350 is a nice round as the long action 33's and 35's, loved the 338/06 I had, but I see NOTHING wrong toting a 338 Federal or 358 to use at normal distances.

Granted, if the arms and ammo companies would have backed the 338/06, it would be a better choice ballistically, speaking in terms of performance.

None the less, I cannot forget in Colorado being in the back of a truck, the driver stopping and one hunter stepping out blasting a 338 Win Mag, and the driver, then unloading a Weatherby in none other than yours truly 340. It sounded like a cannon. I don't think he shot as accurately nor had as quick follow up due to the intensity of the round. He did drop one deer, close shot I believe, but missed other subsequent shots. Point is, more was not better.

Now on elk and the like, I see the 340 as a wonderful killing cartridge, in proper hands that can handle it.

I am not in that group myself. I think any 340 hunter would be embarrassed to admit an animal fled after being shot at with a 340 and not dropping on the spot. Same thing might have happened. Again, no recovered animal, no facts.

I really doubt a 350 would have made the difference here for whatever the reason was, lack of ft. lbs. not being my guess as to what went wrong.

The 338Federal is a great edition to the 308Win family. And it will become a classic given time!

185gn TSX's WOW, now tell me what the average hunter wont kill with a well placed shot with that combo?

I agree, Layne Simpson laid low an elk with the factory load combo I believe at 314 lasered yds.

I assume with your name you use the 340, and can handle it, I guess like a Win Mag on steroids? I imagine a capable shooter with known range can make some long distance kills that are astonishing with that rifle.

I did hold fire on a bull running up a mountain. How he did in 30 seconds what took me 30 minutes to follow I could not believe! Wind gusting, range unknown, about a 350 yd minimum but could have been much much further as the animals are large and I am not used to the terrain so hard to say, needless to say I held fire. Not disappointed, a shooter would have had to have been properly set up to have tried a shot, and I mean with solid rest, and perhaps a good spotter to help, but it seemed the elk did well to stay in timber often as it transversed up that mountain so often a shot was never there, or it was a moving target.

Those animals in my book are smart and tough, watched a show where a guy using a Ruger in 300 hit one square, never flinched, but did die in short order.

Tell me about your experience with the 340, I'd enjoy hearing.

The 340 is definately overkill for deer. It does magic on Elk, bears, large hogs, etc. The 338 federal will be popular among short range bush busters for sure. If I were to lay even money, I would bet on the 338-06 as being more succcesful, but time will tell. It is good to see non magnum 338's make there appearance. Maybe if the called it the 33 deer slayer it would fly off the shelfs. Like any wild cats, until a few famous gun writers push the mythical killinmg prowess of caliber X, most people won't even look at it.

I practice about twenty rounds a week with my 340 or 375 to keep used to the recoil. I would liken the 340 recoil to a 270 gr 375 load. In a well designed rifle (I use a wby accumark), the recoil is very manageable. My wife has fired 3 round strings in the rifle and has commented on how surprisingly comfotable it is to shoot. That being said, you still have to drill the vitals for the bullet to do its work.

Magnum velocity won't kill in and of itself. But, being able to blast through an inch and a half of gristle to get through to the vitals on a large boar is always a plus! It also does a good job on squirrels!

John

I just had a 338 Federal built. Lilja barrel, heavy contour, Rem 700 action and Badger Ordnance bolt handle.

I really like it. I'm currently trying some RL7 with the 185gr TSX bullets. My velocity so far is 2660 fps and no signs of pressure. I'm hoping for a 2750 fps. It's mild mannered and quiet.

Essentially it's a 30-06 with a wider bullet. I don't think you can talk down about this round if you believe a 30-06 is a capable cartridge. This round would be awesome in a scout version, lever or semi. Myself I like heavy rifles so mine is built that way.

The ballistic calculator tells me with this bullet at 2750 fps would give me 8 inches of drop at 300 yards with a 200 yard zero. I can still hold on the animal as far as I'm confortable to shoot which is plenty for me. Maybe it's me but when my father in law hits the 200 yard gong with his 7mm Rem Mag, it doesn't seem as pronounced as when I do. I strongly believe the trade off is better to have a wider bullet and less speed. I hope to test that this fall when moose opens!

Are you sure the loud smack did not come from a tree?

quote:

Originally posted by RMiller:
Are you sure the loud smack did not come from a tree?

quote:

Originally posted by PC:
Pls don't flame for saying this but I have from day one felt that the .338 Fed round just does not have the powder capacity to push heavy bullets at meaningful speeds. Hell I feel that the case (if I remeber rightly it's a .308 based case) in my opinion does not have the capaicity to really push .30 cal bullets at good speeds, I have a rem pump .308 but it''s more a little toy than a real hunting gun if I want a good .30 cal hunting round then it strats with the 30/06. Any way I have been amazed at the interest shown in the .338 fed for that reason, it does not have the case cap to drive heavy .338 bullets hard, and it does not have the bullet weight to compensate like a 45/70 does etc.

I reckon if you had of been shooting the old .338 win mag and driving that 210 gr pill around 300 fps you would have your bear.

I think that the 338-06 is probably about the smallest case you want behind a .338 bullet

Each to there own etc. but there are so many nice .338 winnies on the market I am unsure why one would bother with the .338 federal. These are just my thoughts and they are possibly flawed

Right on brother

Ask bear hunters who used a 41 mag 210gr at 1200-1400 fps how they ever killed their bears. I guess the blast gave them a heart attack.

Do you know what a .429 SWC does at 1050 fps? Stand on the exit side of about a 10" hardwood Willow tree and find the answer. Will a 444 Marlin going more than twice that speed kill twice as good? Maybe farther, but that is not the question.

So, are all those 358 winchester users who are loyal and get such great kills wrong using a 308 case pushing 200-250 gr bullets?

A 308 based round will never range as far as a larger case, BUT tell me its inadequate at 175 yds much less up to 300 and I will say shoot something IN the vitals, tie the animal up so you KNOW where you hit it, and let's see how long it stands there after it is struck with a decent bullet.

To say your 3,000 fps 338 Win mag would have flattened that same bear, is w/o merit.

A cannon is not needed to kill game, proper bullet selection and shot placement are....

Ever see how small the indians arrowheads were that were used on deer and buffalo? Oh, sorry all those deer and buffalo were NOT killed with modern broadheads out of 80 lb super tech cammed compounds. Simple ....self bows....long bows, perhaps 40lbs......hate to say the velocity, but MUCH less than a 338 Federal I hate to say.

Enjoy the 338 Win mag if it makes you feel better but I sold mine, and a nice 338/06 I owned. Would be happy to hunt with a 338 Federal.

Ask Clay Harvey about his 450 yd elk with 180 partition. Too small a powder charge and bullet, too small velocity.......guess he got lucky. Nope, not a brain shot either.

Add 30 grains lead, cut range more than half and shoot an animal perhaps less in weight......as the OP did.......

Cannons are NOT needed for most North America hunting situations IMHO of course.

I guess my 400 yd deer kill using 28.5 grains of powder behind a 105 grain bullet was inadequate.......but the deer died, w/in 25 yds of impact.

Accuracy folks, w/proper bullet choice. That simple. Not knocking the larger cartridges ability to be effective, but when more field reports come out by 338 Federal users, I think confidence will grow by non-believers.

Too much 'theory' by those who have no experience to back it up.

Oh, about hitting a tree? The bear rolled around.....don't think a miss hitting a tree scared him into doing that do you now?

"At the shot the bear pitched forward on the near shoulder that I shot, rolled around and scrambled out of sight without ever really regaining his feet"

According to what I read, this animal WAS definitely hit. How far he went, NO One KNOWS.

One would think by reading some posters, that animals wear Kevlar, and have instruments measuring velocity on impact, bullet type, etc. to decide if or when they will die when shot!

6.5BR I am not trying to stir the pot.
Its just that I have smacked a tree or two myself.

quote:

Originally posted by TSJ:
Remember the 9mm and 9.3 mann and mauser have been around a long time with the same ballistics as a 338 fed or 358 win. Those guns did their work with SOFT bullets, not ultra premiums. With modest vel. I think we tend to over think the bullets, and end up with ones that dont open enough.

Bingo, and they used heavy for caliber, unbonded cup and core bullets that penetrated like mad.

I can't see going up in caliber to .338 and using a light for caliber bullet. Just shoot 200 grain in .30/06 if you're going to do that. The .318 Westley Richards used a 250 grain .329" bullet at modest velocities and was widely used on elephant with good results. The .35 Winchester used 250 grain at 2150 fps and was a fine killer on NA heavy game. The .333 Jeffery Flanged used a .333" 300 grain bullet at 2150 fps and was deadly on everything from elephant on down.

I've done all of my black bear hunting with a double rifle in .400/.360 Purdey Nitro Express - a .366" 300 grain bullet at 1950 fps - with unbonded, cup and core RN bullets with sterling performance. Rifles for large boar and black bear don't get any better.

Impossible to tell, but I've a hunch that Wes' bullet deflected off bone. Just not enough mass. Surely a .338 Federal can push a 250 Woodleigh at 2100 to 2150 fps. That would be a much better choice than a 210 at 2400.
----------------------------------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

Rmiller, missed two deer by hitting brush, saw later where previously/at time of shot, brush in front of animal was not seen, but bullet struck and deflected.

Lucky for me one deer stayed after my bullet cut a small sapling, next shot thru the neck.

I think based on recount of hunt, animal reacted as if hit.

As far as why one would go up in bore size to end up with a lower SD bullet, it gives a higher expansion ratio, allowing a case of same capacity to push a heavier bullet faster, also increasing frontal area. Deer, some black bear and elk may be thrown in but a 185x or 210 partition has been proven in 338 dia. to be very good in penetration. Spoke to a guy who is high up at Kimber, used a 150 accubond to down an elk around 400 yds in 308. I bet a 185-210 bullet has similar SD as a 150 .308 so when you get into better quality bullets that won't blow up, you can go down in weight for given bore size, pick up velocity for trajectory and expansion, and still get plenty penetration.

I don't think anyone would question a 156-160 grain 6.5mm having enough 'mass' yet a 210 338 does not?

I think perhaps you are thinking more in terms of sectional density. Would a 250 give MORE momentum, increased mass AND S.D.? Yes, but at 175 yds will a 250 at 2150 mv expand? Don't know.

A 225 grain in cup/core or even partition I would be comfortable at that distance.

Something it 'appears' seems to have gone wrong upon bullet impact. It is very plausible the bullet did not cut vitals well enough to down the animal quickly. I believe a bear could run on 3 legs well enough as a deer, but as the OP said, the bear never really regained his feet, SO did 1 shoulder get broken, but the far side not? Possible.

Rmiller, did not mean to criticize your thoughts, very valid question whenever an animal leaves the scene.

quote:

Originally posted by 6.5BR:
Rmiller, missed two deer by hitting brush, saw later where previously/at time of shot, brush in front of animal was not seen, but bullet struck and deflected.

Lucky for me one deer stayed after my bullet cut a small sapling, next shot thru the neck.

I think based on recount of hunt, animal reacted as if hit.

As far as why one would go up in bore size to end up with a lower SD bullet, it gives a higher expansion ratio, allowing a case of same capacity to push a heavier bullet faster, also increasing frontal area. Deer, some black bear and elk may be thrown in but a 185x or 210 partition has been proven in 338 dia. to be very good in penetration. Spoke to a guy who is high up at Kimber, used a 150 accubond to down an elk around 400 yds in 308. I bet a 185-210 bullet has similar SD as a 150 .308 so when you get into better quality bullets that won't blow up, you can go down in weight for given bore size, pick up velocity for trajectory and expansion, and still get plenty penetration.

I don't think anyone would question a 156-160 grain 6.5mm having enough 'mass' yet a 210 338 does not?

I think perhaps you are thinking more in terms of sectional density. Would a 250 give MORE momentum, increased mass AND S.D.? Yes, but at 175 yds will a 250 at 2150 mv expand? Don't know.

A 225 grain in cup/core or even partition I would be comfortable at that distance.

Something it 'appears' seems to have gone wrong upon bullet impact. It is very plausible the bullet did not cut vitals well enough to down the animal quickly. I believe a bear could run on 3 legs well enough as a deer, but as the OP said, the bear never really regained his feet, SO did 1 shoulder get broken, but the far side not? Possible.

Rmiller, did not mean to criticize your thoughts, very valid question whenever an animal leaves the scene.

Absurd.
-----------------------------------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

Mind explaining what was 'absurd' sir? I posted my experiences on two hunts, how I understand why bullets don't always make it to intended targets, and my thoughts on bullet performance.

So you are saying my thoughts are incorrect? Looking at bullet performance, penetration by like SD bullets are affected by construction, not just grains vs caliber. Do you disagree? Or do you feel cup/core, bonded, solid copper, and partition bullets all act the same during penetration? I am confused.

I have no problem with heavy slow bullets if they cut a wound channel via frontal area and nose shape i.e. SWC handgun bullets that expand little if cast hard. Now do you feel that a 250 grain at 2150 mv will expand at 175 yds POI? Because if it does not, you lose shock value and wound channel width as that bullet may act like a solid, and be LESS effective. Understand my point?

Or is there something else you disagree with? I am open for debate. Educate me on my flawed thinking? I am open to be enlightened. Thanks.

I think the 338 federal with a 210 partition should do very well on big game.

I do know that bears don't leave much of a blood trail if any. Also they are hard to find in brush.

I did not find my black bear until I was six feet from it and never saw any blood trail at all. I hit it under the chin with a 308 win at 250 yards with a 180 core lokt. Found the bullet in the rear ham nicely mushroomed.

I would expect the 210 partition to penetrate similiarly to the 180 308 even though the S.d. is very different. The extra weight makes a difference. IMHO.

Neat info on the 338 Federal here:

http://link.brightcove.com/services/player/bcpid1156010...757&bctid=1184861568

Check it out.

Great link 6.5 .

Just looked neat seeing the bullet 'in action' wound channel, etc. Not a LONG range number, but I think on deer the bullet used may be an outstanding deer killer for reasons the narrator states. A 185 X might be the ticket for a best load for larger game, getting an improvement in trajectory and perhaps higher impact speed for expansion. Would have to compare to other 200 and 210's. 215 and 225's might have a place as well.

Be neat to have that ballistic media at leisure for testing at will! Answer many questions before trying on game.

is that video what do you think the little piece flying up in the air was between the 2 blocks of media??

I looked as closely as I could and tried to stop it to have a look

To me it looked like the plastic tip from the projectile flying in the air between the 2 blocks as they vibrated from the impact energy.

I plan to use the 180 or 225 Accubond in my .338 Fed when it gets here- whichever is more accurate.
with my 27.5 inch barrel I should be able to get the heavier slug to a couple hundred FPS over the factory listed velocity- more of a good thing

later
p

Having that much bbl I would think you might get 50-70 fps more, but the round has a high expansion ratio, so powder is burned quickly.

If you need more speed you did you consider the 338-06? Or did you just want a milder recoiling and blasting rifle? Just curious. I assume you used a short action?

I like shorter bbls for hunting, typically, but type of use does dictate. What is your game and common distance if I may ask?

I could cut it shorter
im thinking you loose 25 FPS an inch so I should pick up at least 20 per inch longer than the 22 inches most 338 Fed seem to be cut at. So about 100 FPS with a 225 load with the same pressure would be nice.
it's an ex target barrel originally 30 inches long
I'm just leaving it at it's maximum so I can work out what sort of velocity is possible-
If it's too difficult to use in the bush I chop it shorter but I dont plan to.
I am using the 338 Fed for health reasons.
After my major surgery I am unable to handle recoil much past 20 ft-lbs anymore.
My 6.5x55 ramge rifle was too much for me even a few months after a major bowel re-section.
10 months further on I have learned to handle the 6.5x55 with 140 A-max- but some days it's still not easy.
The federal will come out about 10-10.5 lbs scoped so it shouldn't kick much more than the 6.5x55.
Main game will be large ferals and vermin.

I'd really like to have a 180 grain load for feral cats and dogs- something to turn then inside out and then some.
hogs, goats, donkeys, maybe camels and at a very very long chance asiatic water buffalo.
but I live 2500+ miles from the nearest buffalo and flying is uncomfortable so they are unlikely.
I am more of a vermin shooter than a trophy hunter, I freely admit I'd pass up a shot on a 14 point buck to drop a feral cat or dog.
I'm more likely to stake out a waterhole than actively hunt the hills so it being shot from a rest or bi-pod is likely.
Yes
Tikka 595 short action is whats it's being built on.
Have a few 5 gallon drums full of 308 brass and a tapered expander so the 338/06 never got a look in even if I had an action to build it on.
Ranges are 10 feet to 250-300 yards- game is 10lb to 1200lb or maybe greater but rare.
I dont take shots at more than 400 because I cannot see that far
later
P

Sounds like you have it all worked out, I figured brass weighed in heavily on your choice, and recoil. No need to cut down, unless you need to for handling as you say.

Ken Waters did a test with 24" on BSA action, got 2600 with 200 gr ballistic tip IIRC. You will have all the rifle you need for your purposes.

Keep us posted on field results as many want to know how this round will perform. I say it does the same as a larger 338 round, but at shorter distances due to less MV, but it is still pushing a good amount of mass, at a good speed. Isn't it amazing what adding weight to a rifle does to recoil? It is apparent when you shoot a very light rifle, even in a modest cartridge. My 6.5x55 SS Featherweight I had surprised me, did not hurt, but let you know what it had.....modern loads in a modern rifle....140's seeming to nearly duplicate recoil you'd get in a 7/08 or 270 in the same gun.

Tikka action will perhaps have a slightly longer OAL so you can get a tad more powder in case. Keep the Hornady 200 gr in mind, perhaps a better BC and SD than the 180's, gives expansion but you still have 200 grains to work with, perhaps a good all around load for your use, and better priced than premium bullets if it matters. I sometimes use premium bullets, but do more shooting such as range work with conventional ones. Good luck and looking forward to hearing some field reports.

Thanks- I gave the G-smith some dummies so he can cut the chamber to suit best length for the magazine space available, to suit 200-225 projectiles and was just going to seat the 180 out a bit. Trying and find some 230 Failsafes to try as well.
Also in the unlikely event I shoot the throat out with the barrel at 27.5 inches it will enable me to get a few threads cut off and a re-chambering job done. Cutting off 1/2 to 3/4 inch per re-chamber say at every 2500 rounds will give me about 30 years worth of shooting

Do you have the part number of the Hornady you are talking about and I'll make sure I have some to try.

Can you please explain what you mean by a high expansion ratio?? does that mean I need to use a faster powder than I would have if loading a 308 or a slower one??
I thought if you went up in caliber on the same case you were supposed to use a faster powder.
H4895 seems to be the powder for the 308 so I was going to start with H335 or Benchmark.
Would H322 or H4198 be too fast as I have them in the cupboard as well

thanks
later
p

googled the definition:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expansion_ratio

http://www.daviddarling.info/encyclopedia/E/expansion_ratio.html

perhaps that will help, but basically, it's having a larger bore per cartridge size, let's say a 358 vs 243 which are both on the same case-308, the 35 bore has more area in the barrel to burn powder, and YES you are correct, as you INCREASE bore size, faster powders are often in order, now 4895 has been known to give good results in a 338/308 so if you look at burn charts, move in small increments towards faster burning powders.

http://www.reloadbench.com/burn.html

see page two under this article for load suggestions:

http://www.gunsandammomag.com/reloads/0702/

Hope that helps you and keep us posted on your success.

You are going to have to do a lot of shooting to ever get to where you need to set that barrel back, and yes, it should well provide a lifetime of shooting, I'd say 5-8k rounds life at least. Re: expansion ratio, another benefit besides increasing efficiency and energy when increasing bore size, all else equal, is better bore life. Always a trade off but I'd bet you will find loads given .4-.8 moa easily.

Hornady no. 3310 for the 200 gr.

cool thanks
10X, R15 Varget- have all those

just waiting on the rifle now- waiting ,waiting ,waiting

later
P

My final load is 43.5 grs of RL7 with the 185gr TSX bullets and I did achieve 2750 fps. I broke 2800fps using 44grs but pressure problems, loose primer pockets.

It's more than enough calibre and speed for 90% of hunting situations.

My gunsmith told me because of the expansion ratio, keeping a 26" tube would have no benefit so it's cut to 24". Muzzle blast is minimal so I'm convinced I'm getting a complete burn.

Personally I like short barrels and was happy with a 22" in 350 Rem mag, and a 20" would not bother me.

A 338/308 has less powder to burn so it will do fine at shorter lengths. I'd shoot whatever 'feels best' in your hands.

I had a similar experience with my 35 Whelen, a 225 gr. Nosler Part., and a mature bull elk. Although I lost the bull, due to the evidence, I felt the bullet hadn't penetrated adequately. A few days later I did find and kill a somewhat larger bull, but was still dissatisfied with the penetration of the bullet.
The next year, I switched to Barnes 225 gr. TSX. Dad & I found a nice, mature 6x6 and Dad wound up taking him with the Whelen. The bullet hit him squarely in the tater hole (anus) and travelled the length of the bulls torso until it stopped in the middle of the right shoulder and Barnes Bullets has two new customers.


Recovered weight was over 98% of original.

35W

Looks like my 85x recovered from just under hide on a 160lb hog, 243 winchester 20" bbl Ruger #1, 240 yd shot, DRT kill. I was SOLD! My son witnessed it and I am glad we had no tracking, esp. in the thicket it came out of that evening!

SWEET when they drop like a stone! MUCH rather had that x bullet in that cartridge on that animal, looked MUCH bigger and stouter than 160lb, and I think it was the best thing I could have had stoked in the chamber. My shoot a deer just because with that bullet, Barnes sight has a hunter using 243, DRT on about all kills. Not doubt it.

IIRC, Layne Simpson said he busted both shoulders of an elk at 314 yds, and I think had an exit, with 185x and 338 Federal. What more could you want? Or need?

If I had to right a story line on which I had to place money, it would involve using experiences that are not related to hunting. I have extensive experience with the laser rangefinders on our M1 tanks. It is for this reason I've never bothered owning a person one. During certain weather conditions and situations such as dust, twilight, fog, laser readings tend to read short. I've been told that particles in the air, while not enough to individually reflect a laser, have an accumulative ability to do so. When we observed un-explanable short rounds or suspect distance readings, our rangefinders had an adjustment to "arm on second return." This told the ballistic computer to ignore the first return that would be short. If this is what accured in your instance, I would suggest you short-lined the round and broke legbone without hitting vitals. That would account for the noise signature as well as the odd target feedback. Just a wild hunch. Besides, the Partition's reputation would make me look at something other than the bullet. The scenerio I just described would account for good aim, good bullet performance, and the sounds and actions afterwords.

This is not intended as a poke at txpo ..Wes!
I regret his lost bear, and understand the anguish. If you hunt enuf it will eventually happen. I also like his choice of rifle, calibre, and bullet. I hope to own one soon myself (.338 Fed.). Keep the faith in your set-up Wes, it will get you plenty of nice animals in years to come I hope.
However this sounds familiar. I have heard variations on this story before regarding shoulder shot attempts. The results are often a lost Bear.
Jorge..makes a good point.. they are really a lot softer target than most think.
Why not just rip a good bullet thru the heart/lungs? We all do it for deer, elk, moose, etc. Why this facination with trying to pop a Black Bear in the shoulder? Myself I always shoot for the heart/lungs for Blackies.
My last Bear went maybe 10 yds from where I hit him thru the lungs with a 150 gr. 7mm Rem mag, Federal Hi Shok. Nothing hi tech or exotic there but efficient as hell. Took a rib in and out, shredded the lung and some arteries... dead bear.
There seems to be a mystique generated over the years that you need to hit a Blackie in the shoulder and break him down...nah.. he's not a Kodiak. Really.. even a large Blackie will drop pretty quick with a well placed lung/heart shot (just like that last whitetail back home did ;>..). Bonus is if he does travel a ways you will have a good blood trail to follow and finding him should be easy.
Sorry if this sounds preachy.. was not intended that way.

Not being a bear expert myself, thought somebody might could use this bear anatomy info I found for someone on another forum:

http://www.theidahosportsman.com/bear%20anatomy.pdf

I think the OP on this thread did his part, and the cartridge, but read MANY reports how many rounds go through bears and the thick fat layer seals shut quick, not allowing a blood trail, also having heard sometimes a bear may climb and get wedged after dying? Anyone seen this/heard it also?

Anyway, hope the anatomy info helps bear hunters know where to shoot.

Just a thought. . . . You said you used a Nosler partition. I have had the experience of shooting a 80 lb. Blacktail Deer in the shoulder blade, quartering toward me at about 30 yards with a 180 gr. partition, from a .30-06. The Deer never flinched. I watched him for about 20 seconds expecting it to drop; it didn't. The next shot went through the brain and dropped it DRT. When skinning I saw the partition had it's soft nose swipped off at an angle, and only slid about 8" along the blade and stopped next to the skin. The Deer would have lived a long life had I not shot it again. I have had 4 other failures with partitions and will never use one again. I think the noses are too soft so they will expand quickly, and the copper jacket bends to the side easily on a angled shot into bone because of the design. Straight on shots work fine. I know others that have had similar results, but it seems most think they are just the greatest, so folks won't speak up from fear of redicle. I could care less, as facts are facts. I've used the cheap Hornadys, and have never been disapointed. For a premium bullet I would use the Barnes triple shocks.

I have killed elk at 400 plus yards with the 210 Nosler out of my 338 Win. I am sure a 210 Nosler leaving the barrel at 2500 FPS is plenty of bang for bear up to 300 plus yards..I doubt seriously that it failed.

A bear is not well defined and its easy to shoot one a little shallow and if you do it will make many tracks. I suspect that is what happened, I have seen this many times with black bear..

One hates to blame anything on his shooting but in fact that is mostly the case, it happens to all of us that hunt, no exceptions except on the internet, it never happens there!

The bottom line is you have probably lost confidence in your rifle, so what we hunters do in a case like that is dump the 338 Federal and buy a bigger gun like a .375 or 338 Win. and regain our confidence and continue on the path of glory!

Keep talking Ray, I want a LOT of 338 federal ownwers, ESP. Sako Finnlight owners to lose confidence in their rifle, enough drop in demand, will make the supply of guns going CHEAP go up, and I'll snag a steal on a gun I'd just as soon hunt with up to 300 yds as a 358 or 350.

Anyone happy with the 338 Federal, keep it your secret.....at least till I get one.

For what it is worth, I showed up at bear camp with a .338wm and 210 grain partitions. My grizzled old guide told me it was a fine long range round but it would never fully penetrate the bear. As it turned out, he was exactly correct. The bear finally went down, 3 shots at 90 to 175 yards --- all shots entered the chest cavity but no exits. I was a 7 foot blackie at 435 pounds. My take away --- the 210 grain is less than a .3 sectional density. Use a 250 next time.

I got bang-flops on full grown camels with my federal using 225 grain SPBT speers and Varget.
ranges from 50 feet to 200+ yards.
I got one bull camel quartering away at 125 yards- his nose ploughed the ground so hard I though his neck had broken as well- expired in he time it took me to walk the 125 yards over flat gound-
Entered a little bit back but because of the angle it broke his far shoulder and trenched a hole through him on it's way.
Easily 1900+ lbs and a thick shoulder armour plates

I also got a stiff leg face plant on a 600 lbs+ feral stallion.

projectile selection -

later
P

PS just fixed my typo- I originally wrote 900+ LBS it was meant to be 1900 LBS (900kgs) a big bull can go 2400 lbs and up and 12+ feet to the top of the hump.

Ogre, agreed, when using my old 338/06, I selected 225 partitions for my do it all and elk load, whereas a 200 bt was my choice for deer, latter at 2900 mv, former 2670. I do realize bullets 210 and lower will more often be used in the 338F for flatter trajectories but see a place for 225's to be evaluated/used, to my mind doing what a 358/250gr combo does.

The 338F should push 225's at enough speed for most normal ranges (never designed as LONG range) but as to buckeye, I appreciate SD remark but when using MONO bullets- SD comparison is not apples to apples to NON mono IMHO.

375 would have been good but the 338 WM with 225 or 250gr Partitions would have been better than the low powered 338Fed....to me the 210 is a deer bullet...not a bear bullet...sorrry....

quote:

The bullet hit him squarely in the tater hole (anus)

Hence the term "Texas Heart Shot".