Where would this combination be without merit in the vast majority of hunting?

Not a whole lot that you couldn't shoot with that combo!

You could go up to a 200 grain partition for even more penetration but it will be slower but would work admirably.

inside a couple hundred yards the 220 grain bullet in rn configuration hits like a freight train.

what is the total combination?

I'm gonna guess that there are more deer and elk and moose killed with that combo each year than all of the rest combined.

I have shot that load for many years, but mostly at 2700 FPS, and it will kill anything in NA if you stick it in the right spot..Heck, make that anything on the planet with the exception of Elephant perhaps at least it would not be real intelligent to shot and elephant with a 180 gr. Nosler, a solid would be more likely to get you by..

Shoot this myself, IMR4350 Powder and a Nosler Partition 180, pass thru an elk at 200yds, what else you need?

Jerry

quote:

Originally posted by Jerry Eden:
Shoot this myself, IMR4350 Powder and a Nosler Partition 180, pass thru an elk at 200yds, what else you need?

Jerry

What else indeed. I can't figure why anyone would want a heavier bullet for game up to the size of elk. The 180 Noslers I've seen used, either from a .30-06 or a .300 magnum, pass completely through an elk. A friend who marveled that his last bull elk maintained its feet for 60 yards even though hit in the thorax with two fully-penetrating 180 Partitions from a .300 magnum wondered aloud if he should move up to 200's. "What good would that do you?" I asked. "After all, the 180's went completely through, so how would the deeper-penetrating 200's be better?" "Good point", he replied, remembering that elk don't just drop to the ground unless you hit something vital in the central nervous system.

You know, I was on a cow elk hunt a couple years ago. The rifle I was using was a 35 Whelen, with 250 Grain Speer Hot Cores. At the shot, which was about 130 yards: as I looked thru the scope the cow, was looking in my direction, when the trigger broke, and I heard the thwap, and as I came out of recoil, the cow was still looking at me. Now I knew I hadn't missed, but I jacked another in the chamber anyway. In a couple seconds the cow lurched forward, and ran a few yards before dropping, and then kicking and rolling on the ground for what seemed a long time. The shot, was right in the heart, and blew it half apart. So Stonecreek is absolutly right, rarely do they drop right there.

I am thinking about doing something rational (irrational?) and selling many of my rifles with the exception of 2 30-06's. One sighted in for 150gr. bullets to hunt everything smaller than elk with and the other using the 180 Partitions to hunt elk with. Or just sighting both in for the 180gr. partition load and hunting everything with them. Keeping one for backup.

quote:

Originally posted by Palidun:
I am thinking about doing something rational (irrational?) and selling many of my rifles with the exception of 2 30-06's. One sighted in for 150gr. bullets to hunt everything smaller than elk with and the other using the 180 Partitions to hunt elk with. Or just sighting both in for the 180gr. partition load and hunting everything with them. Keeping one for backup.

You can't go wrong with that choice. Sounds like something I'd do.

quote:

Originally posted by Palidun:
I am thinking about doing something rational (irrational?) and selling many of my rifles with the exception of 2 30-06's. One sighted in for 150gr. bullets to hunt everything smaller than elk with and the other using the 180 Partitions to hunt elk with. Or just sighting both in for the 180gr. partition load and hunting everything with them. Keeping one for backup.

As far as successfully hunting and taking game, that plan is not at all irrational as those two loads (or even just the 180's) will effectively take anything you want to hunt.

As far as fulfilling one's passionate need to own as many guns as possible, it is dangerously irrational!

Palidun, you might want to consider the 165 Partition. It flies virtually as flat as the 150 and will hit just about as hard as the 180. I see the 165 in the '06 as just about the best of all possible worlds...

Palidun,,, I quite using 180's about 20 yrs ago, found that the 165 kills just as good and you can get it up to or over 2800fps easily. My 30Gibbs shoots 200gr NP like a lazer and is a great bullet for moose and bears.

One load is what I have used for years when carrying an '06, regardless how big or how little the game hunted. That is a Nosler Partition 200 gr. with a moderate amount of 4350 pushing it. That big bullet goes right through almost any North American animal.

Small deer don't have the resistance to cause explosive expansion, and it has the sectional density to fully expand and still pass clear through heavier elk or moose on quartering shots.

So, yes, I think just using the 180 grain loads on everything would work just fine...in the long run even better than multiple different loads or multiple different rifle chamberings.. With one load you will get used to how the gun shoots, where the bullets impact, and it will speed up your shooting just a tiny tad as you won't have to mentally calculate where to hold. You'll do it automatically, and on shots where you have to shoot quickly that may make the difference between a bare cupboard and meat in the pot.

quote:

Originally posted by Stonecreek:

quote:

Originally posted by Palidun:
I am thinking about doing something rational (irrational?) and selling many of my rifles with the exception of 2 30-06's. One sighted in for 150gr. bullets to hunt everything smaller than elk with and the other using the 180 Partitions to hunt elk with. Or just sighting both in for the 180gr. partition load and hunting everything with them. Keeping one for backup.

As far as successfully hunting and taking game, that plan is not at all irrational as those two loads (or even just the 180's) will effectively take anything you want to hunt.

As far as fulfilling one's passionate need to own as many guns as possible, it is dangerously irrational!

Even thinking about the rational end of this hurts! Shooters Pro Shop has the 180 gr. Partitions on sale presently so I bought some using the fictional rationalization that I could hunt most everything with just one caliber rifle, Hah!

quote:

Originally posted by Palidun:

I could hunt most everything with just one caliber rifle, Hah!

That right there is just crazy talk!

Interesting comments. I have nowhere near the experience of most here, but have used 180 NPs on elk and moose. Have landed 4 of them from .300s w/2950 fps MV. Two did not exit. First was on a steep quartering away (and hastily retreating) bull elk I had given a cervical concussion to. Poleaxed and looking DRT for about two minutes it was. Surprised I was. The second (no-exit) round did the job just fine going in just ahead of the hip muscles penetrating a few feet of elk innards. Elk went down on the spot for good. No complaints about the no-exit projo. Similar story with an Alberta bull moose steep quartering toward me - almost dead on, head held pretty low (looking for a fight). Hit was high enough to take out cervical spinal cord and major vessels. Punched several vertebral bodies - pretty severe test. Moose DRT and no complaints.

I think a '06 180 NP at 2800 would have done every bit as well.

Sam

The 06 may even do a little better with the slightly slower velocity. There will not be as much violent expansion on the bullet.

An 06 with 180 partitions will not leave you wanting for anything the average hunter will shoot including deer. Noslers are made to expand well on the front end with moderate resistance.

As I said in my first post on the subject, I used the 180 Nosler at 2700 FPS for many years and shot a lot of animals with that load..

About 10 or 15 years ago I gave the 200 gr. Nosler a try at 2650 FPS and have not shot a 180 since...The 200 gr. Nosler at 2600 to 2650 and some claim 2700 is and awesome elk killer and some folks I know like it for Brown Bear saying they can't tell any difference in it than say with a .338 with whatever bullet??? That doesn't reall surprise me at all...but I won't run out and sell my .338..

Bring a 40 foot cattle trailer to get the game I have killed with old Rem. 721 in 30/06 with 180 grn. Nosler partitions. It has taken most of my Africa critters, all of my elk and at least 1/2 of my deer plus a few Texas long eared Jacks. I started out with 150's until first elk hunt and then I just never stopped shooting 180's. Never tried 165 or 220 grns.
I bought it 1962 third hand for $90. I did not have the $45 for a Weaver 4X so I had to shoot it for several years with open sights.
Still one of the most accurate rifles I have. If push comes to shove...I am going to stay with the girl I brought to the dance.

I got lucky with my one and only 06, a stainless laminated ruger 77, with sights. After a little bedding work, and a replacement trigger, it shoots factory 165 gr accubonds (at 2800 fps) into less than an inch @ 100yds. Just for grins, I tried 3 different 220 gr factory loads (federal, remington, and some hornadys that are marketed in europe). I shot 3 of each @ 100 yds, and to my surprise, all 9 rounds went into 1.5".......and better yet, they shot 3" lower than the 165's. Dead even left to right. I then sighted the 165's 3" high at a 100 (dead on @ 250), and the 220's are dead on @ 100 yds. Now, with a leupold fixed 6x, and the long range reticle, I chamber one of the 165's while hunting open country, then swap to the 220's in the timber. Probably the most all around/versatile rifle I own. Even if I take another rifle, this one always comes along as a back up.
I know this is not the 1 bullet for everything.....but it's the 2 bullets for everything, for sure! Andy#3

This is my pet load for my 06.. I took it to Africa 2 years ago and took an impala, blesbok, springbok, gemsbok, and zebra with it.. I got complete pass throughs on every animal except the Zebra..

Powder is 4831 57 to 59 grains depending on the brass..

My powder charge for top velocities in the 30-06 with 180's is also H4831, variously 59 or 60 grains and a magnum primer. I have a good amount of H414 and have been using a lot of it lately but don't have a chrony anymore.

quote:

Originally posted by ztreh:
what is the total combination?

The rifle is a 1903A3 Springfield with a 23" 2 groove barrel. This barrel has always given a bit more velocity than expected and has been very accurate with several loads. Otherwise it usually shoots into 1 1/8th or 1 1/4 inch with unsorted brass.

Picked up a Stevens 200 in 30-06 for $150. still in the box. Adjusted the trigger, used black automotive silicon to glue the flimsy stock to the barrel and mounted a 3x9 Bushnell Elite then took it out to shoot. This thing could be used to head shoot sparrows out to 100 yards! Seems to shoot all bullet weights very nicely from the 130gr. Speer HP to the 180gr. Hornady spire points. I need to uglyfie it to a greater degree with a paint job and shoot a couple of hogs with it. The Springfield gets all the Partitions.

Today I have moved to the 180 accubond over the partition as it has slightly better BC.....and next year I'll move to the 165 accubond.....assuming I get equal accuracy and I suspect that's going to be the case.

A .30-06 so loaded is a very fine big game cartridge in deed.

My first big game rifle was a 30-06, at a time when I could only afford one big game rifle. I had two but it was a 270. But I lived in Wyoming and was able to hunt all I wanted. That 30-06 worked on everything so well I had to start trying everything under the sun looking for the perfect rifle. My 2 rifle battery would be the 7x57 and a 35 Whelen. One rifle does all would still be the 30-06.

How about the 168 grain Barnes TTSX at 2900 fps ?

interesting how we all end up with peculiar incidents with projectiles. I loaded some 165 accubonds in a 30-06 for my wife to shoot in Africa (roughly 2700 FPS to keep recoil down). She shot a Impala and a nice bushbuck. Both died within few feet so the bullet did its job. We recovered the accubond from the broadside shot on the Bushbuck. It had peeled away almost the the base of the shank with a massive mushroom. Probably the reason it did not pass through and a bushbuck is not a very large animal. I think from time to time you get some projectiles that are a bit to soft or to hard in production. This has not kept me from using them going forward especially on deer and I think they are a great match for a 30-06 but think I would go heavier on any 300 mag or use a partition.

EZ

I tried the 220 gr. bullets back some time ago, and I learned the 200 gr. Nosler would out penetrate the 220 gr. bullets including the 220 gr. Nosler, it shot flatter than the 180 at 500 yard out for whatever that's worth (not much IMO as I don't shoot at game that far) It just a wonderful bullet, and the 180 Nosler is just a tad behind it..Probably my smartest move would be to load the 180s in my 06 and the 200 in my 300 H&H.

I tried the 165s and they worked about like a 150 as far as I could tell. The are touted as the middle of the road, do everything bullet, but that also means they are not as good as the 150 for the light stuff and not as good as the 180 for the larger stuff according to Finn Aagard and I will buy that as logical.

I can't tell any difference in killing effect, trajectory or anything else between a 06 at 2800 or 2600 FPS, there just isn't any observed difference. The age old 2700 FPS for the 06 has been working like a charm for the last 107 or so years.

quote:

Originally posted by Palidun:
I am thinking about doing something rational (irrational?) and selling many of my rifles with the exception of 2 30-06's. One sighted in for 150gr. bullets to hunt everything smaller than elk with and the other using the 180 Partitions to hunt elk with. Or just sighting both in for the 180gr. partition load and hunting everything with them. Keeping one for backup.

I did just the opposite, I've sold off 3 30/06's over the years to justify keeping all my other rifles.

All intersting as my No. 2 in '15 will likely be a .30-06. Lightest rifle I've ever carried in Africa. But, I'll be hunting a lot of small stuff. Will use softs on the bigger antelope, but still need some solids. If the rifle will shoot them, I was thinking of military ball ammo. Shouldn't do too much damage to a klippi or duiker.

Ever notice how 30-06 users seem to need a lot of reassurance in their choice? I'm not saying that it doesn't work (just like dozens of others)but those other users can get through a day without a group hug.

The gun rags will continue to trot out their annual "The 30-06, does it still work?" article and the once a year hunters will storm the rack to find out if they are good for one more year. After they are reassured, they are happy again.

Is it just an instinctive need to have people agree with them? I've got 4 of them myself, but don't find that there's anything special about them. Just a useful mild cartridge like dozens of others.

I have noticed a need by some to denigrate others and puff themselves up.

I can't remember which writer said it but I agree with what he said: The 30-06 is the cartridge against which all others are compared.
And I agree with Olarmy. You could say Mother Teresa is a nice lady and somebody(s) would find fault with that.

If writer's didn't indirectly denigrate the '06 folks lacking experience might not need reassurance. Writers want to help their advertisers sell guns. More cartridges translates as more potential firearms sold.

But they don't mind when we buy .30-06s, either.

Just a bad cop - good cop routine, is all.

Not like I haven't bought needless rifles that overlap in function.

The point to be made is while the annual re-grind of 30-06 information may be dated and tiring to many of us, to some it is new information and quite interesting.

A gunsmith friend of mine has an old Oberndorf Mauser in 30-06 that he took to Angola in the '70s. When it was still available, he used Norma 205 to get an accurately chronographed 2800 fps out of the Nosler 200 gr. Partition. An obviously "fast" 24 inch barrel gave these near 300 mag velocities consistently, and it was a consistent killer. He took 17 animals up to the size of kudu with 19 shots. I seriously doubt if 100 or even 150 fps would have made much difference in anything but trajectory. Dead is dead, and the 30-06 with Partitions does it well.

I've got a 26" inch Benchmark barrelled 30-06 that trots out 180s at 2850 fps with listed loads of H4350. Its a bit of an over-achiever amongst mine, since the rest struggle for 2700 fps. My .300 Wins idle along at 3150 fps out of 26" barrels. 100 fps may not make a huge difference but 300 is heading that way and 450 fps is very hard to ignore. If you don't think so, take 450 fps off of the typical 2700 30-06. How many don't think that they can tell the difference between a 30-06 and a 30-30?