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One of Us |
I can get 3,250 fps with 180 grain bullets, but 100 fps more with 165 grainers. I am inclined to stick with the 180s. Pros and cons? I like the bigger bullets more than the higher velocity of the lighter ones. Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | ||
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One of Us |
Consider this analysis for similar bullet types a 3% in crease in velocity vs. ~10% increase in BC At 400 yards, there is only .6 of inch less drop for the 165 and that 100 fps difference is down to 19 fps Net - go with the 180 or even a 175 grn Barnes LRX or if you are an Accubond fan the 190 grn LR Accubond Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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one of us |
What game are you shooting? How far do you shoot? Pretty much with the 300s I don’t even shoot 180s anymore. I shoot 200s. In a given construction I’d rather take advantage of the weight and BC, I rarely like my bullets going over 3100 FPS. That’s not a hard and fast rule but it’s usually an indicator I am doing something wrong if I am chasing big game. It’s all about parameters. I am back from a long Hiatus... or whatever. Take care. smallfry | |||
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One of Us |
I was very happy with 180 a frames in mine while hunting in Uganda. | |||
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Administrator |
What barrel length are you using? I have built a 30/404 with a 28 inch barrel, and am getting close to 3500 fps with 180 bullets!! | |||
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one of us |
I never saw any reason to shoot anything less than 180's. There is such a thing as too much velocity if you plan on eating what you shoot. Have gun- Will travel The value of a trophy is computed directly in terms of personal investment in its acquisition. Robert Ruark | |||
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Administrator |
Very true. I shot a bushbuck with my 270/404 - I cannot remember the velocity, but it was very high. He was walking away, and dropped at the shot. His whole body was blood shot. | |||
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One of Us |
Hypersonic muzzle speeds: increase range to decrease impact speed to get less bloodshot meat. | |||
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one of us |
I can't see shooting any bullet less than 200s in a RUM. I like 225 and 220 ELDs. The 200 AB is good too. | |||
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One of Us |
I shoot 200 AB's at +3200 FPS. Win 70: 26" RL 25 | |||
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One of Us |
My barrel is 26 inches long. I’m not trying to max out my velocities. Should have been clearer about that. This is for hunting. I just want to get out to 3-350 yards without much holdover but with a lot of punch. Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | |||
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One of Us |
I'm another one for bullets no less than 180gr. To me at least a big magnum is at its best with bullets at the heavier end. I don't have a RUM but a .300 Weatherby I've had for quite a while. It's running at the same velocity as your getting. At close range the heavies destroy a little less meat, don't stress the bullet integrity as much and at longer range they maintain velocity better. Roger ___________________________ I'm a trophy hunter - until something better comes along. *we band of 45-70ers* | |||
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One of Us |
Then shoot the Nosler 190 AB at 3200 zeroed at 260 yards you will never be more than +2.5 and are only -8.2 at 375. That allows you to still hold on hair for deer sized game. Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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One of Us |
Whichever one shoots more accurately. Weight doesn't matter. This is what does in addition to accuracy: 1 - Impact performance. You need to research this, some bullets definitely work better than others. Of course if your punching paper forget this. 2 - Ballistic coefficient. Look it up, that is what determines impact energy. A 165 with a higher BC than a 180 will shoot flatter and have more energy at any distance. The weight is built into the BC, which I why I said weight doesn't matter. 3 - Recoil. Heavier bullets --> more recoil --> possibly less accurate shooting, depending on the person. | |||
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One of Us |
I'm using 165 grain Swift Scirocco. The only thing I have shot other than paper is a whitetail buck, 30 yards quartering towards me. Went through shoulder bone and exited. My friend who field dressed it (I'm too slow, drives him crazy to watch) said he had never seen such damage from a bullet that exited. Heart/lungs were just liquid. Interestingly it ran about 50 yards before collapse. I thought it was bad shot placement but not. M | |||
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One of Us |
In like for like styles, the BC of the 165 will never exceed the BC of the 180. Of course if you are comparing a 165 BT polymer LR design 165 to standard a 180 spitzer that is a different story but then that would not be a like for like comparison. Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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One of Us |
After looking at the numbers, I’m not sure it really matters. I still tend to think the heavier bullets are better. They strike with power. The 190s are tempting. But I think I’ll stick with a 180. The Barnes TTSX in particular. It’s a good expander and hard hitter, and accurate in my rifle. Thanks for the input. Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | |||
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One of Us |
I use 210 LRAB in my 300 RUM. I like the velocity, weight, BC, trajectory and sectional density just fine and they THUMP whatever they hit with copious amounts of authority. If I thought 165 or 180's were better, I'd use those...but I don't. Reality is, out to a paltry range of 350 yards about anything will do. Zeke | |||
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one of us |
I used 200gr TSX in a Remington 700BDL. | |||
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