I have a spare very short bolt action lounging around doing nothing useful or even social in my vault. It is, or was, an early XP-100 in .221 Fireball.

I still have all the original parts to turn it back into its original self, plus three different after market grip frames.

But I really have no need for another single shot varmint pistol....already have more than enough of those. I think maybe instead I'd like to have a small, light single shot bolt action rifle for use as a spur of the moment target of opportunity blaster out in the desert... seems like a right tolerable idea so far.

I do have a spare .473" faced bolt, too, so am not restricted to just the .221/.222/.223 cartridge cases or wildcats built on them.

Have spare barrel blanks on hand in 6m/m, .250, 6.5 m/m, 7m/m, .30, and .338.

So, what to do? Have been thinking a nice little .250/3,000 Savage. or maybe a switch-barrel .250 savage/7m/m-08 would fill the bill "right purty".

What do you think? A nice little rifle? Some other kind of pistol? A carbine in a pistol chambering?

What would turn your crank? doesn't have to be anything I mentioned or have even conceived of....

Lay your idea on me, please.

What would be the biggest varmint in the desert you would be blasting?

For that a 223 would be hard to beat.

And cheap to shoot.

If you want someting eccelectic, then may be a 250/3000 Savage, shooting the original 87 gr bullets.

One vote for cute little SS 250Savage



SSR

The 250 Savage sounds just right to me.
A switch barrel rig would be awesome as well.

With a 6.5 barrel I would look at the Grendel.

quote:

Originally posted by N E 450 No2:
What would be the biggest varmint in the desert you would be blasting?

For that a 223 would be hard to beat.

And cheap to shoot.

If you want someting eccelectic, then may be a 250/3000 Savage, shooting the original 87 gr bullets.

Well on the edge of the desert is some country with several-hundred pound black bears in it. They come to a varmint call, but I don't think I'd use a .223 on them. Probably wouldn't run onto any of them anyway, though. They are very few and far between. If one went another 150 miles NE there are lots of them that big and bigger, but that isn't desert country. It's forested mountains just beyond the east side of the Apache reservation.

Mainly it would be just a fun gun, capable of shooting whatever a guy ran into out there among the saghuaros, cholla, ironwood, tumbleweeds, bunchgrass, etc...200+ pound mule deer, down through 100-pound white-tails to 40-pound Javelinas, and then the varmints which are pretty common...lions, bobcats, coyotes, and so on. A .223 would kill them all with perfect shots, but I'd rather have something which would be good for the toughest shots on the biggest things I might run onto IF I go with it as a rifle. I don't mind being a bit over-gunned, but I hate being a bit under-gunned. Don't think it is fair to either the animals or me.

Anyway, what I might plan to do with it isn't really important at this point. What you guys would build and use that action for are what I'm curious about.

Describe YOUR potential use, and what you would build on it. That might stir some ideas in my old noggin.

quote:

Originally posted by Von Gruff:
With a 6.5 barrel I would look at the Grendel.

Von Gruff - Please tell me more about the Grendel. Though I hae heard small bits about it for half a dozen years now, I really don't know much about it (...if Grendel knowledge was sand, I wouldn't have enough to scratch my eyeball).

What case is it on? How long is it? What does it do ballistically? How would you compare that with maybe doing a 6.5/.250 Savage? (I have an OLD but still sharp reamer for a 6.5 Donaldson Ace.) Do you know anyone who hunts with the Grendel?

300 savage would cover all those bets.
110 gr bullets for little stuff.
125's for the yotes and such,and 150's for the deer.
you wouldn't be under or over gunned. [bulleted]

260 AI. Most of what a 6.5-284 will do, without pressure problems. Easy to get dies.

AC

Baised on that info I would build a 308.

Yes I know, but I have killed a lot of varmints, deer and even a black bear with a 308.

They are very accurate.

I would work up two loads.
I would use 150 or 165 gr bullets, which ever shot best in the rifle.

I would get these 2 different bullets to shoot as close together as possible.

I would use the Nosler Ballistic Tip, and the Nosler Partition.
These bullets are easy to tell apart at a glance.

I would use the Partition when shooting the bigger deer or a black bear within in say 200 yards or so. I would use the Ballistic Tips for everything else, even the bigger animals at longer ranges.

I would put an 18 to 20" barrel on it.

I have a similar rifle, it is a Blaser K 95 Stutzen. A light weight single shot, in 308 of course.
I have killed turkey, deer, wild pigs and black bear with it.

I would also make it as light as possible.

Short fat fluted barrel around 18" with high end really light graphite stock. Keep the weight to around 5-1/2 pounds. Find something like the old Burris Compact 2-7x to keep the total weight to around 6 pounds. Ideal chambering would be 7-08 or 7BR. Will kill anything you run into, but with lighter bullets is a much better varmint rig and could be shot a lot with more comfort. If it hadn't been a single shot, 338 federal would have been interesting, with relatively low recoil for big stuff but accurate 338 bullets for varmints. Something like that on an old 600 action would be nice, but that could be a restocked 600 in 350 Rem Mag.

The 250 Savage would be nice, but I recently built one that is better, so no interest there. I took a surplus 25-06 Weatherby ULW fluted barrel, set it back and stuck it on a Charles Daly Mini Mauser and put it in a B&C Tan Spiderweb stock with glass bedding. It hits the above specs with a longer barrel and is a repeater. A shorter fatter fluted barrel would make the same specs but would give up some velocity but would maybe gain a little accuracy. Bottom line is that if I were going to use the larger heavier single shot action, I would get a little more bang for the buck.

6.5 Creedmoor (6.5-.250 Imp.). Light 23-24" barrel.

Clarence

Jut saw this on another Forum. This is close to what I am talking about.

http://home.pipeline.com/~shoo...er/Mini%20Mauser.htm

I've got to say that I originally did my 250 in 6BR, but changed to improve feeding. I got the BR to feed, but it was never smooth, and I got tired of it. All the BR cartridges are hard to get to feed well due to being short and almost cylindrical. The 7BR may be better, since the longer bullet may help guid it into the chamber.

I would sell it because of the value. I also hate the dogleg bolt handle. When converted to a rifle, the XP or 600 receivers have the rear receiver screw so close that aftermarket triggers won't clear. I would get a Mod 7 receiver to base my build. Save yourself a little money and have a better end product.

quote:

Originally posted by Alberta Canuck:

quote:

Originally posted by Von Gruff:
With a 6.5 barrel I would look at the Grendel.

Von Gruff - Please tell me more about the Grendel. Though I hae heard small bits about it for half a dozen years now, I really don't know much about it (...if Grendel knowledge was sand, I wouldn't have enough to scratch my eyeball).

What case is it on? How long is it? What does it do ballistically? How would you compare that with maybe doing a 6.5/.250 Savage? (I have an OLD but still sharp reamer for a 6.5 Donaldson Ace.) Do you know anyone who hunts with the Grendel?

The 6.5 Grendel is a 7.62x39 opened up and fireformed to the Grendel..Hornady makes brass for it now..I shoot it with my ar-15..There is a web site 6.5 Grendel. You'll get a lot of info.

Opened up? I thought 6.5 was smaller than the 7.62.

7.62x39. Plenty of cheap ammunition to have fun with and adequate power in handloaded soft points for any deer. Use a .308 barrel -- you will have more good hunting bullet choices and the .310" bullets in military surplus ammunition won't know the difference.

how bout a nice 6mm ppc

quote:

Originally posted by butchlambert:
I would sell it because of the value. I also hate the dogleg bolt handle. When converted to a rifle, the XP or 600 receivers have the rear receiver screw so close that aftermarket triggers won't clear. I would get a Mod 7 receiver to base my build. Save yourself a little money and have a better end product.

That's an interesting thought, Butch. I might rather have a plain old Model 7 anyway. In something like that I could have a nice little switch-barrel in .243, .260, and .338 Federal. Of course, I do really sort of prefer the single shot, though...a nice, lighter, slimmer, gun...kinda like a beater .22 LR but in good condition and on lots of Steroids. (The same but different? Ain't that always what we're after?)

Anyway all this chit-chat about cartridges has got me thinking again....how about keeping the .223 bolt face size and just doing a .223, 6 m/m TCU, and 7m/m TCU? (and maybe even a .300 Grande Whisperer (full length .223 case opened to .30)?

I think your 7mm TCU is great thought. A small/lightweight rifle so chambered is on my "want to do one day" list. The TCUs are great in Contenders, ought to be great in bolt rifle.

quote:

Originally posted by Stonecreek:
7.62x39. Plenty of cheap ammunition to have fun with and adequate power in handloaded soft points for any deer. Use a .308 barrel -- you will have more good hunting bullet choices and the .310" bullets in military surplus ammunition won't know the difference.

This is also a good idea, and I'm surprised I didn't think of it myself. That little case is already in a lot of use around my house. I've got a jacketed bullet bench gun based on my own neck-down of that case to shoot .224 bullets...sort of a .22 PPC AI, plus I've got an AR-15 in the standard 7.62x39, and a cast bullet benchrest rifle in a 7.62x39 AI chambering.

Anyway,if a fella was gonna have just one barrel for his little lightweight, walk-around, single-shot, skinny & willowy desert gun, I think a 7.62x39 might be just the ticket.

Made with a fast enough twist it could always handle bullets such as a Nosler 165gr, Partition (if they make one that weight). Carry a few of those in one's pocket and the odd black bear would be "no sweatsky, Komrade".

Make a hell of a "willow switch" to straighten out bad behaviors of wayward actors like lions and 'yotes, and might put a little meat on the evening platter too....

quote:

Originally posted by craigster:
I think your 7mm TCU is great thought. A small/lightweight rifle so chambered is on my "want to do one day" list. The TCUs are great in Contenders, ought to be great in bolt rifle.

Craig - thanks for your comment. Your thinking always gets serious consideration from me as you are one of the several folks here at AR whom I really respect for their knowledge combined with reasoning power.

I currently have a 6m/m TCU single shot (a Contender), and it is hell on wheels for Coues deer and Javelina. I've been shooting "li'l piggies" with it since '82 and it works on them like about a half-stick of 40% ingested orally. DRT.

I figure for bigger deer the 7 TCU would be the berries. Of course, I live here. I don't HAVE to get a deer on a costly 3-to-5 day hunt. Again, it's a pure target of opportunity thing to me, as my shots aren't gonna be over 200 yards. If a deer (or his brother) is over that distance, well, I'll see him or one of his horny (antlered) relatives up close and personal some other time.

All you other guys, Cross, Lamar, and all the rest of you. I appreciate and am NOT overlooking your comments. All have been useful to me so far. It's nice to be reminded of all the possibilities...and advised of others which hadn't yet crept through the 8" of bone between my ears.

i had, and want it back, a savage striker in 708 .. loved it.. great hunting "pistol" ...

300 blackout

257DGR of course.

257/204 Ruger would be my choice. I have seen 2 versions, the 257 Kimber, and 257 Scooter.

nother easy thought would be a 6x45 or 6x47

my last problem like this ended up to be another martini cadet in 17AH. should be just about of the bluing tanks and ready to put together, with the wildest piece of maple you ever saw

quote:

Originally posted by Alberta Canuck:

quote:

Originally posted by Stonecreek:
7.62x39. Plenty of cheap ammunition to have fun with and adequate power in handloaded soft points for any deer. Use a .308 barrel -- you will have more good hunting bullet choices and the .310" bullets in military surplus ammunition won't know the difference.

This is also a good idea, and I'm surprised I didn't think of it myself. That little case is already in a lot of use around my house. I've got a jacketed bullet bench gun based on my own neck-down of that case to shoot .224 bullets...sort of a .22 PPC AI, plus I've got an AR-15 in the standard 7.62x39, and a cast bullet benchrest rifle in a 7.62x39 AI chambering.

Anyway,if a fella was gonna have just one barrel for his little lightweight, walk-around, single-shot, skinny & willowy desert gun, I think a 7.62x39 might be just the ticket.

Made with a fast enough twist it could always handle bullets such as a Nosler 165gr, Partition (if they make one that weight). Carry a few of those in one's pocket and the odd black bear would be "no sweatsky", Komrade.

Make a hell of a "willow swich" to straighten out bad behaviors of wayward actors like lions and 'yotes, and might put a little meat on the evening platter too....

I'll have to admit that my suggestion comes from years of pining for a 7.62x39 built on a Sako L461 Action. I had one of the Mini Mark X Mausers in 7.62 once, but it apparently had a barrel rifled by a drunk with a chisel because I could shoot better groups with my old 16 gauge Browning Humpback. Legend has it that Sako actually built some factory guns in 7.62, but if that is true there were apparently none imported to the U.S. The little 7.62x39, although not all that powerful, is certainly versatile. Poachers in Africa are said to wear down Rhinos and Buffalo with them.

quote:

Mini Mark X Mausers in 7.62 once, but it apparently had a barrel rifled by a drunk with a chisel because I could shoot better groups with my old 16 gauge Browning Humpback.

It´s usefull to remember that 7,62 do not use ordinary .30 cal bullets. Correct size is .311

quote:

Originally posted by igorrock:

quote:

Mini Mark X Mausers in 7.62 once, but it apparently had a barrel rifled by a drunk with a chisel because I could shoot better groups with my old 16 gauge Browning Humpback.

It´s usefull to remember that 7,62 do not use ordinary .30 cal bullets. Correct size is .311

It is also useful to remember that the name of this forum is "Accurate Reloading" and it can be assumed that most anyone here seeking accuracy will, as I did, try a number of bullet/powder combinations. Various bullets, including factory loads (which usually use bullets closer to .310) were tried in the Mini Mark X, varying from 110 gr. .308" to 150 gr .311" and almost any combination in between. The result was always the same: Unsatisfactory. While I did not bother to slug the bore of the Mini Mark X and am not sure of its nominal diameter, I am aware that most U.S. manufacturers who chamber this round use a .308 barrel on it.

My mini mauser was a 7.62X39, but I rechambered it 270X39. It was an excellent young person's deer rifle. I am now redoing it with the help of KSTOTT and Mike Bryant. It will be chambered in 220Beggs. Actually a 220 Russian[PPC parent case]that has a small difference in the radius at the neck shoulder juncture. Not a big change, but helps to keep the neck from migrating forward. I will shoot 52grn bullets in it.

You didn't mention having a .270 barrel so I stayed silent but now that the .270 X 39 has been mentioned I'll throw in the 6.8 SPC. That will at LEAST = the 30-30 energy level and with 130 gr. bullets or smaller be totally adequate should you run into a 200 # + mulie. You could also neck that case down to 6.5 or .250 and go with 100 grain bullets. That case capacity with the mentioned calibers would have an extremely large range of usable powders to boot.
In truth,IMHO, your expressed option in a 25-3000 would be a dandy. An 18" barrel and a 2 to 7 power scope would facilitate a nice balance. Always willing to help. roger

Actually the 270X39 was an ackley. More like a 270PPC. The reamer is a PPC reamer necked up to 270.

(Suppressed) .300 Blackout.

George

I would think similar to George, but go with a 300 Whisper. The reason being that the Whisper is an officially recognized pistol cartridge if you'd want to hunt somewhere that only allowed pistol cartridges (Ohio and Indiana are 2 that come to mind).

Instead of a 6.5 Grendel, research the 6.5 BPC (Brindell Palisimo Cartridge). Palisimo of PPC fame was the designer, and it is essentially what the Grendel would be if optimised for a bolt rifle instead of the AR15 platform.