Its unbelieveable. A few years ago, the 700BDL's would have ran you about 650 when it was said and done. But now, everywhere I look, you can get 700's for around 500 dollars. Ultra's or standard calibers. In MD, I noticed Bass Pro will be selling them this week for $550. But I have had three 700's in the past three years that the barrel were extreamely rough. May have something to do with it.

Maybe the consumer is sending Big Green a message?

They have to compete with the nice Mausers coming in, like the CZ, which are as good or better and sell for less!!

I bought by first Remington 700 thirty years ago as a high school sophmore, and I still have that rifle. I've owned scores of them since then. Back in the '70s & '80s, the Model 700 was a uniformly excellent, accurate, well-made rifle that you could count on to deliver the goods. It was definately the best rifle buy in the world up until 1988 or so.

The things began the change. Remington went from those smooth button-rifled barrels to hammer-forged barrels (complete with "ratchet" marks inside), to rough crowns, lower-grade wood, and in general the workmanship and quality simply began to decline, and it's been declining ever since. When DuPont sold Remington to the current owners, things really slid for Big Green. I'm convinced that the current ownership is not the right ownership for Remington.

Now you have to pay (assuming retail) top dollar for a Remington 700 with a firing pin lock that no one wants, plus you get a rifle that isn't made and finished anywhere near as well as it used to be. Some package! Also, sales of the current controlled-feed Model 70, not to mention the up-tempo Weatherby rifles, plusquality imports such as the CZ and a declining marketplace have all cut at Remington in a (I suspect) rather serious way. Besides, I can go to gunshows and find mint older Model 700s from the 70s or 80s for less than current retail. I found a new-in-box, twenty-some year old BDL in .223 Remington for an asking price of less than $400..........

My advice to Remington is to forget about any more new cartridges or gimmicks like the Etronx: Produce rifles of higher quality.

AD

Remington has been down grading it's 700 for a long time. The last two-three years they had very bad and rough barrels. I hope they re-design their rifle and shape up the quality. I would like to see sako extractor, external bolt release button. Steel floorplate, straight and well made action with nice fit and finish. Not locking device in the bolt.

If a 700 had have all these features, I would be interested to pay the same money as for a SAKO 75. This features is what the custom actions has been offering for a long time

Remington has to start competeting with quality to make it from the new competitors.

Cheers
/ JOHAN

You know I thought it was only me with these rough barrels. Its got me a bit jaded. All the 700s I have bought new in the last few years have to be cleared of the copper every 10-20 rounds or accuracy drops off. So I broke out my old trusty 270 BDL and fired a few rounds thru it. As a force of habit, I cleaned out the barrel with my Sweets, and it only took a few patchs to do the job and only a few minutes. Thats when I started thinking, that this just isn't right to have to spend 1hour cleaning out copper of these new 700's. I am so fed up with copper, that I got my new kreiger barrel for my 300RUM, but still has to be reamed by my smith. Its ashamed that you have to pay 450 dollars for a barrel job to get a nice smooth bore that you don't have decopper every shooting session.

Its got me thinking about thier actions also. Are they really that great? I am getting ready to start a custom rifle, and I planned to use a 700 action I have but now thinking maybe a model 70 may be a better course of action.

I have a 25-06 mountain rifle--it is a great shooter but just 2 shots from a spotless barrel and copper completely covers the lands!! I never realized what was going on till I read this post.

I have a model 700 LSS in 300RUM I bought last year. I too have noticed a lot of copper fouling in the barrel after a few rounds. I have also found the action is not near as smooth as the action on an early 80's model 700 30/06. It even makes a loud metal rubbing against metal sound when pulling the bolt back or pushing the bolt foward. The 80's model makes no such "noise". I love my Remington 700's but if the quality does not improve I may jump ship and start shooting Browning's or Weatherby's.

(Not that anything is wrong with those rifles, I just grew up shooting Remington)

My 1974 vintage 700 BDL is still a real nice gun, and smoother than any of the others I've picked up since. Will admit that my .308 VS and my 7mm mag Sendero are mighty accurate though. Guy

Aha

That why my 308win ADL synt is just crap. I like the basic look of the rifle, but the stock is made from some crap plastik, the barrel gets full of copper at no time, I'm starting to get a rust problem with the barrel. Bouth inside and outside. I belived I took good care of my weapon but this remington seems to need spesial care.

The trigger was good at first, but it seem to get worse. I don't know what is happeing.

It will be replaced by a SAKO, Tikka, CZ or Sauer as soon as I can get the extra money.

Johan

[ 08-17-2002, 16:12: Message edited by: 308winchester ]

You know 308 shooter, the only difference in the location of the dirtbag depends on what part of Norway your standing in. May your barrels always foul and you temper your European arrogance.

Rickt300-It's nice to know that the attack on canadians was not personal.It appears you hate all non americans.

Naw Stubble, he's just an all-around horse's ass.

308Winchester - I regretfully sold my 7mm Rem mag synthetic 700 ADL after only a couple of years. It was an accurate and dependable hunting rifle. I always took care to wipe it down lightly after shooting. The copper fouling declined considerably after I took the time to break in the barrel correctly, cleaning after each shot for a time, then after each 5-shot string. Eventually it didn't need cleaning very often. The trigger pull needed help right away after I bought it. A good gunsmith took care of that. I sold it only because I had an opportunity to purchase a wonderful match rifle and was short on cash. Wish I had the Remington back, in the short time I had it, it brought home several nice trophies. I looked at it as a light, simple, rugged, accurate and powerful general purpose hunting rifle. Regards, Guy

Well stubblejumper and Johny Ringo read his byline :"the difference between a Harley and a Hoover is the location of the dirtbag". Sort of like saying if you ride American you are a dirtbag, anti-American slander Then listing his prefernce for rifles not made by American manufacturers which is fine as I generally have mine built by gunsmiths using Mauser and Springfield actions.
JohnnyRingo, Stripcut and BPhound the invite to the Cowboy bar in Pinedale, Wyoming still stands.

rickt300-I believe he is saying he doesn't like harleys or maybe outlaw bikers.He didn't attack every other nationality like you are doing.I would never buy a harley myself as I believe they are overpriced for thirty year old technology.That being said I do drive automobiles made in canada and the U.S.and have nothing at all against americans.I find I have more in common with western americans than I do with eastern canadians.

Yep,
I'm sure I'm going to drive all the way to Pinedale, Wyoming to see you.....

I have nothing against Harlys or the people that ride them. I don't really give a rats as on what motorcycle or car you like. I use all my money on guns, ammo, hunting and fishing gear. I don't have a driverslisens because then I wouldn't have money for my rifle.

You should have seen my mother when I got a real ekspensive Gortex hunting jacket and all my other clotes are old and some are full of holes. Can't use money on everyday where when hunying season is close you know. And my grandmother can fix the worst holes if it get to windy

Pleace don't take my signature serios or personal. It a joke, it made me laugh and I hope it makes others laugh as well.

I have broken the barrel in. It helped, but it til fouls to quick in my eyes.
I do oil the the rifle gently outside before and after hunting. Wipe of water if have been out in the rain. I clean it mostly right after shooting but I still have a problem. I theink stainless is the way to go for me.

I was wondering about the trigger. It was good at first but it's starting to slip a bit before it goes of. I should probably give it to a gunsmith and lighten it and clean it up.

I do like Sako, Tikka, Sauer and in some ways the CZ. I'm staring to be a out of the box guy. I belive that a rifle should have a good barrel, good trigger and so on from the start. I also like box magasines so most american rifles are out in my eyes. I do like amerivcan type stocks. They are the best stock. A sako 75 in a mcmillan stock would be a sweet. I also like the sauer 202 with synt stock and rust protection finish.

If you go by a remington ADL synt you will se that there is a lot that has to be done to make it a really good rifle. I belive it has a crap stock and a crap barrel. I can't be my self to understand this "it can be made into a real good rifle". I'd rater get a good one from that start.

I didn't know much about rifles when I got the ADL. And I wouldn't have gotten it today. It seem like I will be stuck with the rem for some years to come, because of studies. So it will have to do for now, I still don't like it very much.

See my ultimat whishing list for guns on the big game forum. And you'll see what guns I like.
(My dream rifle is a winchester 88 lever action in 358win)

Euro arroganse? nah don't think so. By the way we are not a part of EU and will hopefulley never be.

(Sorry for the zpellling)

Johan

Here is my new signature:

Do you like it?

Johan

I take it back, may all your barrels foul little and that you have the best of luck with the next ten you work with.
I also dislike the M700 trigger as it is very sensitive to fine dust and the bolt release has a tendency to stick in the release bolt position when it does get dusty. I don't like the 700 at all actually being a pre 64 winchester fan.

m700, I don't think anybody is saying that you can't get a good one, I think the general idea is its real easy to get a bad one. As far as break in, I had over 300 rounds thru my 300RUM. And you could still see the machine marks in the barrel with a borescope. Still think I need to break in some more?

I have a synthetic 700ADL 270 and it has one of the finest barrels I have seen - it does not foul any more than any other - my other barrels are Shaw, McGowan, Walther and Sako and it is the most accurate medium bore rifle in my collection after my 22-250 - although it took a little bedding work to get it that way - crap plastic stock and all!!

I love the rifle - it is handy to carry, bloody accurate and it hits like a steamtrain. Can't ask for much more than that.

I guess I got lucky.

The best thing Rummytoon could do is fire all the bean counters, drop the entire line of rifles, hire people away from Federal to run their ammo plants and bring back the real rifles, those made on the M-1917 action the M30 and the M30-s. While they are at it a revival of the little pump guns in .218 Bee etal. would be nice and a modern Rolling Block.

Rem, Ruger and Win all downgraded their guns to complete crap.

Ruger has made a turnaround.

Winchester is making improvement.

Remington needs to smell the coffee.

bigcountry - nope, I'd say you've done your break in shooting and more. I imagine Dan Lilja or one of the other custom barrel makers will be more than happy to be getting a call from you soon though... I've got both Kreiger and Hart barrels on some of my rifles. I probably like my Remington rifles too much for my own good. Hard not to after 28 years of success hunting and target shooting.

Oh absolutely. I like a 700 action. Alot don't. I have been a remington man for a long time. Kreiger sent me a barrel for 250. Still got to have it reamed and fitted next week. If this one fouls as bad as the last one, I give up. I know the 300RUM fouls quickly but 5 shot shouldn't have an effect on accuracy. I Have a remington 700 300Win mag that I could shoot 50 shots thru and trust the accuracy of number 50 as much as number 10.

So what are the various letter prefixes and serial numbers for M700 rifles produced during the 1970's and 80's.

The only Model 700 I've got from the 1970's is serial number 674XXXX. I don't know why the "X", but that's the way I see em in all the gun rags, maybe to keep somebody from reporting my rifle as stolen from their collection eh? The other two Model 700's I've got are both 1990's versions. Sold two others over the past three years, both were good guns, but sadly cash was more important at the moment. Guy

Doesn't suprise me. Cheap guns for a cheap price.

Saw a Remington 710 and a Savage 110 in Walmart today, both synthetic stocked. The Remington was priced $10 less than the Savage!