quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:
Does KY also consider the TSX to be a solid?

I ask because like the Cup Point from Norfork, it is a monometal bullet, designed for limited expansion.

I just returned from a buffalo hunt where I used the Cup Points. They expanded.

quote:

Originally posted by 30.06king:
One time I shot one into a dead Cape Buff if that counts for size comparison.

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:
Does KY also consider the TSX to be a solid?

I ask because like the Cup Point from Norfork, it is a monometal bullet, designed for limited expansion.

I just returned from a buffalo hunt where I used the Cup Points. They expanded.

quote:

Originally posted by ldmay375:

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:
Does KY also consider the TSX to be a solid?

I ask because like the Cup Point from Norfork, it is a monometal bullet, designed for limited expansion.

I just returned from a buffalo hunt where I used the Cup Points. They expanded.

I am a big fan of this bullet design.
Michael458 educated me on these. I have not shot any animals with them. But, for my intended use the 325 & 350 grain .458's seem ideal. I have the 325's for the 45-70, and the 350's for the 458 Winchester & Lott.

Your recovered ones look picture perfect to me.

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:
That Will not fly. The reg is clear in its wording. If a Game Warden wanted to cause me problems, I would be in violation. I can’t take the heat as an asst. prosecutor and lawyer.

I am not going to use this bullet in Ky. I was thinking of using in our west for elk and Europe for Reds, boar, and fallow. However, I do want some penetration on that class of game.


The reg would have to change bc I would think about using in KY. Really, would not use it over a 275 Woodleigh PP or 280 Aframe. Both have devastated deer at close range straight down dead w lug shots. My best buck is on the wall thanks to a 280 grain Aframe. Deader quicker than a bucket of extra crispy.


Here is another stupid one. I love a 3/5 bismuth shot blend. Same pellet count as 3 inch 4 shot. That load is illegal bc they Commission thinks it does not have the pellet count. However, you can use lead 2 3/4 inch 28 no 4 shot. That has significantly less Pellets. I have been trying to change it for years.

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
I’m not suggesting you just use it, I’m suggesting that you (and as a prosecutor you are in a pretty good position to argue with them…) that they need to reevaluate their position. The bullet does have a hollow point, it does expand, and thus is essentially identical practically to the allowed TSX. It’s just some dimensional difference. Get that through to them, and they just might change it.

Similarly, I don’t get the issue with 3/5 blend and pellet count. Do they not allow BB, T, or F steel shot? The pellet count in even factory 10 ga mag loads is pretty paltry.

#2 2.75 shells probably are inadequate numbers by that definition… I don’t know of any state that doesn’t allow #2 steel.



If you point out that if you were prosecuting the case that you would have to drop it due to the lack of difference, they might listen. Face it, lots of folks call the TSX a monometal solid expanding bullet.

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:
That Will not fly. The reg is clear in its wording. If a Game Warden wanted to cause me problems, I would be in violation. I can’t take the heat as an asst. prosecutor and lawyer.

I am not going to use this bullet in Ky. I was thinking of using in our west for elk and Europe for Reds, boar, and fallow. However, I do want some penetration on that class of game.


The reg would have to change bc I would think about using in KY. Really, would not use it over a 275 Woodleigh PP or 280 Aframe. Both have devastated deer at close range straight down dead w lug shots. My best buck is on the wall thanks to a 280 grain Aframe. Deader quicker than a bucket of extra crispy.


Here is another stupid one. I love a 3/5 bismuth shot blend. Same pellet count as 3 inch 4 shot. That load is illegal bc they Commission thinks it does not have the pellet count. However, you can use lead 2 3/4 inch 28 no 4 shot. That has significantly less Pellets. I have been trying to change it for years.

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
If a solid is defined as a FMJ, it isn’t.

It does have a hollow cavity that extends into the nose of the bullet. I wouldn’t be surprised if the actual volume of the HP is actually greater than a conventional TSX bullet.

It’s designed to expand in a controlled manner.

I get not wanting to use it until you get clarification in writing from the department, but in this case, the department is wrong.

The CPS is identical in form and function, just not degree to every other monometal hunting bullet. What’s more, its design tends to lead to straight tracking in tissue more so than spitzer style bullets, so it has an actual advantage.

Yes, the easy route is to use what they are erroneously insisting has to be used, but stick up for what makes sense.

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:
In the actual regs they define what a full metal jacket is being a solid.

If the cavity extended into the bullet, it would be fine. The problem is the nose is just dished out.

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:

quote:

Originally posted by 30.06king:
One time I shot one into a dead Cape Buff if that counts for size comparison.

I have no doubt they are awesome for Buffalo. I am thinking of a good weight mono that would be useful on game from 200-800 pounds.

I mean expand and give good tissue damage in lesser game by using the word preform.

If they made a 250-275 tsx in 358, I would be all over that. I have a a couple boxes of hammer 275s, but they are very target looking.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
I have stopped using solids years ago.

Only required for elephants.

Nothing else.

quote:

Originally posted by BaxterB:
Here is their response:


Baxter, Thank you for that additional info. So, for our deer regulations 301 KAR 2:172 Section 3(2)(b)2 is states that it must be “designed to expand upon impact” Title 301 Chapter 2 Regulation 172 • Kentucky Administrative Regulations • Legislative Research Commission and our elk regulations 301 KAR 2:132 Section 8(12)(e)2 it states “Bullets of .270 caliber or larger designed to expand upon impact” Title 301 Chapter 2 Regulation 132 • Kentucky Administrative Regulations • Legislative Research Commission. After looking at the North Fork technologies website, it states the Cup Point was created as an “expanding solid”. So, I would say the North Fork Technologies Cup Point bullet is legal to use to hunt deer and elk in Kentucky. I understand wanting to use a bullet that penetrates and retains most of it’s weight for large game. I enjoy hog hunting in the lower US and use a bullet that expands but stays together and does not fragment all over the place. Please let me know if you have any additional questions about it.

quote:

Originally posted by p dog shooter:

quote:

Originally posted by BaxterB:
Here is their response:


Baxter, Thank you for that additional info. So, for our deer regulations 301 KAR 2:172 Section 3(2)(b)2 is states that it must be “designed to expand upon impact” Title 301 Chapter 2 Regulation 172 • Kentucky Administrative Regulations • Legislative Research Commission and our elk regulations 301 KAR 2:132 Section 8(12)(e)2 it states “Bullets of .270 caliber or larger designed to expand upon impact” Title 301 Chapter 2 Regulation 132 • Kentucky Administrative Regulations • Legislative Research Commission. After looking at the North Fork technologies website, it states the Cup Point was created as an “expanding solid”. So, I would say the North Fork Technologies Cup Point bullet is legal to use to hunt deer and elk in Kentucky. I understand wanting to use a bullet that penetrates and retains most of it’s weight for large game. I enjoy hog hunting in the lower US and use a bullet that expands but stays together and does not fragment all over the place. Please let me know if you have any additional questions about it.

So it seems the bullet manufacturer make the determination. If they say it expands it is an expanding bullet.

quote:

Originally posted by Atkinson:
This thread has taken the no reasoning route!!

quote:

Originally posted by p dog shooter:
So to

Here's the definition from Serria. For their match-king bullets.

While they are recognized around the world for record-setting accuracy, MatchKing® and Tipped MatchKing® bullets are not recommended for most hunting applications. Although MatchKing® and Tipped MatchKing® bullets are commonly used for varmint hunting, their design will not provide the same reliable explosive expansion at equivalent velocities in varmints compared to their lightly jacketed Hornet, Blitz or Varminter counterparts.

Even more so I make my own bullets I can call them any I want.

This again high-lite the foolishness' of caliber and bullet restriction laws.

quote:

Killed every animal I shot with one shot

quote:

Originally posted by KevinNY:
I'd like to hear the story on those 3 CPS bullets from the buff hunt. Caliber, shot placement, etc.