Is the .338-06 chambered by any rifle company or is it still a wildcat custom job for gun makers? Using a 210 gr TSX bullet at around 2,600 fps should be nice step up on a 30-06 with a very slight increase in recoil, but still very comfortable to shoot. I have not come across this cartridge here in SA and I was just wondering how popular it is in the USA. I also noticed that the .338 Federal has been launched a little while ago, that may have eaten into the limelight of the .338-06? Your opinions would be appreciated.

Pieter

Weatherby offered for a very short time in their Mark V Ultra Light. It did not sell. However, my opinion is that anyone wanting a 338/06 in an expensive rifle would buy A Mark V. I think they would buy something more likely to be based on a Model 70 or Mauser 98.

There are some in Australia but I have only seen them on a guns/hunting forum.

I think the problem with the 338/06 (and the 35 Whelen) as factory guns and factory chamberings is the market is very small. However, unlike calibres like the 9.3 X 62, 375, 458 Win and the Wby calibres etc. the 338/06 and 35 Whelen will only bear 270 or 30/06 pricing.

I think Nosler still chambers it in their M48.
Weatherby all but killed it with their over pricing of ammo and Mark V only offering and along with A square who I think standardized the cartridge.

I have 3 of them. One is the Weatherby MK V ULW and the other two are full customs, one of which is built on a Mauser action and the other by top gun builder Mark Bansner (jn a custom wood stock no less)on a model 70 action. Mark is mostly known for very high end (7K) custom very accurate lightweight sheep hunting type rifles. I also have two 35 Whelens, one was built by Mark in his SH type lightweight on a Ruger M77 action and the other in a Remington 7600 pump with a shortened 18" bbl...Quite the quick handling killing machine

Both are well above the 06 for the larger game.

It is a very excellent, old timey wildcat that made good but whose timing and presentation was pi**-poor. I has long been known as one of the better wildcats from that by-gone era whose cognoscente knew a thing or seven, and it's popularity is what got it into factory chambering...this in the non-internet days where word of mouth and gun rags were the only things proffering information.

What's not to like about a shooter that tosses a 225 gr bullet at similar velos as the 30-06 can toss a 180 gr and the 180 gr was known to do an excellent job on anything it hit...forger all the magnumitise "stuff".

I had mine built in the mid 60's...you can do a search on AR for all that information and a bunch more, pro and con.

It's been my go to shooter for the most part because I trust it and know how well it shoots and hardly ever required a second shot.

The several short, fat iterations are also excellent if you like short action rifles.

People get locked into what the advertising gurus feed them and what is available for the most part and for the few times a year shooters most hardly ever look at calibers over 30 or maybe 338.

Gun writers killed the European calibers in the past and present somewhat and ex military like the 223 and black rifles and with the push to take away your guns AND rights MANY excellent calibers are going by the wayside... manufacturers just won't push any cal that doesn't have a track record and those that do see their offerings blindsided. Look at all the excellent cartridges that have died or are dying on the vine in the past 10-15 years.

I like my 338-06 very much and I have a wall rack full of everything from 17 to 50 cal to chose from. I don't hunt anything much larger than a 'yote now days, but my 338-06 will do a job on sage rats to moose (with the correct bullet type and placement) and everything in between with aplomb and not stomp the **** out of me with recoil.

I'm working with my 338 Lapua right now developing loads...it gets 200-300 fs more than the 338-06 with the same weight bullets...the Oehler 33 says ~3250 fs with a 200 gr Hornady with a couple of powders, my 338-06 does 2900-2950 with the same bullet but 25 gr less of a faster powder, less recoil, less noise, less of a lot of things, but a bit more fun doing the purple haze on sage rats.

quote:

Originally posted by NONAGONAGIN:

I'm working with my 338 Lapua right now developing loads...it gets 200-300 fs more than the 338-06 with the same weight bullets...the Oehler 33 says ~3250 fs with a 200 gr Hornady with a couple of powders, my 338-06 does 2900-2950 with the same bullet but 25 gr less of a faster powder, less recoil, less noise, less of a lot of things, but a bit more fun doing the purple haze on sage rats.

Two calibres that have never attracted me are the 338/06 and the 338 Lapua.

I would much rather the 35 Whelen and because of the bullets. As to the 338 Lapua, for me the 338/378 is the choice. Probably because both require the big bolt face and expensive brass so I would rather get the bigger case capacity.

Probably different in America but in Australia a plus the 338/378 has is brass in the sense if the distributor has either 30/378 or 378 brass you are in business.

For the 338 Lapua case capacity I would choose the 338 RUM or 338 Edge.

But things would be fucked if we all liked the same stuff.

The 338 RCM killed it.

Yeah...there's ALWAYS something bigger OR smaller...and I'm a wildcatter from way back...I've done things that few would even think about doing...the 338-06 and 7x57 IMP were the beginning of my "strange things are about to happen" days.

I bought the Savage Lapua because of the slightly larger barrel shank and redesigned bolt and receiver, 5 round straight feed mag, MUCH cheaper than any other Lapua rifle, HUGE MB that really works, plenty of 338 cal bullets on hand from almost 50 years of bullet sales...BUT...mostly anticipating a 50 cal 34-36" barrel for my 510 Makatak Rigby based wildcat for those wily sage rats that take a dive WAY out there...50 cal slugs make a nice dirt splash.

Several years ago I got into a giant hoohaw over suggesting a Savage 110 would handle a Lapua single loaded as long as the pressures were kept down slightly...and anyone who has worked with the Savage knows there used to be a longer magazine for the Sav 116 model, 375 H&H, I think, that would handle a ~3.50" COAL and was available for a time from Midway and a few other places that handled Savage parts...I have a couple extra stuck away in addition to the two I installed on two LA's for 7mmRM, 300 WM, 416 Taylor and 375 H&H "swap" barrels.

NO one saw the "keep the pressures down" bit...all they saw was LAPUA...and I think those that howled the loudest never bothered to look at Lapua pressure specs...I found 2 levels back then. I was getting ready to order a 338 cal barrel for my 375 H&H Savage receiver when the Sav 338 Lapua came out and solved to problems at once.

338 WSM, RCM, FED, MARLIN EXPRESS and the little brudders, /308 and WHISPER...how many others??????

Since the digital age came along we can build just about ANYTHING from sweet dreams to total nightmares...and call it good because SOMEONE WANTS IT.

It's sort of the Rodney Dangerfield of 06 based cartridges.
I've been a big fan of the 338/06 for about 20 years or so. Best use of an 06 case ever in my mind. My Ruger 77 shoots 210 grain Partitions like a dream. It's easy on the shoulder but hard on the eyes.
I'm considering turning loose of my FN 30/06 and my Johann Springer 270 in and re-barreling my Dakota #10 to 338/06 for use as my primary BGR.

I think the 338 Federal was DOA and had no effect on the 338/06.

Cooper sells a lot of 338/06's, in fact it is the #1 caliber on custom orders for them from what I'm told.

I am a fan of the 338-06, mine is built on a VZ24 Brno '98 Mauser action, 1936 vintage I believe. The 338'06 is a wonderful cartridge, the expansion ratio is nearly perfect and the velocity you get is rather surprising with a 24" barrel. Recoil is mild enough, even with 250's, but mine only ever sees 210gr Partitions and some 200gr Accubonds when shooting at gongs for fun.
Although my chamber is SAAMI A-Square spec, my dies are wildcat spec, there doesn't seem to be any difference in the cartridges turned out before and after firing.
I don't think it's as obscure as some think, I have seen more 338-06's at the range than I have 35 Whelens, this makes sense due to the better selection of 338 cal bullets and better ballistics.

Cheers.

quote:

Originally posted by TREE 'EM:

I think the 338 Federal was DOA and had no effect on the 338/06.

There are quite a few blokes on Australia's biggest guns/hunting forums with 338 Federals. Not sure but think Tikka rifles.

But with forums who knows. If we use AR as an example you would think a 375 H&H was behind every second bush

Like you I have also heard that 338/06 is big with Cooper.

Two wildcats that I can't understand a lack popularity are the 6mm/06 and 22/243, not the Middlestead but straight neck down.

I have three .338-06, one .330 Dakota and two .35 Whelens. The .33's are good. They are used for elk except the Dakota which has never been hunted with. The 210 grain TSX runs just slightly below 2800 fps and the Partition nearly the same. They will shoot as flat as I will ever shoot and will group 1" or less. The Whelen works good with 225gr TSX and nearly as flat. I just don't need magnums-these standards do everything I need.

quote:

The 210 grain TSX runs just slightly below 2800 fps and the Partition nearly the same.

Does one really need more than this.... even at lower velocity one is good to hunt the biggest Elk in North America.

Pieter

It's basically the .318 Westley Richards, and that old number earned itself a very fine reputation.

Absolutely Bill...and there IS a bit of bias on some of the threads on AR.

We also need to remember that there are a lot of shooters that DON'T post, post on other forums, post infrequently or post short blurbs and it is only/usually the vociferous ones that let their fingers do the walking and do the Energizer Bunny thing.

I'm betting there are a ton of shooters out there with all the various "hidden" calibers that never utter a peep.

I now have a fast twist 6-284, 220 Swift and 22-243 Midd(the ORIGINAL 22-243, just a 243 or 7-08 case necked down to 22 and not the slight. Some times those hot rock barrels didn't last long enough to develop a decent load for and bullets didn't make it to the 50 yd line.

The old argument between "standards" and "magnums" is no different than the argument between slow, heavy bullets and fast, light bullets, or between semi-autos and bolt, or between bolt and doubles...basically boils down to personal bias/requirements/favorites/likes/dislikes/etc...any answer will never be right for all and if your rifle/caliber works for you then what the Hey

The lowly 22 LR has taken care of I don't know how many deer for me spotlighting...I DON'T RECOMEND using one...it was all I had at one time and the family needed food, but as soon as I acquired a 30-30, the 22 was relegated to small game where it belonged.

Famous words to think on..."It all depends..."

quote:

Originally posted by Michael McGuire:

quote:

Originally posted by TREE 'EM:

I think the 338 Federal was DOA and had no effect on the 338/06.

There are quite a few blokes on Australia's biggest guns/hunting forums with 338 Federals. Not sure but think Tikka rifles.

But with forums who knows. If we use AR as an example you would think a 375 H&H was behind every second bush

Like you I have also heard that 338/06 is big with Cooper.

Two wildcats that I can't understand a lack popularity are the 6mm/06 and 22/243, not the Middlestead but straight neck down.

338 Federal is available in AR10s & Savage is starting to produce them. None of the moderate 338s seem to sell much (338-06, Federal, RCM). The faster 338 Win Mag & Lapua are much more popular.

At least with the 338-06 and the Federal, you never have to worry about brass being discontinued or hard to find.

quote:

Originally posted by scottfromdallas:
The 338 RCM killed it.

Surely you jest!

Matt

quote:

The .338-06 - how popular?

In my area, not at all. If you're a handloader, that's fine; otherwise, it's just more junk in the ammo trunk.

I built up a 338-06 on a 03 A3 Remington action with a ER Shaw 24" bbl. love it. The elk and deer, not so much. 210 Nosler Partitions and 200 ballistic tips are the answer to any questions I could think of.

quote:

Originally posted by ColoradoMatt:

quote:

Originally posted by scottfromdallas:
The 338 RCM killed it.

Surely you jest!

Matt

I was wondering about that as well.

Was at the range Monday morning with a .338 Win Mag. Quickly realized why I had a .338-06 and a .338 WSM. Both of the latter were much easier to shoot.

Isn't that strange...The bigger the caliber gets the harder YOU fall...

But your right...lots of difference in recoil between my 338-06 and 338 Lapua, equal bullet weights compared.


Not much difference between the 338 WSM and the 338 WM is there...performance on game AND recoil wise???. Both run about ~84-86 gr H20 depending. About the same as the 300 WM and the 300 WSM, not splitting hairs...real world.

Winters coming and I've got the itch to do something different??? on the WSM case so I have a miniscule excuse to buy a Tikka WSM.

Absolutely love my 338-06, by far one of if not my favorite rifle.

Nothing more than a short chambered A & B barrel screwed onto a 1950 FN Mauser action and put into a laminated Boyd's stock.

Absolute tack driver with 210 Swift bullets.

One of the interesting things about the 338/06 and 35 Whelen supporters (I am on 35 Whelen page) it's often the case that either calibre's fans lists bullets availability as better

Actually, I was thinking that a 338RugerCompactMagnum would have made a nice rifle for my wife. It does seem a bit more modern and efficient design than the 338-06. Nothing wrong with either caliber and the RCM could come in an easy-carrying package.

But we never got around to buying one of the 338RCM's. When it comes done to decisions and choices, it's hard not to go with the good ol' 338WinMag. If someone wants to give up 150 fps, then they can find a light load with a faster powder.

My wife ended up with a 375Ruger, 20" barrel. It too can be loaded light at 80% power, down to 338RCM, 338=06, and 338WM levels, but it is still legal for anything in Tanzania.

Find a rifle that you like, and chamber it for something that will get the job done. For a wildcat, the 338/375Ruger is worth looking at, too.

If you handload, the 338-06 makes a nice sandwich, and the world will never run out of 30-06 brass, the parent case.

As for the 338 RCM...BOTH guys who bought that caliber in the US agree that it killed off the 338-06 :-)

quote:

Originally posted by Michael McGuire:

quote:

Originally posted by ColoradoMatt:

quote:

Originally posted by scottfromdallas:
The 338 RCM killed it.

Surely you jest!

Matt

I was wondering about that as well.

Yes, it was a joke.

Pieter. The cartridge is mildly popular here in Canada. In my circle of hunting acqaintances I know of 3 fellows, including myself that use this wildcat.
Don't know of any manufacturers currently making guns in this configuration.
And yes, the 210gr bullet is ideal for this cartridge. I use the 210gr Scirocco with outstanding ballistics. ie 2850fps Quite a step up from the 06.
Good luck with your endeavor.

Wonderful cartridge. Mine is in aVZ24 action, Shell maple stock. Partridge front and Lyman 56 rear. Still use 275 grain speers at 2450.

How popular?
Kind of through world of mouth, I guess.

Mainly a magnum devotee and chose .338 as my standard caliber of choice, since live in rural AK. The .338/300win does everything I want, yet I traded a .450marlin guide gun for a semi-custom .338-06 some years back. Just had the chamber AI'ed so guess I'm in for the haul as everybody disdains AI chambers these days.

Bought a used NEI 283gr rn bullet mold some years back, and later a Lee 225gr. Shot the NEI about 20rds in a .340wby and wow! What A Bullet! Not so much out of the weatherby, but the hardcase wheelweight alloy in this bullet runs about 293gr.

Had loaded Failsafe 230gr for the penetration aspect in .338-06, but now w/AI chamber am thinking heavier and slower. The 293gr RN has got to have a huge SD #. The alloy does not deform.

Not sexy high BC or wicked looking BT design with a tip, or black coated, not a partition; but just long, heavy and capable.

Now just have to shoot some slabs of birch or cottonwood to test the penetration. Maybe later today? Have nice weather to get in some last minute deadfall wood...

How is the .338-06 proven popular? By those who commit to it and use it; that's my guess.

This isn't supposed to be a longrange huntng setup; 338/300 does that. W/22" barrel it is fast handling, a bit more compact, holds 5 in the standard magazine and will throw a 300gr big-ass tough bullet w/enough velocity to kill anything.

I owned .35whelen, standard and AI'ed; also gave the .375H&H a try. .338 just has the better bullet selection and performance I wanted. Maybe the .338-06 level of performance would be enhanced if it were a .338/284, so could seat the high BC boattail match jobs more effectively? I may still try one of those... But more and more for woods carry and all-around reliability, I think I have found my answer.

If you're not a reloader, I suggest 338-06. But, if you're a reloader, I suggest 338 Gibbs.

Both, are very efficient, but the Gibbs will closely nip at the heals of the 338 Win Mag. I also suggest a 26" barrel.

I rebarreled to a 338-06 Ackley Improved - great cartridge; but, IMO, the Gibbs is a bit better yet.

Reamer and dies are available commercially for the 338 Gibbs.

To read more go to…
http://forums.accuratereloadin...091032791#5091032791

quote:

.338/284, so could seat the high BC boattail match jobs more effectively? I may still try one of those...

Why not just buy a 338RCM?

And for reloaders, why not just get a 338WM and load it to 3300-3500 ftlbs? Factory ammo is even available as a backup, but at 3800+ ftlbs. And as an option, a reloader could still load all of those great .338" bullets to full hunting loads of 4000ftlbs. The 338WM seems to be sort of a northern states hunting upgrade to a "3006/308". That has surely been the biggest dampener on the 338-06.

Why ask WHY???...and it all depends. You can ALWAYS go bigger or smaller incrementally and defend your choice to the death...for what reason...all these 338-06 were built for personal reasons and could just have easily been something else. I built my ~50 years ago BEFORE I heard about the 375-06 otherwise I would be shooting that one instead and be just as happy. I just finished my 375 JDJ/9.5x62 and use a reformed 9.3x 62 case...the fired case holds 68.5 gr H2O...the 375 Whelen holds 72-75 and the Hawk/Scovill about 80, so I did end up with "almost" a 375-06.

My attitude is...the bigger the game the bigger the bullet AND case. The 338-06 will take care of all the NA game and some world wide...with the right bullet and placement...so will the Whelen...so will a couple dozen other calibers/cartridges...but for bear or moose or larger game worldwide I want larger dia and heavier weight just to be certain the animal doesn't suffer starting with the 375/270-300 gr.

Got a .35 Gibbs barrel and loading setup in a trade. For short bullets, the Gibbs case is an optmizer. For long, high BC bullets, not much... Too much bullet intrusion below the shoulder with .338 longrange or even boattail designs.

As far as loading .338 win to 3500 ftlbs to match .338-06, with 215gr or 250gr (looking at Sierra #5) the Win mag has to add 15% to its powdercharge to make the same velocity. Fewer powders are suitable to make its top velocities.

But as to Popularity, I'd say few guys look to versatility when they select a cartridge... Look at your signature: "A well-rounded hunting battery might include: 500 AccRel Nyati, 416 Rigby, 375Ruger or 338WinMag, 30-06 or 270Win, 243 Win" --

A .375 H&H and a .280rem would cover all your bases.

With 250gr bullet in the .338-06, and 56.6gr of H414 you're at 3610 ftlbs. Enough energy if you place the right bullet correctly.

Bell shot elephants with 7mm Mauser, didn't he? How much energy is enough? But popularity is often a matter of conforming. Few men will risk forming their own opinions or making a purchase their fellows don't understand.

As to .338 ruger compact, I have never seen a piece of brass for it. If you select a rifle for which loading components are not readily available, that rifle may have limited use. Of course, I live 80mi out from nearest thing might call a town, and loading components have been almost non-available for more than 5yrs now...

I have seen the .338/300 be very versatile in terms of range of powder with one bullet weight. Using the 250gr Sierra I have loaded 65-77gr of xmr4350. Sierra 5 shows 62-68gr range for IMR4350. Have actually loaded more in my .338/300 but don't put it in writing.

But what's popular? This week's magnum with most velocity... The .340wby basically performs at top level between 79 and 90 grains. Of course the Wby is no longer popular because it has a belted case... Are the .338 rum and lapua better than the Wby because they can be loaded to 100fps more? Evidently.

RUM brass is not available, LM brass by Lapua is about $4ea. Weatherby/Norma brass is available, anywhere that sells Wby ammo. But it's got that belt... Guys don't know their gun can be setup to chamber on the shoulder rather than the belt... Is a belted-magnum "stronger" than non-belted when shoulder headspaced? Maybe that will be the next popular discovery???

quote:

450ak

I still have a box or two of those 275 speers and I don't even have a 338 anymore. Best Cup & Core bullet combo ever. Matchless on big game.

I used the 338-06 both in std. version and IMP version..Its a great caliber, I tended to prefer it over my 35 Whelen maybe!

When the .338 Win. came out I got one, and it had so much more to offer that I never have returned to the 338-06. The 338 Win. used the same action, the same weight gun, couldn't tell any difference in recoil and I could load the .338 win to 338-06 ballistics but not visa versa...Since that time the .338 Win. has been my favorite gun along with my 30-06..I see no reason for any other combination of calibers until you get to African DG, even then you could get by quite well I suppose. Not saying I will ever have only two rifles just that I probably should have!

I think the 338 Win was the death bellow for the 338-06 and even the 35 whelen for that matter..

If talking magazine length loads, then there are limits that most never discuss.

The Sako TRG m995 action as used for S and 42 rifles has 3.75" oal clearance for its magazine loads. That is about the longest loaded round capacty of any standard magnum receiver made, unless going to a Chey-Tac or other specialty Big-Ass Ctg (BAC); but maybe there are others I don't know about...

Anyway, if you are loading a LAB (long-ass bullet) within a 2.7" or less magazine capacity receiver, most of the bullet is in the case body. This is why to my mind that a .338 Norma is probably the best longrange case going. Short enough to seat bullet w/o intrusion into the case body.

.338-06 has got the long neck and short case length of under 2.5" trimmed.

If there were .35cal match bullets and .375 match besides the 350gr Sierra of limited production, those calibers would offer more versatility than the .338. Yet, no target or tactcal rifles are built in .35cal, and not commonly in .375cal. The RUM and Lapua ctgs are short necked so you get protrusion of bullet into case body. The LAB only can be seated an inch or less outside the case.

What really shoots well? A short bodied case on a long action so you get best bullet seating versatility... But this is not popular, except among those who are concerned with performance.

I think the .338-06 is just a well kept secret.

Phil Shoemaker dotes on the .30-06, and why not? It performs.

Is the .338-06 capable of outperforming its 30cal parent? Sure... Got Accubonds from 18-250gr, Triple X tipped, and many other hunting and target bullets.

I was tired of needing a brake to shoot RUM, and Wby .338 bore magnums. Found my wildcat before there was a .338 Norma... Not really a 1000yd shooter though.

I will load up a few of my 293gr hardcast roundnose cast boolits and fire a few into some wood slabs. Deadfall birch most likely. Will report back today...

Later,

All of the calibers being discussed here work very well...that is, in the hands of a good hunter and shooter.

The quality of the hunter/shooter trumps all the minor differences in calibers, which we all tend to exaggerate the importance of which.

But, then this is a hobby and discussing the minor stuff somehow adds to our enjoyment.

I say enjoy our hobby, but don't lose friends over it.

Wouldn't begin to know how popular it is. Be pretty hard to get an estimate. I have both a 338-06 and a 35Whelen Improved. I've shot a lot of African PG with them both. No practical difference in the field, they both simply thump everything up to and including eland. I use 225's in the 338 and 250s in the 35 at modest velocities. Very effective killers. The only special care I take with them when traveling to Africa is to make sure the headstamps match the caliber marked on the barrel. African customs guys know nothing of necking 06 cases to other calibers.