September next year I will be hunting plains game in Namibia . I have been advised that a barrel band is a good idea to avoid the barrel catching as I push through the bush . It will be on my 30.06 . Is this a good idea ? What position should it be on the barrel .

Mark

I think about two inches in front of the forend, twelve inches in front of the receiver ring. Don't know what that works out in CM's though. One thing, it may be a little tough to install if you have a permanently mounted front sight.

quote:

Originally posted by Jim Kobe:
I think about two inches in front of the forend, twelve inches in front of the receiver ring. Don't know what that works out in CM's though. One thing, it may be a little tough to install if you have a permanently mounted front sight.

Approximately 2.5 cm to the inch.

I have come to like the front sling swivel in front of the forestock so yes, I think it's a good idea. I haven't measured any of mine but Jim's suggestions seem very close.

Mark,

Namibia has alot of varying terrain however it is certainly more well known for it's open plains than bushveld.

Your choice; don't get me wrong I'm a sucker for a well-executed barrel band swivel & front sight and have such on my 20" Model 70 Winchester 375H&H; adds plus points for style & function.

As an option if you really think you have to do this is to simply add a second sling stud to the tip of the forend; works just as good IMO. Especially; like Jim remarked, if there's additional work involved with the front sight mounting the barrel band.

Here's the 20" tubed Winchester:



A Blaser R93 with the swivel stud in the forearm tip, another 375H&H with a 24.6" (65cm) barrel.



Have fun with your choice and a good hunt in Namibia.

Here's a photo of a couple of rifles with barrel band swivel studs. The top one is a 30-06, the bottom a 375H&H.

The easiest, quickest and cheapest way to get the rifle lower when slung is to do what Gerry suggest and put a screw in stud in the fore end tip. If you don't like the aesthetics you can remove it and put an ebony or walnut plug in the hole after your trip.

Also, carrying your rifle slung butt up significantly lowers it's profile, the butt will be lower than your head and about the same height as your ear - but I hate having the muzzle down and fear stuffing it in the dirt when stooping to get under something.



JPK

quote:

I have been advised that a barrel band is a good idea to avoid the barrel catching as I push through the bush .

I find that a bit wierd!!!!

If you like a barrel band do it.....but.......

I like a barrel band on big kickers to keep the stud from smacking my hand under recoil.....not to stay out of the bushes....


.

I'm 5'9 and having a barrel band swivel is the difference between catching the barrel on every branch I duck under or not. I like them and like the looks of them too.

I've never had my hand hit a stud, even on a hard kicker.

A barrel band may look "cool" and will allow your shouldered rifle to ride lower. But it's potential effect on accuracy is negative. It would be a shame to go to the trouble and expense of installing a barrel band only to find that you've now got a rifle than "patterns" instead of "groups". You might get lucky and find no discernible difference in accuracy, but is it worth taking the chance?

Thank you for the prompt answer Jim . Cobra is correct that 2 inches is 5 cm . I don't have any open sights on the barrel , at 64 and wearing bifocals scopes are the go for me . I will get the barrel band as the cost of that is minor compared to the trip to Namibia . Thank you for the nice pictures Gerry and JPK . JTEX I have heard both reasons for barrel bands and the fellow who advised me to do it has done many trips to Africa and he said the barrel hanging up when walking through bush is very tiring .
Stonecreek the accuracy issue I do not know about but I do not use a sling for off-hand shooting and am told that I will nearly always be shooting off shooting sticks .

Mark

FWIW, that 375H&H in the photo I posted, and which has a barrel band, will make clover leafs at 100yds with Federal's 300gr Trophy Bonded factory load. The 30-06 with the barrel band is a 1" rifle but a little picky about bullet weights and styles. It doesn't like 165gr boat tail bullets.

Since both rifle shoot well with suitable factory loads, I haven't bothered hand loading and tailoring loads for them - except for hand loading a 300gr Woodleigh solid load to shoot to the same POA as the 300gr soft load for the 375H&H -and I'm sure that at least the 30-06 could be made to shoot better playing with seating depth...

JPK

Accuracy wont be an issue unless the band is welded on .

Epoxy or low temp soldering are the usual methods of attachment, and don't require enough heat to cause problems. Go the epoxy if you are concerned.

Hold your arm around the sling so you dont have a moving weight if you are off hand shooting.

FWIW, I tried to shift the point of impact for the 30-06 with the barrel band swivel stud by wrapping up very tightly in a sling while shooting kneeling. I succeeded, but I had to really try and it was uncomfortable.

I always carry a set of shooting sticks anyway.

JPK

Never had my hand smacked by the stock mounted swivel stud; if you did, you probably didn't hold on to the rifle tight enough would be my guess.

quote:

Originally posted by JPK:
Here's a photo of a couple of rifles with barrel band swivel studs. The top one is a 30-06, the bottom a 375H&H.

The easiest, quickest and cheapest way to get the rifle lower when slung is to do what Gerry suggest and put a screw in stud in the fore end tip. If you don't like the aesthetics you can remove it and put an ebony or walnut plug in the hole after your trip.

Also, carrying your rifle slung butt up significantly lowers it's profile, the butt will be lower than your head and about the same height as your ear - but I hate having the muzzle down and fear stuffing it in the dirt when stooping to get under something.



JPK

Hubba Hubba. Those are some fine looking rifles!

I also prefer my rifle barrels to ride low when shouldered and moving through bush so a barrel band is a great ideal for African type hunting.

All my guns are English style so I use the barrel band, some are about 2 inches in front of the forend to keep them from hitting the forend, some of my older English built guns are centered between the crown and the forend and I like that very well...

I don't shoot with a sling but if you do then use swivels installed in the forend wood.

As to the stuff about keeping the barrel low in the bush, well, that may or may not be a worthwhile statement, and its only about two inches! my pocket knife is longer than that and who knows where that bush is going to be? I suspect inasmuch as they want their barrel low they might consider hanging the butt end on their shoulder and have nothing sticking up in the bush.

Many such things are accepted as fact, written in stone, but mostly they are nostalgic or of the mind set of "that's the way I've always done it" This is a prime example and the reason I like barrel band swivels! I like the look! I plead guilty.

Use the methods that feels best to you.

If the barel band is 2" up from the fore end tip and a fore end mounted stud is 2" down from the tip the difference is 4". That is about 17 percent of the length of the barrel and a real difference when you are ducking through bush.

As I previously wrote, butt up provides an even lower profile but Can lead to stuffing the muzzle.

JPK

Generally a barrel mounted sling only affects hunting accuracy if it is being pulled on hard enough to steady the aim when shooting. If it is hanging there loose, any adverse effect is usually zip, nada, nonexistent.

Anyway, I'd ask the guide/outfitter and follow his suggestions. He knows the terrain you'll be hunting better than almost anyone else you'll ever meet.

How do you get the barrel "stuffed" if you've got a couple of strips of tape over it?
I rarely carry my rifle at sling arms but when I do, and encounter some thick stuff. I take the wrist of the rifle and rotate it forward. This rotates the barrel out of the way and I guide the butt of the rifle through the brush.

With the typical hunting party in Africa you would be pointing the muzzle at someone.

Don't know about where the OP is hunting but in Zim typical walking is lead tracker, PH, client 2nd tracker, game scout, cameraman if any.

With the " African" carry you can watch you muzzle and "steer" it as required to avoid sweeping anyone. Gotta pay attention, especially when you're tired.

JPK

I have a barrel mounted sling on my .416 but I have to say, I would never put it on a plains game rifle. I definitely see a big shift of impact if I try and shoot sitting with a tight sling. Also, for long shots, I put a bipod on the gun (I don't hunt with one, but I carry it in my pack). I used it once in Namibia to shoot a blesbok and once in Tanzania to shoot a Thompson's gazelle at 250 yards that was partly obscured by grass.

As for beating up your hand, my .338 Win Mag definitely draws blood on my left hand when I shoot it with a tight sling from the sitting position if I fire enough rounds (such as a practice session).

JPK,
I'm 6-3 so a butt carry works better for me perhaps than for a shorter person. It also is the fastest to point sling method. But,one method seems as good as another to me if the user pays attention.

I really like the African carry for both a rifle and binoculars. I keep a thin 7/8s sling in my jacket most of the time, I use it when I have to pack or drag something out or hang my gun on tree limb for what ever reason.

Having lost a couple of good animals over the years from using a sling and getting caught off guard, I just decided to pack my rifle at ready most of the time.

I did a little off handed test one time on barrel band sling shooting and got the impression if the barrel is free floated it effects the POI considerable but with 3 point or tight bedding throughout it didn't seem to effect it much, if at all on my house 65 yard target. This was with the swivel 2 inches forward of the forend tip and with my 416 with a rather heavy stiff no. 4 Douglas barrel. The other 2 guns were a 30-06 free float glass bed with a no. 2 or 3 Douglas and a factory 99 Savage glassed with pressure on the tip. About what I expected. Later I use a couple of other rifles and results were the same.. Not a very scientific testing but I knew what to expect from the rifles in question...

quote:

Originally posted by Stonecreek:
A barrel band may look "cool" and will allow your shouldered rifle to ride lower. But it's potential effect on accuracy is negative. It would be a shame to go to the trouble and expense of installing a barrel band only to find that you've now got a rifle than "patterns" instead of "groups". You might get lucky and find no discernible difference in accuracy, but is it worth taking the chance?

Didn't seen to hurt my 8X57.

quote:

Originally posted by Atkinson:
JPK,
I'm 6-3 so a butt carry works better for me perhaps than for a shorter person. It also is the fastest to point sling method. But,one method seems as good as another to me if the user pays attention.

I really like the African carry for both a rifle and binoculars. I keep a thin 7/8s sling in my jacket most of the time, I use it when I have to pack or drag something out or hang my gun on tree limb for what ever reason.

Having lost a couple of good animals over the years from using a sling and getting caught off guard, I just decided to pack my rifle at ready most of the time.

I did a little off handed test one time on barrel band sling shooting and got the impression if the barrel is free floated it effects the POI considerable but with 3 point or tight bedding throughout it didn't seem to effect it much, if at all on my house 65 yard target. This was with the swivel 2 inches forward of the forend tip and with my 416 with a rather heavy stiff no. 4 Douglas barrel. The other 2 guns were a 30-06 free float glass bed with a no. 2 or 3 Douglas and a factory 99 Savage glassed with pressure on the tip. About what I expected. Later I use a couple of other rifles and results were the same.. Not a very scientific testing but I knew what to expect from the rifles in question...

No doubt the taller the hunter the better a butt up carry would work, and the more important it would seem to get the top of the rifle, muzzle or butt depending on which is up, lower too. It's the uneven ground and the dipping under brush which worry me about the butt up carry. Whacking the rifle barrel on brush is a pita, but that's it. Hitting the dirt with the muzzle would require at least checking for an obstruction, if you notice it. And then finding the right diameter and length branch to push the junk out if its there. If you plug the muzzle without noticing - oops. This stuff isn't theory, I have tried and come to the conclusion for this 5'11" hunter that butt down and a 22-24" barrel doesn't make sense as far as risk/return.

As I mentioned, I tried to move the POI on the 30-06 and could do it, but with a wrap that was far tighter than required for steadying a shot and uncomfortable as hell. That rifle is full length bedded, and, as you point out that may be why it took so much effort. I tried moving the 375H&H POI and didn't succeed; it is also full length bedded. [As an aside, you can take either rifle out of the stock and then return it and turn the screws to the same tension index them in other words - and they return to zero about as well as a set of Talley rings will, a benefit of full length bedding.]

I rarely use a sling for shooting when hunting anymore. I don't like to carry the rifle with a military style sling or a straight 3/4" or 1" sling and I prefer a pair of the light collapsible sticks which are not much slower to get into action than a "quick wrap" with a sling.

As far as for carry, since most of my hunting here on the east coast is stand hunting I often use a sling heading out in the am prior to legal shooting time and coming back in the pm after legal shooting time. Sometimes I'm carrying extra clothes for sitting still without freezing to death and the sling frees up the hands. A good sling with QD swivels makes a decent make do deer drag too!

In Africa, on some of the long walks the rifle gets carried every possible way through a day, but the African carry is by far my favorite since a tracker is carrying any gear I might need beyond ammo belt, multi tool, sunglasses, hat a few hard candies and a couple of sticks of gum. I might or might not be carrying binos, if so they are typically 8x20's around the neck and stuffed in a shirt pocket. The few times I carry 8x30's in Africa it's around the neck and under the arm, same here, where I carry them all of the time.

Also FWIW, I find a barrel mounted sling more comfortable. It seems to change the geometry and offer more room toward the top of the shoulder.

JPK

I delivered my rifle to the gunsmith today to have the barrel band fitted . His only question was whether he could solder it to a stainless barrel . I will leave that question to him .
In the past I have used a safari sling but I am usually on my own where the muzzle pointing up front is not a problem . It is interesting that Ray and I are the same height but I must admit the muzzle down hold is not something I do . If things happen fast I prefer a more familiar hold . My feeling is I will shoot off sticks or offhand , have never used a sling .
I appreciate all the input and thoughts .
Mark

I guess it does help in thick bush.

Muzzle down carry is a risk if you quickly squat down and forget to move the rifle and ding the crown.

In thick bush the rifle is generally in my hands. It is also the best way to steer it away from other members of the party.