Nosler is representing that their new Nosler Custom™ Ammunition for the Whelen will launch a 225 gr. Nosler Partition at 2725 ft/sec. That is a 125 ft/sec. faster than Federal’s Premiums and validates just how lethargically Remington loads their factory ammunition for the Whelen.

Remington deserves credit for commercializing the Whelen and making this super chambering available for average guys like me, but they also did this round a great disservice by under loading their factory ammunition as drastically as they did. For those of us that don’t reload, the Nosler Custom Ammunition allows us to get a bigger piece of the Whelen’s potential. CP.

http://www.noslerammunition.com/35WHELEN225PT.html

CP. While I agree with your comments on Remington not properly loading the .35 Whelen, we have to be realisic about it. How many old Winchester Mod. 95s in 30-06 have been rebored to the Whelen? I surely know of at least one, because I almost bought the damn thing. How many low numbered Springfields as well? Methinks a properly loaded .35 Whelen round might make scrap metal out of some of those guns. Yup! The liability lawyers strike again. That's the same reason the reload data I've seen is in the same range. Looking at some of the load data from early manuals and comparing them to today's data is a bit of something else. I've tried working up to some of those old loads, and no way! I have sosme other gripes about how Remington and Ruger treated the Whelen, like using a 1 in 16" twist rather than a proper 1 in 12", but that's another matter. I have a Remington Classic, Ruger 77 RS and a custom Mauser all in .35 Whelen and only the Mauser has a 1 in 14" twist. The next one will have the 1 in 12" twist.
That Nosler ammo does sound like it's going to be a good deal. I'll be trying some when I can find it.
Paul B.

quote:

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Originally posted by CP:
Nosler is representing that their new Nosler Custom™ Ammunition for the Whelen will launch a 225 gr. Nosler Partition at 2725 ft/sec. That is a 125 ft/sec. faster than Federal’s Premiums and validates just how lethargically Remington loads their factory ammunition for the Whelen.

Remington deserves credit for commercializing the Whelen and making this super chambering available for average guys like me, but they also did this round a great disservice by under loading their factory ammunition as drastically as they did. For those of us that don’t reload, the Nosler Custom Ammunition allows us to get a bigger piece of the Whelen’s potential. CP.

http://www.noslerammunition.com/35WHELEN225PT.html

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More importantly Nosler chose the correct bullet weight for this cartridge. I have always considered 225 grains to be the optimal weight for both the 35 Whelen and the 350 RM. I also agree with Paul about the 1-12" twist rate.

That is great news. I too consider the 225 grain bullet to be the best "all around" load in the .35 Whelen. I get 2630 fps with the Federal 225 gr. TBBC load in my rifle. That load has accounted for a fair number of big game ranging from 40 lbs up to 1500 lbs, and all have been one shot kills. Is the Whelen load available yet? I also have seen on the Remington website, it appears that they have made the Whelen available on a regular basis in the Model 700 CDL line.

Duckster, I believe that it is available on line at the following address: CP.

http://www.nosler.com/customammo.html

you have me scared as i was ready to order a rem 700 in 35 whelen. but if the twist aint right? how much does this effect accuracy?

Is it the new CDL model with a 1 in 16 twist? I have the Classic, made in 1988. I actually don't know the twist on my rifle but it has always been MOA or less with every 225 or 250 grain load that I have tried. It is usually right at MOA with the 200 grain Rem. factory load.

On the Nosler website, I couldn't get the ballistics for the 250 grain Partition load. Anyone else get these to come up?

yes new cdl

Mike

Don't worry about the CDL. I just spent the weekend with one and a Leupold 2-7X. It cloverleafed the 200 gr Hornady's and held the 225's and 250's to an inch. All with IMR4064.

WN

I have two .35 Whelens; one in a Remington 7600 and the other a Mauser Mark X with a Shaw barrel. The 7600 has the 1:16 twist (22") and the Mark X has a 1:14 twist. They both will shoot inside an inch with 180gr. to 250gr. bullets; although the 180gr. and 200gr. bullets print significantly higher than the other weights. I've been following the discussion on this forum, as well as in manuals and magazines. If there is something magic about twists I've not discovered it yet in the last 40 years. I do believe you can "overdrive" a "short" bullet in a "fast" twist as you can under-stabilize a long bullet in a "slow" twist; however, by adjusting the velocity of the load (to do neither) one can usually find an accurate (and usuable) load combination. There maybe a "best" twist for a given weight of bullet, but I believe most twists are suited for a range of bullets, eg. most .308 Winchesters have 1:12 where most 30/06 have a 1:10. Does the 30/06 handle 220gr. bullets better than the .308, or is it because it can drive the 220gr. bullet faster and/or has a longer neck to grip the bullet?
The other interesting topic of the discussion of the Whelen is regarding the + P loading of the 225gr. by Nosler. I too have regarded the Whelen underloaded by Remington and have come to believe it was because of old Springfield conversions that influence even the reloading manuals. It seems most on this forum agree on that assumsion. However, I do not agree that the 225gr. is the optimum weight for the caliber, while I would conceed that it is probably the best for the .350 Rem. Mag (I also own); not because it is optimum, but because of the Rem Mag's short neck and magazine. If you consider the 225gr's sectional density (S.D.) of .251 it compares with a 165gr. (.30 cal.) bullet. Even the 250gr. .35 cal's sectional density is only .279 (much like the .30 cal's 180gr.). Now what would you say if a company only sold 30/06 ammo in a 165 and 180gr.? Many Northern moose and bear hunters using that caliber might not be real happy, eh? It is no wonder the 9.3X62 makes the .35 Whelen look like a .358 Winchester with its 270 and 286gr. bullets with much better sectional densities that are reputed to outpenetrate even the .375. I'm not suggesting the sectional density is everything (although I tend to agree with the late Finn Aagaard that more penatration is always better when shooting large animals); for bullet construction and "core" integrety are also "major players. I just think that the .35 Whelen needs heavier bullets to perform to its full potential and Swift is the only company that has answered that demand with a 280gr. How about Speer reviving the 275gr. or a creating a new heavier bullet with a S.D. close to .300 for us Keith fans. Thanks for your indulgence. Mags

I think it is interesting that Nosler took a higher velocity with the 225 grain load. Quite a bit higher than anything listed in their manual. I do think that load takes you more to the real potential of the Whelen. As far as the sectional density issue, I think that when you get into the heavier bullet weight, regards of caliber (within reason) the sectional density becomes less of a concern than when using a small caliber on relatively large game, i.e. if you are using a 7mm on moose or eland, than you want all the penetration that you can get. Whereas if you are using a bullet that is already .358 in diameter and 60 grains heavier, the sectional density becomes less of a issue. In over 16 head of big game, I have only recovered one 225 grain bullet from the Whelen, this was from a kudu on a strongly quartering shot at 240 yards. I have had complete penetration on eland as well as bull moose.

Now if I were using the Whelen for dangerous game (big bears) I would error on the side of more sectional density, for sure at least 250 grains and maybe the 280 grain slug. What is the sectional density for the 280 grain .358 anyway?

Never mind, I found it, .312 for the 280 grainer.

What kind of velocity can you get from that bullet in the Whelen? I don't have a Swift reloading manual.

Mags. In 1967, Hornady dropped it's 275 gr. 35 caliber bullet. I E-mailed them a while back about seeing if they'd make a run of these considereing the fact that the .35 Whelen was now a legitimate cartridge. They were not interested. The few I have are definitely not Interlocks.

The first edition of the Hornady reloading manual gave a top velocity of 2300 FPS with the 275 gr. round nose with the versions of 3031,4064, 4895, 4320 BL-c2 and H-380 of the period. (1967 copyright date) Current versions of those powders may be faster burning so may not be usable.

It is my belief that when Howe and Whelen developed the cartridge, they picked the 1 in 12" twist because they envisioned 250 and 275 gr. bullets to be the proper weights for the round. I've had no trouble stabilizing bullets uo to 250 gr. in either a Remington 700 Classic or a Ruger 77RS. I only have 35 of the original Hornady 275 gr. bullets on hand, and wish to save them for a 1 in12" twist barrel for a planned on new rifle.
Paul B.

Thanks Paul; I guess us 35 Whelen fans will just have to keep "badgering" the bullet companies until they feel they have a big enough market to make some "heavys". I live close to the Sierra factory and I keep putting in my request for a 250gr. or heavier .35 cal bullets to no avail. I have not been able to try any 275gr. or 300gr. (old original) Barnes in my 1;14 twist Mark X at this time, but sooner or later will find a source. I did read a report that stated that the 300gr. shot more accurately than the 275 (go figure). I have been looking for a Lyman 358009 mold to cast some heavier bullets, but it seems the they stopped making that mold several years ago. Regards - Mags

Has anyone been able to get the ballistics for the 250 grain Partition load to come up on the Nosler website?

I ordered a box of the 225 grain Partions, I will post a range report after I get out and try them out.

Duckster, a month or so ago, Nosler’s web page had more information than it does today. Go figure. I noticed that they also took down the ballistic page for their future .350 Rem. Mag. offering. However, I printed it before it went away and with it still in hand, they represented that a 225 gr. Partition was going to be launched at 2600 ft/sec in that load. The asking price for the .350 Rem Mag ammunition was $59.95/20. CP.

Well, I suppose there will be a few glitches, due to the fact that this a new undertaking for Nosler, on this scale at least.

The loads for the .35 W in the nosler manual are anemic. This is the result of 1895 winchesters and Remington pumps being chambered for this round. Like Remington autos, neither of those guns is up to the full power loads of a good bolt gun.

Some manuals do the same w/ the .280 for the same reason - loading less powder than the .270 w/ the same bullet weight even though there is both more case capacity and bore volume. Take a look at the Barnes manual on the .35W and you will see their loads are significanctly hotter and more realistic of the cartridge potential.

Beartrack,

What does Barnes list for the 250 grain bullet in the Whelen?

You might be interested in these .358 heavies: Northfork makes a 270gr., Barnes Originals are available in 300 grs., and Woodliegh makes a 310 gr. pill for those that want to compare their .35 to a .375. I would think the 270 gr. Northfork would work really well in the Whelen.

Mags and others. Mt. Baldy Bullet Co sells a 280 gr WLN style cast bullet. I have used it in the 358 WCF but not yet in the Whelen. I might be able to find some Hornady 275 Gr.s at 50 bullets to the box. Can we still send PMs around here with the changes? Later Packrattusnongratus

Well, I received my order from Nosler today and it turns out they shipped 250 grain Partition instead of the 225 grain load. It lists a muzzle velocity of 2550 fps. I called Nosler and they said that is what I ordered from the website, but you can't bring up the page to show the ballistics and the "buy now" tab from the .35 Whelen page so I don't know how I could have done that? It still probably isn't a bad load, but not the all-around load that I was wanting.

One of my hunting buddies just booked a brown bear hunt in Russia at the SCI convention. He has been thinking of converting a Mark X in .270 to .35 Whelen. Any recs for a load for the Whelen for brownies? Maybe the Nosler load with 250 gr. Partition at 2550 is the best choice?

I had a 35 Whelen AI built on a 1917 Eddystone action. I was told after the fact by someone that should know (but may be just a know-it-all that doesn't) that the Eddystones were improperly heat treated and brittle as a result. The smith that did the work said the action was very hard which may well mean brittle. If this is the case I'll not try to push it to the limit or use these new Nosler loads

Strange as I cannot get them to return emails on this subject. Actually I want some of each of the 225 and 250's but for the life of me cannot confirm that they even are making the 250's as like you say they do not come up on their website.

quote:

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Originally posted by duckster:
Well, I received my order from Nosler today and it turns out they shipped 250 grain Partition instead of the 225 grain load. It lists a muzzle velocity of 2550 fps. I called Nosler and they said that is what I ordered from the website, but you can't bring up the page to show the ballistics and the "buy now" tab from the .35 Whelen page so I don't know how I could have done that? It still probably isn't a bad load, but not the all-around load that I was wanting.

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quote:

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Originally posted by robroy:
I had a 35 Whelen AI built on a 1917 Eddystone action. I was told after the fact by someone that should know (but may be just a know-it-all that doesn't) that the Eddystones were improperly heat treated and brittle as a result. The smith that did the work said the action was very hard which may well mean brittle. If this is the case I'll not try to push it to the limit or use these new Nosler loads

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I think you action should be OK. The bad ones usually cracked when removing the original barrel. I've heard said it was because the original barrels were screwed on too tight on a fairly hard action and that they'd crack when removing the barrel. It believe you action. like the Springfield 03s had a fairly hard casehardening on the surface, which would explain the gunsmiths stating it was hard.
When I worked for a guinsmith, he would put the Eddystone barrel into his lathe and take a cut on the barrel where it entered the action, thus relieving the pressure. he made several into .375 H&H and 458 Win, mags and none of them ever blew up. I have an Eddystyone right now that was rebarrelled for use in WW-2 with a Springfield (Remington???) two groove barrel. They didn't blow, they just cracked when being rebarrelled.
Paul B.

Thanks Paul

Muy,

That is what I thought was strange. You can't even log on to the page to buy the 250s and can't email to customer service. I called and they were going to have someone call me back. I have not heard anything yet. I hope this is not always how the customer service will be!

duckster, have you had a chance to try the ammo? I went ahead and ordered the 225's in hopes I get the 250's! Actually I wanted to try them both. Also ordered the 375 H&H in the 260 accubond bullet just to see the accuracy of their ammo. Like you I certainly have hopes that the ammo is much superior to their communications.

I just read this thread for the first time. It appears a lot of Whelen fans think like me that a bullet heavier than 250 gr. is desireable. I also feel that at Whelen velocities we don't really need a premium bullet. So I decided to obtain a Corbin Bullet reducing die for about $95 and reduce any of the 9.3mm bullets to .358". The one I've done the most is the Speer 9.3mm 270 gr. Hotcor, but I've also reduced the Nosler 9.3mm 286 gr. partition (though I haven't shot these). I've shot one black bear with the 270 gr. (broadside heart shot at 140 yds) and it performed quite well.

This is the cheapest way to get mass-produced heavies that I know of. I'll provide 'em to you Whelen fans for cost plus shipping, free labor-wise, plus I'd like $2/box to help amortize my die cost. That's whatever 9.3mm you want reduced.

I'll have to cancell this offer if I get too many requests, 'cause I don't have a lot of spare time.

Happy hunting...Long Live The Whelen!
Jerry/AK

quote:

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Originally posted by mags:
Thanks Paul; I guess us 35 Whelen fans will just have to keep "badgering" the bullet companies until they feel they have a big enough market to make some "heavys". I live close to the Sierra factory and I keep putting in my request for a 250gr. or heavier .35 cal bullets to no avail. I have not been able to try any 275gr. or 300gr. (old original) Barnes in my 1;14 twist Mark X at this time, but sooner or later will find a source. I did read a report that stated that the 300gr. shot more accurately than the 275 (go figure). I have been looking for a Lyman 358009 mold to cast some heavier bullets, but it seems the they stopped making that mold several years ago. Regards - Mags

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Mags. After several years of badgering Lyman on the #3589/358009 mold, I finally found one used at a gun shop. I've seen them sell for $100 up on E-bay. I gave $25 for the one I found. Guess some people really want them awful bad.
Anyway, on the old Shooters.com, a group of us got together and sent David Mos samples of the #3589, Lyman's old number and had hum make up molds that duplicated the Lyman with a slight change. We had him put a small flat on the nose of the bullet, about 1/8 of an inch in size and we named it the 3589I (for improved). About 25 people showed interest in the mold, but only six put their money where their mouth was. I have one, nuff said?
The #3589 I have is defective, and must have been made about the time the cherry wore out as the gas check shank is too small to hold even the Hornady crimp on checks. I fixed it by a process called "Beagling". You can find out how to do thin on www.castbullets.com. Basically, you use aluminum tape to hold the mold halves farther apart. I've salvaged two molds by this process. Hasn't seemed to hurt the accuracy any, and two molds that would have been junked are now usable.
NEI makes a mold that is roughly 289-290 gr. depending on the alloy used. All Miller did a writeup on it in, I belive Handloader magazine. The one he had was NEI #358-282GC with the DD ring. Price is $117.00 plus S&H. A friend of mine has that mold and sent me 50 of the raw bullets. His alloy weighs out at 290 gr. It's a good looking bullet with a decent flat on the nose for hunting use. His rifle has a 1 in 10" twist which should handle that bullet well. I'm thinking a 1 in 12 should work as well.
Anyway, check out that NEI mold. It just might be what you're looking for.
Paul B.

Thanks for the info Paul. I'll check e-bay. I'll be interested in how your 1:12 project is going and how your friend's rifle shoots the 290 "grainers". One individual mentioned about "sizing down" 9.3 bullets to .358. I once ordered a die from a fellow in Montana for my .318 bore to resize the normal .323 rounds. I lubed the bullets and drove them through the dies with a pucnch, much like you would do in an "old" Lee die, wiped them off and loaded up. As was suggested to me, Speer bullets worked well, others not as well (the jackets were easy to damage with the punch on other brands). Mags

My Corbin die fits in a reloading press and doesn't use a driven punch.
Jerry/AK

Muygrande,

The weather here in Nebraska hasn't been great on the free days that I have had since getting the ammo. I tried to call, and they have not gotten back to me yet. Did you have any luck with the email contact link? Were you able to even order the 250 grain loads, or did it give you a "page not available" message?

So far, I have not found a load for my Whelen that would not shoot well, of course there are only 4 factory loads, now just 3. When I first got my Whelen, you could still find the Remington 250 grain roundnoses. These actually shot a little better than the 250 grain spitzers for me. The Federal 225 grain TBBC has always been a sub MOA load from my rifle. I have used this load for hunting nearly exclusively, and have only recovered one bullet.

duckster, I had zero response with email. I have not tried to call just went ahead and ordered and will see what arrives. Yes, I got the page not available on the 250's as well. My rifle is the Ruger tang safety older model and it did not like the Federal 225 TBBC offering but does shoot the Remington 200 and 250's nicely. I have high hopes for the Nosler ammo.

Muygrande,

Well, if you get the 225 grain and want the 250s, maybe we could arrange a trade? I have not been out to shoot any of mine yet. At this point, most of my shooting with the Whelen doesn't require a 250 grain slug, I would be just as happy with the 225s.

Well, I have to say that Nosler is type of company that I have always thought they were, I got to speak to someone regarding my order in which I received the 250 grain load instead of the 225 grain load. I was informed that because of their mix up, they were sending me the 225 grain load at no charge and I was to keep the 250 grain load as well. They were very pleasant regarding the whole situation. I have to say "TWO THUMBS UP FOR NOSLER!" I am anxious to get to the range to try it out. Real customer service is not dead, it looks like I may be using their ammo for all of my needs from now on.

There seems to be a number of users of the .35 Whelen here so I have a question or two to ask. I am in the process of building my .35 Whelen(on a Rem. M721 action) and am wondering what everyone thinks of the Barnes 225 gr. TSX bullet? What is the best powder you have found for use in the Whelen? Lawdog

duckster, perhaps I will get the same treatment. Still does not answer how you in fact can order the 250 gr ammo with a window that does not open? Let me know how yours shoots as mine as yet to arrive. How long was the shipping on yours?

Lawdog, the TSX is a very accurate bullet in several rifles I shoot with factory ammo but have not shot it in the Whelen. Should be a great bullet for handloading the Whelen.

I have had good results with RL 15, but have not used the Barnes TSX yet. I would like to give it a try at some point.