I have a .280 Rem in a push feed M70 featherweight. I bought the gun in 1990. I have used it a lot and like the gun. Lately, I have been having a lot of trouble getting it to group under 2". It never was a superbly accurate gun, grouping 1" to 1.5" with 150gr Fed. Nosler Partitions. I have shot about 1000 rounds through it.

I am not reloader and use the Fed. Premium ammo.

I shoot from the Lead Sled by Caldwell.

Any suggestions on improving accuracy?

I usually have better luck when I bed and float the barrel. After that I would try different ammo. I've never used a lead Sled. Could it be interferring with how you see through the scope? The old paralax issue.

One thing you have learnt with your 280 is a rifle doesn't have to shoot .1's to reliably take game.
I'd kinda start from scratch with the rifle. That is take the scope off and remount it to make sure everything is tight, make sure I wasn't getting any contact along the barrel channel (do the dollar bill thing), and then give the bore a good cleaning. I mean right down to the metal. If you've gotten some throat erosion and you don't reload, there's not a whole lot you can do about that unless you want to have a smith rechamber the barrel and set it back a couple of threads.

Two issues really. First is the why it shot 1-1.5 MOA in the first place, the second why it won't do what it once did. On the first for factory ammo, you are definately getting average performance. Can you tighten that up a bit, probably so, bedding would be my first area to look into. Personally I wouldn't chase it if your shooting under 1.5 MOA with factory ammo, there is nothing wrong with your rifle. Bedding and reloading your own ammo would most probably trim that number.

Now the second problem, it is currently shooting 2 MOA. Two items are the most likely problems, your ammo has changed or you have copper foulong in your barrel. Unless you are using old ammo from the same lot your ammo is different. There are variations between ammo lots.

But the most likely problem is your rifle is copper fouled and needs to be cleaned throughly. I use Sweets, and there are several other good products that do the same thing, scrub, let it soak, and see if your patches come out blue or greenish. Then after you got all the copper out, clean with regular gun cleaner as I don't like leaving ammonia in my rifle barrels.

My guess is this will help a lot. Another item to check, is the torgue on the action screws, don't quote me on this but I think you need around 40 inch pounds on that action, the Winchesters us less than the Remingtons.

Give the above a whirl and see if that doesn't help.

What does the group look like? Is it just larger? Does it string shots or shoot into two groups? Is the ammo from a different lot?

1.Make sure the front receiver screw is tight.
2.I would check scope mounts, particularly if the rear base is windage adjustable.
3.See if the stock forend has warped and touching the barrel.
4.Have a 'smith check the muzzle crown. Sometimes a fresh crown job will do wonders.

Are you shooting 3-shot or 5-shot groups? I would recommend the former with that light barrel. Good luck.

I agree with all of the above!!I have shot .280 since the 60's. Ammo makes a difference try several different brands.For factory I use Rem. corelock.I reload to sub MOA.If you haven't had a trigger job done I would include it with the bedding

Try the simplest and cheapest fixes first. Get yourself some CR-10 or other good copper fouling remover and give it a thorough cleaning. No blue patches...

Check the action and scope-mount screws - make sure they haven't rattled loose.

Second, factory ammo can vary from lot to lot, so it may just be that the newer lots of your ammo don't jive with your rifle as much previous lots. So try a few other loads.

I doubt you have any significant throat erosion after only 1000 rounds, unless you consistently shoot 20 shots in a row as fast as possible every time you go to the range...

Unless you had a fall where the muzzle was damaged, I doubt a new crown will make any difference...

JMO...

You don't say how often you clean your rifle, but I'll bet it needs a good cleaning. For the cost of 1000rds of factory ammo, you could have purchased a decent single stage reloading kit & components for the 1000rds, probably the best way to improve your accuracy is by handloading. Factory ammo is very good, but still designed to work in all rifles. A note, if you can find any of the Speer Nitex ammo in 145gr or 160grGS give it a try. It is the most accurate factory load I have tried in ym .280.

quote:

Originally posted by Glen71:
What does the group look like? Is it just larger? Does it string shots or shoot into two groups? Is the ammo from a different lot?

1.Make sure the front receiver screw is tight.
2.I would check scope mounts, particularly if the rear base is windage adjustable.
3.See if the stock forend has warped and touching the barrel.
4.Have a 'smith check the muzzle crown. Sometimes a fresh crown job will do wonders.

Are you shooting 3-shot or 5-shot groups? I would recommend the former with that light barrel. Good luck.

Glen,
THe groups tend to be a triangle, usually two shots are close with the third being out. I usually shoot three shot groups.

I will give it a good cleaning and tighten up the scope mounts.

One thing that all of these good suggestions have made me aware of is 1) clean it better adn 2) check the scope.

Thinking back over the years, I had the better groups with a Leupold Vari X II and switched to to a Zeiss Conquest. I have a new VX III to try out that was destined for another gun. I will try it on my .280 to see if that helps.

THanks for all of the suggestions. I appreciate it.

quote:

Any suggestions on improving accuracy?

Trade it for a .270

WHat's a .270??????????????????

quote:

Originally posted by MajorCaliber:
Trade it for a .270

You didn't just say that.

Dogcat, I hate to veer this thread away, but if you like the 280 Rem and don't reload, something ain't right!
Get even a cheap little Lee single-stage and a set of dies, and find out how much fun it is to roll your own!
You just might end up besting that 1.5 MOA in the end....

280 Factory stuff is a bit on the light side, you can tap into a lot more performance and still be real safe by rolling your own. The only way that gun gets any better is making it an Ackley IMO LOL I am just getting back on this board so be gentle LOL. Clean it then clean it again. The new bore foams make life much easier. Check everything, screws and scope. Try some different ammo. The lot of ammo you are using might not agree with your rifle. A glass bedd /pillar job will not hurt. I would check the inletting to make sure no high spots have devolped and re-seal the inletting up at least. Sounds like Santa needs to bring you a reloader.

quote:

Trade it for a .270

A 270 sucks in comparison to the 280 Remington!

quote:

Originally posted by D Humbarger:

quote:

Trade it for a .270

A 270 sucks in comparison to the 280 Remington!

HaHa! In theory only

How long have you been shooting with the Lead Sled? Having not used one, I'm no expert, but I know recoil has to go somewhere. With your shoulder not taking some of it, the stock takes the recoil from the barrel and receiver and then tranfers it to the sled. Thus your stock may be the weak link, especially if it is a wood stock. Check the stock screws and then you may want to consider getting the rifle glass bedded. You may also want to get the muzzle recrowned. If all that doesn't work, consider getting a new barrel, it'll be the same old friend but with all new performance.

Sorta like an old wife after a few months in the gym and a new set of store bought boobs.

Again, thanks to all of you.

As for the .270 - I like it, my son shoots one.
The .280 was an anniversary present from my wife years ago when we were broke, so I plan to stay with it.

I will also get with some one reloading. Must not be as tough as I thought as all of you guys are suggesting it.

I will tighten everything up (much like my wife at the gym, however, no need for the plastic boobs. Like a rifle, I prefer wood and skin to plastic and silicone!! She has all I can handle as it is)

Merry Christmas and thanks for the help.

quote:

Originally posted by dogcat:
I have a .280 Rem in a push feed M70 featherweight. I bought the gun in 1990. I have used it a lot and like the gun. Lately, I have been having a lot of trouble getting it to group under 2". It never was a superbly accurate gun, grouping 1" to 1.5" with 150gr Fed. Nosler Partitions. I have shot about 1000 rounds through it.

I am not reloader and use the Fed. Premium ammo.

I shoot from the Lead Sled by Caldwell.

Any suggestions on improving accuracy?

Are you sure it's the rifle, and not the ammo, that is causing your problem?

Any rifle that will shoot 1" to 1.5" groups with factory ammo is plenty accurate! When you find a factory load that shoots 1" groups, buy at least 100 rounds of that same lot #!!

quote:

Originally posted by D Humbarger:

A 270 sucks in comparison to the 280 Remington!

Thanks for the laugh!!!

I need a tissue, my eyes actually watered on that one.

Again, what exactly is a .270?

What exactly is a .270? Well I'll tell you, it is one of the most popular rifle calibers in the world (FAR MORE POPULAR THAN A 280...MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH MORE POPULAR, AND JUST AS EFFECTIVE)!!!!

I have 3! Then I just jumped OVER the 280 and got a 30.06.

The differance is .007 ,270 is a wasted caliber compared to a 7mm .007 smaller what would you want with a caliber .oo7 smaller than a 7mm ? Look at some ballistics and you might decide that it's not all you think it is ! If I were given one free I'd give it away to some one I don't like !

Not to .270 bash, well maybe alittle, but the .280 is a far better design. If I wanted something smaller, then a .260 is the obviuos choice.

quote:

Originally posted by fredj338:
Not to .270 bash, well maybe alittle, but the .280 is a far better design. If I wanted something smaller, then a .260 is the obviuos choice.

Even jack O'Connor privately admitted as much!

quote:

Originally posted by fredj338:
the .280 is a far better design.

.007 is FAR better?

quote:

270 is a wasted caliber compared to a 7mm

The 280 is a wasted caliber! Who needs that when the 7x57, 270, 30.06, and 7 Rem mag are around?!!

Just check sales! I had never heard of a 280 until I watched a Primos hunting video back in the early 90's or late 80's.

NOW, a 280 AI is a different story. But a 280 was Remington's attempt to fill a niche that didn't need fillin.

quote:

Look at some ballistics and you might decide that it's not all you think it is ! If I were given one free I'd give it away to some one I don't like !

I have looked at ballistics, and it's everything I think it is and does everything I've ever needed it to do! Funny you mention giving away a rifle, I just about did just that 7 years ago when a deacon at my church sold me his 280 Remington for $100. I traded it the next day for a 270. There's just no need for a 280.

quote:

Originally posted by El Deguello:
Even jack O'Connor privately admitted as much!

Yep, that's why he used the 270 so much.

The 7x57 &7mm Mag shoot the same bullets as the 280/7mm EXP and they have been around since 1957 ,Yes 32 years later than the Misfit 270,

I have both and like them both - it is kind of like red heads and blondes. Not many red heads out there, but when you get a good one - hold on tite. For blondes, lots out there, but only a few that are the complete package.

Think that a 270 is a fine caliber if your just a little fella and don't like getting recoil from a real rifle

I would use barnes cr-10 and remove any copper fouling that may be present.However if you really desire more accuracy ,you may have to try other loads.It should also be noted that the cartridge companies do change loads over time so the loads that you are buying now may not be exactly the same as you were buying previously.

Doc, I'm having a bit of fun w/ you but really, the .270 was a brilliant solution to a non existent problem. Agreed, the .280 was an also ran, but the 7x64 was out long before the .270. The .270 was, like many cartridge designs we have today, marketing hype but no real improvement over what was already available. There is nothing a .270 can do that a .280 cannot, but the same can be said for the .30-06 vs the .280. It is blondes vs redheads, but then again, I've always liked redheads, I think they're a bit smarter than the blondes.
Some day I may own a .30-06 (bought my son one) but I will never, no matter the reason, buy a .270. I leave those for the guys who buy their ammo & Walmart.

After all the above, cleaning, tightening, etc grab a box of Hornady Lt. Mg 130 gr SST's and go hunting!

I certainly hope everyone knows I'm playing too. I have nothing against any caliber. I've just been playing. No here.

The ONLY reason I'm such a 270 fan is it was my first deer rifle. That's all. Sentimental value if you will. I have nothing against the 280, really.

In fact, I've recommended it to many new hunters along with other calibers to choose from. The 280 has always been at the top of the list. I just really like getting into pseudo whizzing matches for fun.

I actually solved the problem mentioned in the beginning by having Dennis Olson switch barrels to a 270. This is the honest truth by the way. I never could get the original 280 barrel to shoot and this is from someone who has owned at least a half dozen other 280s. Actually I guess two of them said 7mm Express Remington on the barrel and one said 285 OKH. Today I will take a 270 any day over a 280 because I have found it takes far less to make one group.

As far as a cartridge not filling any need I would say the 260 and the 280 both fall into that class. We have already heard about the 7X64, and the 7X57 will do almost what the 280 will. There's a good reason why the 280 barely hangs on I would say. I doubt even Jack O'Connor could have helped it surpass the 270 because so many people know how well the 270 works. Also the 6.5X55 will wipe out a 260 any day of the week and it is probably older than anyone here. I can't for the life of me see why anyone would want a 260. If you have to have a short action the 7mm-08, which doesn't quite come up to the 7X57, will do anything the 260 will and more. As for me personally I can still cary a rifle that has a long action which will be a 270, 7x57, or a 30-06. No need for a 338-06 either.

Sorry about the

quote:

Originally posted by Idared:

As far as a cartridge not filling any need I would say the 260 and the 280 both fall into that class. We have already heard about the 7X64, and the 7X57 will do almost what the 280 will. There's a good reason why the 280 barely hangs on I would say. I doubt even Jack O'Connor could have helped it surpass the 270 because so many people know how well the 270 works. Also the 6.5X55 will wipe out a 260 any day of the week and it is probably older than anyone here. I can't for the life of me see why anyone would want a 260. If you have to have a short action the 7mm-08, which doesn't quite come up to the 7X57, will do anything the 260 will and more. As for me personally I can still cary a rifle that has a long action which will be a 270, 7x57, or a 30-06. No need for a 338-06 either.

Sorry about the

Oh that's OK, it's nice to be right anyway.

Just because someone cares, the .260 makes a far better dual purpose cart. than the .243 or 7-08. As a pure deer rifle play, the 7-08 is fine, but so is the .260 or 6.5x55. The .260 works on true SA rifles & if you are trying to build a superlight, you still need a SA (my .280 is built on a M70 & only weighs 7.25# scoped, ready to hunt). To me the .270 has always been a "tweener", too big for dual purpose varmint/deer & too small for deer/elk combo gun. Yeah, yeah, I know, many guys hunt elk w/ them but not my choice. I also don't think anyone can make an argument that the .270 bore is inherently more accurate than a .280, there are good rifles & not so good rifles. My .280 is extremely accurate for a ft.wt. bbl. but it was put together right. There are just too many .270 cool-aid drinkers out there, I'm happy for you, just don't feed us the bs that the .270 is magic & the .280 is an also-ran. Let's not even go down the road of the .338-06 being useless.

quote:

Originally posted by fredj338:
Let's not even go down the road of the .338-06 being useless.

I do agree with you here. The 338-06 is a handy close up rifle, especially for bears over bait, etc. I also do not agree with the "inherent accuracy" of most any caliber other than the 308. The whole craze of short magnums haven't convinced me of that at all and I've shot and loaded for quite a few now. I find myself spending just as much time, generally, working up loads for them as any standard long action, so I say, where's the evidence that short and fat is ALWAYS better than long/skinny? I'm not convinced.

To me the .270 has always been a "tweener", too big for dual purpose varmint/deer & too small for deer/elk combo gun.

To me the 280 is the "tweener". It isn't a 270 and it isn't a 30-06. It doesn't shoot either the 130 grain or the 200 grain bullet well, if at all, so for my money it doesn't replace both of them. As far as accuracy is concerned I will stand by my statement,Today I will take a 270 any day over a 280 because I have found it takes far less to make one group. Call it what you want, but I have never seen a 270 that wouldnt shoot well right out of the blocks with H-4831 or RL-22 and a good 130 or 150 grain bullet. Matter of fact I have seen few that H-4831 and a good 130 grain bullet wouldn't go about 3100 fps and group right at an inch with the first loadings. After owning over a half dozen 280s I have never found one that was quick to find a suitable load for. I won't say that one could not be found, I'm just saying it takes a lot more playing with the reloads to accomplish what the 270 does right from the start. For the non-reloader factory ammo for the 270 usually beats the 280 in both velocity and accuracy.

One thing I don't think helps the 280 is that different folks have different ideas what the twist rate should be while the 270 has pretty much always had a 1 in 10 inch twist. I have seen barrels with a twist rate all the way from 1 in 8 to 1 in 11 inch on various 280s. The funny thing to me is that few people use a 1 in 10 inch which to me would seem to be the optimum judging by what the 270 thrives on. I had one particular 280 that had a 1 in 9 inch twist and it would not shoot 160 or 175 grain bullets at all. It would shoot 140s and 150s but to me that just made it a poor substitute for the 270. For me if a 280 is to be something better than a 270 it has to shoot the heavier bullets as well as the lighter ones. I myself have NEVER had one that would.

Let's not even go down the road of the .338-06 being useless.

No, it's not useless, but it will never be a huge success as a factory cartridge because it isn't a 30-06 or a 35 Whelen. It is between the two and suffers from a lot of the same things the 280 does when compared to the 30-06 or the 35 Whelen. Barrel twist is just one thing that plays into it, although I actually think the 35 Whelen suffers from that to some degree also. Bottom line, if it wasn't for the fact that the 338 Win is so popular I don't think the 338-06 would hardly be around. You may disagree, but I don't think the 333 OKH would be much in use today if the 338 Win hadn't been brought out.

Well Idared, it's blondes vs. redheads I guess. I think the facination w/ one caliber over another is more about what you are exposed to than what really works "better". I for instance do not own a .270 or a .30-06 (except for a Garand), just too many other rounds out that work just as well or better. Since I handload, I can tweek anything I want so why not something different. The biggest advantage to the .270/.30-06 guys is they can buy ammo @ Wallyworld or across the pond in most sporting goods stores. Here in the USA, we can be & many choose to be different. My lowly .280 has a 1-9 PacNor on it & handles 140-175 w/ pretty boring accuracy (1moa or better). I have only this rifle as a gauge so I can't say about all the factory rigs out there.
You're right the .338-06 will never be as popular as the .338winmag. My question would be so? It is a great cart. as is the .280. To say the .270 or .35hwelen are better, well that's just a wee bit nieve. I'm glad you own a .270 & a .30-06, all rifles need a good home regardless of their caliber.

Fred

If I had ever owned a 280 that does what you say yours does I would still have one today without a doubt. As I said, I have tried six different 280s and a 285 OKH which proved to be a 280. There were three factory 700s, two of which said 7mm Express Remington on the barrel, a Ruger 77, two rifles that had Shilen 1 in 9 inch twist barrels, one rifle that had a 1 in 9.5 inch twist Shaw, and an unknown barrel that had a 1 in 11 inch twist. Not one of those seven rifles did what you say your 280 does. I am not saying they wouldn't shoot, some did exceedingly well with one or two bullets, but none did what I would call a respectable job with the full spectrum of bullets. The strangest ones were the two Shilens. One liked heavy bullets, one liked lighter bullets but neither liked both. One of these two shot 160 grain Noslers so well it was scary but wouldn't keep 140s in much less than an inch and one half. As I said above I just never had those problems with any 270 I owned or loaded for. All of them shot 130, 150 and 160 grain bullets well with very little effort at the reloading bench and the range. I eventually tired of the execise and haven't owned a 280 for about three years now. I doubt I will ever try another again regardless of how good you or anyone else tells me they shoot.

You are right when you say we have the right to be different in the U.S. and for that I am thankful. I'm even glad that there are some folks like you who still shoot the 280. It nearly died a slow death a few years ago so I hope folks like you keep it breathing because on paper it is a good round. It just didn't prove out in real life for me.

When it comes to the 338-06 I myself feel that in order to justify it, it should show me something that the 30-06 with the 200 grainer does not do. This to me is shoot 225 to 250 grain bullets well at a decent velocity with good accuracy. Sadly with a 338-06 and a 338-06 A.I. this was not to be. The fact that I own a 338 Win probably didn't help, but I was a bit disappointed in the accuracy especially with 225 grain Nosler Partitions in both. Both shot the 210 Nosler pretty well, but that just made them basically a 30-06 in my book. I don't remember what bullet you use in yours but some folks have used the heavier bullets with great success I guess. Again I was not so lucky.

A 35 Whelen I had shot the heavier bullets fairly well and I probably should have kept it but let it go because it wasn't a 338 Win. My last experiment with the 30-06 case will likely be a 400 Whelen someday not because it adds anything to my battery but because it looks like an interesting execise.

I agree with your statement that all rifles need a good home, so continue with what you are doing and I will do the same. I am betting we will both be happy.