taken with a 180 or 200 grain bullet out of .300 Win Mag case. Nice and flat shooting, not too much recoil, ammo in every gun store on the planet - what's not to like.

Having had one, and taken game with one, I would think for your hunting preferences a good medium sporter of about 7.5 lbs (bare) of either Remington or Winchester (wouldn't a Supergrade be nice to have right now) would be the perfect choice.

The .338 Win Mag (I've got one for sale) is a much heavier kicker as would be the .300 Ultra Mag. The Ultra Mag also has the liability of limited ammo availability and lesser resale value.

.300 Weatherby, or a 8mm Rem mag

The 338 win mag is way more versitle than the 376 or 9.3 calibers.I think the 376 will be in with the wssm shooters one day not far away very quite due to lack of ammo and brass.I think the 338 win mag will still be around 50 years from now if we still have guns then.Get a Ruger stainless 77 338 win mag and be done with it.I had a 300 win mag and there is a big difference in the killing power of the 338 vs the 300 win mag.I switched to 338 win mag for my all around big game rifle.

quote:

The .338 Win Mag (I've got one for sale) is a much heavier kicker as would be the .300 Ultra Mag. The Ultra Mag also has the liability of limited ammo availability and lesser resale value.

Perhaps Redlander has run into a stock fit issue. I own or have owned 7 or 8 different 338 Win Mags, and 5 different 300 Ultra's, including otherwise identical rifles in the 2 calibers. To me the 300 Ultra is noticably nastier to shoot than the 338 Win mag and again I've shot identical rifles side by side.

Another way of looking at the 300 Ultra is that it will shoot the same exact bullets that your 308 Win shoots to the same velocity at 250yds that you 308 shoots them at the muzzle. Again it's a longer range 30 Cal. All a 300 Mag does is shoot the same size bullets a little faster or to the same impact velocity further away. A 338 or 375 adds versitility in that it will shoot larger heavier deeeper penetrating bullets that you might need for larger game..............DJ

Cupped N Fallin:
The .300 Win Mag is a great choice. It is more than enough gun for any of the game that you are considering hunting, and factory ammo is available everywhere if you need it. I reload for that caliber as well as several others, and I do not find any difference at all in terms of the difficulty between reloading belted and non-belted cartridges.

quote:

Originally posted by Jay Gorski:
30-06 will dispatch anything you want to hunt, nuff said. Jay

I couldn't agree more. Talk about making it simple! I'll take my .06 for elk anyday and shoot with complete confidence to 400 yards, no hesitation---(with a Barnes TSX).

My second choice would be a 300 Win Mag for your purposes. (Even though I own a 300 RUM).

Forget the crap about belted cases and reloading. I've loaded 300wm and 7mmRM for years, never had a problem.

Oops, I see a few other posts stating the same. Sorry, I answered from reading your post at the top without reading all the others first.

You'll be completely satisfied with a 300WM.

I will second DJ's comment on the Ultra kicking more than the 338, and more for sure than a 300 mag. I also agree that the belt is not an issue in reloading a given round, although I personally just don't like belts.
Having said that, if your inclined to the 300 win mag, that is a great round as others have stated, and ammo is available around the world, if that matters. If you don't like a belt 30.06 will do you!

Don't get a Ultra Mag. They don't kill anything deader than a 30-06 or a 300 Win Mag. Plus there brass is spendy and so is loaded ammo. Plus UM ammo is hard to find in the middle of Alaska, the Yukon, or BC.

Thanks guys, with everything being said. I have anchored it down and am for sure getting the 300 win mag. I believe a bigger gun may be in the works also. I have heard everyone talk about the 338 and the 375 H&H.

Next question: is the 338 to close to the 300WM or would one go to the 375 H&H? I really like what I am reading about the 338. This would be used onthe bigger species of game that I have mentioned. This is a serious question. So if it sounds stupid, please be gentle.

CNF

Heck, some folks use a 270 to shoot elk, so go figure about using a bigger gun for that. Anyhow, a lot of folks would feel comfortable using the 300WM for elk too. The 338 RUM,WM, or 340 WBY loaded with 250gr bullets will even work on bears(Some use the 300 for that too), and the 338 is accurate, and has reach too. The 375 loaded with 300gr bullets will take care of ANYTHING in NA, to include Africa. The overlap is shooting 250gr bullets out of the 375, compared to the 338. On the same token, you can load down the 338 to 300WM performance too. If it were me, I would get the 375. if youre gonna go big, then dammit go big. Hell, I would get a 416. Get a 450 RIGBY! GO BIG!!

You will be very happy with the 300 Win Mag. I personally would be very confortable shooting anything on your list with a 300 SAUM 300WSM or 30-06. Even the Alaska web site says anything with a 150 gr bullet at 2500fps or greater is plenty for moose. There is no need for a 375H&H in America but I am going to get one simply because it is a classic caliber and if a dream hunt to Africa ever happens I will be ready.

Have fun shopping for the new toys.

quote:

Originally posted by Cupped_N_Fallin:
Thanks guys, with everything being said. I have anchored it down and am for sure getting the 300 win mag. I believe a bigger gun may be in the works also. I have heard everyone talk about the 338 and the 375 H&H.

Next question: is the 338 to close to the 300WM or would one go to the 375 H&H? I really like what I am reading about the 338. This would be used onthe bigger species of game that I have mentioned. This is a serious question. So if it sounds stupid, please be gentle.

CNF

If you were to keep your .308, I would say get the .375 hands down. For a single gun in North America, the 338 is hard to beat. The .375 is an excellent caliber, but I wouldn't want to take an antelope with it. The .338 bullets have a much higher BC than the 30 cal of the same weight. My wife bought herself a 338 win mag this year (ruger mark II stainless), and I must say, it is more comfortable to shoot than my 300 win mag was (browning a-bolt). She likes the show off factor and the idea that she can shoot deer, pigs, bear, brown bear, african planes game with just one rifle.

John

As a proud owner of a 300WinMag I can say you made the right move. It's been very easy to reload. In fact it's what I started reloading with. It gave me 1MOA groups from the first batch and has improved from there.

From 25-06 to 300WinMag to 416Rem in my opinion.

quote:

I Reload and have considered the 7 Mag, 7 STW, and 300 Win mag(as the in between calibers). However I have never reloaded Belted Mags and have heard they are a little difficult in comp. to non belted cases.

As long as your chamber is cut properly, there is NO DIFFERENCE at all between reloading for a rimless beltless case and one that has a belt........... 'F I were you, and planned mainly on shooting elk and moose, I'd choose a .338 #Win. or a .375 H&H........ Both will do nicely for the smaller stuff, and ruin less meat than the smaller, faster bullets!